Thedelldays Posted 22 July, 2010 Share Posted 22 July, 2010 Just imagine this: You're walking down the high street with your 3-year old son. Some bloke walks in front of you and treads on your sons toes (accidently? who knows) and he starts crying. You give him a piece of your mind but he ignores you and offers no apology, momentarily you lose your rag and push the bloke over. Somehow it causes him to die. What is the likelihood that the CPS would take over one year to come to a decision? What is the likelihood that the CPS would prevent it from going to court on some technicalities? What is the likelihood that enough time would elapse to prevent even lesser assault charges from being pressed? One rule for the Police. I wonder if that boncer that pushed the poster from here called sir griff (which lead to his death) went down or anything..? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EastleighSoulBoy Posted 22 July, 2010 Share Posted 22 July, 2010 I wonder if that boncer that pushed the poster from here called sir griff (which lead to his death) went down or anything..? Not sure of the outcome but I think there was a prosecution. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonnyboy Posted 22 July, 2010 Share Posted 22 July, 2010 http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-10723274 No charges to be brought. Good. Right Decision. ffs what does a copper have to do to someone to get charged?!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonnyboy Posted 22 July, 2010 Share Posted 22 July, 2010 simply bollix....when I got caught in the 2000 mayday riots (it was a farking riot..people crapping in the streets and smashing shops up)....I spoke to the police..(who initially pushed me around) and they let me through....and off home I went to camdem...walking most of the way I will add just think, they might have tonked you on the head and put you in a coffin, still, only doing their job eh? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ponty Posted 22 July, 2010 Share Posted 22 July, 2010 Just imagine this: You're walking down the high street with your 3-year old son. Some bloke walks in front of you and treads on your sons toes (accidently? who knows) and he starts crying. You give him a piece of your mind but he ignores you and offers no apology, momentarily you lose your rag and push the bloke over. Somehow it causes him to die. What is the likelihood that the CPS would take over one year to come to a decision? What is the likelihood that the CPS would prevent it from going to court on some technicalities? What is the likelihood that enough time would elapse to prevent even lesser assault charges from being pressed? One rule for the Police. I cannot get my head round this. Why, on God's green Earth, would a copper take his 3 year old son to a riot? He should be charged with neglect at least. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndyNorthernSaints Posted 22 July, 2010 Share Posted 22 July, 2010 simply bollix....when I got caught in the 2000 mayday riots (it was a farking riot..people crapping in the streets and smashing shops up)....I spoke to the police..(who initially pushed me around) and they let me through....and off home I went to camdem...walking most of the way I will add I can't imagine you leaving the scene without arguing your case :-o Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom8558 Posted 22 July, 2010 Share Posted 22 July, 2010 But don't you think that that officer is already being punished because he has killed someone and has to wake up every single day with that in his mind. I don't agree with what he did but if you sacked him then he would probably be near the point of suicide. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EastleighSoulBoy Posted 22 July, 2010 Share Posted 22 July, 2010 But don't you think that that officer is already being punished because he has killed someone and has to wake up every single day with that in his mind. I don't agree with what he did but if you sacked him then he would probably be near the point of suicide. As many would point out to us lefties, he should have thought about it before he did it. If he can't control himself, a good policeman's attribute, then he shouldn't be doing the job. How can anyone step to his defence when the CPS concede that he performed an unlawful act? They then contradict themselves by stating that there were no prospects of a conviction. They now know, arguably, how a jury might find? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benjii Posted 22 July, 2010 Share Posted 22 July, 2010 I cannot get my head round this. Why, on God's green Earth, would a copper take his 3 year old son to a riot? He should be charged with neglect at least. You're an admin. Don't be an adbell-end. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benjii Posted 22 July, 2010 Share Posted 22 July, 2010 But don't you think that that officer is already being punished because he has killed someone and has to wake up every single day with that in his mind. I don't agree with what he did but if you sacked him then he would probably be near the point of suicide. It probably does play on his mind and remorse can count in your favour as mitigation. That doesn't give rise to the principle that people who commit illegal acts should be excused prosecution if they suffer self-inflicted mental anguish as a result. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ST Randy Posted 22 July, 2010 Share Posted 22 July, 2010 Imagine the headlines if this had happened in Zimbabwe. Or Iran. Or anywhere else in the world in a country that we do not like. "Unarmed bystander killed by the police" or "police get away with causing an innocent man's death" or even "Unarmed protestor killed by police" The outcry would have been huge. The Foreign Office would be involved in diplomatic acts of the highest order. God knows how we look in the eyes of the rest of the world but decisions like the CPS's today really make me question the future of this country. The fact that the policeman is getting Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperMikey Posted 22 July, 2010 Share Posted 22 July, 2010 The outcome of this trial is f*cking disgusting. While manslaughter charges may have been a bit harsh, the guy just gets away scott free? He pushed the bloke over for no apparent reason, as well as tonking him with his baton (this is The Lounge, I realise the innuendo in that part of the sentence...) and triggered his death. If it was the other way round, a newspaper seller pushes a policeman, the newspaper seller would've been locked up by now and facing manslaughter charges. The way this country works sometimes just f*cking sickens me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thedelldays Posted 22 July, 2010 Share Posted 22 July, 2010 just think, they might have tonked you on the head and put you in a coffin, still, only doing their job eh? but they did not tonk him on the head...they (or someone) pushed him... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Verbal Posted 22 July, 2010 Share Posted 22 July, 2010 It seems the officer who beat Tomlinson to the ground has form. http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/financetopics/g20-summit/7905549/G20-riots-policeman-who-stuck-Ian-Tomlinson-faced-two-previous-aggression-inquiries.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonnyboy Posted 22 July, 2010 Share Posted 22 July, 2010 but they did not tonk him on the head...they (or someone) pushed him... what do you mean "someone"? - there is video evidence ffs, which as usual disproved some of the cops denials in the first place, he was pushed over and whacked hard on the backside, try watching it http://www.youtube.com/watch#!v=QMt0WtSjXAg&feature=related also http://www.youtube.com/watch#!v=6THfDGy1hN4&feature=related Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonnyboy Posted 22 July, 2010 Share Posted 22 July, 2010 It seems the officer who beat Tomlinson to the ground has form. http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/financetopics/g20-summit/7905549/G20-riots-policeman-who-stuck-Ian-Tomlinson-faced-two-previous-aggression-inquiries.html what a surprise. I read with interest his face was covered as was his identity number, plus a police dog bit Mr Tomlinson as well Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rut Posted 22 July, 2010 Share Posted 22 July, 2010 there you are folks. a model citizen. not like all you "protestors" and anti-establishment types, going around causing trouble. they get what they deserve. blair peach, liddle towers, jean charles de menezes. they all had it coming. Just put a bit of the Upstarts on. Good to see (yet another) Punk anthem from the late 70's/early 80's standing the test of time. As for this bloke not getting done? Course he didn't. He's Old Bill. There are the law (and therefore above it). As the 4-Skins sang - 'One law for them - and another one for us'. Guess what? Another Punk athem that.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint_clark Posted 22 July, 2010 Share Posted 22 July, 2010 F*cking ridiculous decision. One of the things in that video that angers me the most is that the copper who pushes him clearly scarpers off to stand to the right somewhere so when the bloke turns round to see what the f*ck happened, he's faced with a line of police, none of whom actually did anything. F*cking cowardly, that's what it is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EastleighSoulBoy Posted 23 July, 2010 Share Posted 23 July, 2010 It seems the officer who beat Tomlinson to the ground has form. http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/financetopics/g20-summit/7905549/G20-riots-policeman-who-stuck-Ian-Tomlinson-faced-two-previous-aggression-inquiries.html Hmmmmmmm, what's that about leopards changing their spots? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anothersaintinsouthsea Posted 23 July, 2010 Share Posted 23 July, 2010 I cannot get my head round this. Why, on God's green Earth, would a copper take his 3 year old son to a riot? He should be charged with neglect at least. so funny Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anothersaintinsouthsea Posted 23 July, 2010 Share Posted 23 July, 2010 Even the IPCC thought it should go for trial: http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2010/jul/22/ian-tomlinson-g20-cps-ruling Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gemmel Posted 23 July, 2010 Share Posted 23 July, 2010 F*cking ridiculous decision. One of the things in that video that angers me the most is that the copper who pushes him clearly scarpers off to stand to the right somewhere so when the bloke turns round to see what the f*ck happened, he's faced with a line of police, none of whom actually did anything. F*cking cowardly, that's what it is. I noticed that as well. This is a shocking decision and is detrimental to the all the decent coppers out there. I've seen the "rent a mobs" that turn up at every protest and try and kick things off and accept that sometimes, police under extreme provocation need to act with less traditional methods. I can also quite clearly see this guy Tomlinson was not just walking home from work. He was deliberately walking slowly in front of the police and dogs (You don't walk inbetween 3 snarling police dogs) for