Brown calls Labour voter a "bigot"

[Guided Missile]

Bigot stands for Brown is going on Thursday...

[Daren W]

No Nick I'm not defending him. I already said it was disappointing and that I was dismayed or did your selective myopia come into play?

 

I was just saying that he didn't tell her to her face that she wasn't a bigot (and then go on to say she was). That, my friend is what hypocrisy is.

 

And it's downright silly to compare her to me because, whilst I might well have challenged him about some things (Iraq war for example) I wouldn't have asked a question about Eastern Europe immigration because it's not a topic that bothers me. I wouldn't have given him reason to call me bigoted.

 

I did notice that, every time he tried to answer her questions, she cut him short and asked another question on a different topic. That must have been quite frustrating for him.

 

A bit like Cameron, in the end, walking away from the father who challenged him about mainstream education for disabled children yesterday.

 

Perhaps Cameron said something derogatory 'in private' about that?

 

That kind of puts a damper on your "defendable" theory doesn't it? Saying Cameron might have said something as well? If it's defendable then

 

Look, the worst thing about all of this is how Brown obviously cherry picks his public. The moment one, very ordinary, old woman expresses a view vehemently ... he falls apart. He didn't listen to her, he gave her "I'm smiling but I detest you really" smile of his and walked away probably leaving her feeling a bit short changed...

 

You can't write it off, this has cost Brown a huuuuge chunk of the working class vote as I'd guarantee a lot of them hold similar views to the pensioner..

[OldNick]

No Nick I'm not defending him. I already said it was disappointing and that I was dismayed or did your selective myopia come into play?

 

I was just saying that he didn't tell her to her face that she wasn't a bigot (and then go on to say she was). That, my friend is what hypocrisy is.

 

And it's downright silly to compare her to me because, whilst I might well have challenged him about some things (Iraq war for example) I wouldn't have asked a question about Eastern Europe immigration because it's not a topic that bothers me. I wouldn't have given him reason to call me bigoted.

 

I did notice that, every time he tried to answer her questions, she cut him short and asked another question on a different topic. That must have been quite frustrating for him.

 

A bit like Cameron, in the end, walking away from the father who challenged him about mainstream education for disabled children yesterday.

 

Perhaps Cameron said something derogatory 'in private' about that?

No apology from you to me then BTF ? That is hypocrisy, chasing Dune for a couple of hours as you were up in arms as he said you said something you didn't , and wouldn't come off your perch until you got it. When the boot is on the other foot , it gets ignored.

See I have used the word hypocrite on this thread, today and now.

[Sergei Gotsmanov]

Slightly different. The chap that accosted Cameron was a Guardian writer.

[trousers]

Slightly different. The chap that accosted Cameron was a Guardian writer.

Makes a change from a headless chicken from the daily mirror

[View From The Top]

You can't write it off, this has cost Brown a huuuuge chunk of the working class vote as I'd guarantee a lot of them hold similar views to the pensioner..

 

Don't confuse opinion with fact.

[OldNick]

Slightly different. The chap that accosted Cameron was a Guardian writer.

You are kidding?????

[trousers]

What has surprised me most about this episode is that no one in the media or world at large has seemingly picked up on Brown's biggest gaffe. Not the bigot quote; not the instinctual blame diversion to his advisors; not the contempt for 'ordinary' voters' views but the very fact that he thought the discussion with the woman had gone badly.

 

I actually thought he handled his 'first' real/unrehearsed punter quite well. The fact Brown even thought it was a "disaster" tells me all I need to know about his judgement capabilities.

 

That was his biggest gaffe IMHO

[View From The Top]

The Poles in our area got a special english teacher at primary school. The ones that left their children behind received child benefit for their children in Poland. Now if we invite them over then I do not begrudge that in part because they pay their taxes but we should have been a lot more organised when we allowed this to happen. The Poles gave our economy a boost but I can see why people at the bottom of the pile felt priced out.

 

I rest my case.

 

They are taught English so to access education in English. End of.

 

It's a myth peddled by papers like the Mail that they are taught in their "mother tongue".

[OldNick]

Don't confuse opinion with fact.

I think it is hard to make anything like this a fact but it is a very fair assessment. Without a doubt the embedded Labour support will not desert Brown, Im sure it would be the same for any party. The floating voter will Im sure be joining the Libs. Perhaps we will still have a 2 party parliament after the election after all.

