Is Cortese deliberately trying to annoy the fans.

[Dave Benson Phillips]

I have heard a rumour that the training ground revamp has stalled due to the contractors walking out due to Cortese, can anyone confirm this?

 

Correct.

 

Something to do with Cortese demanding they start work without him crossing their palm with silver because his word is his honour, or some sh!t like that ( allegedly )

 

But yes, a change of contractors has indeed delayed it.

[trousers]

Correct.

 

Something to do with Cortese demanding they start work without him crossing their palm with silver because his word is his honour, or some sh!t like that ( allegedly )

 

But yes, a change of contractors has indeed delayed it.

 

Yet another shrewd business move by Cortese: Never pay a builder up front. Matt Albright would be proud ;-)

[CanadaSaint]

This is starting to sound quite worrying.

 

It seems to me that a number of Cortese's actions in past months are all about financial responsibility and sustainability - becoming and staying profitable. Not just "when we get back to the Prem" but right now as well.

 

The decision not to fire AP (at significant cost), the season ticket changes, the Staplewood delay, the lengthy list of released players, the lack of progress on signings and several other things would all fit into that pattern.

 

I wonder if he reached a lot of those decisions after seeing the interim finances.

 

He's not doing this stuff to please or p*ss off the fans but he might be doing them to keep the finances strong.

 

Now if that's the case I'm not going to knock him because I think this is what football in general needs to do, but it would mean that having a "minted" owner is kind of irrelevant at the moment. It would also mean that we'll go into this season without the big advantage we've been hoping for.

 

If we sell any starters, the picture would be clear. God forbid.

 

Just some thoughts.

[SaintBobby]

Everything seems a bit over-heated here. As a fan - and STH - I'm pretty damned pleased with the overall ownership picture. Loved last season. Loved it.

 

My worry is simply that a few things seem a bit, well, crappy.

 

I'm just a tad surprised I've received nothing in the post asking me to renew my season ticket. No probs for me. I check the OS virtually everyday. But I sort of imagined there'd be an aggressive marketing drive to increase our STHs to, say, 15,000. You know the sort of thing - door-to-door leaflet drops in Soton, posterboards saying "come and watch the Saints", aggressive advertising of our pre-season friendlies and some tasty pre-season friendlies too (e.g. Ajax not Reading).

 

I just expected this stuff to happen effortlessly and to be be rolled out from, say, mid-March. Maybe my hopes were too high or maybe I just don't get marketing.

 

But Im just surprised at the rudimentary things that have apparently not been done. An example was a failure to get programmes printed for the Southend game at the end of last season. Ok, stuff happens. But I've never known it to happen before at a professional football club.

 

Or David Luker not having the time to promote the new ST prices. Weird. We knew we were staying in League One at the end of April. Sort of expected season ticket prices to be announced and widely advertised by the 1st of May. Or maybe a well-drilled March Madness offer when we still had a shot of the play-offs. Again, I'm not that bothered. If we win on the pitch, then if we never print a programme again, or cant offer installment plans for STs or only advertise ST prices way after the season has ended on the OS, then fine.

 

But to me, it just points to something not being quite right somewhere. That's what troubling me, rather than any of the specific things that seem to have gone awry.

[trousers]

Perhaps it's time to resurrect one of my bizzare conspiracy theories from the past....the one about Cortese and Liebherr perhaps not being what they seemed on the surface 12 months ago...or perhaps not...

[Dave Benson Phillips]

Last day of season ticket renewals, I fully expect emails, text messages, maybe even a phone call asking me why I have not renewed. Press and radio advertising and massive coverage on the OS.

 

( yes I haven't renewed, contrary to earlier posts )

 

No???

 

Now someone please try and tell me that they haven't deliberately tried to reduce Season Ticket numbers again?

[sandwichsaint]

Everything seems a bit over-heated here. As a fan - and STH - I'm pretty damned pleased with the overall ownership picture. Loved last season. Loved it.

 

My worry is simply that a few things seem a bit, well, crappy.

 

I'm just a tad surprised I've received nothing in the post asking me to renew my season ticket. No probs for me. I check the OS virtually everyday. But I sort of imagined there'd be an aggressive marketing drive to increase our STHs to, say, 15,000. You know the sort of thing - door-to-door leaflet drops in Soton, posterboards saying "come and watch the Saints", aggressive advertising of our pre-season friendlies and some tasty pre-season friendlies too (e.g. Ajax not Reading).

 

I just expected this stuff to happen effortlessly and to be be rolled out from, say, mid-March. Maybe my hopes were too high or maybe I just don't get marketing.

