An Englishman Abroad, Where Do We Start?

[TijuanaTim]

Forget all prejudice and bitterness, just put that aside - let's review.

 

Firstly us Anglos here are every bit as heartbroken right now, was it because the Germans were devastatingly good...maybe, maybe not? Also wouldn't we agree that this is what we believe to be one of the best squads of individuals England has ever sent to a World Cup...so how much joy has England given you, honestly? Not much if any huh.

 

My American friends all were understanding, supportive and decent - none, I repeat none, gloating or giving us/me the stick that the embarrassing, pathetic, gutless and worst of all clueless England performance so richly deserved. That is despite quite a few ex-pats here in the US that dished it out after the (let's be honest) US's admirable, going down fighting effort.

 

Next, how many of these over spoilt, prima donna England players will hold their hands up and take responsibility? How many will learn from this and grow...maybe, just maybe one or two, right. Those loads should all being taking long hard looks in the mirror and not at their bank statements and WAGS FFS. Everyone will be pointing their fingers and blaming others, just check out that baby Rooney's body language and attitude. He should be ashamed to have that St George's cross on his shoulder...you and I know amateurs that would have done better against our old enemy, at least died trying.

 

English and American football/soccer fans are gutted but for different reasons, US fans because the team did their best and brought thrilling excitement, then fell agonizingly short...whereas us England fans have had zero good out of this and then we were inexcusably and humiliatingly let down by our team's total ineptitude.

 

Thoughts?

 

n.b. For those that all too predictably have nothing to add and just give abuse...go ahead, it's a good reflection on you and good for a giggle.

[texas_saint]

USA might not have the superstars but they at least play as a team and put forth some effort. Didn't see either from England. Blame Capello all you want but he's not the one out on the pitch.

[EastleighSoulBoy]

Forget all prejudice and bitterness, just put that aside - let's review.

 

Firstly us Anglos here are every bit as heartbroken right now, was it because the Germans were devastatingly good...maybe, maybe not? Also wouldn't we agree that this is what we believe to be one of the best squads of individuals England has ever sent to a World Cup...so how much joy has England given you, honestly? Not much if any huh.

 

 

My American friends all were understanding, supportive and decent - none, I repeat none, gloating or giving us/me the stick that the embarrassing, pathetic, gutless and worst of all clueless England performance so richly deserved. That is despite quite a few ex-pats here in the US that dished it out after the (let's be honest) US's admirable, going down fighting effort.

 

Next, how many of these over spoilt, prima donna England players will hold their hands up and take responsibility? How many will learn from this and grow...maybe, just maybe one or two, right. Those loads should all being taking long hard looks in the mirror and not at their bank statements and WAGS FFS. Everyone will be pointing their fingers and blaming others, just check out that baby Rooney's body language and attitude. He should be ashamed to have that St George's cross on his shoulder...you and I know amateurs that would have done better against our old enemy, at least died trying.

 

English and American football/soccer fans are gutted but for different reasons, US fans because the team did their best and brought thrilling excitement, then fell agonizingly short...whereas us England fans have had zero good out of this and then we were inexcusably and humiliatingly let down by our team's total ineptitude.

 

Thoughts?

 

n.b. For those that all too predictably have nothing to add and just give abuse...go ahead, it's a good reflection on you and good for a giggle.

 

Hi Tim, I'm naffed off with them TBH, now you know where I'm coming from here's my take.

 

Firstly, let's get the disallowed goal out of the way. FIFA now have to set real time replays in line to support the referees. However, that would not have improved on our performance in any way if given and, given the team are professionals (cough cough cough), it should have galvanised their attitude into making a stronger effort. It just didn't happen.

 

England have been poorer, in their last four games, than I could ever have imagined. Two poor defeats, a lucky win and a richly deserved spanking from a Germany who themselves are far from their best!

 

James has played well and has not been supported or defended by his back four. Definitely not a prima donna. Ashley Cole is just short of being a real world class player despite shining on a weekly basis for his league team. The same can be said for Rooney and a few others. Rooney just didn't get it about the booing which shows the lack of respect he has for the honour bestowed on him in being chosen to play for England.