[View From The Top]

That was his biggest gaffe IMHO

 

No, that was becoming PM when he wasn't elected by the public into that position.

[trousers]

 

No, that was becoming PM when he wasn't elected by the public into that position.

That makes him as bad as John Major.... ;-)

[Sergei Gotsmanov]

You are kidding?????

 

http://order-order.com/2010/04/27/no-such-thing-as-innocent-by-stander/

[trousers]

 

http://order-order.com/2010/04/27/no-such-thing-as-innocent-by-stander/

 

Labour supporters take spin to a new bottom of barrel level.

[OldNick]

http://order-order.com/2010/04/27/no-such-thing-as-innocent-by-stander/

OH, thanks for that. Seems a bit of a set up.

[Sergei Gotsmanov]

I rest my case.

 

They are taught English so to access education in English. End of.

 

It's a myth peddled by papers like the Mail that they are taught in their "mother tongue".

 

Do not rest it to long. The question you need to ask is did it cost more resources to teach Polish children?

 

As I said I have no bones with the Poles - they did a lot for our economy and I like that bit in the Battle of Britain when the Polish pilots spot the messerschmitt 'enough of that Polish chit chat'.....

 

I can however see why some people had issues because they were directly effected. Raising them with the PM should not make you become a bigot.

[TopGun]

Do not rest it to long. The question you need to ask is did it cost more resources to teach Polish children?

 

As I said I have no bones with the Poles - they did a lot for our economy and I like that bit in the Battle of Britain when the Polish pilots spot the messerschmitt 'enough of that Polish chit chat'.....

 

I can however see why some people had issues because they were directly effected. Raising them with the PM should not make you become a bigot.

 

How does Polish immigration affect the infrastructure of the greater lazy unemployed in Rochdale or elsewhere?

[buctootim]

You are kidding?????

 

http://order-order.com/2010/04/27/no-such-thing-as-innocent-by-stander/

 

Labour supporters take spin to a new bottom of barrel level.

 

OH, thanks for that. Seems a bit of a set up.

 

 

Dont bother with real story guys -you swallow the Tory party spin on Camerons embarrassment by pretending it was a Labour setup.

 

Ironically, it later emerged that Mr Bartley – the co-director of the Christian thinktank Ekklesia – had been invited to meet Mr Cameron by a Tory party official who approached him as he waited to take his son to a hospital appointment. Nor can Mr Bartley be described as hostile to the Tory cause: he was part of John Major’s team during his battle with John Redwood for the Conservative leadership in 1995.

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/politics/article7109763.ece

Edited 29 April, 2010 by buctootim

[Thorpe-le-Saint]

Bigot stands for Brown is going on Thursday...

 

You stole that from 5live!!

[View From The Top]

Do not rest it to long. The question you need to ask is did it cost more resources to teach Polish children?

 

No.

 

It's the same SEN strategy that all schools have in place for those who struggle with English, usually poor white working class British born kids.

[Sergei Gotsmanov]

Dont bother with real story guys -you swallow the Tory party spin on Camerons embarrassment by pretending it was a Labour setup.

 

Ironically, it later emerged that Mr Bartley – the co-director of the Christian thinktank Ekklesia – had been invited to meet Mr Cameron by a Tory party official who approached him as he waited to take his son to a hospital appointment. Nor can Mr Bartley be described as hostile to the Tory cause: he was part of John Major’s team during his battle with John Redwood for the Conservative leadership in 1995.

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/politics/article7109763.ece

 

He is politically active not the sort of chap that you normally find on the street.

[Sergei Gotsmanov]

No.

 

It's the same SEN strategy that all schools have in place for those who struggle with English, usually poor white working class British born kids.

 

VFTT I am really sorry I am wrong then. Maybe my local school was just a one off but they had to take on somebody as a result of the arrival of a Polish family.

[Frank's cousin]

What has surprised me most about this episode is that no one in the media or world at large has seemingly picked up on Brown's biggest gaffe. Not the bigot quote; not the instinctual blame diversion to his advisors; not the contempt for 'ordinary' voters' views but the very fact that he thought the discussion with the woman had gone badly.

 

I actually thought he handled his 'first' real/unrehearsed punter quite well. The fact Brown even thought it was a "disaster" tells me all I need to know about his judgement capabilities.

