Cameron on the Unions - "What planet are they on?"

[AndyNorthernSaints]

What a great budget. It makes such a refreshing change to have government that looks past just tax rises, and instead gets it's teeth into the public sector. For the past year or so it's been the private sector that have borne the brunt so it's about time the public sector were dragged into the real world. They won't like it though because they always like to play the victim card.

 

Here's a policy you would like Stanley.

 

http://www.general-election-2010.co.uk/bnp-manifesto-2010-general-election/bnp-manifesto-2010-a-healthy-nation-public-health-and-the-nhs

[dune]

Here's a policy you would like Stanley.

 

http://www.general-election-2010.co.uk/bnp-manifesto-2010-general-election/bnp-manifesto-2010-a-healthy-nation-public-health-and-the-nhs

 

The BNP will end the scandalous situation of NHS underfunding by reallocating money from the foreign aid budget. The reported NHS deficit is £620 million and the current foreign aid budget is £9.1 billion.

 

This is a policy I would support. Why should money from British tax payers be given to third world countries that are only in the position they are due to their own incompetence. I was reading an article yesterday about a Zimbabwean farm that was once the most productive farm on the continent - it's now wasteland. Foreign aid donations should never come from the taxpayer because we are not a charity.

[AndyNorthernSaints]

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2010/jun/22/budget-2010-conservatives-liberal-democrat

 

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2010/jun/22/budget-poor-fairness-osborne

 

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2010/jun/22/nurses-nhs-ringfenced

 

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2010/jun/22/budget-renewed-downturn/print

[View From The Top]

Could have been worse but for me, the devil is in the detail regarding childrens tax credit as my wife couldn't afford to work without the child care element but we only require it for one more academic year so we should be ok.

 

The real cuts come in the Autumn spending review and they are going to bite hard.

 

Some people are seriously misinformed regarding pay in the public sector. My colleagues in Sandwell haven't had a pay rise in the last two years due to single status review and now have a two year pay freeze.

 

I'm guessing those living at home with mum, working in a low skilled private sector job and with no kids won't notice any changes.

[dune]

This is a group I do support. Without mentioning names I have noticed that some posters on here display a vile attitude towards the disabled, but these people are amongst the most vulnerable in our society and as such should be exempt from future cuts.

 

http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=339296849588&v=wall

[CB Saint]

Could have been a hell of lot worse, althoguh I suspect this is a tor dipping exercise by Osbourne to gauge market and international sentiment and well as easing the economy into a more austere environment. The autum and next March budget will be B'stards.

[Johnny Bognor]

Most public sector jobs are there to help other people,nurses,prison officers,probation officers,librarians cleaners etc and a lot of these jobs offer lower pay,but have a better pension as compensation.

Now these people will have to take a pay freeze for two more years(some already have had a pay freeze for two years already),and more than likely have to contribute more to their pensions.

Hummmm.Seems a lot of people may disagree with you Dune.

 

R&RM No2, not sure I agree here.

 

Anyone earning under £21k in he public sector will get a guaranteed £250 year on year increase for the next three years and the majority of those people you describe will benefit from this. Most of the people in the private sector will not have such guarantees, will be thankful if they even still have a job in three years time and that is without taking pensions into account. Over 240,000 people in the UK earn less than the minimum wage and I'll wager that none of them will work in Public Services. I will also wager that more people in the private sector are on the minimum wage when compared to the Public Sector. Unfortunately the millions of hotel workers, bar workers, retail staff, agricultural workers, manual unskilled labourers and the armies of underpaid workers will have little sympathy with your plight.

[Johnny Bognor]

I'm guessing those living at home with mum, working in a low skilled private sector job and with no kids won't notice any changes.

 

That is of course if they are not part of the 1 million+ people who have lost their jobs in the last few years.

[bridge too far]

R&RM No2, not sure I agree here.

 

Anyone earning under £21k in he public sector will get a guaranteed £250 year on year increase for the next three years and the majority of those people you describe will benefit from this. Most of the people in the private sector will not have such guarantees, will be thankful if they even still have a job in three years time and that is without taking pensions into account. Over 240,000 people in the UK earn less than the minimum wage and I'll wager that none of them will work in Public Services. I will also wager that more people in the private sector are on the minimum wage when compared to the Public Sector. Unfortunately the millions of hotel workers, bar workers, retail staff, agricultural workers, manual unskilled labourers and the armies of underpaid workers will have little sympathy with your plight.

