Retained List

[EBS1980]

He comes from Bristol

 

Considering we could do with perhaps one more defender does that mean a move for Elliot Ward may be back on?

 

I would, I think martin would benefit from going out on loan next season and getting a good number of league games under his belt

[doddisalegend]

I am surprised how many he has cut as well - but think it is about time that our squad was a first team squad - players all good enough to be fighting for a start.

 

The performances I have seen from Fonte, Seaborne, Jaidi and Martin this season suggest that Perry and Thomas - both players I like - are way down the pecking order, as well as being older than most of our other CBs. I would not have kept either.

 

AP has made these choices based on seeing all of their games, them every day in training and - probably most importantly - with the knowledge of his budget and what players are available.

 

The signings he has made have all improved the first 22 so I think it is fair to say that he does know what he is doing.

 

Our first 11 is probably:

KD

new RB

Fonte / Seaborne or Jaidi

Harding

Lallana

Schneiderlin

Hammond

Puncheon

Lambert

Barnard

So not really a problem for gelling unless loads of those go.

 

Do you really think he would have released two decent RBs in James and otsemobor if he didn't have a plan to improve in that area?

 

What worries me there is the lack of pace. Plus who are our match changers of the bench? Of course I'm not to worried yet, there's a long summer ahead I just hope AP is looking to some pacy wingers/strikers.

[stmusicdude]

For those who have commented on / criticised my post.

 

Thomas had some useful performances last season and got a few critical goals. Perry never let the team down, and James would have had another season from me to show if he's got it.

 

For all of those saying "AP got it right", as has been said on we are now RB-less, and Calderon hasnt been signed yet..

 

Yea fair enough Alps. Don't have an answer other than If you have clearly decided a player is not good enough & he is out of contract what's your next move? I dont know your right re the RB ..

[S-Clarke]

Why is everyone panicking?

 

we will sign a right back, and will also either re-sign or replace papa and Antonio with better players.

 

We're not going to go into next season weaker, there is no chance of that. We will have a stronger squad by the end of august.

 

..and to start that process, you need to reduce the current squad size.

[beatlesaint]

For all of those saying "AP got it right", as has been said on we are now RB-less, and Calderon hasnt been signed yet..

 

We dont play another competitive match until early August !!

[sadoldgit]

Good to see the clear out starting and looking forward to the rebuilding process. Slightly surprised at James as Pardew seemed to be bigging him up ealier in the season but we need better so no problem there.

 

Still some I'd like to see move on to make room for better players but the aeson has just finished so plenty of time yet.

 

Does Pardew know what he is doing? Of course he does though no doubt those who have problems with him will look to pick over his every decisions looking for something to pull him up on.

 

We shall start the season with a stronger squad that we finisished this season, that is for sure. How we fair next season, who knows. It will be tough but if Cortese backs Pardew in the transfer market and we bring in more player of the quality of Lambert and Fonte, we should be in for a cracking season.

[View From The Top]

Why is everyone panicking?

 

 

By everyone you mean Alpine?

[S-Clarke]

By everyone you mean Alpine?

 

mainly, but there are a few other panicky posts too

[Saint_clark]

What worries me there is the lack of pace. Plus who are our match changers of the bench? Of course I'm not to worried yet, there's a long summer ahead I just hope AP is looking to some pacy wingers/strikers.

 

If we sign Antonio and Waigo (as I think we should) then we have 5-6 players with pace.

[Saint_clark]

For those who have commented on / criticised my post.

 

Thomas had some useful performances last season and got a few critical goals. Perry never let the team down, and James would have had another season from me to show if he's got it.

 

For all of those saying "AP got it right", as has been said on we are now RB-less, and Calderon hasnt been signed yet..

 

What would you have done then Alps? Signed them on again and then still signed better players, leaving the squad even more overinflated than it already is?

[Wade Garrett]

We defintely need a centre-midfielder to replace the woeful Hammond/Wotton.

 

I don't buy all this 'Hammond does stuff you don't notice'. The only things I notice about him are not being able to play a simple pass and not being able to trap a bag of wet cement.

[Saint_clark]

We defintely need a centre-midfielder to replace the woeful Hammond/Wotton.

