Thedelldays Posted 26 July, 2010 Share Posted 26 July, 2010 I think they're unfairly biased towards mothers in most cases. But back to my salient point - if you love your child, you'll do whatever you can, even if you don't have access. It's not fair on the child to use it as a bargaining tool. who would be using them as a bargening tool...if you refuse access, you should not have to pay..let the CSA chase the person doing wrong for once Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saint lard Posted 26 July, 2010 Share Posted 26 July, 2010 Hey that's wrong! If she's a bank manager, she, of all people, should know not to do that! Is the account in his name / in a trust account? See if you can't organise something so that she can't access it. The account is in his name but she set the account up via her bank,i think her initials are tagged onto it,it was the only way she would agree. I just get the statements as i wanted proof that i was making payments,as the CSA were attrocious,and also that when my son gets older he will know i contributed to his upbringing.What he won't realise is all the extras...school uniform,school books and such like i have purchased for him,but hey ho. She is now getting a nice little income from renting out our old house,whilst she live 'rent' free in a small holding with her jet setting businessman fella. I asked her if there was any equity in the property when she was going to sell it for her to put between £500-£1k into Toms account,she refused.Trout. She is very clever and a tad devious,it is better i do not make waves,trust me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saintjay77 Posted 26 July, 2010 Share Posted 26 July, 2010 CSA is screwed. I think the system is set up to catch the absent parents that couldnt give a toss and to hammer them. But instead of going after them its all about numbers so they hammer the parents that hold there hands up to support there kids. I have my kids every weekend from Fri night till Monday morning and we split the holidays 50/50. That 1 night a week extra my ex gets the kids during term time means I have to pay around 20% of my wages. My ex works full time and has got married to a guy who also works full time. They get all the benifits for the kids and the tax relief to go along with that. Personally I think that as she has them 3 days a week and I have them 3 days a week we are even for those 3 days. the extra day she has them I should be liable for. On top of that there are things like school uniforms and trips which I think we should both be liable for but it doesnt match up to anything like they think I should pay. I cant argue it though, there is no-one to argue it too. I also feel that if I do try to argue it only looks like I am one of those tossers that doesnt want to support his kids. CSA have only recently informed me that they have messed up for over 1 year and havnet been charging me enough. They take the money straight from my wages and tell my work how much they want. So to find out im nearly £1000 in arrears was a bit of a shock to say the least. What can I do about it???? Naff all!!!! They wanted to take out nearly £300 per month to get rid of the arrears which would have left me with bugger all after bills pretty much. Told them I would be handing my notice in at work as I would get more on benifits if they went down this route. Got them to reduce the arrears payments to £170 but it only helps a bit. What annoys me the most though, is if I have just one of my kids 1 night a week extra, I will have to pay nothing at all. And if both kids decide they want that one extra night with me then there mum has to pay me. I think the system sucks and far too often the tossers who couldnt give a stuff about there kids get away with it all and the decent parents that stand by there kids get screwed over. My wifes little boy is 7 years old and has seen nothing from his so called father. What have the CSA done about his case? Someone else I know fiddles things that much that on his £400 per week job as a taxi driver he somehow has to pay just £5 per week to 3 kids he couldnt give a monkeys about. At what stage does the taking away of passports and driving license happen? When does the court case happen for these absent parents who couldnt give a stuff? CSA is quiet happy to phone me with the arse on about a mistake they made demanding that I go without and make my kids go without when they are with me just so they can say "oh look at us, we have made another nasty dad pay up" CSA is a scam set up to massage numbers for what ever gov is in place and its the decent people who end up having to pay the most. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sadoldgit Posted 26 July, 2010 Author Share Posted 26 July, 2010 From the other side of the fence, I'd say that it's fair enough that your ex-wife's new husband doesn't have any financial responsibility for your children. My second husband didn't for the children of my first marriage. Having said that, he was the one who provided a roof over their heads and paid for our holidays etc. I think being a father (or mother for that matter) is a life-long commitment for which we pay emotionally and financially. It actually worked out to our advantage as, when my children were going to University, their step-father's income wasn't taken into account and this meant they got full maintenance grants as my salary alone was used for reckoning and was meagre. I do think some fathers are treated very unfairly. I also think some mothers suffer a lot because their children's fathers wriggle out of paying what they should. He is there step dad and because of him they went to live in Spain for over 3 years. They could only go because he chose to pay for them to go to a fee paying International School. My ex wife gave up work because he earns over £150k a year (over £100k a year more than my partner and my joint earnings). If I dropped dead tomorrow and he