Leaving St Mary's?

[Matthew Le God]

St Marys with a roof on would make one heck of a concert arena / exhibition centre and the revenue raised from its use could help fund the new stadia ? just a thought !

 

They'd make a lot more money by selling the St Mary's site for millions.

[ART]

Easy access via a Rail link would be a big plus. I'm sure the events down the road on Monday and beyond, will be a big influence on any future plans over moving to another stadium.

 

Who knows? Perhaps another member of the Liebherr clan is lining up an offer to buy out the Skates and eventually ground share.

[SFKA South Woodford]

Maybe some developer has his eye on the whole area around SMS and is willing to pay through the nose to get it.

 

We certainly dont need bigger capacity at the moment.

 

Actually, I find the whole thing a bit hard to believe. Are you sure you didnt misunderstand him ?

 

This is could make sense, there have been whispers that Red Funnel have agreed the sale of their land around town quay for the expansion of the docks and are looking at moving their operation around into the Itchen. If these are true it could make the land along the bank of the Itchen and around St Marys very valuable, especially as Saints supposedly have first refusal on some of the land around St Marys.

 

The land where the old TVS studios were located would be an ideal location for a new ground, as it has good road and rail links nearby.

[tpbury]

http://www.footballeconomy.com/archive/archive_2005_may_05.htm

 

"One of four teams will escape relegation from the Premiership next Sunday, but the least likely candidates for survival are Southampton. Given that the other candidates have recent experience of the Championship, the Saints are the club least well equipped to cope with the £12m drop in income after parachute payments. Southampton have not been out of the top division since 1978. The club is bearing a debt of £22.7m because of the move to St.Mary's Stadium. The loan is secured against future season ticket sales and it is understood that the club has to pay a premium above base rate if they are relegated to compensate for the likely drop in sales. Even in the Premiership, Southampton have seen their average attendance figure slip from 31,704 to 29,862. Games against the likes of Crewe and Watford are unlikely to attract large crowds. Commercial income was already falling this season and operating costs are high. Getting out of the Championship is always tough, as West Ham have found, but the Saints may find it particularly difficult."

 

Can we put to bed the myth that Saints sold out 'every game in the Prem'? The above clearly shows we 'lost' 1800 fans somewhere between mid-table in the Prem and the year we went down - no schitt Sherlock? - people will only watch a 'winning team' and where's the guarantee of that?

 

I clearly remember a dire 0-0 v Charlton in the Prem in our second or third season at SMS which attracted a then record lowe crowd to SMS of 26k (or might even have been 24k?).

 

Not sure our core support is anywhere near what some seem to imagine it is - you don't have to go back too far to Burley Tuesdays when we had barely 16k v the likes of Colchester in the CCC.

 

Do people really want to swap what we've got now for ground-sharing with 25k nu-plastics, paying top-dollar for seats, and watching a bunch of ageing prima-donna playboys 'gelling' their way into mid-table Prem obscurity?

 

45,000 for Saints v Blackburn? Pull the other one....

 

Now if we were to look outwards and grow our brand a little; we could quite conceivably control the whole southern triangle / M3 corridor from our new super-stadium sited just south of Basingstoke (lovely road and rail access) - 20k from the now-defunct 'Saints', 10k from third division (at best) Pompey, 10k from those that no longer watch the EPL (sic) at Reading, 5k from the Surrey commuter belt - that makes 45k watching the franchised 'Southern Saints' battling it out for a top 6-8 prem league place. That's not for me ...

 

The other obvious, and bigger, drawback - who's going to score the final goal at SMS?

 

Lambert v Bolton doesn't quite have the same symetry as MLT v Arsenal and Saints will never win the Prem; last game of the season and needing one point to win it they would go to already-relegated Wolves on the back of a nine game winning streak and lose 0-2 - it's what Saints do!

 

Agree with this, mayo and pepper, thanks. The amount of times I went to SMS (and even the Dell) and encountered loads of ManU, Liverpool and other away fans in the home seats was embarassing. I'm glad we're doing well(ish) in the third tier, but however much we 'grow the brand', we simply do not need more seats. I suggest we build on the european model (Marcus?) and build a really strong club/town identity with other sports teams becoming associated with St Mary's, and other facilites for them being built around SMS.

 

(doesn't really matter as I left the Soton area years ago, but still care about the club!)

Edited 13 March, 2010 by tpbury
I am irrelevant expat

[Petersfield Saint]

I'm shocked and appalled at all those voting for increased capacity ahead of the original Ted Bates statue.

 

+1

[saint_jas]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/teams/s/southampton/8565161.stm

[ART]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/teams/s/southampton/8565161.stm

 

Many thanks for posting the link for the interview.