 

I don't buy all this 'Hammond does stuff you don't notice'. The only things I notice about him are not being able to play a simple pass and not being able to trap a bag of wet cement.

 

Well you're the only person who notices that out of every Saints fan, Pardew, the players and the PFA who have voted him in their team of the week a number of occasions.

[Wade Garrett]

Well you're the only person who notices that out of every Saints fan, Pardew, the players and the PFA who have voted him in their team of the week a number of occasions.

 

Merely my opinion, and I'm sure I'm not the only person.

[JibMcdo]

Merely my opinion, and I'm sure I'm not the only person.

 

I agree, I think he can be replaced.

[Katalinic]

I agree, I think he can be replaced.

 

Anyone can be replaced but to describe Hammond as "woeful" is just plain wrong imho.

[david in sweden]

 

I am shocked at how deep the cuts are. I would have held on to Perry, Thomas and James.

 

I hope AP knows what he is doing. This is fairly radical, and we cannot afford gelling time next season.

 

 

Actually I don't disagree with your comments either Alpine, but to be fair, Perry may have a good season left in him (as indeed may.. a recovered Murty). Lloyd James has never really had a chance to prove himself but is not good at RB and not first choice for midfield either and as for ..Thomas (as most admit) he really doesn't seem to fit in anywhere...and there's better out there.

 

IMHO ..AP wants young hopefuls; Seabourne, Aaron Martin, Mills who will be around for 4-5 seasons and not need to replaced in 12 months time. (As would above). With a clear out of over a dozen players I expect to see several free's come into both defence and midfield and AT LEAST one more striker (of class) maybe even a former Prem. player..or two..

and a few from the Academy.

 

If we were still looking at the released list on 31st July and worrying about it I might agree, but that won't happen and by

1st August most above will be forgotten names. Most of all we need cover for the unexpected..and thats most important.

[Weston Saint]

Merely my opinion, and I'm sure I'm not the only person.

You are not. He is ok but has not come up to the hype. I would be looking to find someone better in his place at the first opportunity. He is not good enough!

[SuperSAINT]

You are not. He is ok but has not come up to the hype. I would be looking to find someone better in his place at the first opportunity. He is not good enough!

 

I can see both sides to the argument regarding Hammond. I think he's fine for us in league 1, but I don't think he'd be up to scratch when we move up to the championship.

[Weston Saint]

Lloyd James - no pace, no flair, not good enough at this level.

 

Simon Gillett - not rally given the chance despite playing at a higher level. Clearly Pardew does not see him fitting into his style. He will get another club

 

Oliver Lancashire - could have developed and will do well elsewhere. We have enough for that position who are ahead of him. Good luck to him in the future

 

Chris Perry - Good servant of the club and still one of the best defensive football brains. Reads the game well but age is against him if we want to build a long term stable centre back understanding. We have Fonte, Seabourn and Martin with Jaidi's strength as cover

 

Wayne Thomas - Did enough to sugest he was good cover at the back but wages too high and injury prone now.

 

Graeme Murty - We took him on knowling he had an injury history and it caried on. Cannot afford to risk it again next season. If he can recover a little fitness he will do a good job for someone in Div 1

 

Jamie White - not really had the opportunity and I do not see him breaking into the first team squad so best he looks elsewhere at a lower level.

 

Michael Poke - Not going to break into the squad and at this stage in his career he needs first team football somewhere. He will get it.

 

Jon Otsemobor - signal of intent we are looking to strengthen that area and Calderon looks a signed on certainty when the window opens. Thoght we might have given him another year as cover but not that suprised he is going.

 

Cannot really comment on the others below as I have not seen them but clearly we had too many youngsters under contract who will never break into the first team so not suprised.

 

Kayne McLaggon

Tom Dunford

Jack Boyle

 

I wonder if this is all. Perhaps some of the others under contract will be put on the transfer list soon.

[Legod Third Coming]

I can see both sides to the argument regarding Hammond. I think he's fine for us in league 1, but I don't think he'd be up to scratch when we move up to the championship.