 

But Im just surprised at the rudimentary things that have apparently not been done. An example was a failure to get programmes printed for the Southend game at the end of last season. Ok, stuff happens. But I've never known it to happen before at a professional football club.

 

Or David Luker not having the time to promote the new ST prices. Weird. We knew we were staying in League One at the end of April. Sort of expected season ticket prices to be announced and widely advertised by the 1st of May. Or maybe a well-drilled March Madness offer when we still had a shot of the play-offs. Again, I'm not that bothered. If we win on the pitch, then if we never print a programme again, or cant offer installment plans for STs or only advertise ST prices way after the season has ended on the OS, then fine.

 

But to me, it just points to something not being quite right somewhere. That's what troubling me, rather than any of the specific things that seem to have gone awry.

 

Far too reasonable, that'll never catch on round here.

[sadoldgit]

Things have improved football wise so that is something to be thankful about. Cortese is probably cut from the same cloth as Lowe and ceratinly doesn't have any PR savvy, but if we keep going in the same direction does it really matter?

 

I was concerned about his apparent lack of support for the manager and lack of knowledge about football, but if he backs Pardew and lets him do his thing that is all you can ask of a CEO.

[trousers]

Last day of season ticket renewals, I fully expect emails, text messages, maybe even a phone call asking me why I have not renewed. Press and radio advertising and massive coverage on the OS.

 

( yes I haven't renewed, contrary to earlier posts )

 

No???

 

Now someone please try and tell me that they haven't deliberately tried to reduce Season Ticket numbers again?

 

We won't know the answer to that until we see what the number of season tickets sold at the start of the season. You could well be correct.

[sandwichsaint]

Sure, seeing as I was talking about how it was wrong for someone that is banned or risking their mental health to be posting on here, just by you posting a reply, I would say you are wrong. Just because you think it is ok to ignore a banning, some of us think this is wrong, ie, it is against the rules. But, that is my question to the mods, because, that is how I perceive the rules to be. However, I am not so righteous as to want someone banned for life or reincarnate themselves as a new poster, if, they did it in a way which didn't continue their methods which got them banned in the first place.

 

I have argued with people on here, and, in the past, maybe the mods have been leniant with some of my comments. But, I try not to swear, I try no to antagonise and I try to reason and debate issues, whilst accepting there are 2 sides to every arguement. Sometimes that is difficult and I have over stepped the mark by a smidging. However, I have control over myself and if I have one wrong, I tend to slepp on it and re-position myself. For instance, I do owe one poster on here an apology. I misread their post and my response made me sound pompous. This was unintentional, I will apologise in time, but, I couldn;t at the time because I didn;t want to add more fuel to the flames of another tedious thread on the same topic, hijacked by the same people. I was annoyed and let my heart rule my mind. I realised I had posted the wrong thing and I did what I usually do, I stop posting and reflect on why. In due course I will apologise to this poster because he argued his side very well, despite of my pompous reply, and I admire him for that, and will tell him so when I think the apology will not be used to fuel the flames of this argument again.

 

So, I have used this post to show you how I think you are wrong to continually post on this subject in the way that you do if you are banned. I will leave it to others to decide if they think you are wrong also. If I am wrong and you are a new poster, never to have posted on this site, or its predecessor before, then I apologise. But, if you are a new poster, I have one question, how did you come to hate NC so quickly and over this one decision, because as you have pointed out, in your opinion, he has been taking advantage of us gullible fans and persecuting the media and hero's for months, 200+ posts in little over 1 month, that's quite some hatred, so why this hatred?

 

I feel your pain!

[LostBoys]

Marcus and Nicola out - bring back the Pinnacle guy as I hear he has now raised another 10p. Its amazing what no news does to this forum although I agree with complaints about the ST payment instalment plan being dropped.

 

Also the parking price has risen to £200 but I have not complained as I now get my old farts discount on the ST.

[Saint Fan CaM]

Everything seems a bit over-heated here. As a fan - and STH - I'm pretty damned pleased with the overall ownership picture. Loved last season. Loved it.

 

My worry is simply that a few things seem a bit, well, crappy.

 

But to me, it just points to something not being quite right somewhere. That's what troubling me, rather than any of the specific things that seem to have gone awry.

 

I think perhaps we all feel that way a little bit because for a number reasons things are a bit slow on the news front. This is just the way of NC it seems - he prefers to ensure Saints lead the way on positive Saints news - fair play I say.