refused to support the children how would she cope? He choose to marry a women with three children by one father and another by another. I think he should take financial responsibility (not all granted). When I married my ex she had a 7 year old daughter and I paid for everything as her father had passed away (thanks to the way my ex wife treated him - he took his own life after she threatened to prevent him from seeing his daughter). Each case should be handled on its own merits. If I lived in the Highland of Scotland my CSA contribution would be the same as if I lived in central London - there is no regional allowance. What the CSA call disposable income is a joke. They tell me that my partner and I have £775 "disposable income" each month. No we don't, we don't have any because it all goes on paying the bills that the CSA ignore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baj Posted 26 July, 2010 Share Posted 26 July, 2010 4 years down and 12 to go for me. Yes they are c unts but they are pretty stupid/ gullable c unts also. A self employed person should have a field day! explain, cos reading their "how we calculate your benefits" it seems pretty watertight to me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buctootim Posted 26 July, 2010 Share Posted 26 July, 2010 I look after my two children half time and their mother has them half time. In my simplistic view of the world that should mean we are supporting them equally and neither parent should have to pay the other, especially since she earns £34,000pa lives in a mortgage free detached house, gets all the child benefit and has a live boyfriend on £100,000pa. In reality, even though I have a mortage I am expected to also pay her 20% of my income - money which should go towards my support of the kids, holidays for them etc. The system is totally skewed to benefitting the mother, not the interests of the children. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buctootim Posted 26 July, 2010 Share Posted 26 July, 2010 explain, cos reading their "how we calculate your benefits" it seems pretty watertight to me Declared income and undeclared income? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thedelldays Posted 26 July, 2010 Share Posted 26 July, 2010 again...if you are allowed access to your kids 2 nights a week..you should be entitled to 2/7ths of the benefits... again, does not work like that..thank god I dont have kids best bit of birth control the country has ever produced Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bridge too far Posted 26 July, 2010 Share Posted 26 July, 2010 who would be using them as a bargening tool...if you refuse access, you should not have to pay..let the CSA chase the person doing wrong for once We've got two arguments going on here. The topic, about the CSA, is showing just how flawed the system is and it obviously needs serious reform. I don't have an argument with that - I know too many people (mainly men) who have been very shabbily treated by this system. The question about access is for the courts to decide. If a parent feels that they're being unfairly denied access then they need a good solicitor on board to sort it out to everyone's satisfaction. But to say 'if you don't let me see my child(ren) I'm not going to pay' is using the child as a bargaining tool. And that's plain wrong IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thedelldays Posted 26 July, 2010 Share Posted 26 July, 2010 We've got two arguments going on here. The topic, about the CSA, is showing just how flawed the system is and it obviously needs serious reform. I don't have an argument with that - I know too many people (mainly men) who have been very shabbily treated by this system. The question about access is for the courts to decide. If a parent feels that they're being unfairly denied access then they need a good solicitor on board to sort it out to everyone's satisfaction. But to say 'if you don't let me see my child(ren) I'm not going to pay' is using the child as a bargaining tool. And that's plain wrong IMO. people would but they cant afford it due to CSA payments...and round and round we go... in cases I know..the courts HAVE declared there is not problems and said dad is to have acccess every week un supervised etc...still, never allowed..what can he do..? f-all Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bridge too far Posted 26 July, 2010 Share Posted 26 July, 2010 I look after my two children half time and their mother has them half time. In my simplistic view of the world that should mean we are supporting them equally and neither parent should have to pay the other, especially since she earns £34,000pa lives in a mortgage free detached house, gets all the child benefit and has a live boyfriend on £100,000pa. In reality, even though I have a mortage I am expected to also pay her 20% of my income - money which should go towards my support of the kids, holidays for them etc. The system is totally skewed to benefitting the mother, not the interests of the children. Apart from the maintenance you pay for your children, you mean? You should get back to a solicitor asap as, if she has a partner, you shouldn't have to pay anything towards HER upkeep. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baj Posted 26 July, 2010 Share Posted 26 July, 2010 Every other weekend? Staying with you for two nights at a time? Does he also stay on a Wednesday? Add up the nights he stays over in a year because if it's 52 or more then you can go here to see if that has an effect on your payments. hooooooly ****... I just did the calculator... You told us: Number of children maintenance will be paid for: 2 Number of other children living in the non-resident parent's household: 0 Number of nights, on average, the non-resident parent has the child(ren): 156 to 174 The non-resident parent's net weekly income: £ *** The non-resident parent is not claiming any benefits. The weekly amount of child maintenance is approximately: £74 lets just say im paying her WAY more than that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bridge too far Posted 26 July, 2010 Share Posted 26 July, 2010 people would but they cant afford it due to CSA payments...and round and round we go... in cases I know..the courts HAVE declared there is not problems and said dad is to have acccess every week un supervised etc...still, never allowed..what can he do..? f-all Go back to court to challenge it - that's what I would do, with or without a solicitor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buctootim Posted 26 July, 2010 Share Posted 26 July, 2010 Apart from the maintenance you pay for your children, you mean? You should get back to a solicitor asap as, if she has a partner, you shouldn't have to pay anything towards HER upkeep. No I mean I pay 20% to her for the maintenance of the children. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thedelldays Posted 26 July, 2010 Share Posted 26 July, 2010 Go back to court to challenge it - that's what I would do, with or without a solicitor. yes...and they say he is allowed to see his kids...on the day of the races...............all takes time and he still has no money to live.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint Fan CaM Posted 26 July, 2010 Share Posted 26 July, 2010 Wow, there's a lot of common issues here - incredible that so many suffer the same misfortune when it comes to care of their children in particular, however this I am sure is the tip of the iceburg. It is true to say that many men will not speak out about the problem because they are too embarrassed to talk about the subject, particularly if the situation has come about from their partner having an affair (more and more common nowadays and a subject in its own right). I was 'fortunate' as my ex-wife had an affair - that's never been easy to disclose, however it gave me 'leverage'. I did what many guys in that situation fail to do - I kept my calm and kept my own council. When I found out I started putting things in place - manipulating the situation to ensure that I would not lose out. The first step was to ensure I had financial control of MY finances. I politely made sure that it was understood that I would not 'go away quietly' (i.e. give up my claim to the house, it's contents and indeed custody of the kids) unless certain conditions were observed. I drew up a Seperation Agreement which we both signed and which was witnessed by a Solicitor. I made sure all of this was done at no expense to myself. My maintenance payments were agreed and set in stone - how? - because they were linked with every other condition of the Seperation Agreement, including issues that were beneficial to her (e.g. giving up any rights to her private pension). Indeed when two of my kids came to live with me, the Seperation Agreement included the provision for a reduction of my payments to her. Needless to say, I have continued to support my children way beyond the requirements of the Seperation Agreement (still have one at Uni), however I have remained in control throughout without a sniff from the CSA. Unfortunately, the whole system is set-up to work against responsible Dads. So you need to be supercool and make sure you think things through logically - act as swiftly as possible - don't let issues drag on and fester because they'll not get any easier to sort out. There's so much advice to give to younger guys but would start with, (a) don't create a child unless you are 110% sure you are prepared to stand by it at all costs - i.e. take full responsibility for birth control (b) if you have one or more kids don't play away from home - it could cost you more than you think, © keep your cool - try at all costs to work things out with the ex without having to involve a Solicitor because there's only one person who will benefit from that game, (d) try not to blame yourself for not getting access to the kids - one day they will find out the truth (i.e. you're the good guy) and you'll be vindicated IF and only IF you've not done anything stupid. Good luck SOG and all others currently going through the trauma... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Draino76 Posted 26 July, 2010 Share Posted 26 July, 2010 hooooooly ****... I just did the calculator... You told us: Number of children maintenance will be paid for: 2 Number of other children living in the non-resident parent's household: 0 Number of nights, on average, the non-resident parent has the child(ren): 156 to 174 The non-resident parent's net weekly income: £ *** The non-resident parent is not claiming any benefits. The weekly amount of child maintenance is approximately: £74 lets just say im paying her WAY more than that Be happy then! You can show her these figures to manipulate her expectations down, or you can manipulate your own figures her to lower her expectations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Draino76 Posted 26 July, 2010 Share Posted 26 July, 2010 http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/authors/s/sun_tzu.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sadoldgit Posted 26 July, 2010 Author Share Posted 26 July, 2010 so because you were unemployed,your kids cost your ex nothing in food/clothing/heating/school trips/sports clubs etc at the time??? and just because her new husband is minted doesn't mean you have the right not to pay for them.....they're YOUR kids ,not his!! agree with you on the access issue, and you have my sympathies,truly, but maybe you could ask for some sort of compromise?? appeal to her better nature (if she has one)...perhaps put the money into a trust fund for when they're older? She got all sorts of tax benefits, she got the house, I had to pay off the £17k credit card bill. All I got was told when I could and could not see my children. I continued to take them on holidays, buy them clothes etc when I wasn't earning. I had a 2 hours round trip to see them and not once was there an offer to drop them off or meet half way. They may well be my kids not his but he took me to court in order to overturn my contact order with the children so that he could move them to Spain. