Cortese V Lowe

[Arizona]

IMO up until the ST release, Cortese has been nigh on perfect. Very professional, keeping his gob shut in the press. He has supported Pardew in the transfer market, without being wreckless with Liebherr's money.

 

The STs situation is disappointing, but that is very minor in comparisson to the stuff Lowe has thrown at us. The instalment plan, or lack of, would seem like an oversight to me. There is no reason for it, the club wont make more money from not having the installment plan.

 

If, in the next couple of weeks, the club brought out an instalment plan and scrapped the surcharge on internet bookings everyone would be happy again.

[Big John]

It's quite re-assuring too that we appear to be the only club aiming for promotion/improvement from our current position.

 

imho Chelsea are the ONLY club in England who should be lacking in ambition, and even they won't be doing that.

 

5 year plan? I bet every fan in the country has a 5 year plan ffs.

 

Next game is the only game that matters, ST prices are irrelevant in the big scheme as the only thing that really matters in the big scheme of things. We start winning and everything else becomes irrelevant, we falter and the shirt will be wrong, the badge will be wrong the pricing policy will be wrong, the latest signing will be pants and the manager and/or CEO will be shown the door in some people's eyes..

 

whem will some people be satisfied I ask myself !!

[Big John]

And fwiw imho it is Cortese's job to build bridges with the Echo, it is in his interest to play the good guy. What is to be gained by anyone with the current state of play, thr Echo are still selling papers after all yet many are of the opinion that (due to NC's decision making) the club will experience the lowest ST sales figures in St Mary's history. Do the math.

[Dark Munster]

If you want to understand the future you need to understand the past.

Those who don't know history are destined to repeat it.

[Dark Munster]

When he gets through 10 managers in as many years, gets rid of a decent manager and employs 4 useless dutchmen, wastes money on failed radio stations, insurance companies and sees attendances drop by more than 10k then maybe we can compare.

And don't forget 2 relegations, administration, and saddling us with -10 points in L1 by doing so 4 f**king days after the carry-over date.

[skintsaint]

and being seen in a training kit with the lettering NC on the tit area....

[SaintRobbie]

The feud with the Echo, the stories of club staff not being allowed to talk to him, the way he had a dig at MLT and Lawrie, the Pardew speculation, and now the season ticket prices/lack of an installment plan/booking tax on tickets.

 

Take away Markus's money and I see very little difference between Cortese and Lowe.

 

I see determination and ambition coupled with ability versus ambition and arrogance coupled with ineptitude.

 

NC for me everytime!

[SaintRobbie]

Those who don't know history are destined to repeat it.

 

'History is not a good schoolmaster, but it is the only one we have'.

[stevegrant]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/teams/s/southampton/8268510.stm

 

40 minutes onwards: "if you tell me is 5 year reasonable...i would say yes"

 

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/teams/s/southampton/8565161.stm

 

3 minutes onwards: "i've been always talking about the five year plan...obviously the five year plan is resolved on the pitch but again finance it involves finances .../... this the five year plan that is approved and fully funded from Markus so today we're running based on that business plan which is obviously based on my judgements and my decisions" so that five year plan is still in place "well yes of course...we have possibly been a bit more spending on the transfer window than initially planned but it's still based on the five year plan and i'm still very much focussed on that plan"

 

--------------------------

 

The five year plan is the five year plan. It hasn't just been magicked up...

Thankyou Scudamore, you clearly have far more patience than I do! Knew it was around somewhere but couldn't put my finger on it.

 

Did the owners at these other clubs wipe out £30m of debt, build a new training facility and invest heavily in the first team squad? There is clear evidence of investment at Saints that goes further than just promises.

Firstly, the debt was £23m (we can all be pedantic arses to prove a point, you see, you're not unique), and I would be amazed if Liebherr wasn't looking to retrieve the £15m or so he put in to settle those debts further down the line. That's the idea of "investment", that you get a positive return from it in the future.

 

At the moment, we have no new training facilities. To my knowledge, building work at Staplewood was due to commence some time in March, but as yet contracts are yet to be signed.

