BNP

[StuRomseySaint]

I can see the BNP ( and UKIP ) making real headway in this election, with the possibility of quite a few seats.

 

What are peoples thoughts on this?

 

Also, where/when is a list of candidates announced? I assume that BNP won't bother standing in Romsey?

[trousers]

As long as it's legal and democratic it's fine by me

[Guy]

I can't see BNP winning anything under the current first-past-the-post system, the constituencies are too big for their core vote to make an impact. People are also more likely to make protest votes in local or Euro elections rather than a GE.

 

There should be an un-official list of candidates on the BBC Elections website, but I think the nominations are still open for a few more days.

[Thorpe-le-Saint]

I can see the BNP ( and UKIP ) making real headway in this election, with the possibility of quite a few seats.

 

What are peoples thoughts on this?

 

Also, where/when is a list of candidates announced? I assume that BNP won't bother standing in Romsey?

 

I would imagine the exact opposite SRS - Majority white small town/village areas are where UKIP/BNP probably have a good chance of gaining seats due to, and I'm going to be 'pigeon holeing' people here, the amount of people in those areas that read the Daily Mail/Express etc.

 

On top of areas such as Barking and Dagenham, like you say, the BNP (unbelievably IMO) could well have a MP

[Scummer]

I don't think either party will win a seat at this election.

[View From The Top]

The BNP stand a chance in Dagenham but nowhere else except, perhaps, Stoke-On-Trent if they can focus on two seats at once.

 

UKIP stand a chance nowhere at all.

[StuRomseySaint]

I would imagine the exact opposite SRS - Majority white small town/village areas are where UKIP/BNP probably have a good chance of gaining seats due to, and I'm going to be 'pigeon holeing' people here, the amount of people in those areas that read the Daily Mail/Express etc.

 

On top of areas such as Barking and Dagenham, like you say, the BNP (unbelievably IMO) could well have a MP

 

O.K. That's a fair one. Thinking about it, we are a bunch of racists in Romsey... and it's the older ones that are worse.

 

I would imagine that BNP and UKIP giving it a good enough run this election, so that people will not see it as a wasted vote, and will look to push on at the next elections.

[Sergei Gotsmanov]

I would imagine the exact opposite SRS - Majority white small town/village areas are where UKIP/BNP probably have a good chance of gaining seats due to, and I'm going to be 'pigeon holeing' people here, the amount of people in those areas that read the Daily Mail/Express etc.

 

On top of areas such as Barking and Dagenham, like you say, the BNP (unbelievably IMO) could well have a MP

 

I hate sterotying people Thorpe Le Saint. You clearly do not live in a small town/village area if you think that these people vote for the BNP. I think it is appalling you can label a community in this way.

 

The BNP strongholds are areas in industrial towns and cities where mass immigration has diluted local local identities causing resentment. That is why the BNP are a threat to Labour not the Tories. Your small towns and villages may be radical and vote for UKIP.

 

BNP vote is not concentrated enough to generate seats. There only chance is Barking where Grifin is standing I think.

[Thorpe-le-Saint]

I hate sterotying people Thorpe Le Saint. You clearly do not live in a small town/village area if you think that these people vote for the BNP. I think it is appalling you can label a community in this way.

 

The BNP strongholds are areas in industrial towns and cities where mass immigration has diluted local local identities causing resentment. That is why the BNP are a threat to Labour not the Tories. Your small towns and villages may be radical and vote for UKIP.

 

BNP vote is not concentrated enough to generate seats. There only chance is Barking where Grifin is standing I think.

 

I live Colchester now but originate from a place in the New Forest right in the back arse of nowhere: Langley! Do you know it? No, so shut your mouth and **** off! I do know how people in small villages feel because I had to ****ing put up with their racist rants and un-educated logic for 23 years!!

 

Even around Colchester in villages such as Brightlingsea, Ardleigh, Elmstead Market there are people who will vote BNP as many people (especially in Brightlingsea) think that immigrants are a threat to them when they're not!

[View From The Top]

BNP vote is not concentrated enough to generate seats. There only chance is Barking where Grifin is standing I think.

 

They are the 2nd biggest party in Stoke and have been quite cunning in their targeting of wards so they may be in with a shout in Stoke Central or will at least finish 2nd.

[IamLeGod]

I've made a similar point on other threads. The BNP's 'success' at the european elections last year was quite distorted and disproportionate.