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bridge too far Posted 26 July, 2010 Share Posted 26 July, 2010 She got all sorts of tax benefits, she got the house, I had to pay off the £17k credit card bill. All I got was told when I could and could not see my children. I continued to take them on holidays, buy them clothes etc when I wasn't earning. I had a 2 hours round trip to see them and not once was there an offer to drop them off or meet half way. They may well be my kids not his but he took me to court in order to overturn my contact order with the children so that he could move them to Spain. I guess things must have changed then. I remember when my 'new' husband got a job in Scotland but we couldn't take it because my children's father objected to them being moved out of England! This was some time ago, mind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sadoldgit Posted 26 July, 2010 Author Share Posted 26 July, 2010 Wow, there's a lot of common issues here - incredible that so many suffer the same misfortune when it comes to care of their children in particular, however this I am sure is the tip of the iceburg. It is true to say that many men will not speak out about the problem because they are too embarrassed to talk about the subject, particularly if the situation has come about from their partner having an affair (more and more common nowadays and a subject in its own right). I was 'fortunate' as my ex-wife had an affair - that's never been easy to disclose, however it gave me 'leverage'. I did what many guys in that situation fail to do - I kept my calm and kept my own council. When I found out I started putting things in place - manipulating the situation to ensure that I would not lose out. The first step was to ensure I had financial control of MY finances. I politely made sure that it was understood that I would not 'go away quietly' (i.e. give up my claim to the house, it's contents and indeed custody of the kids) unless certain conditions were observed. I drew up a Seperation Agreement which we both signed and which was witnessed by a Solicitor. I made sure all of this was done at no expense to myself. My maintenance payments were agreed and set in stone - how? - because they were linked with every other condition of the Seperation Agreement, including issues that were beneficial to her (e.g. giving up any rights to her private pension). Indeed when two of my kids came to live with me, the Seperation Agreement included the provision for a reduction of my payments to her. Needless to say, I have continued to support my children way beyond the requirements of the Seperation Agreement (still have one at Uni), however I have remained in control throughout without a sniff from the CSA. Unfortunately, the whole system is set-up to work against responsible Dads. So you need to be supercool and make sure you think things through logically - act as swiftly as possible - don't let issues drag on and fester because they'll not get any easier to sort out. There's so much advice to give to younger guys but would start with, (a) don't create a child unless you are 110% sure you are prepared to stand by it at all costs - i.e. take full responsibility for birth control (b) if you have one or more kids don't play away from home - it could cost you more than you think, © keep your cool - try at all costs to work things out with the ex without having to involve a Solicitor because there's only one person who will benefit from that game, (d) try not to blame yourself for not getting access to the kids - one day they will find out the truth (i.e. you're the good guy) and you'll be vindicated IF and only IF you've not done anything stupid. Good luck SOG and all others currently going through the trauma... My ex had an affair. I did try and play it cool but she moved her mother into our house when I refused to move out and they would call the ploice at every opportunity prentending that I had assaulted them etc. The police always cart the man away if kids are involved so I got arrested quite frequently even though I did nothing. In the end I was advised by my very expensive solicitor not to go back the house. She was supposed to sell the house but ignored the court order. In theend my sols told me to sell to her, which I did at a large cost to myself. She did very well out of the divorce and beter still found out there was a single pilot living at the top of the road so she made a beeline for him and was even more quids in. She has Narcissistic Personality Disorder and any time I challenge her about anything she uses my contact with my children to get back at me. These people are very manipulative and very convincing. They are also completley self centred and selfish and the word compromise does not exist in their vocabulary, so anything I tried to do, no matter how reasonable, does not work unless she wants it to work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint in Paradise Posted 26 July, 2010 Share Posted 26 July, 2010 After reading this thread my heart goes out to all you fathers being screwed over. Probably a wrong thing to say but I am surprised more women are not murdered. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Draino76 Posted 26 July, 2010 Share Posted 26 July, 2010 I know of a mate of mine that took a poorly paid job when the CSA were doing their assessment. Then he got a better paid job but forgot to tell the his ex and the CSA! He keeps taking his kids to the IOW and Wales, but secretly sneaks off to Rio and Pattaya when nobody is looking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bridge too far Posted 26 July, 2010 Share Posted 26 July, 2010 I know of a mate of mine that took a poorly paid job when the CSA were doing their assessment. Then he got a better paid job but forgot to tell the his ex and the CSA! He keeps taking his kids to the IOW and Wales, but secretly sneaks off to Rio and Pattaya when nobody is looking. Good on him. I bet he is really smug knowing he's having a good time whilst his children are maybe not having such a good time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint in Paradise Posted 26 July, 2010 Share Posted 26 July, 2010 Women are always bleating about being "equal" with men so if their income becomes more that the ex through whatever reason, they should take over the payments full stop. I mean aren't the kids theirs as well ?????? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bridge too far Posted 26 July, 2010 Share Posted 26 July, 2010 Women are always bleating about being "equal" with men so if their income becomes more that the ex through whatever reason, they should take over the payments full stop. I mean aren't the kids theirs as well ?????? This happens already, so I've been told. A cost is calculated and then attributed according to each parent's income. That's why a divorce judge will expect a woman to take on paid work once the children are of school age. Whether this generally happens in practice I don't know. But I do have a couple of female friends who contribute more to the cost of bringing up their children than their ex-partners do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Draino76 Posted 26 July, 2010 Share Posted 26 July, 2010 Good on him. I bet he is really smug knowing he's having a good time whilst his children are maybe not having such a good time. No they have the time of their life when they see him, every time; all the time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benjii Posted 26 July, 2010 Share Posted 26 July, 2010 I know of a mate of mine that took a poorly paid job when the CSA were doing their assessment. Then he got a better paid job but forgot to tell the his ex and the CSA! He keeps taking his kids to the IOW and Wales, but secretly sneaks off to Rio and Pattaya when nobody is looking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saint boggy Posted 26 July, 2010 Share Posted 26 July, 2010 (edited) My ex had an affair. I did try and play it cool but she moved her mother into our house when I refused to move out and they would call the ploice at every opportunity prentending that I had assaulted them etc. The police always cart the man away if kids are involved so I got arrested quite frequently even though I did nothing. In the end I was advised by my very expensive solicitor not to go back the house. She was supposed to sell the house but ignored the court order. In theend my sols told me to sell to her, which I did at a large cost to myself. She did very well out of the divorce and beter still found out there was a single pilot living at the top of the road so she made a beeline for him and was even more quids in. She has Narcissistic Personality Disorder and any time I challenge her about anything she uses my contact with my children to get back at me. These people are very manipulative and very convincing. They are also completley self centred and selfish and the word compromise does not exist in their vocabulary, so anything I tried to do, no matter how reasonable, does not work unless she wants it to work. i really do feel for you SOG , any woman that uses her kids as a weapon does not deserve a penny. But, you said in a previous post that she ignored a court ruling? surely she can't be allowed to get away with that? and just to even things up a bit on here.......i have 3 friends who have all within the last 3 years split from their children's fathers........not one of them gets a penny towards them.....the fathers are off with their new girlfriends and new lives,living it up , seeing the kids when (and only when) THEY want to see them. 2 of those friends have had no choice but to become welfare dependant and the other (who was training to be a nurse) has had to give up her career in order to get a full-time job and have her son go to a carer.....hardly ideal for any of the innocent parties, eh!. oh, and not to mention a family member whose marriage split up and she was left with a 2 yr old who the father would arrange to come and see and then NEVER turn up,leaving the little lad totally distraught.He left her with all the bills that he hadn't paid for months on end,which she then had to pay out of her meager income over the following 5 years, while he swanned off to live in Australia, get re-married have another kid and live in a detatched house with a swimming pool and a boat, while his ex and 1st child lived in a ****ty council flat in Thornhill!!........so, please , don't bash ALL women, we're not all like SOG's ex!! Edited 26 July, 2010 by saint boggy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint Fan CaM Posted 26 July, 2010 Share Posted 26 July, 2010 My ex had an affair. I did try and play it cool but she moved her mother into our house when I refused to move out and they would call the ploice at every opportunity prentending that I had assaulted them etc. The police always cart the man away if kids are involved so I got arrested quite frequently even though I did nothing. In the end I was advised by my very expensive solicitor not to go back the house. She was supposed to sell the house but ignored the court order. In theend my sols told me to sell to her, which I did at a large cost to myself. She did very well out of the divorce and beter still found out there was a single pilot living at the top of the road so she made a beeline for him and was even more quids in. She has Narcissistic Personality Disorder and any time I challenge her about anything she uses my contact with my children to get back at me. These people are very manipulative and very convincing. They are also completley self centred and selfish and the