 

It is clear that there is work on-going at SMS to revitalise the stadium. I feel sure there are or will be soon new players coming in - we couldn't compete without them. It's July 1st tomorrow and the players start pre-season next week, so in the next week or two, we'll start to hear about a few things and I predict some of the negativity on the forum will start to evaporate.

[Dave Benson Phillips]

We won't know the answer to that until we see what the number of season tickets sold at the start of the season. You could well be correct.

 

I am correct on the point I am making. It's on the final number of Season Tickets that is yet to be determined, but I think surely we can all agree that SFC could have had many more season ticket holders "if they wanted them"

 

SFC have put in LOADS of measures which would ensure minimal season ticket takeup. There is absolutely no doubt about that, regardless what the number is, they have put absolutely no effort into selling them, on that front, surely you can agree with me?

[Chez]

Virtually all Saints fans I have spoke (sic) to think withdrawing the repayment plan at short notice isn't much to be concerned about in the general scheme of things.

 

I guess it depends with whom one talks to.

in your case probably not supporters that use the payment plan then or give a **** about less well off supporters than themselves.

[trousers]

I predict some of the negativity on the forum will start to evaporate.

 

Sir, if i may say so, your optimism is both admiral and foolhardy! :-)

[Saint Fan CaM]

Sir, if i may say so, your optimism is both admiral and foolhardy! :-)

 

I did say some!

[SaintRichmond]

I'll answer your questions, even though I agree that Cortese is being too ruthless in trying to extract every last penny from the paying customer.

 

Installment plan; unerstandable to scrap it in its previous form as the club were losing money from it for no real gain. The argument whether they should offer an alternative has been done to death so I won't revsiit that, but my point of lack of notice stands; if they'd announced the scrapping of the plan months before this isn't an issue.

 

Tciket tax: I think its perfectly understandable to have a ticket tax separate to the cost of the ticket so that the booking process is transparent. that said, it needs to be reflective of the actual cost, and £3 is too high IMO.

 

Half season tickets: like I said, I can't fathom it out, not sure if I agree with your reasoning that they don't want ST holders but you may be proved right, we'll see.

 

And I agree with your last point.

 

For the Reading friendly, a Senior Citizen seat in Kingsland will cost £5 ........but if purchased via phone, it will be an extra £3 (60% mark up)

 

Methinks a lot of Zimmers will block the road leading to the Ticket Offices

[MINIBARCELONASAINT]

Makaton Man:

Now someone please try and tell me that they haven't deliberately tried to reduce Season Ticket numbers again?

 

Do we need to advertise Season Tickets?

I am sure we already have a bigger fanbase than most teams, if not all, in our league and probably rank in the top half of the Championship, going on last season's average attendance of 20,982. With Norwich and Leeds promoted that leaves us as the club with the highest average attendance of the league because Sheff Wed had 23,719 and with their ST sales decreasing due to relegation, they may be the only club to rival us for average attandance, as Peterborough and Plymouth both had average attendances under 11,000.

With the fact that our tickets are the 2nd/3rd most expensive in the league paired with the fact we have the 1st/2nd highest average attandance, that probably makes us comfortably the most profitable club from gate receipts.

 

Now knowing that, is advertising really necessary?

 

Ok, I understand that printing a story on the OS is free but excluding that, every other form of advertising could potentially cost more than it earns back.

If the individual game prices haven't risen, as some have said, (I actually haven't looked into it, I just bought my ST and got on with life like one of those plain old boring people because for me all the advertising I needed was last season, a team that play for each other and some top quality players, oh and a Wembley trip), we should still sell roughly 5000 non season-ticket tickets for each game.

If Cortese is simply here to make money out of quickly, or want to come across as fan loving with his sponsorless shirts etc but then actually making up the loss on tickets etc, why would he then make no effort to sell tickets?

I would argue that scrapping half season tickets is a subtle push in the direction of buying a season ticket actually, making people buy one knowing they cant get one in January, and if they dont do that they will be buying per game, thus paying slightly higher prices for Cortese to lace our team with class.

How many businesses are successful without being harsh occasionally, Cortese and Leibherr bought a football club not a charity, so we can't expect 70's prices for tickets. Another point worth mentioning is that it isn't just ticket prices etc rising, the cost of everything is rising (in general), with higher costs for the club they are going to have to raise income.

What will speak for itself is when the season starts; last season looked daunting at the beginning, I am sure some part fans/plastic fans didn't purchase a ST last season and may do this season and with a long time left till they go off of sale, you can expect ST sales to keep rising.

Success breeds success too, so when Saints get off to their winning start ticket sales will slowly rise as we march up the table. I honestly dont understand why people are moaning! We love to wind up Porksmuff down the road about how we have bigger attendances but now we are suggesting our own chairman is trying to reduce attendances.