 

They probably won't have jobs sadly as, due to Georgie boy's misunderstanding of how economics work, we'll probably have a 'double dip' and lots of jobs in all sectors will go. He's even not listening to his own Office for Budgetary Responsibility.

 

Instead of knocking public sector pensions, workers in the private sector should demand that they have parity. After all, their own bosses get huge pensions. And we should support the private sector workers because, after all, it's us buying their companies' products and services that produce their profits that fill up the pension pots of their bosses.

 

We pay for the private sector bosses' pensions by boosting their profits as much as we pay for the public sector pensions through tax.

[View From The Top]

That is of course if they are not part of the 1 million+ people who have lost their jobs in the last few years.

 

Plenty of jobs shed in Sandwell and more on their way including compulsory redundancies but you keep on with the crusade Johnny as we all know that you despise anyone who works in the public sector. God forbid those like myself actually want to help people by being teachers or nurses.

[rocknrollman no2]

R&RM No2, not sure I agree here.

 

Anyone earning under £21k in he public sector will get a guaranteed £250 year on year increase for the next three years and the majority of those people you describe will benefit from this. Most of the people in the private sector will not have such guarantees, will be thankful if they even still have a job in three years time and that is without taking pensions into account. Over 240,000 people in the UK earn less than the minimum wage and I'll wager that none of them will work in Public Services. I will also wager that more people in the private sector are on the minimum wage when compared to the Public Sector. Unfortunately the millions of hotel workers, bar workers, retail staff, agricultural workers, manual unskilled labourers and the armies of underpaid workers will have little sympathy with your plight.

 

Fair comment Johnny B and you make some valid points.

[dune]

They probably won't have jobs sadly as, due to Georgie boy's misunderstanding of how economics work, we'll probably have a 'double dip'.

 

If we don't will you concede that the Libservatives made the right call?

[Johnny Bognor]

Instead of knocking public sector pensions, workers in the private sector should demand that they have parity. After all, their own bosses get huge pensions. And we should support the private sector workers because, after all, it's us buying their companies' products and services that produce their profits that fill up the pension pots of their bosses.

 

I suppose they could follow Labour's philosophy and borrow money they don't have to pay the workers, but unfortunately that money has to be paid back.

 

Plenty of jobs shed in Sandwell and more on their way including compulsory redundancies but you keep on with the crusade Johnny as we all know that you despise anyone who works in the public sector. God forbid those like myself actually want to help people by being teachers or nurses.

 

My Mum was a nurse for the best part of 35 years and my auntie a midwife for a similar period. I have nothing against public sector workers, with exception to the ones that moan they are so ****ing hard done by....."playing the victim" card as Dune put it earlier. If they actually admitted they had it pretty cushy, then I would hold my hands up and say fair play. I despise people who moan about something, when they have little to moan about (Public or Private sector, hence my stance on BA cabin crew, who also have it so cushy when compared to their counterparts).

 

As for comparisons on pay, I can quote any major paper (incl the Groaniad) and any published source out there. The best you can come up with is your best mates 2nd cousin twice removed or BTF going on about hospital cleaners.

 

Fair comment Johnny B and you make some valid points.

 

Cheers R&RM No 2.

 

Many of the lefties are adamant in defending public sector workers, but there are millions of underpaid and ill treated workers in the private sector who don't seem to have any sympathy from the intellectual socialists. I am far from a socialist but I feel I have to speak up for these under represented people. They deserve so much more as they are the first to feel any pain from a downturn but rarely get the benefit of an upturn, but at least they get off their arses and try and earn a living....they have my respect.

[bridge too far]

If we don't will you concede that the Libservatives made the right call?

 

I reserve my judgement. Interesting comparisons being made with Japan on the News ATM - it didn't work for them.

[View From The Top]

 

As for comparisons on pay, I can quote any major paper (incl the Groaniad) and any published source out there. The best you can come up with is your best mates 2nd cousin twice removed or BTF going on about hospital cleaners.

 

 

Care to show any thread where I make comparisons or mention pay?

 

I don't because I can only do my job in the public sector so I cannot compare pay and I appreciate that I am well paid for what I do. I also understand it's a choice I made. I could have used my degrees to work in finance on 4x my current salary as some of my colleagues have done but my choice was not to.

 

My/our support staff are paid no more, and since single status was introduced often less now, that the privare sector. Where the public sector is paid to much is at middle management and above. They are often perfect examples of the Peter Principal.