 

While the accounts will now be a lot later when they are eventually submitted to Companies House due to the much looser regulations on private limited companies, I'll be amazed if they don't show SFC at least breaking even for this financial period. The crowds have been much higher than expected, added to the revenue from two cup runs, which has allowed them the freedom to spend a bit more on the playing squad.

[Joensuu]

So far, I fail to see any reason to doubt Cortese. Too many on here seem to have built up a distrust of anyone in the role of chairman. I wouldn't have made all of the same decisions, but to date Cortese has done nothing to warrent this level of fan distrust. The Echo tiff seems to show a strong chairman, and a desperate local rag. The ticket prices seem fair. Removing installments should have been better communicated. The booking fee should definately be dropped. But these things are minor compared to the progress we have made and initiative Cortese has shown. It concerns me when other fans criticise with so little evidence.

 

Why the Cortese hatred Dune? Is it because he's foreign and doesn't have a shaven scalp?

[Saint Fan CaM]

Why the witch hunt?

 

Finally we get someone to lead the club, make tough decisions, improve every aspect from playing staff to facilities and you tossers on here are still not happy??

 

What do you want? Sometimes the attitude of people on here beggar belief.

 

Unhappy when we were borderline going out of business and now unhappy when we enter our most exciting period since the early 80's

 

 

What he said, with one exception. I believe we are starting a journey that will see this club rise to heights NEVER previously seen both in terms of success on the pitch AND in terms of professional, long-term investment in infrastructure. In 10 years I believe Saints will be competing in the top 6 of the Prem consistently, will be the envy of even the 'top' clubs and we will have been lucky enough to have witnessed the re-birth.

 

Stick with the program. Keep your patience people - there are some very good times ahead.

[Wes Tender]

What he said, with one exception. I believe we are starting a journey that will see this club rise to heights NEVER previously seen both in terms of success on the pitch AND in terms of professional, long-term investment in infrastructure. In 10 years I believe Saints will be competing in the top 6 of the Prem consistently, will be the envy of even the 'top' clubs and we will have been lucky enough to have witnessed the re-birth.

 

Stick with the program. Keep your patience people - there are some very good times ahead.

 

This is what I also believe. Until a few weeks ago it would have been a bit more pie in the sky, but rumblings from the footballing powers that be, are suggesting that clubs will not be allowed to enter the Champions League unless they have enough income to cover their debt. That means that most of the top Premiership clubs will struggle to meet those requirements unless they live much more within their means. By the time we get back into the Premiership, we will be the model debt free and well run club, able to compete on the much more level playing field.

 

As for any required support for either Lowe or Cortese, then I really cannot be arsed to dignify that with a response. It is the most ludicrous thread title for some time.

[RonManager]

Which one is best?

 

There's only one way to find out -FFIIIGGHHTTT!!!

[Tac-tics]

Pretty sure its on record that Markus wont be taking a return out of the club.

[stevegrant]

Pretty sure its on record that Markus wont be taking a return out of the club.

I'm sure he won't be withdrawing any cash from the business for as long as he owns it, but there's absolutely no way he won't be selling for a profit in the future if he can. That's why he invested, it was an absolute bargain with near-guaranteed profit in the medium-to-long-term if the club is run well and gets promoted.

[saintjay77]

We may have been for a year or so but not for any length of time.

 

I do agree that we were not very successful in the transfer market after getting Niemmi and Svensson but they did not cost that much.

 

But lets see what happens if we do get back in the Premier League before we can make comparisons.

 

I think one of the problems we had was that with so many managers wanting to add there own players to the team it was only a matter of time before we ended up with a squad full of chaff.

 

Even WGS brought in a number of players that did nothing and he was one of our more successful managers.

 

Lowe was probably the main reason behind so many managers but the players identified to come in must be down to the managers here at the time.

 

If NC changes managers as often as Lowe did then its very possible that we end up with another team of players that dont work well together and we could end up struggling.

 

Although I can see what the OP is trying to get at I dont actually thing NC will be making the same mistakes as Lowe and with the financial backing Lowe never had I cant see us deliberatly going for too many cheaper options at the expence of success.

[martel]

The feud with the Echo, the stories of club staff not being allowed to talk to him, the way he had a dig at MLT and Lawrie, the Pardew speculation, and now the season ticket prices/lack of an installment plan/booking tax on tickets.