 

That was his biggest gaffe IMHO

 

Sorry, have to disagree there. The reason he considered it a disaster was quite simply that what had been filmed and braodcast was a traditional labour voter actually questioning the record and in particular bringing up that elephant in the room that is immigration...

 

Personally, the fact that he made the gaffe does seem blown out of all proportion as come on lets be honest, how many times have we all said things that woudl be considered derogatory behind folks backs?

 

It highlights for me though all that is wrog with politics in this country and with our obsession with the confrontational politics - the way the media and all parties focus on the slightest negative about each other rather than the positives that each of the parties bring to the table... its just utter pathetic playground politics with the percentage of the public whose swing left to right and right to left depending on what the 'Sun says' - having the power over all of us - This election is not about issues and debate, its about how the media have portrayed these leaders.... and the fact we have a population not mature enough to discuss issues such as immigration from a balanced perspective with all parties knowing it so they avoid the question.

 

Lets take immigration for example for every person who believes the figures quoted in the media about the numbers from 'Eastern Europe' - how many can call up the numbers of Brits emmigrating to Spain, France, Aus, Canada to live and work? What is the net figure? How many of those who come here pay tax and NI versus are those exploited by 'British' employers and given low wages ?

 

There are obvious social consequences to immigrationthat need to be discussed, but no where near as the 'fear factor/propoganda' elements of the media and certain parties have successfully caused an ignorant element of the population to believe....

[Johnny Bognor]

He is politically active not the sort of chap that you normally find on the street.

 

Who just happened by pure chance to be in the same place as DC

[OldNick]

Sorry, have to disagree there. The reason he considered it a disaster was quite simply that what had been filmed and braodcast was a traditional labour voter actually questioning the record and in particular bringing up that elephant in the room that is immigration...

 

Personally, the fact that he made the gaffe does seem blown out of all proportion as come on lets be honest, how many times have we all said things that woudl be considered derogatory behind folks backs?

 

It highlights for me though all that is wrog with politics in this country and with our obsession with the confrontational politics - the way the media and all parties focus on the slightest negative about each other rather than the positives that each of the parties bring to the table... its just utter pathetic playground politics with the percentage of the public whose swing left to right and right to left depending on what the 'Sun says' - having the power over all of us - This election is not about issues and debate, its about how the media have portrayed these leaders.... and the fact we have a population not mature enough to discuss issues such as immigration from a balanced perspective with all parties knowing it so they avoid the question.

 

Lets take immigration for example for every person who believes the figures quoted in the media about the numbers from 'Eastern Europe' - how many can call up the numbers of Brits emmigrating to Spain, France, Aus, Canada to live and work? What is the net figure? How many of those who come here pay tax and NI versus are those exploited by 'British' employers and given low wages ?

 

There are obvious social consequences to immigrationthat need to be discussed, but no where near as the 'fear factor/propoganda' elements of the media and certain parties have successfully caused an ignorant element of the population to believe....

The reason he called it a disaster is that he was worried that he was asked questions out of his comfort zone.

I thought he dealt with her well, but his paranoia was that it had gone wrong. He called her (unfairly IMO) a bigot. The main thing it shows to the public in general that all the mealy mouthed talking by all these peole means nothing, as they say 1 thing but really think another.

Brown will be damaged by the voters who are not politicalised, as I suspect they will move away from him.

Tonight the politicians have a big decision to make, do they tell us the truth and what we have to expect after the election regarding the state of the economy or do they hide it?

It would take a brave man to come out with the truth for the nation , but they really have duty to do so

[buctootim]

Who just happened by pure chance to be in the same place as DC

 

er no. A Tory researcher dragged him out to meet charming Dave, which makes it all the funnier.

Edited 29 April, 2010 by buctootim

[John B]

Sorry, have to disagree there. The reason he considered it a disaster was quite simply that what had been filmed and braodcast was a traditional labour voter actually questioning the record and in particular bringing up that elephant in the room that is immigration...

 

Personally, the fact that he made the gaffe does seem blown out of all proportion as come on lets be honest, how many times have we all said things that woudl be considered derogatory behind folks backs?