 

We all make our career choices yet some small minded people seem to think it's demeaning to be working in the public sector.

[dune]

We all make our career choices yet some small minded people seem to think it's demeaning to be working in the public sector.

 

It must be very rewarding. I just hope you don't work with those with disabilities given the horrid names you use to describe them on here.

[Johnny Bognor]

Care to show any thread where I make comparisons or mention pay?

 

 

OK, fair enough, crossed wires. You were talking about lost jobs.

 

Since summer 2008, unemployment has risen by ONE MILLION (and it's still rising). I would suggest that nearly all of them will have been from the private sector, with the obvious exceptions like one of your best mate's nan's 2nd cousin twice removed.

 

Unfortunately it is the lower paid workers that have taken the brunt of this, but as long as you and the others in the public sector are OK, ****'em.

[hamster]

Does anyone else worry that this budhet s going to create a polarised north/south divide?

 

we appear to have a lot of 'thatcher's children' in our midst, bless them, they just get 'it'.

 

never mind, let's all have a nice cup of tea.

[Johnny Bognor]

Does anyone else worry that this budhet s going to create a polarised north/south divide?

 

we appear to have a lot of 'thatcher's children' in our midst, bless them, they just get 'it'.

 

never mind, let's all have a nice cup of tea.

 

Hamster, the world has turned on its head. A neo-con like me is fending for the low paid against the better paid public sector socialists. Who'd have thought it eh? (Nick and the Lib Dems have a lot to answer for)

 

Two sugars please.

Edited 22 June, 2010 by Johnny Bognor

[dune]

Hamster, the world has turned on its head. A neo-con like me is fending for the low paid against the better paid public sector socialists. Who'd have thought it eh?

 

Two sugars please.

 

Johnny you're just a modern and caring Conservative like David Cameron and his team.

[Johnny Bognor]

Johnny you're just a modern and caring Conservative like David Cameron and his team.

 

Nah, I am lucky where I can post my opinions based on fact, reason and common sense. I am not restricted by towing any party line, political dogma or outdated views in a modern age. I am the future......

[hamster]

johnny, i have a lot of respect for you and you regularly make comments that make have a good old think about things. top man. my mate found a job and has never been happier, thanks for the advice you gave him.

 

i have a limited knwledge of public sector management hierarchies, but without getting myself into very deep water, i can tell you that i am not alone in knowing where their HAVE TO BE savings.

 

i have personally questioned the (imho) waste in the sheer numbers of management, and had a very stern phone call from the then director of social services. i know that i have been labelled (rightly perhaps) a 'troublemaker', but i have always challenged things that i believe to be unfair.

 

re those managers can i ask a question? do you think that many of them would survive in the 'real world'? i cant possibly comment myself but i promise you that without exception, i would not change one member of staff who i currently work with. they are a great bunch and they do a sterling job. i could get you references from over 125 satisfied service users.

 

i am worried that there are going to be a lot of innocent victims of this recession if they don't get more ruthless in cuts to the 'decision makers' who seem to take forever to give you an answer as to how they are 'developing the service'.

[dune]

I had to chuckle at Hariett Harman, the Devina McCall of politics, and her little temper tantrum today.

[Johnny Bognor]

johnny, i have a lot of respect for you and you regularly make comments that make have a good old think about things. top man. my mate found a job and has never been happier, thanks for the advice you gave him.

.

 

Good, I hope he sets his opportunity clock every morning :-)

 

i have a limited knwledge of public sector management hierarchies, but without getting myself into very deep water, i can tell you that i am not alone in knowing where their HAVE TO BE savings.

 

I agree, too many chiefs, leave the indians alone

 

re those managers can i ask a question? do you think that many of them would survive in the 'real world'?

 

In an SME, in a word 'no' as poor managers get found out too easily. In large corporates, it is easier for them to hide and can get away with it for much longer, so it normally takes a major cull before they go. In the Public Sector it is very difficult to get rid of people, it is in the culture, which means that they can pretty much stay put and carry on regardless. That's my opninion FWIW

 

i am worried that there are going to be a lot of innocent victims of this recession if they don't get more ruthless in cuts to the 'decision makers' who seem to take forever to give you an answer as to how they are 'developing the service'.

 

There have already been 1 million victims of the credit crisis / recession and we are not through the woods yet.