 

Most of them will sit at the de-briefings and just nod at the right moments while paying lip service to it all. IMHO I think that this W.C. has been a pain in the collective ar5e for the team. A most unwelcome interlude, eating into their holidays before returning to where they earn their money, the domestic season. The sad truth is that the importing of foreign players into our leagues has definitely diluted our core strength for the national team. When we can't buy a good foreign player we seem to inflate these individual's worth. They are made to look good because they can play along these international stars. Put out a full team of Englishmen at PL level and they can't be succesful.

 

Take a dive into the CCC and, more so, L1 and you find teams which are predominantly English or UK born. It's a lower standard admittedly but they succeed because nothing is put on a plate for them. They work collectively and that empowers each individual in the team.

 

That's most definitely why I am Saints first and England a very poor second.

 

Today's game has made me savour Saint's coming season even more.

 

Sorry for being so negative but that's how I see it, sadly.

 

I'd imagine an end of year report would sum up with 'Must do better, tear up the plans and start again.'

[sperm_john]

rooney = wa nkerr, not singing the national anthem, shouting at the cameras for fans getting on the teams back who have spen $$$ to get there and seen us draw with utter sh 1teee and then his form ... what an over rated, over paid to$$er

[dubai_phil]

In 2004 I was in a pub here surrounded by Dutch, Irish, Russians and Jocks when we went on penalties to Portugal. Somehow I think deep down we all felt that this was coming. Sure we tried to be positive, we tried to see improvements, but in reality? The Rickie for England thread summed up our real worries (and in fact he sure as hell couldn't have been any worse than those out there.)

 

The reality of the whole approach was that we were one dimensional, we took identical lightweight wingers and old fashioned cumbersome centre halves. whatever style or tempo or system we were supposed to have used in qualifying just went out the window. Hell I saw more tempo and commitment from the Away Team in the forum match than in the first 30 minutes on that pitch.

 

I thought we went to the world cup to play FOOTBALL. I may have been back in the 80's but I was sure that when I played football we used to run around, not walk around.

 

We always "Over-react" to our "unlucky" demise in tournaments, but this time, this squad, this cost, this preparation, this manager? No, I'm sorry something is very rotten in English Football if that is the best we can put out onto a pitch.

 

Emotionally, I'm not gutted, heartbroken or even really mad. The Cricketers cheered me up with some excitement. BUT what I am is just hollow.

 

It wasn't an embarrassment, it was a lesson. Football played at pace made our team look like a pub side.

 

Is that REALLY the BEST we can do? If so we may as well give up now

 

Thank GOD I wasn't in a pub watching and was able to suffer alone at home

[Thorpe-le-Saint]

In 2004 I was in a pub here surrounded by Dutch, Irish, Russians and Jocks when we went on penalties to Portugal. Somehow I think deep down we all felt that this was coming. Sure we tried to be positive, we tried to see improvements, but in reality? The Rickie for England thread summed up our real worries (and in fact he sure as hell couldn't have been any worse than those out there.)

 

The reality of the whole approach was that we were one dimensional, we took identical lightweight wingers and old fashioned cumbersome centre halves. whatever style or tempo or system we were supposed to have used in qualifying just went out the window. Hell I saw more tempo and commitment from the Away Team in the forum match than in the first 30 minutes on that pitch.

 

I thought we went to the world cup to play FOOTBALL. I may have been back in the 80's but I was sure that when I played football we used to run around, not walk around.

 

We always "Over-react" to our "unlucky" demise in tournaments, but this time, this squad, this cost, this preparation, this manager? No, I'm sorry something is very rotten in English Football if that is the best we can put out onto a pitch.

 

Emotionally, I'm not gutted, heartbroken or even really mad. The Cricketers cheered me up with some excitement. BUT what I am is just hollow.

 

It wasn't an embarrassment, it was a lesson. Football played at pace made our team look like a pub side.

 

Is that REALLY the BEST we can do? If so we may as well give up now

 

Thank GOD I wasn't in a pub watching and was able to suffer alone at home

 

This I think hits the nail firmly on the head.