 

It highlights for me though all that is wrog with politics in this country and with our obsession with the confrontational politics - the way the media and all parties focus on the slightest negative about each other rather than the positives that each of the parties bring to the table... its just utter pathetic playground politics with the percentage of the public whose swing left to right and right to left depending on what the 'Sun says' - having the power over all of us - This election is not about issues and debate, its about how the media have portrayed these leaders.... and the fact we have a population not mature enough to discuss issues such as immigration from a balanced perspective with all parties knowing it so they avoid the question.

 

Lets take immigration for example for every person who believes the figures quoted in the media about the numbers from 'Eastern Europe' - how many can call up the numbers of Brits emmigrating to Spain, France, Aus, Canada to live and work? What is the net figure? How many of those who come here pay tax and NI versus are those exploited by 'British' employers and given low wages ?

 

There are obvious social consequences to immigrationthat need to be discussed, but no where near as the 'fear factor/propoganda' elements of the media and certain parties have successfully caused an ignorant element of the population to believe....

 

I totally agree with you but how the points you raise are to understood by the working man in the street when most of the tabloid press feeds us with half truths I dont know.

 

I just feel that the media should show more respect to the members of parliament but that is very difficult when lots of them seem to be at Westminster just to line their own pockets.

[Lord Duckhunter]

Brown meeting "Gillian" was not the same as Cameron meeting the disabled boys father. The Cameron meeting was a lot tougher, the man was obvioulsy highly educated and articulate. It could have been a very tricky front page moment for Cameron, but he played it well. They came a cross as 2 passionate fathers wanting the same thing, but having differences over the means to get there.I doubt very much if Cameron got in the car and started ranting at his aides and slagging off the father, although we'll never know.

 

Brown handled "Gillian's" gentle questions well, but with a forced smile on his face.She was hardly paxman and was a Labour supporter, prasing schools and other aspects of policy.Nobody in their right mind would have called that a disaster.

To compound the problem he then went on Radio and made a half hearted apology, with his head held in hands, making him look weak and foolish.

 

Brown is now a figure of fun, Mr Bean, as Cable called him.

[Frank's cousin]

Brown meeting "Gillian" was not the same as Cameron meeting the disabled boys father. The Cameron meeting was a lot tougher, the man was obvioulsy highly educated and articulate. It could have been a very tricky front page moment for Cameron, but he played it well. They came a cross as 2 passionate fathers wanting the same thing, but having differences over the means to get there.I doubt very much if Cameron got in the car and started ranting at his aides and slagging off the father, although we'll never know.

 

Brown handled "Gillian's" gentle questions well, but with a forced smile on his face.She was hardly paxman and was a Labour supporter, prasing schools and other aspects of policy.Nobody in their right mind would have called that a disaster.

To compound the problem he then went on Radio and made a half hearted apology, with his head held in hands, making him look weak and foolish.

 

Brown is now a figure of fun, Mr Bean, as Cable called him.

 

 

Thing is Brown is whatever you choose to believe he is right now...basd on your previous perceptions and how influenced you are by the media representation of him following what was in all truth something we have all done...

 

eg. it would be equally as valid for me to say Brown now hadmore sympathy with many, because he has shown he is only human, and all leaders suffer at the stress and strain of such a campaign - But it all depends on what is said, who said it and where its said as to how its thenm percieved as a 'truth' by the population.

 

Naturally its vital to a free socety to have a free press and a free media, but for me the media needs to take responibilty and understand that it is dealing with in some cases an unedereducated public and that ofetn connot distinguish between and editorial slant and down right propoganda. I have no problem with papers taking and editorial position, but I do have an issue with the likes of Murdoch rags that change this purely for their own gain... because they either know it will attract more readers or in Murdoch's case whichever party will be creating conditions more favourable to his business empire and personnal wealth... to me that is a perversion of democracy because he does not take his responibilty to that influence his papers yield over those politically naive, seriously - he uses and abuses those readers to suit his own aims...

[Johnny Bognor]

er no. A Tory researcher dragged him out to meet charming Dave, which makes it all the funnier.

 

 

It is mildy funny, but it really doesn't compare to Calamity Clown.

 

Brown is now a figure of fun, Mr Bean, as Cable called him.

 

I disagree, Brown is funnier than Mr Bean.

[John B]

Brown meeting "Gillian" was not the same as Cameron meeting the disabled boys father. The Cameron meeting was a lot tougher, the man was obvioulsy highly educated and articulate. It could have been a very tricky front page moment for Cameron, but he played it well. They came a cross as 2 passionate fathers wanting the same thing, but having differences over the means to get there.I doubt very much if Cameron got in the car and started ranting at his aides and slagging off the father, although we'll never know.