whatever reason. But that said he was not breaking the law, he was not violent and it was his right to protest. What that copper did was wrong and whether it did or didn't result in the guys death, you can't have coppers behaving like that, espeacially when the public has seen the video clip. I would bet that most coppers are gutted with the decision as in some way or another it will impact them, the next time they try and arrest someone for assult or the next time they are involved in public disorder. This wont go away and losing his job wont be enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EastleighSoulBoy Posted 23 July, 2010 Share Posted 23 July, 2010 I noticed that as well. This is a shocking decision and is detrimental to the all the decent coppers out there. I've seen the "rent a mobs" that turn up at every protest and try and kick things off and accept that sometimes, police under extreme provocation need to act with less traditional methods. I can also quite clearly see this guy Tomlinson was not just walking home from work. He was deliberately walking slowly in front of the police and dogs (You don't walk inbetween 3 snarling police dogs) for whatever reason. But that said he was not breaking the law, he was not violent and it was his right to protest. What that copper did was wrong and whether it did or didn't result in the guys death, you can't have coppers behaving like that, espeacially when the public has seen the video clip. I would bet that most coppers are gutted with the decision as in some way or another it will impact them, the next time they try and arrest someone for assult or the next time they are involved in public disorder. This wont go away and losing his job wont be enough. I think you've summed it up fairly. To me it would have been in the public's interest to charge and prosecute. The people need a confidence in their Police also a proof that the Police, themselves, are being policed. There are only a small minority of bad apples within the police but they make it hard for all the good eggs because the bad apples are the ones who get remembered when a situation deteriorates and the police are needed to act strongly and lawfully, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ponty Posted 23 July, 2010 Share Posted 23 July, 2010 You're an admin. Don't be an adbell-end. Sorry, but I couldn't understand the comparison. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anothersaintinsouthsea Posted 23 July, 2010 Share Posted 23 July, 2010 Sorry, but I couldn't understand the comparison. It's fairly simple I was trying to present a situation where an ordinary member of the public might lost their temper and push someone over who then died. I invited the reader of the post to imagine that they were walking on a high street with a young child, how you could interpret that as a policeman taking a toddler to a riot I don't know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ponty Posted 23 July, 2010 Share Posted 23 July, 2010 It's fairly simple I was trying to present a situation where an ordinary member of the public might lost their temper and push someone over who then died. I invited the reader of the post to imagine that they were walking on a high street with a young child, how you could interpret that as a policeman taking a toddler to a riot I don't know. But the copper had no excuse to lose his temper. I'm not sure we're coming at this from a different opinion, as I think the copper should have been prosecuted and agree that Joe Public certainly would have been, but I think the analogy is a bit flawed. Anyway, no matter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jonnyboy Posted 23 July, 2010 Share Posted 23 July, 2010 Even the IPCC thought it should go for trial: http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2010/jul/22/ian-tomlinson-g20-cps-ruling delldays knows better Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
millbrooktonian Posted 27 July, 2010 Share Posted 27 July, 2010 Did the PC and other PC's on duty that day, deliberately obscure the numbers on their uniforms, surely this is a disciplinary offence ? It is a sad day for justice when the CPS prevent a jury deciding if Ian Tomilnson was killed unlawfully. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barney Trubble Posted 28 July, 2010 Share Posted 28 July, 2010 Is being awkward worthy of death then now? If the Police can't be trusted to deal with a person being awkward then than does make me worry. Where was he pushing the boundaries? Is that all you can tolerate? Is that the best you have got? If you think what that man did deserved that beating then you are a mentally weak and feeble excuse for a man, just as those officers were, god help you in a pressure situation......dear, dear....and to think you were responsible for being in control of a gun It'd be like the wild west if you were in Iraq or Afghanistan then today........they'd crack you so easily if that's the best you could take without dishing out almighty force.......I can just imagine you approaching hostile forces and a tense situation unfolds, they start walking away, but are being a bit "awkward".......then Delldays pulls the trigger as he can't handle it mentally Move on son or we beat the **** out of you is the message or answer that modern days sends out to how best deal with somene being "awkward"? Is this North Korea or a civilised and non-oppressive country? It seems you would prefere to live in the former. Jeez, we are such a backward country if we really analyse ourselves and behaviour. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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