 

Many of my clients are overseas / London based, but I have a number of connections with the local print industry in Chichester. In the last 6 months, we've lost RPM and Sussex Litho which have both been local family businesses for 30+ years. Many of the staff (who now have no job) were employed for much of this period. It is very sad to see an established employer dissappear where more than half the staff haven't got a hope of getting another job anytime soon.

 

So there have been many forgotton victims already (as much of this Forum and the Media focus has been on the Public Sector).

 

I hope and think the indians will be OK, the chiefs need to take the pain.

Edited 22 June, 2010 by Johnny Bognor

[hamster]

we have had a virtual freeze on recruitment for almost two years at my place, were just glad that not too many have left. hope no-one decides to leave over the next 12 months or so too, it could get very difficult very quickly imo.

[Johnny Bognor]

I think that will be the issue for public services with headcounts being reduced through natural wastage. No one wil lose their jobs (unlike the private sector), but those that are left to cover for those who leave will have to work harder / will endure more work stress / service levels suffer.

[CB Saint]

we have had a virtual freeze on recruitment for almost two years at my place, were just glad that not too many have left. hope no-one decides to leave over the next 12 months or so too, it could get very difficult very quickly imo.

 

There is usually a difference between recruitment and replacement. In my experience (private sector admittedly) a recruitment freeze prevents increasing headcount above a certain predetermined figure, you can still hire to replace leavers if below that number.

[View From The Top]

I think that will be the issue for public services with headcounts being reduced through natural wastage. No one wil lose their jobs (unlike the private sector), but those that are left to cover for those who leave will have to work harder / will endure more work stress / service levels suffer.

 

Wrong. The "job under threat" letters went out in Sandwell last week and have already gone out in Birmingham, Walsall, Wolverhampton & Staffordshire.

 

The team I work with in Sandwell have already lost 10% of their number and at least another 20% will go by September. Not through wastage, through redundency. More will be coming on top of that. The same is true in Wolverhampton.

 

Never let the truth get in the way of dogma eh Johnny.

[Johnny Bognor]

OK, there may be some redundancies, but I don't see anywhere near the scale of job losses that have been witnessed in the private sector over the last few years. Unemployment has gone up by 1 MILLION and it is still rising - 99% of these have not come from the public sector.

[View From The Top]

OK, there may be some redundancies, but I don't see anywhere near the scale of job losses that have been witnessed in the private sector over the last few years. Unemployment has gone up by 1 MILLION and it is still rising - 99% of these have not come from the public sector.

 

And we both know not all of the private sector redundencies were neccessary. We both know that some companies used the crisis to "rationalise".

 

Still, you keep up your blinkered and dogmatic and plain wrong attack up Johnny, makes you look real big and clever, honest it does.

Edited 23 June, 2010 by View From The Top

[Wes Tender]

They probably won't have jobs sadly as, due to Georgie boy's misunderstanding of how economics work, we'll probably have a 'double dip' and lots of jobs in all sectors will go. He's even not listening to his own Office for Budgetary Responsibility.

 

I'll send George Osborne an email and advise him to contact you for advice as to how he really ought to be running things. Thank God that we have people in this country qualified in economic matters right down to grass roots level, although I really wonder why you're wasting your time posting on a football forum when you ought to be on the Bank of England's monetary panel or a highly paid and respected advisor to the International Monetary Fund.

[EastleighSoulBoy]

Plenty of jobs shed in Sandwell and more on their way including compulsory redundancies but you keep on with the crusade Johnny as we all know that you despise anyone who works in the public sector. God forbid those like myself actually want to help people by being teachers or nurses.

 

Of course, as espoused by Stu (I think) those Nurses can leave the NHS and get a job with an agency doing the same thing for more money. That's probably going to be what will happen because the nurses will not strike, it's not in their psyche, so they will leave. What will the NHS do then? I believe they have a nil recruitment policy currently.

[trousers]

And we both know not all of the private sector redundencies were neccessary. We both know that some companies used the crisis to "rationalise".

 

Still, you keep up your blinkered and dogmatic and plain wrong attack up Johnny, makes you look real big and clever, honest it does.

 

No, I think your replies are cleverer. Just my opinion mind you.

[badgerx16]

At least with VAT going up to 20% GCSE maths will be a bit easier

[GenevaSaint]

Throbie le saint? That's new, how long did it take you to come up with that gem? If I'm honest, I was ready to go all out in slagging this budget off, but apart from a few issues regarding welfare and the VAT hike, I don't think it's that bad - It could have been a lot worse!!