 

Brown handled "Gillian's" gentle questions well, but with a forced smile on his face.She was hardly paxman and was a Labour supporter, prasing schools and other aspects of policy.Nobody in their right mind would have called that a disaster.

To compound the problem he then went on Radio and made a half hearted apology, with his head held in hands, making him look weak and foolish.

 

Brown is now a figure of fun, Mr Bean, as Cable called him.

 

It is much easier having a discussion with someone who knows the facts than someone like the lady from Rochdale

[Whitey Grandad]

It is much easier having a discussion with someone who knows the facts than someone like the lady from Rochdale

Might I presume that she knows more about the local situation in Rocdale than you or I?

[John B]

Brown meeting "Gillian" was not the same as Cameron meeting the disabled boys father. The Cameron meeting was a lot tougher, the man was obvioulsy highly educated and articulate. It could have been a very tricky front page moment for Cameron, but he played it well. They came a cross as 2 passionate fathers wanting the same thing, but having differences over the means to get there.I doubt very much if Cameron got in the car and started ranting at his aides and slagging off the father, although we'll never know.

 

Brown handled "Gillian's" gentle questions well, but with a forced smile on his face.She was hardly paxman and was a Labour supporter, prasing schools and other aspects of policy.Nobody in their right mind would have called that a disaster.

To compound the problem he then went on Radio and made a half hearted apology, with his head held in hands, making him look weak and foolish.

 

Brown is now a figure of fun, Mr Bean, as Cable called him.

 

From your comments the problem appears is that you are probably bigotted against Mr Brown .

 

 

He made a mistake and left his microphone on thats all.

Edited 29 April, 2010 by John B

[John B]

Might I presume that she knows more about the local situation in Rocdale than you or I?

 

Listening to the interview prior to bigotgate she appeared to be talking a great deal in generalisations and not specifics

[Lord Duckhunter]

From your comments the problem appears is that you are probably bigotted against Mr Brown .

 

 

He made a mistake and left his microphone on thats all.

 

"that's all", what a load of pony. He was all smiles asking about her family,saying "nice to see you" and laughing. He got into the car and then we saw his true personality. The Labour party had spent the whole election campaign shielding Bean from ordinary voters, and now we know why. He has utter contempt for the ordinary working people he purportes to represent. She was a Labour supporter from her top to toe. Generations of her family supported the party, and she had her vote ready to go. She even told reporters she was voting Labour after her chat with Bean and before she heard his remarks.

 

Look at the look of shock on her face when first told what he'd said, she was genuinely upset and shocked.As Andrew Neil pointed out on the Daily Politics today, he lied with the answer he did giv Mrs Duffy. He said that a million Brits were living in Europe and a million Europeans were living in UK. When figures show that net immigration is higher in than out. He just can not be stright with the British people, he even lied at the Chilcott enquiry . He is unfit to be leader of a great political party, a party that has had many honourable people in it, and he is certainly unfit for the highest office in the land.

[St Marco]

What i don't get is what the women actually asked that he felt was out of order. Her questions were pretty good and very relevent. We in Southampton have seen one of the highest eastern europe population increases here so we can sort of relate to her questions. I would not say we are a racist city, we are a nice bunch really. So i can understand why some people would like to know how these people are selected to live here. Is it a simple open door policy etc.. By asking those questions does not make you a biggot, it is just asking how their party policy on imigration works.

 

The reason why he is getting a kicking is not because of he left a mic on it is because it shows his public image and his private image are two very different things. If he try's to be all sincere in front of the cameras but is really like that off it then you have to say he is just a phoney.

 

What shocks me is that this wasen't some evil heated debate where some yobo threw a egg at him or insulted him etc.. It was a grandma, who has voted labour all her life just talking normally with her. She even said she agreed with him and will vote labour at the election. He had no need to be irritated. It was all set-up to make him look good. A interview with a labour die-hard supporter. He had the cameras, he had the mics etc.. He even said "they will run with it" talking about the news going to report on him visiting this women, in a form of propoganda to show he cares what people think.

 

He fecked up bigtime. If he is like that with something so trivial then what is he like when it is something more heated?