 

I don't think DBP is a Cortese hater, he is an antagonist that sparks interesting debate from some but occasionally it turns into a slagging match. He makes good points, not always, but he does and I would rather prove him wrong by constructing a sensible arguement than by rofl lolling owning pwning him.

[trousers]

I am correct on the point I am making. It's on the final number of Season Tickets that is yet to be determined, but I think surely we can all agree that SFC could have had many more season ticket holders "if they wanted them"

 

SFC have put in LOADS of measures which would ensure minimal season ticket takeup. There is absolutely no doubt about that, regardless what the number is, they have put absolutely no effort into selling them, on that front, surely you can agree with me?

 

Yes, I entirely agree. They could (and some say 'should') have marketed season tickets much better. I think 99% of people agree with you there.

 

I believe where the 'disagreement' comes into play is that some (the majority perhaps?) of the Saints fan base don't see it as a significant issue whereas some see it as more significant than others.

 

For me, the jury's out.

 

This could either be the thin end of a ruthless business wedge from Cortese in a dogmatic push for top flight football as soon as possible - and at all costs - or it could simply be misguided incompetence.

 

All I'm suggesting is that we won't definitively know which scenario is correct until 2 or 3 years down the line.

 

So, yep, most people are in wild agreement that the way Cortese has approached season ticket sales has not showed much loyalty and understanding to existing season ticket holders (and, yes, that MAY come back to haunt him) but I don't think that is where the debate actually lies. The debate lies in the future consequences, not in the fact that it has happened.

[SaintRichmond]

You are a **** of the highest order and worth getting banned for

 

THAT is a pathetic statement and you know it. Whether you agree OR disagree with anyone, they have the right to express. Not only that, they have the right to expect criticism if merited, and arguments against if warrented. Knock his argument down with a bone fide response, not abuse

"What have the Romans ever done for us ? "

That is all he is asking re Cortese's rapport with US SUPPORTERS. A valid question deserving a valid logical reply

IS Cortese interested in US FANS ?? Is his Policy purely Monetary ??

Answer THAT ..... don't just slag off the poster

[Dave Benson Phillips]

 

I don't think DBP is a Cortese hater, he is an antagonist that sparks interesting debate from some but occasionally it turns into a slagging match. He makes good points, not always, but he does and I would rather prove him wrong by constructing a sensible arguement than by rofl lolling owning pwning him.

 

Errr... to be honest I lost interest in your post when you tried to say that SFC do not need to advertise if they want to maximise revenue.

 

I will state to you the 3 groups of people who you get in membership based sales.

 

A) The people who will, regardless of terms and conditions, price, value for month etc.

 

B) The re-active customer, someone who will join, but they need selling, through telesales, advertising, big signings, an offer, press releases, renewal packs etc

 

C) Those that won't renew regardless.

 

That is how it works, it's the first rule of membership based sales, you need to concentrate on Group B, these are the people you need to sell to and these are the people that will shape what your attendances are. The club have not only not made even the very slightest effort to capture fans from Group B, not only that but they have even tried to force out a number from Group A with the restrictive selling of tickets, removal of installment plan etc etc

[once_bitterne]

I quite shocked at the amount of vitriol being aimed at Cortese (and really do hope he remains unaware of it) given the immense progress the club have made in 12 months in which he has been Chairman of the club. To go from where we were this time last season to where we are now is a great achievement and one that, without Mawhinny’s 15 point deduction, could have already meant us being in the CCC.

But then it suddenly dawned on me! Most golf clubs provide some called a Social Membership. This means the member can enjoy all the social aspects of the club without actually having to venture out on the course itself. There is a parallel to this at SFC. A large proportion of our fans are football fans, we love the game, love to discuss football and love seeing the team we support do well. To us Cortese has been a total success, we won something like 10 home games in a row last season and went to Wembley and saw the team lift a Cup, not bad for the first season in charge.

However, we also have a second, albeit smaller, group of fans who could be called Social Fans. These fans who attend games solely for the social aspect. For them it’s all about turning up with their mates, having a laugh and in most cases getting drunk. They tend to arrive at the game late, leave for half time early, arrive for the second half late and leave the game early. They have little or no interest in what is going on on the pitch, it’s all about having a few beers with their mates and hurling abuse at the opposition fans. Funnily enough most of our ‘Social’ fans seem to take s quiet pleasure in when there is any crowd trouble in and around the game.