[capitalsaint]

It's a bizarre suggestion and hopefully not one based on the turn out for the JPT final where numbers have been bouyed by ST holders taking the chance to give members of their family a day out who would never normally contemplate or probably be able to afford a ticket on a regular basis.

 

I like to try and read and understand the great philosophers in life such as Descartes, Sartre, Camus etc and it appears just recently so has Cortese whose philosophy appears to be 'I don't think, therefore I am not'.

 

If there is any mileage in this suggestion then I would like to know how it will be funded as I doubt Mr Liebherr will risk his own millions which means more collateralised debt no doubt. We have a great stadium but appear to have learned nothing from building it and someone needs to stand up to Mr Cortese and give him a history lesson.

 

Possibly one of the funniest posts I've ever read!

 

I think you should maybe have another read of your Descartes, perhaps something got lost in translation?

[Gingeletiss]

They'd make a lot more money by selling the St Mary's site for millions.

 

Is it ours to sell?...I thought the council 'donated' it?.

[dune]

I can't be arsed to read all the posts, but has it been mentioned that this may have something to do with us being a world cup host?

 

I know it's been said we can't do it, but with Plymouth pulling out (?_) and the Skates bid gone tits up the FA may well need to re-assess.

[Matthew Le God]

I can't be arsed to read all the posts, but has it been mentioned that this may have something to do with us being a world cup host?

 

I know it's been said we can't do it, but with Plymouth pulling out (?_) and the Skates bid gone tits up the FA may well need to re-assess.

 

Plymouth haven't pulled out. But with the way things are going for them they may do. I think it would then be offered to Leicester or Hull as bids that missed out.

[SFC Forever]

I can fully see us moving into a 100,000 all seater stadium within the next 50 years when we are fully established as one of the best clubs in the world. Roll on the good times.

 

 

I just might have to be the oldest ever season ticket holder to make that.

[Nineteen Canteen]

Possibly one of the funniest posts I've ever read!

 

I think you should maybe have another read of your Descartes, perhaps something got lost in translation?

 

It was just a play on words and granted, maybe an obtuse angle but perhaps not all Cortese's philosophy on the the future of this club and what we have acheived this season in comparison to Nooorwich and Charltoon (Solent interview) shows he is at times not thinking and that does not always justify or explains his existence at the club. What is more important by interminable degrees is Mr Liebherr's involvement.

 

It's a worry that with all Pardew has achieved and the apparent lack of recognition from Cortese we could end up with QPR syndrome. Add that to some less than IMO rational ideas at least until out 5 year plan is consolidated with stability in the top flight we are gambling with either gifts or loans from a wealthy owner who really needs to be worshipped as our Deity and that is something we do not need to think about, we are at SMS because he is,

[September Saint]

+1

We want a...........shrubbery!

[saint_mears]

Leaving St Marys was clearly provoked by the interviewer to be honest. There clearly is issues on planning regarding expansion and surrounding infrastructure. But many football stadia with bigger capacitys have even less transport than SMS. Anfield and Goodison park are examples of 40,000 in far tighter surroundings.

 

To sum up though this is clearly something way down the list and is very very unlikely.

[Ewell]

Leaving St Marys was clearly provoked by the interviewer to be honest. There clearly is issues on planning regarding expansion and surrounding infrastructure. But many football stadia with bigger capacitys have even less transport than SMS. Anfield and Goodison park are examples of 40,000 in far tighter surroundings.

 

To sum up though this is clearly something way down the list and is very very unlikely.

 

Agree entirely especailly wtih your first point.

 

Also do not dismiss links to redevelop the St Mary's stadium area with the Snow Dome project. This could be key and I can see the whole waterfront along there being included. They are not going to want out of town visitors coming into an area looking as it currently does. Transportation will also need to be improved in this area and I can see this all benifting our football club.

 

http://www.dailyecho.co.uk/news/4869858.Snow_dome_for_Southampton/

[St. Jason]

Why wouldn't they just expand st marys?

 

We had this debate in the pub before the game.

 

We were all in agreement, why move? The ground can be expanded to 55k which is more than enough. St. Marys is right in town, good for beer, food and train.

 

Mr. Cortesse, you and Marcus are great, I love your ambition but please don't be fooled by home games against Exeter, Portsmuff, Mk, Leeds and our Wembley attendance, yes we have great support but, I think even at 55k would have 15k empty seats for 80% of most games!

[krissyboy31]

Leaving St Marys was clearly provoked by the interviewer to be honest. There clearly is issues on planning regarding expansion and surrounding infrastructure. But many football stadia with bigger capacitys have even less transport than SMS. Anfield and Goodison park are examples of 40,000 in far tighter surroundings.

 

To sum up though this is clearly something way down the list and is very very unlikely.