 

I would be very surprised if they are manage to come close to replicating this in anyway at the General Election. Much of the BNP vote last year came for two reasons.

 

1) These were the first European Elections since the passing of the Lisbon Treaty. The BNP campaigned hard on the issue of EU withdrawal, away of voicing discontent at the governments passing of the Lisbon Treaty without asking the electorate. However, I find it difficult to believe that in a General Election the electorate will genuinely feel that BNP are the party to handle issues such as the economy, education, health etc.

 

2) In the wake of the Expenses Scandal (the latest in the long line of scandals) leaving people disillusioned with mainstream politics. This lead many voters of the mainstream political parties to either not vote, or vote for the BNP in protest. People are more likely to make protest votes in European Elections as they do not see their MEP as having much of an impact on their everyday lives. Looking at the BNP vote in comparison to previous elections, one would notice their vote did not actually rise too dramatically, it was more a case of other parties votes falling. Also it may be worth remembering that they did only win 2 seats, the hype the media made about this played into the BNP's hands, making it appear that had in fact done much better.

[sadoldgit]

I hope you are wrong and that the BNP disappear off of the face of politics. What we need is greater tolerance, not less. Sadly some people still think that watered down Facism is a good idea.

[RedAndWhite91]

I wouldn't go into a panic if the BNP won another seat or two. They will never win a majority and they are a legal political party so I don't see the problem. I won't be voting for them, but at the same time I won't be worrying if they gain.

[miserableoldgit]

I hope you are wrong and that the BNP disappear off of the face of politics.

 

What we need is greater tolerance, not less. Sadly some people still think that watered down Facism is a good idea.

Do the first part of the quote and the second go together?? You will not tolerate the BNP??

[Gemmel]

I hope you are wrong and that the BNP disappear off of the face of politics. What we need is greater tolerance, not less. Sadly some people still think that watered down Facism is a good idea.

 

In my opinion BNP's rise in popularity has more to do with the Tories and Labour refusal to properly and openly debate the issues that the BNP fly their flag to (And i dont mean 1hr on questiontime).

[View From The Top]

In my opinion BNP's rise in popularity has more to do with the Tories and Labour refusal to properly and openly debate the issues that the BNP fly their flag to (And i dont mean 1hr on questiontime).

 

I agree 100%.

[sadoldgit]

Probably not but there is a huge difference between tolerance and not tolerating the behaviour of people of a certain belief. Should we have tolerated the Nazis for example?

 

I don't think it is unreasonable to say that every human being ought to have the same rights on this planet. Just because you were born in a certain place doesn't give you a right to dictate what other people's rights are. Why should any one tolerate intolerance?

[sadoldgit]

In my opinion BNP's rise in popularity has more to do with the Tories and Labour refusal to properly and openly debate the issues that the BNP fly their flag to (And i dont mean 1hr on questiontime).

 

I think you are probably right, but it is sad that the disaffected don't give their vote to something like the Green Party rather than a bunch of ignorant racists.

 

A lot of disaffected Germans gave their vote to Hitler and probably lived to regret it.

[RedAndWhite91]

Probably not but there is a huge difference between tolerance and not tolerating the behaviour of people of a certain belief. Should we have tolerated the Nazis for example?

 

I don't think it is unreasonable to say that every human being ought to have the same rights on this planet. Just because you were born in a certain place doesn't give you a right to dictate what other people's rights are. Why should any one tolerate intolerance?

 

Appeasement? We would have let them carry on if they hadn't invaded Poland, who we had the peace pact with. Germany was a nice buffer between the Communist USSR for a while.

[miserableoldgit]

Probably not but there is a huge difference between tolerance and not tolerating the behaviour of people of a certain belief. Should we have tolerated the Nazis for example?

 

I don't think it is unreasonable to say that every human being ought to have the same rights on this planet. Just because you were born in a certain place doesn't give you a right to dictate what other people's rights are. Why should any one tolerate intolerance?

I understand what you are saying but this part of the problem with todays society. We are so intent on treating everyone equally, honouring everyones "Human Rights" (whether they deserve them or not), and not giving offence to anyone. If you believe in these things then you must extend them to the BNP, or any other Political Party that you don`t agree with. You cannot pick and choose.