 

I've been mildly disappointed by him on occasion as I was led to believe he was a box to box dynamo with plenty of goals in him... not really what I've seen. Puts himself about but seems to blow hot and cold to me.

[Clifford Nelson]

 

Do you really think he would have released two decent RBs in James and otsemobor if he didn't have a plan to improve in that area?

 

It is refreshing that being "decent" is no longer good enough.

[Clifford Nelson]

Amongst the supporters speaking as a collective there are two interesting trends:

 

A - The attitude to some players (sack them, get rid of them, etc. or "can easily be replaced") such as Wotton, Papa Waigo (12 goals in 11 starts) and Lloyd James.

 

B - The sentimental wish to retain players who hasn't played any dominant part for some time, just in case, such as Perry, Thomas and surprisingly Lloyd James.

 

If you were to try to manage the team by following advice from the fans you would end up seriously bewildered.

[JibMcdo]

You are not. He is ok but has not come up to the hype. I would be looking to find someone better in his place at the first opportunity. He is not good enough!

 

Did I read somewhere that Pardew said if Hammond didn't improve his first touch he'd be out of the team?

 

EDIT: Search says it was this thread I read it: http://www.saintsweb.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?p=709705

Edited 16 May, 2010 by JibMcdo

[alpine_saint]

What would you have done then Alps? Signed them on again and then still signed better players, leaving the squad even more overinflated than it already is?

 

We have ditched 13 players. I am simply suggesting I feel a case for 3 of them being made extending offers can be made. The situation at RB is clear though.

 

It's hardly an "AP OUT" rant, panicking or continuing with a (non-existent) agenda as I have been accused of on here.

 

Some of you want to grow up a bit before you lecture about the posts of others on here.

[Andy_Porter]

A real show of intent realeasing so many players at once, especially considering the right backs all being moved on.

 

I think releasing Lloyd James will come back to haunt us, he's a very sound footballer just needs a bit of experience, will shine for a mid table side in our league IMO.

[Andy_Porter]

Amongst the supporters speaking as a collective there are two interesting trends:

 

A - The attitude to some players (sack them, get rid of them, etc. or "can easily be replaced") such as Wotton, Papa Waigo (12 goals in 11 starts) and Lloyd James.

 

B - The sentimental wish to retain players who hasn't played any dominant part for some time, just in case, such as Perry, Thomas and surprisingly Lloyd James.

 

If you were to try to manage the team by following advice from the fans you would end up seriously bewildered.

 

It's fairly obvious why people want James and Thomas around, they're both important squad players. No one's suggesting they should be starting every week just that they can be usefull off the bench.

[JustMike]

releasing Thomas suggests to me that AP has seen enough of Martin to not need him, especially as he was reportedly on alot of money.

 

James showed this season he is not good enough for what we want to achieve.

 

Lets not start moaning about having no players for x position until we know who is lined up to replace them.

[david in sweden]

A real show of intent realeasing so many players at once, especially considering the right backs all being moved on.

 

I think releasing Lloyd James will come back to haunt us, he's a very sound footballer just needs a bit of experience, will shine for a mid table side in our league IMO.

 

 

you may be correct, but life is full of such decisions although in my 50 +years as a fan the number of " regretable deals " can be counted on one hand..

Ted Bates said the only deal he ever regretted was Martin Chivers moving to Spurs. As it was Chivers was Englands first choice CF within a season ...and the move was a British record deal at the time, and we were lounging at the bottom of Div.1 ..and there was some consolation in the fact that his replacement was a teenager named M. Channon ! (who made a name for himself, too.:smt041

 

No-one can wish them ill because they go..or are released, I hope they can make a living at the game they obviously love...just as long as they don't play too well if we ever meet their new team(s) !

Edited 16 May, 2010 by david in sweden

[alpine_saint]

Lets not start moaning about having no players for x position until we know who is lined up to replace them.

 

Yeah, lets not bother discussing facts, lets rely on speculation, eh ?

 

I was lectured on here during the summer of 2006 about shutting up about our lack of CBs; the rest is history.

[Saint_Ash]

I like the fact we've let loads of average players go. This means we're going to have an excellent summer of speculation and signings.

 

Very exciting!