For our Social fans, Cortese has not been a success at all. He has made it more difficult for them to sit together by removing the payment plan, and if they can’t go with their mates there is little point in going to matches at all as football holds about as much interest to them as it does for Dale Winton. Cortese also refused to give them notice of the pre-season tour as many socials wanted spend their Summer hols following the club around Europe (tho in fairness would almost certainly been too drunk to actually attend any games)

I would assume the same Social fan behaviour has existed for the World Cup. The Social fans will be at the pub cheering on England with their mates but I would strongly assume that, if at home on their own, they would have rather watched a repeat of an episode of Columbo than one of the lunchtime kickoffs.

It does seem that Cortese is indeed actively trying to discourage these Social fans. TBH, as a football fan I really don’t have any problem with this at all.

It was asked somewhere on this thread to list all the positive PR things that Cortese has done. Well my list would be:

Appoint a Prem level Manager even though a L1 club

Sign the top goal scorer from the season before last

Sign the top scorer in L1 at Christmas last season.

Sign one of the best defenders in the CCC even tho a L1 club

Win a high % of home games last season

Go to Wembley

Win a Cup

Not a bad list for 12 months in the job. However, I do admit, that there is little there for the social fan….

[Red_No_7]

I think NC has made some good decisions over the last 12 months and some not so good ones.

At the end of the day he has all the power and is answerable only to one man, unlike Lowe he can get away with anything.

 

From where we were a season ago I think most are very glad that Liebherr and Cortese rode into town but.........various people who are well-placed and no axe to grind, tell me he is making a large number of enemies out there, there are many decent and hard working employees at SMS who are unhappy at his style of running things and there are many close to the club who think Cortese to be utterly out of control and acting like a despot. I have heard enough to be worried.

 

I hate to say this but I think next season is not going to be a smooth one and the bookies, although making us favourites, maybe unaware of a lot of tension bubbling along under the surface.

 

.....

[miserableoldgit]

Posting at work, and now my wonderful evening has come to an end, I have popped on here for a browse. Notice a gap in posting yesterday evening and this evening... because I was having a life

Up to 17 posts a day now Stu! Still posting from work?? How are you finding the time with all of that high-powered advertising/business stuff that you do??

[alpine_saint]

At this moment in time, I see no evidence of tight-fistedness on the playing side from Cortese. He is simply trying to maximise revenue for sustainability whilst testing how far he can really push the fans to cough up. However, 1st July is almost upon us, and if we see no team strengthening over the next 2 weeks, the alarm bells that we have another Lowe on our hands should start ringing.

 

Maybe some of the "In AP We Trust" brigade can ask themselves if some of the revenue-boosting schemes coming from the club (at the expense of the fan) are due to their Messiah Above Reproach failing to get us to the playoffs last season despite huge team investment.........

[The9]

some people are never happy. I suggest you follow an american sport that is scripted to keep people happy. Maybe WWF wrestling is the way forward for you. The fact that the only bid on the table to keep the club alive was from ML/NC suggests to me that they have the right to do the **** they like if they deliver a saints team for us to watch

 

You clearly haven't watched wrestling in a very long time.

[NickG]

I quite shocked at the amount of vitriol being aimed at Cortese (and really do hope he remains unaware of it) given the immense progress the club have made in 12 months in which he has been Chairman of the club. To go from where we were this time last season to where we are now is a great achievement and one that, without Mawhinny’s 15 point deduction, could have already meant us being in the CCC.

But then it suddenly dawned on me! Most golf clubs provide some called a Social Membership. This means the member can enjoy all the social aspects of the club without actually having to venture out on the course itself. There is a parallel to this at SFC. A large proportion of our fans are football fans, we love the game, love to discuss football and love seeing the team we support do well. To us Cortese has been a total success, we won something like 10 home games in a row last season and went to Wembley and saw the team lift a Cup, not bad for the first season in charge.

However, we also have a second, albeit smaller, group of fans who could be called Social Fans. These fans who attend games solely for the social aspect. For them it’s all about turning up with their mates, having a laugh and in most cases getting drunk. They tend to arrive at the game late, leave for half time early, arrive for the second half late and leave the game early. They have little or no interest in what is going on on the pitch, it’s all about having a few beers with their mates and hurling abuse at the opposition fans. Funnily enough most of our ‘Social’ fans seem to take s quiet pleasure in when there is any crowd trouble in and around the game.