 

Labour will not win the election, we all knew that anyway. But with this they will be lucky to even finish second.

[St Marco]

Also he said "i would never say anything like that" before the tape was played. Which again shows he lied....

[John B]

"that's all", what a load of pony. He was all smiles asking about her family,saying "nice to see you" and laughing. He got into the car and then we saw his true personality. The Labour party had spent the whole election campaign shielding Bean from ordinary voters, and now we know why. He has utter contempt for the ordinary working people he purportes to represent. She was a Labour supporter from her top to toe. Generations of her family supported the party, and she had her vote ready to go. She even told reporters she was voting Labour after her chat with Bean and before she heard his remarks.

 

Look at the look of shock on her face when first told what he'd said, she was genuinely upset and shocked.As Andrew Neil pointed out on the Daily Politics today, he lied with the answer he did giv Mrs Duffy. He said that a million Brits were living in Europe and a million Europeans were living in UK. When figures show that net immigration is higher in than out. He just can not be stright with the British people, he even lied at the Chilcott enquiry . He is unfit to be leader of a great political party, a party that has had many honourable people in it, and he is certainly unfit for the highest office in the land.

 

Politics is addressing the issues not being biggoted against Gordon Brown who you probably have never met and dont know his ideals.

[Lord Duckhunter]

Politics is addressing the issues not being biggoted against Gordon Brown who you probably have never met and dont know his ideals.

 

I know he lied to the Chilcott enquiry.

I know he has one face in public and one when he thinks he's off camera.

I Know he sold our gold at rock bottom prices, costing us more money than was ever lost on Black Wednesday.

I know he promised me a vote on the Lisbon Treaty and then went back on his word.

I know he told us he'd abolished boom and bust.

I know he pays tax credits to people earning more than £40,000

I know he set up the tripartite regulation system for the banks.

I know his tax raid decimated private pension's in this country.

 

If I only voted for people I'd met, the choice would be pretty narrow.

[John B]

What i don't get is what the women actually asked that he felt was out of order. Her questions were pretty good and very relevent. We in Southampton have seen one of the highest eastern europe population increases here so we can sort of relate to her questions. I would not say we are a racist city, we are a nice bunch really. So i can understand why some people would like to know how these people are selected to live here. Is it a simple open door policy etc.. By asking those questions does not make you a biggot, it is just asking how their party policy on imigration works.

 

The reason why he is getting a kicking is not because of he left a mic on it is because it shows his public image and his private image are two very different things. If he try's to be all sincere in front of the cameras but is really like that off it then you have to say he is just a phoney.

 

What shocks me is that this wasen't some evil heated debate where some yobo threw a egg at him or insulted him etc.. It was a grandma, who has voted labour all her life just talking normally with her. She even said she agreed with him and will vote labour at the election. He had no need to be irritated. It was all set-up to make him look good. A interview with a labour die-hard supporter. He had the cameras, he had the mics etc.. He even said "they will run with it" talking about the news going to report on him visiting this women, in a form of propoganda to show he cares what people think.

 

He fecked up bigtime. If he is like that with something so trivial then what is he like when it is something more heated?

 

Labour will not win the election, we all knew that anyway. But with this they will be lucky to even finish second.

 

Most politicans have a private side different from there public no one who would have thought Mr Major was having an affair Edwina Currie.

[John B]

I know he lied to the Chilcott enquiry.

I know he has one face in public and one when he thinks he's off camera.

I Know he sold our gold at rock bottom prices, costing us more money than was ever lost on Black Wednesday.

I know he promised me a vote on the Lisbon Treaty and then went back on his word.

I know he told us he'd abolished boom and bust.

I know he pays tax credits to people earning more than £40,000

I know he set up the tripartite regulation system for the banks.

I know his tax raid decimated private pension's in this country.

 

If I only voted for people I'd met, the choice would be pretty narrow.

 

You do seem to be a very clever chap but obviously you do not understand how the political system works .

 

By the way is Mr Cameron a Liar as he said he would he would have a referendum on the Lisbon treaty.

[Thedelldays]

You do seem to be a very clever chap but obviously you do not understand how the political system works .

 

By the way is Mr Cameron a Liar as he said he would he would have a referendum on the Lisbon treaty.

to me...they are all chancers, opportunists..clegg, cameron, brown, blair..