 

Take away Markus's money and I see very little difference between Cortese and Lowe.

 

Sorry Dune, I have to disagree, they are chalk and cheese as far as I am concerned, for example how often have you seen Cortese on T.V. compared to Lowe? Lowe for me was always attention seeking, whereas Cortese just wants to get on with the job in hand with out the interference.

[dune]

Sorry Dune, I have to disagree, they are chalk and cheese as far as I am concerned, for example how often have you seen Cortese on T.V. compared to Lowe? Lowe for me was always attention seeking, whereas Cortese just wants to get on with the job in hand with out the interference.

 

If Cortese didn't want to be in the limelight he wouldn't have declared war on the Daily Echo and he wouldn't have slagged off Matt Le Tissier and Lawrie. The bloke's a pr11ck.

[saintjay77]

If Cortese didn't want to be in the limelight he wouldn't have declared war on the Daily Echo and he wouldn't have slagged off Matt Le Tissier and Lawrie. The bloke's a pr11ck.

 

You say that about NC yet you have those 2 on your avatar??????

 

EDIT:

To be fair you could have had Gordon Brown and I would have said the same thing.

[dune]

You say that about NC yet you have those 2 on your avatar??????

 

The avatar is just to annoy Bungle.

[RonManager]

If Cortese didn't want to be in the limelight he wouldn't have declared war on the Daily Echo and he wouldn't have slagged off Matt Le Tissier and Lawrie. The bloke's a pr11ck.

 

What about writing to him? You might prompt a response, he must be aware by now of the feeling.

[Joensuu]

If Cortese didn't want to be in the limelight he wouldn't have declared war on the Daily Echo and he wouldn't have slagged off Matt Le Tissier and Lawrie. The bloke's a pr11ck.

 

That's just wrong. Cortese defended the club against the Echo. He didn't slag off either Tiss or Lawrie, he told them (quite rightly) not to interfere.

 

Notice you didn't answer my question about your motives for slandering Cortese.

[John B]

That's just wrong. Cortese defended the club against the Echo. He didn't slag off either Tiss or Lawrie, he told them (quite rightly) not to interfere.

 

Notice you didn't answer my question about your motives for slagging off Cortese.

 

The bloke appears to be pompous and arrogant and probably looking to make a quick buck

[Matthew Le God]

If Cortese didn't want to be in the limelight he wouldn't have declared war on the Daily Echo

 

How do you know what happened with the Echo?

 

How do you know if a ban was or was not justified?

 

and he wouldn't have slagged off Matt Le Tissier and Lawrie. The bloke's a pr11ck.

 

What he said about Le Tiss and Lawrie when you read it word for word is hardly "slagging" as you put it...

 

ACTUALLY READ IT!

 

“Various figures with past associations to the club have been quick to voice their opinions, among them a long-time former manager, and former players, one of whom was associated with a so-called consortium which delayed for an important few weeks last summer our plans to stabilise the club.

 

These commentators are each entitled to their opinions of course.

 

However, I must tell them that running a major football club such as Southampton is a rather different matter from writing about doing so.

 

One of my early actions was to eradicate the politics that had cast a shadow over Southampton for so long."

 

They were asked a question that was based on rumour. Le Tiss and Lawrie could have said "no comment it is just idle rumour". Instead they choose to comment on something they knew little about other than press speculation.

 

Cortese just defended his position in the article, he hardly "attacked" them in that article.

 

If anything Le Tiss and Lawrie should be the ones apologizing.

Edited 2 June, 2010 by Matthew Le God

[NickG]

If Cortese didn't want to be in the limelight he wouldn't have declared war on the Daily Echo and he wouldn't have slagged off Matt Le Tissier and Lawrie. The bloke's a pr11ck.

 

when did he declare war on the echo?

 

He used his right to reply.

[stevegrant]

Cortese defended the club against the Echo.

Did he?

 

What scandalous accusation did the Echo put the club's way?

 

That their plans for Staplewood had been approved by the New Forest District Council, as shown by their publicly visible website, and as earlier publicised by Radio Solent and Sky Sports, among others?