For our Social fans, Cortese has not been a success at all. He has made it more difficult for them to sit together by removing the payment plan, and if they can’t go with their mates there is little point in going to matches at all as football holds about as much interest to them as it does for Dale Winton. Cortese also refused to give them notice of the pre-season tour as many socials wanted spend their Summer hols following the club around Europe (tho in fairness would almost certainly been too drunk to actually attend any games)

I would assume the same Social fan behaviour has existed for the World Cup. The Social fans will be at the pub cheering on England with their mates but I would strongly assume that, if at home on their own, they would have rather watched a repeat of an episode of Columbo than one of the lunchtime kickoffs.

It does seem that Cortese is indeed actively trying to discourage these Social fans. TBH, as a football fan I really don’t have any problem with this at all.

It was asked somewhere on this thread to list all the positive PR things that Cortese has done. Well my list would be:

Appoint a Prem level Manager even though a L1 club

Sign the top goal scorer from the season before last

Sign the top scorer in L1 at Christmas last season.

Sign one of the best defenders in the CCC even tho a L1 club

Win a high % of home games last season

Go to Wembley

Win a Cup

Not a bad list for 12 months in the job. However, I do admit, that there is little there for the social fan….

 

Some good points there.

[Capel Saint]

Did Cortese not say when Lebherr first bought the club that he wanted to ensure that the club is self sufficient and does not keep going to the owner for a wedge of cash each season. Maybe these season ticket changes are part of this process.

[Dave Benson Phillips]

Did Cortese not say when Lebherr first bought the club that he wanted to ensure that the club is self sufficient and does not keep going to the owner for a wedge of cash each season. Maybe these season ticket changes are part of this process.

 

If this is a way of making more money, why don't the other 91 clubs in the league adopt this strategy?

 

Just playing devils advocate, like.

[miserableoldgit]

If this is a way of making more money, why don't the other 91 clubs in the league adopt this strategy?

 

Just playing devils advocate, like.

 

Really?

[Dave Benson Phillips]

Really?

 

I am genuinely interested if people honestly believe that Cortese is right and the other 91 teams are wrong.

 

Nobody so far has given me a straight answer. :-(

[Capel Saint]

If this is a way of making more money, why don't the other 91 clubs in the league adopt this strategy?

 

Just playing devils advocate, like.

 

No idea as I don;t have access to Mr Cortese to ask him, however, if season ticket sales and attendance levels at games fall this season then we will know the answer. Time will tell!

[Dave Benson Phillips]

No idea as I don;t have access to Mr Cortese to ask him, however, if season ticket sales and attendance levels at games fall this season then we will know the answer. Time will tell!

 

As long as people give a balance view and understand that in a title winning season ( as everyone is expecting ) sales should be up anyway, so anything less than an average of 23/24k is a fail in my opinion.

 

And the real test will be Dagenham and Redbridge, below 10k is going to be a real possibilty.

 

I don't expect like Dulldays to come on here and admit they were wrong you, people have seen from today that he won't put his hands up about the pre-season tour.

[miserableoldgit]

I am genuinely interested if people honestly believe that Cortese is right and the other 91 teams are wrong.

 

Nobody so far has given me a straight answer. :-(

The only answer is "Time Will Tell". This time next year we will all know if Mr Cortese`s strategy

has worked. If it hasn`t, no doubt he will change it.

[Dave Benson Phillips]

The only answer is "Time Will Tell". This time next year we will all know if Mr Cortese`s strategy

has worked. If it hasn`t, no doubt he will change it.

 

Are we all agreed that anything less than a significant rise in attendances is a fail?

[aintforever]

Really hope this anti-Cortese stuff dies down quickly. I know they'll always be a few idiots, but it's an important season that should go very well and the last thing I want is it turned into more chairman obsessed rubbish. We've had enough of it to last another 125 years. I'll put up with a lack of info in the close season if it means we keep being well run, sign a few players and win games next season.

 

No one is anti-Cortese, just questioning a few decisions made by the club, nowt wrong with that.

 

If anything the club would welcome honest, constructive criticism and feedback.

[hughieslastminutegoal]

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/sport/football/football_league/article7070442.ece

 

(mods - apologies if I've cut and pasted too much from that Times Article - just felt it gave some balance to the thread if posted as a direct quote rather than via a link)

 

"The 40-year-old never planned to run a football club. Last summer he conducted the deal to buy Southampton for Markus Leibherr, a German-born, Swiss-based industrialist. After the purchase was completed in July — despite a false start, the negotiations concluded rapidly — the new owner realised he had acquired a business with no senior management structure."

 

Now this is where the motivation starts to get more than a bit cloudy. NC has said elsewhere that HE spotted the opportunity and persuaded ML to buy the club. But what was the opportunity he spotted? Was billoinaire ML really interested in having an English Football club in his portfolio? Was a billionaire interested in the profit he could make from it? Is he that interested in it as a toy? Is he interested in re-establishing it's community ties?