[alpine_saint]

Hi Tim, I'm naffed off with them TBH, now you know where I'm coming from here's my take.

 

Firstly, let's get the disallowed goal out of the way. FIFA now have to set real time replays in line to support the referees. However, that would not have improved on our performance in any way if given and, given the team are professionals (cough cough cough), it should have galvanised their attitude into making a stronger effort. It just didn't happen.

 

England have been poorer, in their last four games, than I could ever have imagined. Two poor defeats, a lucky win and a richly deserved spanking from a Germany who themselves are far from their best!

 

James has played well and has not been supported or defended by his back four. Definitely not a prima donna. Ashley Cole is just short of being a real world class player despite shining on a weekly basis for his league team. The same can be said for Rooney and a few others. Rooney just didn't get it about the booing which shows the lack of respect he has for the honour bestowed on him in being chosen to play for England.

 

Most of them will sit at the de-briefings and just nod at the right moments while paying lip service to it all. IMHO I think that this W.C. has been a pain in the collective ar5e for the team. A most unwelcome interlude, eating into their holidays before returning to where they earn their money, the domestic season. The sad truth is that the importing of foreign players into our leagues has definitely diluted our core strength for the national team. When we can't buy a good foreign player we seem to inflate these individual's worth. They are made to look good because they can play along these international stars. Put out a full team of Englishmen at PL level and they can't be succesful.

 

Take a dive into the CCC and, more so, L1 and you find teams which are predominantly English or UK born. It's a lower standard admittedly but they succeed because nothing is put on a plate for them. They work collectively and that empowers each individual in the team.

 

That's most definitely why I am Saints first and England a very poor second.

 

Today's game has made me savour Saint's coming season even more.

 

Sorry for being so negative but that's how I see it, sadly.

 

I'd imagine an end of year report would sum up with 'Must do better, tear up the plans and start again.'

 

Good post, esp. the bit I've highlighted.

[TijuanaTim]

Thanks, all of you...helped me see some great points!!

[St Landrew]

I think the jury, which has been out considering its verdict for many years on this English bunch of players, has most definitely come back to the courtroom and pronounced guilty.

 

Guilty of being pumped up, overhyped, overpaid, overlypreached to and overlyworshipped. Technically, they are perfectly capable players - the English cream of their generation, and a generation of which, is particularly rich in technical skill and fitness. What they lack is brains. They are so set by tactics and a european pace of the game, that not one of them has any individual flair left worthy of the name. None of them is capable of taking the game by the scruff and leading the others. They seem as scared as rabbits caught in the headlights. Even Rooney is a pale shadow of the precoious youngster that he used to be. He may be not as fit as he should be, but there is no evidence of what might be there if he was. Lampard is... well god knows what Lampard is there for. He certainly isn't there to be an asset, on his showings in an England shirt. One could go through many of those individuals and wonder why on earth they are there.

 

I said, after England played Algeria, that the first half decent team that England meet will either hammer them or completely outclass them in a close match. Well we got the former, not the latter. It almost reminds me of Saints in their demise from the Championship. Perfectly good enough players, to do well, who completely lost it. They either got scared or they didn't care, or both. A recipe for confidence going down the drain, shortly after, and then there is only one way things are going. And they didn't have the nounce to realise what was happening. It's the same with this sad bunch.

[TijuanaTim]

I think the jury, which has been out considering its verdict for many years on this English bunch of players, has most definitely come back to the courtroom and pronounced guilty.

 

Guilty of being pumped up, overhyped, overpaid, overlypreached to and overlyworshipped. Technically, they are perfectly capable players - the English cream of their generation, and a generation of which, is particularly rich in technical skill and fitness. What they lack is brains. They are so set by tactics and a european pace of the game, that not one of them has any individual flair left worthy of the name. None of them is capable of taking the game by the scruff and leading the others. They seem as scared as rabbits caught in the headlights. Even Rooney is a pale shadow of the precoious youngster that he used to be. He may be not as fit as he should be, but there is no evidence of what might be there if he was. Lampard is... well god knows what Lampard is there for. He certainly isn't there to be an asset, on his showings in an England shirt. One could go through many of those individuals and wonder why on earth they are there.