 

That Markus Liebherr was not at the Southend game, as first reported by Radio Solent?

 

That Alan Pardew was on the verge of being sacked, as first reported by Radio Solent, and then by Sky and the Daily Mail?

 

Although the old saying does suggest that the best form of defence is attack...

[NickG]

think there is a mixture of jealousy of successful business men and people enjoying slagging the club off.

[dune]

That's just wrong. Cortese defended the club against the Echo. He didn't slag off either Tiss or Lawrie, he told them (quite rightly) not to interfere.

 

Notice you didn't answer my question about your motives for slandering Cortese.

 

Do you really believe Cortese didn't want to/wasn't going to sack AP?

[NickG]

Did he?

 

What scandalous accusation did the Echo put the club's way?

 

That their plans for Staplewood had been approved by the New Forest District Council, as shown by their publicly visible website, and as earlier publicised by Radio Solent and Sky Sports, among others?

 

That Markus Liebherr was not at the Southend game, as first reported by Radio Solent?

 

That Alan Pardew was on the verge of being sacked, as first reported by Radio Solent, and then by Sky and the Daily Mail?

 

Although the old saying does suggest that the best form of defence is attack...

 

says echo correspondent;)

http://www.dailyecho.co.uk/sport/saints/news/8196115.Saints_facing_season_ticket_backlash/

[NickG]

Do you really believe Cortese didn't want to/wasn't going to sack AP?

 

I don't think he was going to sack him. It doesn't make sense.

[dune]

I don't think he was going to sack him. It doesn't make sense.

 

It makes perfect sense. Put yourself in Pardews position and the lack of denial despite continued speculation speaks volumes. If I was AP and a club came along wanting my services i'd tell Cortese to stick his job because you can be sure AP isn't going to be here for long and Cortese will get shut as soon as we have a bad run.

[NickG]

why didn't he sack him then?

 

if he wanted to he would have done. Pardew has been having his name chanted most of the season.

 

Think you are just jealous

[Joensuu]

Do you really believe Cortese didn't want to/wasn't going to sack AP?

 

Yes. I have seen no evidence to suggest Cortese was thinking of sacking Pardew. I'm sure he will start considering it if we underperform in the first few months of next season.

 

Cortese doesn't like responding to media speculation. I respect him all the more for that.

 

Why do you dislike Cortese?

[Matthew Le God]

Dune can't or won't respond to all my points/questions in post 124

[stevegrant]

Dune can't or won't respond to all my points/questions in post 124

He's taking after you in the "avoiding answering anything that might completely scupper the point you're trying to make" stakes.

[dune]

Cortese doesn't like responding to media speculation. I respect him all the more for that.

 

Why do you dislike Cortese?

 

He wants us to think he's not a media whore because he doesn't want to be seen as being like Rupert Lowe, but he is like Lowe and loves the limelight. The fact he banned the Echo for reporting a story that was reported elsewhere first shows he's full of himself. I dislike him primarily because of his dig against MLT because it shows that he has no respect for a club legend and therefore has no idea about the history of our club or how the fans feel towards Matt. Corteseb thinks he's all that, but he's not, he's just a jumped up little ****.

[AK]

It always amuses me on this forum that people seem to take such entrenched views.

 

Its either NC is the Messiah or he is a complete arsehole where the truth lies somewhere between the two.

 

Those who refuse to recognise any faults are probably the same people who bought The Go Wilde T-shirts !

 

I think we should be ever grateful to ML and just a little bit cautious of NC.

[Joensuu]

It makes perfect sense. Put yourself in Pardews position and the lack of denial despite continued speculation speaks volumes. If I was AP and a club came along wanting my services i'd tell Cortese to stick his job because you can be sure AP isn't going to be here for long and Cortese will get shut as soon as we have a bad run.

 

Pardew's reactions would depend upon what Cortese was saying to him directly. "Alan, ignore the press, your jobs perfectly safe as we are more than happy with your first season. I'm not going to respond to the press, as I don't have time to waste on silly speculation. Right, have you considered where you would like to strengthen the squad?"

[miserableoldgit]

It always amuses me on this forum that people seem to take such entrenched views.