 

They are but both Liverpool and Everton are looking to move to new larger stadia with greater peripheral facilities. Most sports stadia are pretty much white elephants (for want of a better expression) because they get used once every other week for a 40 week period. To make them worthwhile ventures, they need to be used for other events most days throughout the whole year. St Mary's, although it can be extended to a capacity of circa 48,000, because of its position has very little potential for peripheral extension and would become just a larger white elephant.

[Thedelldays]

We had this debate in the pub before the game.

 

We were all in agreement, why move? The ground can be expanded to 55k which is more than enough. St. Marys is right in town, good for beer, food and train.

 

Mr. Cortesse, you and Marcus are great, I love your ambition but please don't be fooled by home games against Exeter, Portsmuff, Mk, Leeds and our Wembley attendance, yes we have great support but, I think even at 55k would have 15k empty seats for 80% of most games!

so what if they are...?

[red&white56]

I'd hate the thought of moving ground ffs. We have a ground in the part of our City we started out at. Imagine a souless out of town ground off the motorway, like Bolton's and Coventry's. This has to be a joke.

 

Yesterday I would have bitten your hand off for a new stadium on the out-skirts! Getting into Southampton yesterday was a nightmare - huge traffic queues at junctions 8 and 9 - I thought we'd never get to SMS in time despite leaving early.

[JustMike]

We had this debate in the pub before the game.

 

We were all in agreement, why move? The ground can be expanded to 55k which is more than enough. St. Marys is right in town, good for beer, food and train.

 

Mr. Cortesse, you and Marcus are great, I love your ambition but please don't be fooled by home games against Exeter, Portsmuff, Mk, Leeds and our Wembley attendance, yes we have great support but, I think even at 55k would have 15k empty seats for 80% of most games!

 

55k trying to get in and out of town on a saturday! never going to happen

[benjii]

People saying we would have trouble filling a bigger ground need to consider that in ML's long-term plan we are a top-half Premiership team. We would easily sell out a 40k ground in that scenario for most matches (unless the prices went mental). We will sell out SMS most matches when we are promoted to the CCC of things continue to go well.

[St. Jason]

so what if they are...?

 

My point is why move? If we extend sms to 55k and we'll be only 80% full why move to an even larger stadium?

 

But thanks for your question!

[Thedelldays]

My point is why move? If we extend sms to 55k and we'll be only 80% full why move to an even larger stadium?

 

But thanks for your question!

because it will generate more money..I bet at a 50k staduim our average attendance over a whole season in the prem would be higher than it ever could be at SMS...

[St. Jason]

55k trying to get in and out of town on a saturday! never going to happen

 

Thats what all the protesters said about Ikea, yet now its built everyone is amazed the expected traffic kaos has never materialised!

 

Not forgetting IF the ground was extended we'd probably be in the premiership and the club would hopefully bring in loads of initiatives ie, free bus travel with your ticket, open a train station by the bike sheds or opposite the Alfred, free shuttle buses from central station, red funnel etc. Where there's a will there's a way!

[dune]

ML won't be around forever, but bricks and mortar will. If moving to a state of the art stadium (out of town or not) is on the cards it'd set us up as a club for decades.

[St. Jason]

because it will generate more money..I bet at a 50k staduim our average attendance over a whole season in the prem would be higher than it ever could be at SMS...

 

Still missing the point mate, SMS can be extended to 55k, it's cheaper to extend, everything is already in place, sms is now part of our great city, so again, why move??

[Thedelldays]

Still missing the point mate, SMS can be extended to 55k, it's cheaper to extend, everything is already in place, sms is now part of our great city, so again, why move??

I am not missing the point at all...

 

maybe they want to generate more money in the summer and non footballing days..?

 

I personally cant see it..but if they choose to build one on the edge of southampton..I wont mind too much..a ground close to the M27 would be easier to get to and from IMO

[dune]

Still missing the point mate, SMS can be extended to 55k, it's cheaper to extend, everything is already in place, sms is now part of our great city, so again, why move??

 

St Marys is a cheap jack tin shed. It's the same as the walkers stadium and similar to many other tin pot stadiums. If we have the opportunity to move to a stadium to be proud of we should seize the opportunity.

[St. Jason]

ML won't be around forever, but bricks and mortar will. If moving to a state of the art stadium (out of town or not) is on the cards it'd set us up as a club for decades.

 

We are in a state of the art stadium, we are set up for decades. Yes increase the capacity, make more use of the stadium, why are we not on the stadium tour agena's? Why is Oasis playing the rose bowl and not sms? Contact premier league darts and suggest sms for a venue, sell it to them "this will be a first for darts, imagine 40k darts fans at 1 venue, out door darts, come lads, imagine" says Mr. Cortesse to Prem Darts execs etc!