 

I'm having real difficulty really finding any motivation for ML. I can however see the motivation for NC himself. I've said before, and I still believe it, that ML is funding a project that NC has marked out for himself. I really do think it's a 5 year project for NC to make as much money from it as possible before he gets bored. I think NC really did have the intention of running it himself right from the off. So there is a credibility gap there for me. And I think he is proving slowly but surely that his statements are less than reliable, as "DBP" has provided a decent few examples.

 

Maybe most really don't care as long as we win matches. But that's probably what most MU fans thought when the Glazers took over.

 

I just have a sneaking feeling that people like "DBP" will be saying "I told you so" with some justification in a couple of year's time.

[NickG]

The only answer is "Time Will Tell". This time next year we will all know if Mr Cortese`s strategy

has worked. If it hasn`t, no doubt he will change it.

 

agree, wish they had made more of an effort to fill the stadium but suspect still will have decent crowds for where we are

[beatlesaint]

For the Reading friendly, a Senior Citizen seat in Kingsland will cost £5 ........but if purchased via phone, it will be an extra £3 (60% mark up)

 

Under 14's, if accompanied by an adult go free.

So if you get their ticket over the phone does free turn into 3 ?

[beatlesaint]

No one is anti-Cortese, just questioning a few decisions made by the club, nowt wrong with that.

 

If anything the club would welcome honest, constructive criticism and feedback.

 

Quite right.

We are allowed to question certain things surely, such as the Season Ticket renewal policy and lack of advertising etc etc.

 

I noticed on the back page of the Bournemouth Echo today there is a red banner at the bottom with the date and times of all Bournemouth's pre-season fixtures, sort of a cut out and keep so if anyone wants to pop along they know when games are.

 

What have we done ? Announced one for definite with others shrouded in mystery. Why ? They must know by now who they are playing and when FFS...or is it going to be like the kit launch where they announced it just barely 24 hours in advance. Talk about giving people chance to arrange their day etc etc.

 

The more notice people get the more inclined people are to warm to the idea of going to something, thats basic marketing.

 

The vale of secrecy when we were told everything was going to be more transparent is a puzzle, and I dont understand the thinking or logic behind it.

[miserableoldgit]

Are we all agreed that anything less than a significant rise in attendances is a fail?

 

No. Success or failure for Saint is not simply about season ticket sales or the number of bums on seats. For NC it will be whether the club makes/ doesn`t lose money this year. Success on the pitch (TV money, prize money, commercial opportunities etc) plus more money from the fans that do go will all be part of that. You could have 32,000 at each home game, but if the club is mangaged badly (not in the AP sense) you could still make a loss. Ask P*mpey. I may be that NC has miscalculated things. I personally think that the lack of communication with the fans is his biggest mistake but as I say, Time Will Tell.

[Gorgiesaint]

I am genuinely interested if people honestly believe that Cortese is right and the other 91 teams are wrong.

 

Nobody so far has given me a straight answer. :-(

 

I don't know if Cortese is right or wrong, but if 92 clubs all keep doing the same thing then nothing changes. Think of it like 4-4-2 if you like, it works for a while but does that mean we should keep playing it or do we do something brave & try something different to improve things.

 

Given the profitability (or lack of) of the the majority of the 92 clubs, maybe Cortese thinks just following the tried and trusted method isn't the way to go. Time will tell if he's right or not.

[MarkSFC]

When ML and NC were in discussions last year it was done extremely privately. MLs company is not one that appears to court publicity and ML certainly isn't. This is their nature and the manner in which they do business.

 

Moving from the environments they ate used to, to what is the most public of arenas would surely be a steep learning curve for anyone. I agree with those who say communication with the fanbase has in general been a little underwhelming. I would contend that maybe this will improve. I am happy for NC to concentrate on getting the infrastructure in place behind the scenes before he addresses the PR side. Sure he may lose a few ST holders this year but judge the man two or three years from now.

 

I think someone has mentioned on here about employees not enjoying NC as a boss etc. It would be interesting to know what level of employee it is. Very often (and many here may hate this) the lower paid employees are less motivated and therfore any question of their workload is taken personally because most people at the lower end of the pay scale ( for many different reasons ) just want an easy life!!

 

Also it is extremely reasonable to assume that over the last two or three years at SMS the employees have had very little direction or leadership coupled with the stress of the poor running of the club.

 

I'm not blindly "in NC I trust" but it will take alot more than removing a method of paying for the product and realistic pricing which actually is very good value for money, and some REAL facts, before I start to doubt his intentions and/or ability.