 

Thorpe, I agree, relatively happy with that budget to be honest, I don't get tax credits so little impact. I'll be a bit worse off this year, but hey ho, life's a *****. Whilst not happy with the 20% VAT lets face it, it does impact all areas of society not just those who earn and pay income tax.

 

The real concern will be the departmental reviews in October. On average a 25% cut across departments apart from those ring fenced is going to hurt....

Edited 23 June, 2010 by GenevaSaint

[CB Saint]

At least with VAT going up to 20% GCSE maths will be a bit easier

 

DUne did say that - guess he was right after all

[Johnny Bognor]

And we both know not all of the private sector redundencies were neccessary. We both know that some companies used the crisis to "rationalise".

 

Still, you keep up your blinkered and dogmatic and plain wrong attack up Johnny, makes you look real big and clever, honest it does.

 

There may have been some rationalisation, but some big companies have gone to the wall. This may have escaped you in your cosy little world http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/7874026.stm

 

Take the retail sector, for example, which is reknowned as one of the lowest paid industry sectors. Big names have gone to the wall. Companies like Woolworths have dissapeared from the high street. When Woolworths went, I thought "****, 27,000 people have just lost their jobs in one foul swoop". I bet you thought, "****, where can I buy my pick and mix?"

 

So we have 27,000 from one company. Next time you go to SMS, look around you and visualise the stadium being filled with woolworths employees. This is just one company in one industry.........

 

Actually, I am astonished that the intellectual left on here don't seem to give a flying **** about the 1 million people, many of whom are innocent "victims" (the majority of whom will be those from lower incomes, although you can't get lower than no income at all) of this recession and you can't even empathise / sympathise with them. I didn't realise socialism was so selective......

Edited 23 June, 2010 by Johnny Bognor

[badgerx16]

The real concern will be the departmental reviews in October. On average a 25% cut across departments apart from those ring fenced is going to hurt....

This is the one that will hurt, and everybody will be hit; also, the ring-fencing is probably only for one year.

[bridge too far]

I'll send George Osborne an email and advise him to contact you for advice as to how he really ought to be running things. Thank God that we have people in this country qualified in economic matters right down to grass roots level, although I really wonder why you're wasting your time posting on a football forum when you ought to be on the Bank of England's monetary panel or a highly paid and respected advisor to the International Monetary Fund.

 

Poor and *****y response, Wes.

 

The views I posted were not mine - I don't pretend to understand economics - but the views of respected commentators and advisors. Why did the ConDems form an Office for Budgetary Responsibility and then not listen to the advice?

 

I can't find it now but ages ago I posted a link to an article about Osbourne. He has absolutely no experience of economics and even had to get his wife and his family to arrange a mortgage for him FFS

[dune]

DUne did say that - guess he was right after all

 

I'm always right. As Winston Churchill once said just because you're in a minority doesn't mean you're wrong.

[Lord Duckhunter]

Poor and *****y response, Wes.

 

The views I posted were not mine - I don't pretend to understand economics - but the views of respected commentators and advisors. Why did the ConDems form an Office for Budgetary Responsibility and then not listen to the advice?

 

I can't find it now but ages ago I posted a link to an article about Osbourne. He has absolutely no experience of economics and even had to get his wife and his family to arrange a mortgage for him FFS

There was an expert on TV last night night saying that Clegg surprised everyone in the first TV debate and this was Osbourne's "TV debate moment". He had surprised everyone with this budget and his performance, he called it "very clever". perhaps they should have had you on the programme to peddle your "Osbourne is an idiot" line. When asked what you based this view on, you could reply "I posted an article on a football forum".

[bridge too far]

There was an expert on TV last night night saying that Clegg surprised everyone in the first TV debate and this was Osbourne's "TV debate moment". He had surprised everyone with this budget and his performance, he called it "very clever". perhaps they should have had you on the programme to peddle your "Osbourne is an idiot" line. When asked what you based this view on, you could reply "I posted an article on a football forum".

 

Had I been able to use the (new) search facility, I would have found the link and posted it.

 

However, in any event, I didn't post an article - I posted a link.

 

People who make stupid comments suggesting some of us should appear on panels and TV programmes to 'peddle our points of view' should look to themselves when they peddle their own points of view to the contrary.