 

Its either NC is the Messiah or he is a complete arsehole where the truth lies somewhere between the two.

 

Those who refuse to recognise any faults are probably the same people who bought The Go Wilde T-shirts !

 

I think we should be ever grateful to ML and just a little bit cautious of NC.

ML completely trusts NC to run his business. Shouldn`t we gie a bit of trust too?

[stevegrant]

I think we should be ever grateful to ML and just a little bit cautious of NC.

This is pretty much where I stand.

 

Without Liebherr's money, we wouldn't even be having this conversation because Saints would more than likely have ceased to exist 11 months ago.

 

Cortese clearly played a role in that, and credit clearly goes to him for doing so. However, I'm sure I'm not alone in being slightly wary about some of the things he has said, done or been rumoured to have said or done.

[dune]

ML completely trusts NC to run his business. Shouldn`t we gie a bit of trust too?

 

Cortese may be effective in most businesses, but he seems to be struggling as a chairman where he's in the spotlight. He has already made several errors of judgement and his bombastic nature will ensure that he continues to make mistakes.

[Joensuu]

He wants us to think he's not a media whore because he doesn't want to be seen as being like Rupert Lowe, but he is like Lowe and loves the limelight. The fact he banned the Echo for reporting a story that was reported elsewhere first shows he's full of himself. I dislike him primarily because of his dig against MLT because it shows that he has no respect for a club legend and therefore has no idea about the history of our club or how the fans feel towards Matt. Corteseb thinks he's all that, but he's not, he's just a jumped up little ****.

 

So basically you have heard some rumours, and decided to interpret all events relating to Cortese with a negative spin, despite all of the positive changes Cortese is introducing, and despite the lack of any substantial evidence to suport your vitriol. You sir are jumping to conclusions.

[Matthew Le God]

He wants us to think he's not a media whore because he doesn't want to be seen as being like Rupert Lowe, but he is like Lowe and loves the limelight. The fact he banned the Echo for reporting a story that was reported elsewhere first shows he's full of himself. I dislike him primarily because of his dig against MLT because it shows that he has no respect for a club legend and therefore has no idea about the history of our club or how the fans feel towards Matt. Corteseb thinks he's all that, but he's not, he's just a jumped up little ****.

 

Read and answer all points in post 124.

 

Pretty please.

[dune]

So basically you have heard some rumours, and decided to interpret all events relating to Cortese with a negative spin, despite all of the positive changes Cortese is introducing, and despite the lack of any substantial evidence to suport your vitriol. You sir are jumping to conclusions.

 

I have made my mind up abour Cortese now, and I don't like him.

[Joensuu]

Cortese may be effective in most businesses, but he seems to be struggling as a chairman where he's in the spotlight. He has already made several errors of judgement and his bombastic nature will ensure that he continues to make mistakes.

What mistakes? Which misjudgements? I've heard hearsay, but seen no evidence.

[miserableoldgit]

What mistakes? Which misjudgements? I've heard hearsay, but seen no evidence.

Dune doesn`t need evidence to make his mind up about anything. That just gets in the way.

[AK]

ML completely trusts NC to run his business. Shouldn`t we gie a bit of trust too?

 

I don't know what ML's view of NC is but i think it is perfectly OK for people to to question some of the recent decisions .Mind you the thing that seems to be upsetting people is not the decisions themselves but the way they have been communicated, so perhaps the club could improve on their customer relations a bit.

[Joensuu]

I have made my mind up abour Cortese now, and I don't like him.

 

I'm sure, that in the unlikely event that Cortese ever becomes aware of you, the feeling would be mutual.

[Matthew Le God]

I have made my mind up abour Cortese now, and I don't like him.

 

So you base your opinion on rumour? What if a paper ran stories about David Cameron that had no evidence in them. Would you change your mind on him?

 

You are far too easily influenced by the media!

[miserableoldgit]

I don't know what ML's view of NC is but i think it is perfectly OK for people to to question some of the recent decisions .Mind you the thing that seems to be upsetting people is not the decisions themselves but the way they have been communicated, so perhaps the club could improve on their customer relations a bit.

I think that it is quite in order to question NC`s actions but there are some on here who now view him as the bastard love child of Ming the Merciless.