[SuperSAINT]

Yeah, lets not bother discussing facts, lets rely on speculation, eh ?

 

In Pards I trust. We had a similar issue with left-back's last year, and he pulled Dan Harding out of the bag.

[Matthew Le God]

Yeah, lets not bother discussing facts, lets rely on speculation, eh ?

 

I was lectured on here during the summer of 2006 about shutting up about our lack of CBs; the rest is history.

 

Perry and Thomas are 5th and 6th choice centre backs.

 

How often do you think 5th and 6th choice will be used next season?

 

I'd wager not at all!. Is it worth paying them thousands to not even sit on the bench or is is not better to use the money saved from their wages elsewhere?

 

James is a central midfielder. He is extremely average and most likely will end up at another League One side. Saints intend to be a Championship side in 12 months and will be looking for players that can play at that level to compete with Hammond/Schneiderlin. No point James not even making the bench at Saints if more central midfielders are brought this summer.

 

Some people in this thread are setting their expectations too low and showing too much sentiment and not enough ambition!

Edited 16 May, 2010 by Matthew Le God

[david in sweden]

We have ditched 13 players. I am simply suggesting I feel a case for 3 of them being made extending offers can be made. The situation at RB is clear though.

 

It's hardly an "AP OUT" rant, panicking or continuing with a (non-existent) agenda as I have been accused of on here. QUOTE]

 

 

 

well... I did agree with you Alpine..see post #268. (and also with you about the CB situation in 2006)...but hopefully NC /AP are a little more far sighted that the management we had at that time, and get good replacements.

 

MY main concern is not the best 11 we field next season .(.I think 6 or 7 are in place already)...but what sort of cover we have for unforseen injuries, suspensionsetc, in potentially 60 game season.

[S-Clarke]

Yeah, lets not bother discussing facts, lets rely on speculation, eh ?

 

I was lectured on here during the summer of 2006 about shutting up about our lack of CBs; the rest is history.

 

alpine, in your honest opinion, do you really think AP will go into the season in August, with no RB's?

 

the situation in 2006 was different, we had no money and had to sell our best defenders.

[WATERSIDEIFASAINT]

We want players who can play at the top of the ccc(Ap has said that).That is why so many players have been released.Yes some of them could do a job in this league but I would not want 1 of them in our first team squad in the ccc if we are going places.

 

We will bring in quality signings as AP has serious money to spend if he needs to.

 

Do people seriously think we can't attract a better right back than Semi & James!!!

 

I think we will bring in 2 right backs.Calderon plus 1 as he will want back up and competition for that place.

 

Also think we will sign another central defender to replace Perry & Thomas.I am sure one of the reasons AP played Martin for the last 2 games was to see whether he could potentially make it to see whether he needed to keep Perry,Thomas or Lancashire.As Martin played well he could then afford to release the others.

 

I am staggered that people are panicking as AP has already said we will have a far stronger squad come the start of next season.

 

We need to know the results of the play offs and all the players available on frees before we start making too many transfer moves as players like Bailey,Racon,Robinson,Austin & Paynter could all become achievable targets if their sides don't go up.

 

It's going to be an exciting summer so lets enjoy it and stop panicking that we have released a whole load of players that are not good enough for the standards we aspire to.

[aintforever]

I'm surprised at the size of he cull but I see it as a positive, players like James and Lancashire would have done a job but it looks like were aiming higher than that, we will be looking to sign players who can do a job in the Championship.

 

Should be an interesting summer.

[NickG]

Yeah, lets not bother discussing facts, lets rely on speculation, eh ?

 

I was lectured on here during the summer of 2006 about shutting up about our lack of CBs; the rest is history.

 

fact is those player are not likely to be first team players.

[Sidney Fudpucker the 3rd]

Yeah, lets not bother discussing facts, lets rely on speculation, eh ?

 

I was lectured on here during the summer of 2006 about shutting up about our lack of CBs; the rest is history.

 

Inclined to agree. I'm assuming that AP has a RB & CB lined up and maybe someone who can cover both positions? I've not been that impressed with Seabourne and it's still early days for Martin. Jaidi is knocking on, so i'm concerned about the likes of Thomas, James and Semi being released.