[sadoldgit]

We did tolerate them until they violated Poland, it is true. There is always a point at which you make a stand. For some it will be too soon, for others too late. As with the Middle East, at what point is it "right" to interfere with another sovereign state?

 

We have the luxury of hindsight of course, but there we many who could see the evil of the Nazi Party as it was growing within its own boundaries and who left Germany for more tolerant societies.

 

As for the buffer, yep, Churchill was not fan of Stalin's either but considered him the lesser of two evils - some choice eh?

[sadoldgit]

I understand what you are saying but this part of the problem with todays society. We are so intent on treating everyone equally, honouring everyones "Human Rights" (whether they deserve them or not), and not giving offence to anyone. If you believe in these things then you must extend them to the BNP, or any other Political Party that you don`t agree with. You cannot pick and choose.

 

Who gets to decide whether people "deserve" them or not??? Sounds chilling like something from the 1930's!!!

 

As for the BNP and rights, I don't think that should apply to parties who want to deny others rights. Hasn't history taught us that? We did pick and chose when it came to the Nazis, the the Facists in Italy etc.

Edited 8 April, 2010 by sadoldgit
spelling

[TopGun]

O.K. That's a fair one. Thinking about it, we are a bunch of racists in Romsey... and it's the older ones that are worse.

 

I would imagine that BNP and UKIP giving it a good enough run this election, so that people will not see it as a wasted vote, and will look to push on at the next elections.

 

 

As others have said they are very unlikely to win seats at the GE. Where the BNP have pockets of support such as Barking and Burnley they are still generally second or worse to Labour across the constituency. I don't believe there is a Tory seat that is even challenged realistically by BNP.

 

UKIP are different as their support is more wealthy than BNP's working class white support so the demographics are different. But once again they will not get near any seat with the possible exception of Buckingham which is the Speaker's seat. Tory and Lab and LD are not standing against the Speaker as is usual but Farage is standing for UKIP.

 

The Greens are in a similar position as their support is very disparate although they have a slim chance in Brighton Pavillion where their leader Caroline Lucas is standing.

 

I expect Respect to disappear.

Edited 8 April, 2010 by TopGun

[miserableoldgit]

Who gets to decide whether people "deserve" them or not??? Sounds chilling like something from the 1930's!!!

 

As for the BNP and rights, I don't think that should apply to parties who want to deny others rights. Hasn't history taught us that? We did pick and chose when it came to the Nazis, the the Facists in Italy etc.

I personally think that anyone who steps outside of the bounds of civilised behavior (rapists, murderers etc) should forfeit their "Human Rights" and that the"Human Rights Act" is being used/ abused by certain sections of (in particular) the legal profession to acheive things that are not acceptable.

I do actually agree with what you say but I am just trying (probably badly) to illustrate the tightrope that you walk on when you try to treat everyone with an idealised fairness and equality.

If , for example, you think that it is fair that Muslim extremists are at liberty, in this country, to preach the downfall of western civilisation and to celebrate suicide bombers, because it would be impinging on there "Human Rights" to prevent them, then you must allow any legal political party to express their views as well, because, presumably it is their "Human Right" to be able to say whatever they like.

Sadly, in this country, in so many walks of life, we are no longer allowed to apply "Common Sense" solutions to problems. All IMHO.

Edited 8 April, 2010 by miserableoldgit

[sadoldgit]

It is a thorny issue...where does someone human rights start and anothers end?

 

Whilst I agree that people who perpetrate "uncivilised" acts on others do needed to be treated differently. I also still believe that in a civilised society they should still be afforded "civilised" capitivity.

 

As for extemists of any persuasion (and in the Middle East some would see "The West" as being Extemists) the you could argue that those people of that persuasion ate intolerant. I know it comes down to who is doing the defining (such as pon ema's terrorist is another man's freedom fighter) but all we can do as individuals is deal with what is on our doorstep and elect a Government to deal with the bigger issues.

 

I do believe in freedom of speech and as long as people do not break the law then it is fine for them to say what they like. It was good that the BNP had a platform on Qurstion Time because, if there was any doubt what is really going on there, hopefully it was dispelled.

 

After what the world went through in the last century though I find it hard to believe that some "rational" people think it is a good idea to give them their vote. But that is just what I think.

 

I am happy that I live in what is most is mostly tolerant society and that etremists of any persuasion are in the minority. I hope that situation does not change and I hope the BNP do not manage to pull the wool over the eyes of decent, tolerant people.