 

the last real leader we had (or even potential leader) that was not, was good old Mrs T.

 

IMO, someone has to run the country, some has to try and sort this utter mess out that we are in..everything will be cut make no mistake..all of us, rich or poor will feel the pinch

 

the question we have to ask ourselves, is, which chancer is the lesser of 3 evils to run the country...

 

IMO, cameron is that man..his party offer an alternative and more likely to get in power than clegg..Clegg IMO offers completely mental ideas on what his party wants..and brown and his lot seem to have run their course

 

having a hung parliament will be disasterous IMO.....will serve none of us nothing at all

[Lord Duckhunter]

By the way is Mr Cameron a Liar as he said he would he would have a referendum on the Lisbon treaty.

 

There was only one party that had the chance to give us the promised referendum, the Labour Party. All the Torys could do was table an amendment and hope that enough Labour MP's had the moral decency to honour their manifesto promise.

 

The Tory party tabled an amendment to the ratification of the treaty through Parliament.This amendment called for a referendum, and was defeated by 63 votes.29 Labour rebels voted to honour their manifesto pledge and 13 Lib/Dems voted to honour their's. There was nothing more that Cameron could do.

 

 

Once the treaty had gone through all the European Parliaments it was legally binding and could not be blocked at a later date.

Edited 29 April, 2010 by Lord Duckhunter

[solentstars]

to me...they are all chancers, opportunists..clegg, cameron, brown, blair..

 

the last real leader we had (or even potential leader) that was not, was good old Mrs T.

 

IMO, someone has to run the country, some has to try and sort this utter mess out that we are in..everything will be cut make no mistake..all of us, rich or poor will feel the pinch

 

the question we have to ask ourselves, is, which chancer is the lesser of 3 evils to run the country...

 

IMO, cameron is that man..his party offer an alternative and more likely to get in power than clegg..Clegg IMO offers completely mental ideas on what his party wants..and brown and his lot seem to have run their course

 

having a hung parliament will be disasterous IMO.....will serve none of us nothing at all

you mean the poor will be effected more or the tax avoider lord ashcroft would not be funding the present tory party unless he got his payback.

roll on the hung parliament and hopefully a modern demoracy in the long run.

[landford.saint]

You do seem to be a very clever chap but obviously you do not understand how the political system works .

 

By the way is Mr Cameron a Liar as he said he would he would have a referendum on the Lisbon treaty.

 

Politican is code for 'a person who knows what the truth is but will do whatever it takes, even lying about anything just so they can keep their snout in the trough'.

 

Poli-tics is described thus:-

 

Poly = many

Tics = bloodsuckers.

[Whitey Grandad]

you mean the poor will be effected more or the tax avoider lord ashcroft would not be funding the present tory party unless he got his payback.

roll on the hung parliament and hopefully a modern demoracy in the long run.

Believe me, you do not want that. Be afraid.... Be very afraid.

[Whitey Grandad]

Listening to the interview prior to bigotgate she appeared to be talking a great deal in generalisations and not specifics

Then she would make an ideal politician!

Edited 29 April, 2010 by Whitey Grandad

[Thedelldays]

you mean the poor will be effected more or the tax avoider lord ashcroft would not be funding the present tory party unless he got his payback.

roll on the hung parliament and hopefully a modern demoracy in the long run.

 

 

no matter what party, people will get a free ride..lord ashcroft with the torys....scroungers with labour or open door to illegals with the libdems

 

just got to look past that and chose a leader as one ruling would be better than 3 trying

[Lord Duckhunter]

you mean the poor will be effected more or the tax avoider lord ashcroft would not be funding the present tory party unless he got his payback.

.

 

The double standards over ascroft is truely breathtaking. Gordon Brown made Lord Paul a privy councillor and deputy speaker of the Lords, before he was made to stand down due to financial irregularities.He has donated vast amounts to the Labour Party (although not as much as Ashcroft). He is also a non dom (like Ashcroft). The Labour line seems to be, we can make a non dom a Lord and a privvy councillor, we can also accept money from a non dom, but the Torys can't because he donates too much. You either are against the principle, or you're not. You cant accept money from a non dom and then complain about another party doing so.

[solentstars]

Believe me, you do not want that. Be afraid.... Be very afraid.

 

sorry i,m a positive person ,it does not scare me and hopefully its the end of the tory and labour love in.