 

I said, after England played Algeria, that the first half decent team that England meet will either hammer them or completely outclass them in a close match. Well we got the former, not the latter. It almost reminds me of Saints in their demise from the Championship. Perfectly good enough players, to do well, who completely lost it. They either got scared or they didn't care, or both. A recipe for confidence going down the drain, shortly after, and then there is only one way things are going. And they didn't have the nounce to realise what was happening. It's the same with this sad bunch.

 

Great post, my moderate friend.

[BigShadow]

For once, this Englishman is pleased to be abroad because I'd surely be feeling the pain much more if I was back home. American friends have been sympathetic albeit equally confused at just how poorly England performed during this tournament

 

To sum up England's team - no urgency, no commitment, no passion, no desire, no clue, no pride.

To sum up Capello - urgently needing goals he brings on Heskey, removes Defoe, leaves Crouch and Lennon on the bench - says it all.

 

I can't help feeling there is a story to be told here - divisions in the England camp, disagreements with Capello, something....there has to be something to explain the abject performances. There may be some players who don't value the England shirt, but not the majority of them surely. In previous World Cups, I have experienced England's exit with a feeling of being robbed after the boys had done well, usually an individual error or lack of discipline had cost us. There is no such feeling this time. In fact, I am looking forward to enjoying the rest of the tournament without any emotional investment.

 

Let the post-mortem begin...albeit without David Cameron needing to interview the players.

[Super_Uwe]

Agree with that. For whatever reason the England team seemed to be completely lacking any sort of team spirit.

 

Not one of the players looked like they wanted to be there, and that is just criminal. Why that may have been the case is anyone's guess, but there was something fundamentally wrong within the England camp. We can talk all day long about the players playing too much football - well, perhaps it did have an effect - but it should also be remembered that most of the other European leagues finished AFTER the Premier League did.

 

As much as I will never forget his pathetic efforts with Saints, I do think Redknapp would be a decent contender as his man-management skills are proven enough. If nothing else he would have the media on his side which should not be underestimated. Whether he would want to keep fighting if the going got tough and there weren't enough players about...well that's another matter. As is the £m+ compensation package for Fabio!

[alpine_saint]

I think the jury, which has been out considering its verdict for many years on this English bunch of players, has most definitely come back to the courtroom and pronounced guilty.

 

Guilty of being pumped up, overhyped, overpaid, overlypreached to and overlyworshipped. Technically, they are perfectly capable players - the English cream of their generation, and a generation of which, is particularly rich in technical skill and fitness. What they lack is brains. They are so set by tactics and a european pace of the game, that not one of them has any individual flair left worthy of the name. None of them is capable of taking the game by the scruff and leading the others. They seem as scared as rabbits caught in the headlights. Even Rooney is a pale shadow of the precoious youngster that he used to be. He may be not as fit as he should be, but there is no evidence of what might be there if he was. Lampard is... well god knows what Lampard is there for. He certainly isn't there to be an asset, on his showings in an England shirt. One could go through many of those individuals and wonder why on earth they are there.

 

I said, after England played Algeria, that the first half decent team that England meet will either hammer them or completely outclass them in a close match. Well we got the former, not the latter. It almost reminds me of Saints in their demise from the Championship. Perfectly good enough players, to do well, who completely lost it. They either got scared or they didn't care, or both. A recipe for confidence going down the drain, shortly after, and then there is only one way things are going. And they didn't have the nounce to realise what was happening. It's the same with this sad bunch.

 

Agree with the general gist of the post, but reckon you've been a bit too generous to the current England team about their abilities.

[saint_bert]

The only way it will change, IMO, is if fans vote with their feet.

 

Dont fill Wembley, dont go to the away qualifiers if the same old players are continued to be picked.

 

MOTD will soon be bigging up Rooney, Gerrard, Lampard et al once the PL kicks off.