 

A couple of major signings this week would be good though!!!!

[landford.saint]

I really wish I had never started this thread. As I have previously stated my original intention was for an open minded and intelligent discussion on what I personally think have been PR gaffs by SFC in my assumption that NC is instrumental in these decisions. I am not anti-NC in fact I am more than happy with the majority of what is occurring atSFC. I know one or two people on here like taking a antagonistic stance just for the fun of it, but some have genuine concerns over one or even a few recent announcements at the club. If we could all differentiate between the two and ignore one and debate with the other perhaps we could all continue more amicably.

[ottery st mary]

Cortese is the main man..

 

..Picture on my bedroom wall....

 

I used to idolise Duncan Holley...But he has turned to fronting a pop band called The Axe Grinders or was it the Trolley Dollies.

 

No time for his first true love anymore.

 

NC is now my God.

 

 

COYRS with the luvverley sash.

[benjii]

Errr... to be honest I lost interest in your post when you tried to say that SFC do not need to advertise if they want to maximise revenue.

 

I will state to you the 3 groups of people who you get in membership based sales.

 

A) The people who will, regardless of terms and conditions, price, value for month etc.

 

B) The re-active customer, someone who will join, but they need selling, through telesales, advertising, big signings, an offer, press releases, renewal packs etc

 

C) Those that won't renew regardless.

 

That is how it works, it's the first rule of membership based sales, you need to concentrate on Group B, these are the people you need to sell to and these are the people that will shape what your attendances are. The club have not only not made even the very slightest effort to capture fans from Group B, not only that but they have even tried to force out a number from Group A with the restrictive selling of tickets, removal of installment plan etc etc

 

Let's say you're right.

 

If that it is the case it is clearly the result of a conscious decision based on analysis. It has clearly been decided that it is in the best long term interests of the club. We do not need to sell STs to people who will come to a fair few matches anyway.

 

Quite a good business rule is not to sell something at a discount if you don't need to. You obviously know that as you are expert in business.

 

So what's your problem?

Edited 30 June, 2010 by benjii

[benjii]

I'm not blindly "in NC I trust" but it will take alot more than removing a method of paying for the product and realistic pricing which actually is very good value for money, and some REAL facts, before I start to doubt his intentions and/or ability.

 

A couple of major signings this week would be good though!!!!

 

Indeed!

[Fitzhugh Fella]

Cortese is the main man..

 

..Picture on my bedroom wall....

 

I used to idolise Duncan Holley...But he has turned to fronting a pop band called The Axe Grinders or was it the Trolley Dollies.

 

No time for his first true love anymore.

 

NC is now my God.

 

 

COYRS with the luvverley sash.

 

You are ferkin mad but you make me laugh! Is that a line from Adge Cutler - you will remember him Ottery!

[up and away]

Originally Posted by hypochondriac

No idea sorry trousers. I just know that Pardew was going to be sacked at the end of the season. You could see it was going to happen simply by listening to that Solent interview. I would imagine he had someone lined up or at least had looked into possibilities but that's just guesswork on my part.

Cheers for the reply. My hunch was Coppell.

 

I wonder how close the date of Coppell joining Bristol City (22nd April) was to the date that Cortese convinced himself to retain Pardew....?

 

There is no one who knows what Cortese's actual intentions are, of that I am pretty sure. There have been indications with some of his enquiries, but no one can say the exact nature of what his ultimate intentions were or the reasons behind such. Just because he looks in a direction, is no real definitive guide he intends treading that direction.

 

A few things I do know is that he keeps checking and going over things almost to the extent of being OCD. That's just his nature and the manner his nerves interact in these situations. Without doubt he could be a bit more fan friendly, but is totally engrossed in making Saints a success. My only fear for the guy is that Saints become a problem for his family, then we could have problems if Markus cannot find that trust elsewhere.

 

When you look at the big picture, Cortese is an enormous plus on Saints side. Listing numerous petty points does not come close to what he adds to Saints.

[Dave Benson Phillips]

Let's say you're right.

 

If that it is the case it is clearly the result of a conscious decision based on analysis. It has clearly been decided that it is in the best long term interests of the club. We do not need to sell STs to people who will come to a fair few matches anyway.

 

Quite a good business rule is not to sell something at a discount if you don't need to. You obviously know that as you are expert in business.

 

So what's your problem?

 

Forget my opinions of how to sell tickets.

 

91 out of 92 clubs pro-actively sell season tickets.

 

Are they all wrong and Cortese is right?