[INFLUENCED.COM]

I hate sterotying people Thorpe Le Saint. You clearly do not live in a small town/village area if you think that these people vote for the BNP. I think it is appalling you can label a community in this way.

 

I live Colchester now but originate from a place in the New Forest right in the back arse of nowhere: Langley! Do you know it? No, so shut your mouth and **** off!

 

From this response alone I am able to deduce that those from Langley must be an unpleasant bunch.

 

I agree with Gemmels post above, engage and have debate with Griffin et al, however, I very much doubt it will happen as it seems any rational discussions of the problems of migration are discouraged by all.

[IamLeGod]

I personally think that anyone who steps outside of the bounds of civilised behavior (rapists, murderers etc) should forfeit their "Human Rights" and that the"Human Rights Act" is being used/ abused by certain sections of (in particular) the legal profession to acheive things that are not acceptable.

I do actually agree with what you say but I am just trying (probably badly) to illustrate the tightrope that you walk on when you try to treat everyone with an idealised fairness and equality.

If , for example, you think that it is fair that Muslim extremists are at liberty, in this country, to preach the downfall of western civilisation and to celebrate suicide bombers, because it would be impinging on there "Human Rights" to prevent them, then you must allow any legal political party to express their views as well, because, presumably it is their "Human Right" to be able to say whatever they like.

Sadly, in this country, in so many walks of life, we are no longer allowed to apply "Common Sense" solutions to problems. All IMHO.

 

The use of Muslim Extremists is an interesting example. Going further than simply their expressions of hate etc against the Western world; you can understand their terrorist attacks as a manipulation of the Western Liberal Democratic system to which they are so opposed.

 

Due to the ideas of freedom of expression, association etc and the pivotal notion of innocence until proven guilt, it is possible for such extremists to get together and formulate plans relatively easily. The clever thing about these groups is their ability to recruit often unsuspicious 'westernised' muslims disillusioned with the western world. Authorities are powerless to simply round up random muslims simply for their appearance/background/ethnicity/religion in the hope they may find someone who is engaged in terroristic activities (rightly so). It is the western democracies reliance on liberties and rights that allows these groups the freedom to carry out these attacks, using these liberties and rights as a weapon against them.

[Sergei Gotsmanov]

I live Colchester now but originate from a place in the New Forest right in the back arse of nowhere: Langley! Do you know it? No, so shut your mouth and **** off! I do know how people in small villages feel because I had to ****ing put up with their racist rants and un-educated logic for 23 years!!

 

Even around Colchester in villages such as Brightlingsea, Ardleigh, Elmstead Market there are people who will vote BNP as many people (especially in Brightlingsea) think that immigrants are a threat to them when they're not!

 

No you are right Thorpey, your indepth knowledge of small towns and villages enables you to make such a judgement - and you are right to call all people in these villages and towns racist. Do you work for Gallup or Mori?

 

It must have been difficult living with all of these 'uneducated people' (bit wurzel were they?). You must have loved the pub quizzes in Langley...... 'and the winner is.....

 

......Thorpey again!!! He is so clever and we are all so stupid. oh arhhh bet hes in that Mensa!'

[ecuk268]

No you are right Thorpey, your indepth knowledge of small towns and villages enables you to make such a judgement - and you are right to call all people in these villages and towns racist. Do you work for Gallup or Mori?

 

It must have been difficult living with all of these 'uneducated people' (bit wurzel were they?). You must have loved the pub quizzes in Langley...... 'and the winner is.....

 

......Thorpey again!!! He is so clever and we are all so stupid. oh arhhh bet hes in that Mensa!'

 

I've worked for a company in Hardley (about 2 miles from Langley) for years and, although I'm a sophisticated Southampton city dweller, haven't noticed too many of my colleagues from Langley being rampant racists.

 

Did hear a couple of them discussing invading Poland to get more lebensraum. Is this a clue?

[Huntingdon]

I live in John Major's old constituency, so it's fairly right-wing (as you can imagine)

 

I'm very surprised at the continued growth of the BNP

 

Whether they win a seat or not is uncertain, but they certainly have hardcore support

 

I blame the 3 major parties for this - they are too quick to slag off the BNP, but are not addressing the issues why people are turning to them. I wouldn't mind betting that the average BNP supporter, is not somebody who'd be rude to someone just because they are black. They are turning to the BNP for more deep rooted issues & this is something the mainstream parties are struggling to grasp

[dune]

Local/European elections are where the small parties will do well, not in General elections.