word compromise does not exist in their vocabulary, so anything I tried to do, no matter how reasonable, does not work unless she wants it to work. I sympathise with you - sounds like your situation was not as straight-forward as mine, although like I said it pays to act quickly. It doesn't take long for the lines of demarkation to be drawn up and as any dedicated estranged Dad will know, it's the woman who has the trump hand. And almost every estranged Dad I've talked to has experienced some form of emotional torture from the ex-wife playing the kids against him. This alone should be made a criminal offence in my opinion - it's truly disgusting. Keep it together SOG - if they're anything like mine, your kids will respect you for it one day f'sure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saintjay77 Posted 28 July, 2010 Share Posted 28 July, 2010 hooooooly ****... I just did the calculator... You told us: Number of children maintenance will be paid for: 2 Number of other children living in the non-resident parent's household: 0 Number of nights, on average, the non-resident parent has the child(ren): 156 to 174 The non-resident parent's net weekly income: £ *** The non-resident parent is not claiming any benefits. The weekly amount of child maintenance is approximately: £74 lets just say im paying her WAY more than that LOL I just did that calculator and it said I have to pay nothing!!!! Wa nK! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
View From The Top Posted 28 July, 2010 Share Posted 28 July, 2010 My ex had an affair. I did try and play it cool but she moved her mother into our house when I refused to move out and they would call the ploice at every opportunity prentending that I had assaulted them etc. The police always cart the man away if kids are involved so I got arrested quite frequently even though I did nothing. In the end I was advised by my very expensive solicitor not to go back the house. She was supposed to sell the house but ignored the court order. In theend my sols told me to sell to her, which I did at a large cost to myself. She did very well out of the divorce and beter still found out there was a single pilot living at the top of the road so she made a beeline for him and was even more quids in. She has Narcissistic Personality Disorder and any time I challenge her about anything she uses my contact with my children to get back at me. These people are very manipulative and very convincing. They are also completley self centred and selfish and the word compromise does not exist in their vocabulary, so anything I tried to do, no matter how reasonable, does not work unless she wants it to work. I would have flipped and killed them both I reckon! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint-scooby Posted 28 July, 2010 Share Posted 28 July, 2010 Well, until a few months ago I was paying in excess of £1000 per month to my ex, plus extras for my 4 kids. I was working 7 days a week, sometimes not getting back home until 4 in the morning, after 3 years of this I said SOD IT, she can get a job. I was fed up of her saying she had no money, but she had a gardener, a cleaner, and a big drinking habit plus a nice house on the sea front I took time off from work to spend more time with the kids, and I got blasted for that. Luckly the CSA are not going to get involved as I am still paying her above what I should. Hold your ground. keep a diary of what you do and spend, and things you hear, its a very good thing to call upon when things get nasty Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonnyboy Posted 28 July, 2010 Share Posted 28 July, 2010 After reading this thread my heart goes out to all you fathers being screwed over. Probably a wrong thing to say but I am surprised more women are not murdered. yeah that is wrong, what with Fordingbridge this week and all Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saint1977 Posted 28 July, 2010 Share Posted 28 July, 2010 I think they're unfairly biased towards mothers in most cases. But back to my salient point - if you love your child, you'll do whatever you can, even if you don't have access. It's not fair on the child to use it as a bargaining tool. Exactly BTF and that works BOTH ways. I'm lucky in that if - God forbid - this situation ever occured between me and my wife - we wouldn't resort to some of the evil tactics that some of the posters here have been on the end of. In fact, if anything, my wife has been too generous and accommodating with her ex (although no kids involved there). Yes, both parties do have a duty to the child but that doesn't extend to ruining the other parent, which is only to the child's detriment in terms of the relationship between the biological parents, and isn't justifiable. The CSA should be disbanded as part of the spending cuts and replaced with a body that focuses on parents who are determined not to pay AT ALL and Government is right to pursue those individuals. It should stay out of cases where parents are negotiating and means testing should be compulsory. Whilst I am not advocating that new partners be made directly responsible for their partner's kids from a previous marriage, we should look very carefully down the last penny at what the mother is spending in relation to earning. She should have to make the same sacrifices as the ex-husband in terms of curtailing her lifestyle. After all, the new partner knows what they are taking on by getting involved with her. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SFKA South Woodford Posted 28 July, 2010 Share Posted 28 July, 2010 You have to be one special type of barsteward to work for the CSA. Frustrated traffic wardens is what I liken them to. They lie and cover up for each other. I wouldn't p on one if it was on fire. And yes, I do pay all mine. I worked with a guy who had previously worked for the CSA, and this was far from the case, he was actually a really nice bloke, who left the CSA when he didn't tow the line of bashing the fathers into submission. He told me some intresting things about how they operate, with monetary targets being set and consequences for not meeting them, a tittle tattle culture among their staff, and his partner who is a manager there, getting into trouble for telling fathers to come to amicable arrangements with the mothers as it would probably cost them less in the long run. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magnet Posted 28 July, 2010 Share Posted 28 July, 2010 I look after my two children half time and their mother has them half time. In my simplistic view of the world that should mean we are supporting them equally and neither parent should have to pay the other, especially since she earns £34,000pa lives in a mortgage free detached house, gets all the child benefit and has a live boyfriend on £100,000pa. In reality, even though I have a mortage I am expected to also pay her 20% of my income - money which should go towards my support of the kids, holidays for them etc. The system is totally skewed to benefitting the mother, not the interests of the children. I have two kids, one lives with me 100% of the time the other stays 3 days out of 7 with me but I still have to pay her £160 a month wheres the justice in that! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EastleighSoulBoy Posted 28 July, 2010 Share Posted 28 July, 2010 I worked with a guy who had previously worked for the CSA, and this was far from the case, he was actually a really nice bloke, who left the CSA when he didn't tow the line of bashing the fathers into submission. He told me some intresting things about how they operate, with monetary targets being set and consequences for not meeting them, a tittle tattle culture among their staff, and his partner who is a manager there, getting into trouble for telling fathers to come to amicable arrangements with the mothers as it would probably cost them less in the long run. Obviously I am speaking from a long history of experience with them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buctootim Posted 28 July, 2010 Share Posted 28 July, 2010 I have two kids, one lives with me 100% of the time the other stays 3 days out of 7 with me but I still have to pay her £160 a month wheres the justice in that! Its a totally one sided system. In your case could you not counter claim from her for support of the one who lives with you 100%? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saint boggy Posted 28 July, 2010 Share Posted 28 July, 2010 I have two kids, one lives with me 100% of the time the other stays 3 days out of 7 with me but I still have to pay her £160 a month wheres the justice in that! yeh, that is just wrong.....but ,playing Devil's advocate here, perhaps your earnings completely outstrip hers, in which case would it have been done so that both children are living in similar income homes maybe??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sadoldgit Posted 29 July, 2010 Author Share Posted 29 July, 2010 I worked with a guy who had previously worked for the CSA, and this was far from the case, he was actually a really nice bloke, who left the CSA when he didn't tow the line of bashing the fathers into submission. He told me some intresting things about how they operate, with monetary targets being set and consequences for not meeting them, a tittle tattle culture among their staff, and his partner who is a manager there, getting into trouble for telling fathers to come to amicable arrangements with the mothers as it would probably cost them less in the long run. The person handling my case was quite keen for me and my ex to come to an agreement between us as it saved her work and aggro. They can just then close the file, job done. Trouble is her partner got involved and wants what they say I should pay. My point is that I already pay that amount directly to the children via holidays, clothes etc and I can't afford to do that still if I pay them. So the support I gave them disappears and the money will just get swallowed up on my exs hair dressing appointments. What is wrong is the system for working out payments. It is not regional based, it is not means tested both sides of the divide. They tell me it costs £197 to bring up three children per week - surely that figures varies depending on where you live and what your lifestyle is like? When I see my girls I spend over £70 per day but I appreciate that is because we go to the cinema and do stuff. That doesn't get taken into account though yet my ex can't be bothered to take the kids out so if I don't do rarely happens. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sadoldgit Posted 29 July, 2010 Author Share Posted 29 July, 2010 I know of a mate of mine that took a poorly paid job when the CSA were doing their assessment. Then he got a better paid job but forgot to tell the his ex and the CSA! He keeps taking his kids to the IOW and Wales, but secretly sneaks off to Rio and Pattaya when nobody is looking. They can fine him for this and take the arrears so he better hope that his ex doesn't tell the CSA! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saintjay77 Posted 29 July, 2010 Share Posted 29 July, 2010 I have two kids, one lives with me 100% of the time the other stays 3 days out of 7 with me but I still have to pay her £160 a month wheres the justice in that! Im almost in the same boat. I have an 18 year old that lives away with his mum all the time. For some reason the CSA think I should carry on paying for him till he is 19. Strange but not arguing. My other 2 are with there mum 4 nights and me 3 nights. IMO 3 nights each should be covered by ourselves, and the extra night is what I should be paying for. That seems far too logical though. I was told however that if one of my kids stayed with me just that 1 extra night the claims each way would cancel each other out and there would be no payment either way. I would get child benifit and so on for one and she would get it for the other. So bang down the middle seems like the only fair way of doing things. Slightly one side of the other and one person is dragged through the streets by there balls. Your situation sounds like there is something not right though. the child thats with you 100% I take it is not your ex's? I have a step son thats with us perminently. CSA have supposedly been chasing his so called father for the last 7 years and got no-where. Which just goes to wind me up further when they phone me up all arsey cause they have made a mistake. Cause he is here the CSA take it into account and reduce how much I have to pay for mine or something but thats where I lose the will to live and start to not understand there logic at all. The system was set up to reign in the tossers that couldnt give a flying F about there kids but is used to hammer the parents that stand up to be counted. The tossers they were after continue to fiddle the books and strut about without a care in the world. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magnet Posted 30 July, 2010 Share Posted 30 July, 2010 Im almost in the same boat. I have an 18 year old that lives away with his mum all the time. For some reason the CSA think I should carry on paying for him till he is 19. Strange but not arguing. My other 2 are with there mum 4 nights and me 3 nights. IMO 3 nights each should be covered by ourselves, and the extra night is what I should be paying for. That seems far too logical though. I was told however that if one of my kids stayed with me just that 1 extra night the claims each way would cancel each other out and there would be no payment either way. I would get child benifit and so on for one and she would get it for the other. So bang down the middle seems like the only fair way of doing things. Slightly one side of the other and one person is dragged through the streets by there balls. Your situation sounds like there is something not right though. the child thats with you 100% I take it is not your ex's? I have a step son thats with us perminently. CSA have supposedly been chasing his so called father for the last 7 years and got no-where. Which just goes to wind me up further when they phone me up all arsey cause they have made a mistake. Cause he is here the CSA take it into account and reduce how much I have to pay for mine or something but thats where I lose the will to live and start to not understand there logic at all. The system was set up to reign in the tossers that couldnt give a flying F about there kids but is used to hammer the parents that stand up to be counted. The tossers they were after continue to fiddle the books and strut about without a care in the world. The one that is with me is my ex's to. As she chooses not to work I cant claim anything off her from the CSA. I do feel Im paying for the **** head fathers that dont. I did try been a **** head father but the did an attachment of earnings within 4 weeks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcjwills Posted 30 July, 2010 Share Posted 30 July, 2010 When I met my wife she had 2 girls that I supported, her Ex lived with his girlfriend and still does but gave up work and went unemployed as all he had to pay for both girls was £35.00 every 2 weeks, sodding £17.50 for 2 teenage girls at the time, didn't even keep them in phone vouchers at the time. What made it even worse was that when his eldest daughter wanted to go to Uni, and the course fees have to be paid for guess who was liable for them, yes dear old muggins here, I had to pay for his daughter to go to Uni, when asked if he would contribute 50% he said could not afford it but could afford 2 holidays a year including one to Australia for 4 weeks, we kept asking for him to be reassessed but we are sure he claimed he was a lodger at his girlfriends house. When it came to the end of my daughters uni course at her graduation, he wanted a ticket and asked why I should attend his daughter graduation over him. Talk about bloody cheek, expected me to pay and not go to the graduation, soon told him to fark off. So SOG go unemployed let the Govt pay the majority or her husband. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seaford Saint Posted 1 August, 2010 Share Posted 1 August, 2010 A sorry thread...was anyone else at St Mary's a few years ago when Fathers for justice were collecting? Spontaneous applause for them rang out. I have never forgotten that. 8 years ago I divorced. I recall the anger bitterness. The total confusion I felt, due mostly to a lack of sleep. It got better for me though and I am happily remaried. My son and were travelling back froma holiday in Charmouth yesterday and we were talking about life post divorce. I made light of how I thought he would appreciate me in the years to come...the sacrifices I made etc and the efforts I made to have the kids as often as I did. He made it clear how he recognised what I had done for him and his sister. I explained to him that after paying the mortgage, maintenance and everything else I was left with £200 a month for food. I think my boss gave me a generous pay rise in part due to my situation. I could not afford to use the central heating. My kids used to put hats and coats on and go to bed it was so cold for them. My ex used to sneer and say to the kids that I was mean. My current wife when we first met was really impressed with my efforts with my kids. My conclusion is this. Kids are not daft and they know deep down the rights and wrongs in any given situation. Do the right thing, spend as much time with your kids as you can. The best advice I remember from those dark days was this....Oprah Winfrey said (I got this from my sister) never insult your DNA. She meant, never slag off your ex partner to your kids. Tough I know Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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