 

Were hear the same old, "we want to put it right" lies that we have heard time after time fro the players

 

If it remains the same, which I suspect it will, the FA will get twitchy when the "Golden generation" are playing infront of a half full Wembley.

 

All IMO of course

[ericofarabia]

Due to work i only managed to see the Germany game live, but in that match and from what I've read about the other matches, the team seemed totally devoid of any motivation, inspiration or national pride.

 

As alluded to above, you virtually sensed this World Cup was an irritation to them, rather than being the pinnacle of their careers.

 

On the motivational side of things, I just can't imagine Capello really getting into the minds of the players with his faltering English. Maybe he should rant and rave in Italian to get the gist and feeling across and then let Stuart Pearce translate and add a few "I'll rip your b0llOx off", ram my size 10 boot up your ar5e or scratch the paint on your poxy brand new cars.

 

The football was one dimensional, and any substitutions just seemed like for like. Where was the great Capello tactical nous, or had he realised with his squad there simply wasn't a Plan B.

 

How on earth Crouchy only got 10 mins against USA and 6 mins v Algeria and nothing in the last 2 games is a total mystery. OK we are 4-1 down 20 mins left what shall we do. I know, lets take off Defoe and put on Heskey. Talk about waving a white flag and surrendering there and then.

 

I didn't really rate our chances in the first place, a lack of world class defensive cover, a lack of attacking quality and a selection of midfielders who seem to self implode when selected in the same team and simply cannot reproduce club football performances at International level. But what did hurt was the complete lack of passion. Maybe all the molly coddling and protection from outside world contact de humanised them? I saw an article by Terry Paine recently talking about the night before the 66 final. Sir Alf took the players down to the local cinema to watch Chitty Chitty Bang Bang .... and they walked there and back!!!

 

Different times, different players, different set of standards.

[suewhistle]

Well, I watched the Germany game in an Italian bar alongside the locals, an English couple and a group of Germans. It was excruciating. For the second (?) breakaway goal I was shouting as the move began "get back and cover" only to see Upson (?) barely sprinting. To add to all the comments here it was the sheer naivety of the way they pushed forward with half an hour still to go. Even in italian local regional women's football our team talk will cover the opposition's key players, and if they have a play-maker or particularly speedy forward we change things to take that into account. We didn't seem to have done anything to cover our lack of pace: it was like Sunday football but without the honest endeavour and giving it your all.

[EastleighSoulBoy]

So you can't blame a manager for anything?

 

He's not on the pitch, but his players are. It's a managers job to turn the pool of players available into the best possible TEAM. I think he failed miserably in that task as we had good players left out and no sense of team whatsoever.

 

How come we were so great in qualifying? The squad is mainly the same, the manager the same.

 

My cynicism tells me that something happened within the camp, at some early stage, or maybe even earlier?

[Ekelund24]

How come we were so great in qualifying? The squad is mainly the same, the manager the same.

 

My cynicism tells me that something happened within the camp, at some early stage, or maybe even earlier?

 

I know if you disguise something controversial in a joke it isn't libelous, as that happens all the time on Have I got news for you, so here goes:

 

Two men walk into a bar and the first one says to the other, " have you finished your chores?"

the second man then replies, "What Chores?",

so the first man says,

 

"Courts held a further 2 week gagging order on steve gerrards private life, turns out he got his wifes sister pregnant (not a 16 year old ) Will hit the newspaper in 14 days, the judge held the gagging order to protect FA while they decide on capello, and the future of English footy.. John terry and the england boys all know about it and JT had a argument with capello because gerrard got to keep the captains armband. the tension in the camp was down to JT and half the team saying gerrard was a disgrace and the other half of the squad backing gerrard..The press conference was related to the tension and JT wanted Gerrard exposed - they hate each other.. from j.t.’s financial adviser,…nice. The bit in brackets relates to another rumour circulating that gerrard has been ****ging Ronnie whelans daughter ,..who is 16. Apparently there have been a number of gagging orders by the f.a.on England players private lifes.......

 

......Mines a double Whiskey!!!!!!"