[dune]

I live Colchester now but originate from a place in the New Forest right in the back arse of nowhere: Langley! Do you know it? No, so shut your mouth and **** off! I do know how people in small villages feel because I had to ****ing put up with their racist rants and un-educated logic for 23 years!!

 

Even around Colchester in villages such as Brightlingsea, Ardleigh, Elmstead Market there are people who will vote BNP as many people (especially in Brightlingsea) think that immigrants are a threat to them when they're not!

 

You have a point. I'm countryside born and bred and patriotic views are certainly more prevelent. We look at the big conurbations and think ourselves lucky we still live in comunities where immigrants haven't yet settled, but there is a fear that this cannot be taken for granted. We have a saying "it's no good shutting the barn door once the horse has bolted" and for that reason the votes for UKIP and the BNP are growing. Also there's many people in the countryside now who've moved out of the big cities to get away from the mullti cultured cities and they don't want to see their new area turned into the area they left.

[Crab Lungs]

I live in John Major's old constituency, so it's fairly right-wing (as you can imagine)

 

I'm very surprised at the continued growth of the BNP

 

Whether they win a seat or not is uncertain, but they certainly have hardcore support

 

I blame the 3 major parties for this - they are too quick to slag off the BNP, but are not addressing the issues why people are turning to them. I wouldn't mind betting that the average BNP supporter, is not somebody who'd be rude to someone just because they are black. They are turning to the BNP for more deep rooted issues & this is something the mainstream parties are struggling to grasp

 

Brilliant summary... +1

[Baj]

Do you know it? No, so shut your mouth and **** off!

Whilst the rest of your post is relevent, the tone of it is inappropriate. Im making this a public reply so everyone knows, more than one reply like this and it's an instant ban on them from the GE 2010 forum. sorry

[TopGun]

You have a point. I'm countryside born and bred and patriotic views are certainly more prevelent. We look at the big conurbations and think ourselves lucky we still live in comunities where immigrants haven't yet settled, but there is a fear that this cannot be taken for granted. We have a saying "it's no good shutting the barn door once the horse has bolted" and for that reason the votes for UKIP and the BNP are growing. Also there's many people in the countryside now who've moved out of the big cities to get away from the mullti cultured cities and they don't want to see their new area turned into the area they left.

 

Heh heh... classic NIMBY!!!

[dune]

I live in John Major's old constituency, so it's fairly right-wing (as you can imagine)

 

I'm very surprised at the continued growth of the BNP

 

Whether they win a seat or not is uncertain, but they certainly have hardcore support

 

I blame the 3 major parties for this - they are too quick to slag off the BNP, but are not addressing the issues why people are turning to them. I wouldn't mind betting that the average BNP supporter, is not somebody who'd be rude to someone just because they are black. They are turning to the BNP for more deep rooted issues & this is something the mainstream parties are struggling to grasp

 

My uncle was a Conservaive councillor in Warboys during the Major years.

[buctootim]

The BNP, leaving aside their immigration policy, are distinctive on most issues. Whilst the three main parties all agree on pretty much everything -to stay in the EC, anti capital punishment, troops in Afghanistan etc. The BNP do at least offer a real choice. Whilst I dont agree with them on hardly anything I think in some ways they are a good thing to shake up the cozy cartel of the main three.

[Sheaf Saint]

I live in John Major's old constituency, so it's fairly right-wing (as you can imagine)

 

I'm very surprised at the continued growth of the BNP

 

Whether they win a seat or not is uncertain, but they certainly have hardcore support

 

I blame the 3 major parties for this - they are too quick to slag off the BNP, but are not addressing the issues why people are turning to them. I wouldn't mind betting that the average BNP supporter, is not somebody who'd be rude to someone just because they are black. They are turning to the BNP for more deep rooted issues & this is something the mainstream parties are struggling to grasp

 

I agree wholeheartedly. The problem being that these people you speak of seem to be taken in by the BNP's veneer of respectability. If everybody who was thinking of turning to them for the reasons you mention above could scratch the surface and discover the true history of the party members and their colourful pasts, they might think twice before putting their cross next to a group of convicted thugs.