[GenevaSaint]

There was an expert on TV last night night saying that Clegg surprised everyone in the first TV debate and this was Osbourne's "TV debate moment". He had surprised everyone with this budget and his performance, he called it "very clever". perhaps they should have had you on the programme to peddle your "Osbourne is an idiot" line. When asked what you based this view on, you could reply "I posted an article on a football forum".

 

I generally thought that Osbourne came across as a total fool during the election campaign. To be fair, I was impressed with his performance yesterday, and not working in the public sector I'm happy to say I am only £383 a year worse off. Obviously ignoring VAT. So, from a personal perspective, it's all good.

 

I do however worry about front line services with the 25% cut across the governmental depts. To add to my concern I've just seen a line on the BBC that said the education budget is only ring fenced for 1 year. We all know what's going to happen there next year. I grew up in the under funded schools of the late 70's and 80's, it wasn't a good place to be from an educational perspective.

 

But lets wait and see, so far, I'm relatively happy with the way things are going, lets see what October holds.

[Lord Duckhunter]

I do however worry about front line services with the 25% cut across the governmental depts. To add to my concern I've just seen a line on the BBC that said the education budget is only ring fenced for 1 year. We all know what's going to happen there next year.

But lets wait and see, so far, I'm relatively happy with the way things are going, lets see what October holds.

 

Labour were going to cut the budgets by 20% anyway.

 

The Torries aren't cutting to fund tax cuts, they are cutting to balance the books.

 

If I ran up huge Credit card bills and Mrs Duck had to take over my finances and the paying back of all my debts, is it her fault if I can't afford to play golf and go and watch Saints. Or is it my own fault for getting into the mess?

 

This budget is Labour's legacy.

[AndyNorthernSaints]

http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2010/jun/23/budget-economy

 

http://www.guardian.co.uk/politics/2010/jun/23/budget-2010-losers-women-disabled

 

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2010/jun/23/cutting-disability-benefits-not-fair

[AndyNorthernSaints]

The BNP will end the scandalous situation of NHS underfunding by reallocating money from the foreign aid budget. The reported NHS deficit is £620 million and the current foreign aid budget is £9.1 billion.

 

This is a policy I would support. Why should money from British tax payers be given to third world countries that are only in the position they are due to their own incompetence. I was reading an article yesterday about a Zimbabwean farm that was once the most productive farm on the continent - it's now wasteland. Foreign aid donations should never come from the taxpayer because we are not a charity.

 

It's called compassion for human beings Stanley. Being a Nazi you would not understand.

[Redbul]

They probably won't have jobs sadly as, due to Georgie boy's misunderstanding of how economics work, we'll probably have a 'double dip' and lots of jobs in all sectors will go. He's even not listening to his own Office for Budgetary Responsibility.

 

Instead of knocking public sector pensions, workers in the private sector should demand that they have parity. After all, their own bosses get huge pensions. And we should support the private sector workers because, after all, it's us buying their companies' products and services that produce their profits that fill up the pension pots of their bosses.

 

We pay for the private sector bosses' pensions by boosting their profits as much as we pay for the public sector pensions through tax.

 

I remember a time when it was those in the public sector that were asking for parity with those in the private sector. Recession does funny things to peoples' perceptions.

[Lord Duckhunter]

http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2010/jun/23/budget-economy

 

http://www.guardian.co.uk/politics/2010/jun/23/budget-2010-losers-women-disabled

 

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2010/jun/23/cutting-disability-benefits-not-fair

 

The Guardian are against the Budget?

 

I'm sure they were prepared Weds moring to look at a Tory budget objectively and from a neutral point of view. Shall we post The Telegraph's praise, or is it only The Guardians opinion that counts?

 

No wonder their circulation figures are so poor.

[AndyNorthernSaints]

The Guardian are against the Budget?

 

I'm sure they were prepared Weds moring to look at a Tory budget objectively and from a neutral point of view. Shall we post The Telegraph's praise, or is it only The Guardians opinion that counts?

 

No wonder their circulation figures are so poor.

 

Do you know who the Guardian backed in the election?

[bridge too far]

The Guardian are against the Budget?

 

I'm sure they were prepared Weds moring to look at a Tory budget objectively and from a neutral point of view. Shall we post The Telegraph's praise, or is it only The Guardians opinion that counts?

 

No wonder their circulation figures are so poor.

 

But not falling as fast as the Telegraph's

 

http://www.pressgazette.co.uk/story.asp?sectioncode=1&storycode=45576&c=1

 

The Guardian supported the Liberals during the election campaign. I guess that was before they saw their true colours.