However, I'm sure AP knows exactly who he wants for these positions so we'll just have to wait and see.

[NickG]

how many CBs did the likes of Leeds and Norwich have last year? Don't know enough about their squads but would be surprised if they had more than 4.

[RonManager]

Also, extra to the Retained List will be a list of players that the club will be happy to let go should an offer of interest be forthcoming, either directly or as a makeweight in part of a swap deal.

[Matthew Le God]

how many CBs did the likes of Leeds and Norwich have last year? Don't know enough about their squads but would be surprised if they had more than 4.

 

Exactly.

 

Saints have Fonte, Jaidi, Seaborne and Martin.

 

Perry and Thomas would be 5th and 6th. An expensive option to keep them and not even have them on the bench! If they stayed they wouldn't get a game. Their wages better used elsewhere.

[sidthesquid]

I've been mildly disappointed by him on occasion as I was led to believe he was a box to box dynamo with plenty of goals in him... not really what I've seen. Puts himself about but seems to blow hot and cold to me.

 

The only time he looked below par was when he came back from injury in Feb, but as the alternative was Wotton I guess he was rushed back!

[NickG]

using wiki looks like Norwich only has about 3???

 

Think Fonte / Seaborne is likely to be Pardew's first choice, with Jaidi as cover for experience for Fonte, and Martin for Seaborne.

[The Fat Controller]

Most people feel sorry for players being released... I don't as they are paid very well try probably 10 years of your current salary per year for kicking a ball.

 

We as supporters of the club spend on average 1/10th of a weeks wages to watch a game to pay for their lavish lifestyles.

 

Any player who has been released for reasons other than injury , probably would have been fired from any other job in life for poor performance.

 

Whilst I wish all the players well that are leaving, welcome to the real world of wondering how you are going to pay off all your bills next week

[sidthesquid]

We have ditched 13 players. I am simply suggesting I feel a case for 3 of them being made extending offers can be made. The situation at RB is clear though.

 

It's hardly an "AP OUT" rant, panicking or continuing with a (non-existent) agenda as I have been accused of on here.

 

Some of you want to grow up a bit before you lecture about the posts of others on here.

 

I think Perry is a great player but way too old to play at the level we need all the time, Thomas is injury prone and inconsistent and Lloydy, much as I like him, is limited. (Plus the rumours on here about his off-field misdemeanours)

[Avenue Saint]

..........

Edited 16 May, 2010 by Avenue Saint
wrong thread!

[alpine_saint]

I think people going on about Thomas and Perry being 5th and 6th choices are being disingenous. We could have a nightmare injury patch at any time. Both played last season, even after the January window, and didnt let the team down.

 

If they were happy knowing they are 5th and 6th choice and wanted to stay, I would have offered. Those going on about Thomas large pay - he would be on a new contract, so would have a new (lesser) offer. But I personally would still have made the offer, even if it were rejected.

[Suhari]

I like the fact we've let loads of average players go. This means we're going to have an excellent summer of speculation and signings.

 

Very exciting!

 

Nail. Head. Hammer.

 

Shame to see some go, but it does signal ambition. Invariably the handful of replacements we get will be of far higher quality than the ones that have left.

 

Really looking forward to a summer of transfer activity.

 

I wonder how early in the summer will make signings? Hopefully not the lastminute, lets not pay their holiday wages, Lowe school of thinking.

[Andy_Porter]

I think Perry is a great player but way too old to play at the level we need all the time, Thomas is injury prone and inconsistent and Lloydy, much as I like him, is limited. (Plus the rumours on here about his off-field misdemeanours)

 

Anything interesting?

[Andy_Porter]

releasing Thomas suggests to me that AP has seen enough of Martin to not need him, especially as he was reportedly on alot of money.

 

James showed this season he is not good enough for what we want to achieve.

 

Lets not start moaning about having no players for x position until we know who is lined up to replace them.

 

You could say that about a lot of players IMO, I'm not really botherd just think it's a decision that could come round to haunt us, if we are going to compete in two or three competitions next season then we will need a utility player like James and there aren't many of them around.