[Channon's Sideburns]

I think the reason why BNP get some support is because of (in a clever PR like way) they hijack the political arena by openly criticising immigration etc...in a way that no 'normal' party would.

 

They do this because all the others are frightened of being classified as 'politically incorrect' - political correctness has a LOT to answer for.

 

I don't support or endorse the BNP but in my little village there's one property who always plasters their front gate with BNP posters...so Thorpie has a valid point.

 

Where the fook this attitude comes from I don't know.

 

Ironically, isn't it funny that inward immigration is seen as such a problem, but it's glossed over that WE could work in Poland etc if we wanted....it works both ways.

[jeff leopard]

I can see the BNP ( and UKIP ) making real headway in this election, with the possibility of quite a few seats.

 

What are peoples thoughts on this?

 

 

I despise the BNP and I find the rise of the far-right across Europe deplorable. But I'm starting to think that we need the BNP to do well just to shake party politics out of its comfort zone and actually motivate people to commit to something approaching progressive change (rather than just paying lip-service to it).

 

The bottom line is that even if the BNP get a person elected onto every council in the country, they’ll all be isolated from decision making and will achieve nothing, thank christy.

[Gingeletiss]

.......Even around Colchester in villages such as Brightlingsea, Ardleigh, Elmstead Market there are people who will vote BNP as many people (especially in Brightlingsea) think that immigrants are a threat to them when they're not!

 

Says you. Not what the facts say....93% of new jobs in the last 12 months have gone to IMMIGRANTS.

[Baj]

Says you. Not what the facts say....93% of new jobs in the last 12 months have gone to IMMIGRANTS.

Source?

[IamLeGod]

Source?

 

Nick Griffin said so?

[Lord Duckhunter]

Why have UKIP and the BNP been lumped together on this thread. Nobody would lump The Greens in with the BNP, so why UKIP?

 

Due to our First Past the Post system the BNP will not gain a seat at this election, neither will the Greens. UKIP may in the Speakers seat, but that's pretty doubtful (unfortunatly because he's a complete fool).However like the referundum Party, UKIP could do damage to the Tory vote, although they've said they wont stand against Tory's that share their view on Europe.

[View From The Top]

Source?

 

A FOI request by The Spectator.

[trousers]

Source?

 

Or prove him wrong via another source...?

[trousers]

Why have UKIP and the BNP been lumped together on this thread. Nobody would lump The Greens in with the BNP, so why UKIP?

 

I'm guessing it's either political naivity or typical human laziness of thought

[IamLeGod]

Why have UKIP and the BNP been lumped together on this thread. Nobody would lump The Greens in with the BNP, so why UKIP?

 

 

Maybe because the two both controversially made headway in the last set of elections the country saw last year. Additionally both parties are essentially one-dimensional, lead by eccentric leaders that make themselves and politics look a joke on a regular basis, and neither stand a real chance of gaining a majority vote in a General Election.

 

Policy wise they are different, but in terms of their respective positions on the political horizon and agenda they aren't exactly a million miles apart.

[tpbury]

Without redress to any facts, the UK is one of the select group of countries which 'owns' 80% of the world's wealth with 20% of the population. China and India are now deemed 'wealthy', but again that wealth is concentrated in the top 10 or 20% (btw, this means there are twice as many educated 'middle class' people in each of India and China than the whole population of Britain; or the educated middle class of these countries outnumber the entire population of the USA (children, rednecks, survivalists included)).

 

From a status quo point of view, we want to encourage this type of demographic in order that they can effictively suppress the 80% (=2 billion) of dirt poor potential revolutionaries. Or we could try and redistibute wealth to the poverty stricken frickers in a fair way (that means you get to wash a no frills car on your Sunday, rather than your pride and joy £30K loanmobile).

[Lord Duckhunter]

 

Policy wise they are different, but in terms of their respective positions on the political horizon and agenda they aren't exactly a million miles apart.

 

What a load of rubbish.

UKIP have a legitimate agenda and should no way be compared to the BNP. They want withdrawal from Europe for every white, black, Asian, Chinese, lesbian, gay ect ect person in the UK. To compare them to the BNP is a disgraceful slur.

 

They are the same as the Greens (only more popular) and yet the left wing biased media in this Country try and portray them as some sort of right wing loons. It wasn't so long ago that the Labour party, including Brown, campaigned on the back of leaving the EEC.