[krissyboy31]

Still missing the point mate, SMS can be extended to 55k, it's cheaper to extend, everything is already in place, sms is now part of our great city, so again, why move??

 

But that's the point, is it? In cost terms, maybe but in terms of future revenue streams and cost effectiveness? Probably not and that would be the decisive reason for starting from scratch.

[dune]

We are in a state of the art stadium, we are set up for decades. Yes increase the capacity, make more use of the stadium, why are we not on the stadium tour agena's? Why is Oasis playing the rose bowl and not sms? Contact premier league darts and suggest sms for a venue, sell it to them "this will be a first for darts, imagine 40k darts fans at 1 venue, out door darts, come lads, imagine" says Mr. Cortesse to Prem Darts execs etc!

 

St Marys is hardly of the same standard as Arsenals stadium or even MK Dons stadium. It's just a cheap and boring bog standard tin shed.

[St. Jason]

I am not missing the point at all...

 

maybe they want to generate more money in the summer and non footballing days..?

 

I personally cant see it..but if they choose to build one on the edge of southampton..I wont mind too much..a ground close to the M27 would be easier to get to and from IMO

 

It would only be easier to get to and from if you had a 2 mile slip road otherwise the m27 would be kaos. As I've already posted, start selling sms to tour operators, get big stadium bands playing here, premier league darts!

[Matthew Le God]

We are in a state of the art stadium, we are set up for decades.

 

I think you misunderstand what the term "state of the art" means. St Mary's is a long way from being the best quality new stadium.

Edited 14 March, 2010 by Matthew Le God

[dune]

It would only be easier to get to and from if you had a 2 mile slip road otherwise the m27 would be kaos. As I've already posted, start selling sms to tour operators, get big stadium bands playing here, premier league darts!

 

It's chaos.

[St. Jason]

But that's the point, is it? In cost terms, maybe but in terms of future revenue streams and cost effectiveness? Probably not and that would be the decisive reason for starting from scratch.

 

I don't see what future revenue would be generated from an "out of town" stadium as opposed to SMS. Out of town would have no hotels, resturaunts, bars etc. Yes you could build all that but who would use them when nothing was on? Lets be honest, would you phone your mates a nd say "i've an idea, lets all go to sms Friday night, lets get a taxi 4 miles out of town to a big field for a pint" I wouldn't!

[St. Jason]

St Marys is hardly of the same standard as Arsenals stadium or even MK Dons stadium. It's just a cheap and boring bog standard tin shed.

 

I think the problem is we are all taking what we have for granted a little. I've seen it time and again, away fans in ore of sms. its a great stadium, if your bored and suggest change your seat or team because I'm having a great time there!

[dune]

I don't see what future revenue would be generated from an "out of town" stadium as opposed to SMS. Out of town would have no hotels, resturaunts, bars etc. Yes you could build all that but who would use them when nothing was on? Lets be honest, would you phone your mates a nd say "i've an idea, lets all go to sms Friday night, lets get a taxi 4 miles out of town to a big field for a pint" I wouldn't!

 

But with the stadium built other leisure opportunities have the room to spring up around it. Perhaps these other facilities would make you visit.

[dune]

I think the problem is we are all taking what we have for granted a little. I've seen it time and again, away fans in ore of sms. its a great stadium, if your bored and suggest change your seat or team because I'm having a great time there!

 

Some away fans in L1 might think it impressive, but back in the Premiership St Marys is a nothing stadium. It cost peanuts to build and it shows. Have you been to Mk Dons and seen their stadium? - you can stand on the concourse and watch the game - it's much much better than St Marys.

[St. Jason]

I think you misunderstand what the term "state of the art" means. St Mary's is a long way from being the best quality new stadium.

 

Please explain what your looking for from a football stadium? I've got a great seat, nothing disturbing my view, when I have a p1ss i'm not standing in someone else's p1ss and I can have a pint and a pie and watch the first half high lights on the tv's, it'll do for me!

 

Ps. and on a special occasion I can ponce up a bit in the Micky Channon suite or even a box!

[dune]

Please explain what your looking for from a football stadium? I've got a great seat, nothing disturbing my view, when I have a p1ss i'm not standing in someone else's p1ss and I can have a pint and a pie and watch the first half high lights on the tv's, it'll do for me!

 

Ps. and on a special occasion I can ponce up a bit in the Micky Channon suite or even a box!

 

But St Marys isn't state of the Art. It's bog standard.

[Matthew Le God]

Please explain what your looking for from a football stadium? I've got a great seat, nothing disturbing my view, when I have a p1ss i'm not standing in someone else's p1ss and I can have a pint and a pie and watch the first half high lights on the tv's, it'll do for me!

 

Ps. and on a special occasion I can ponce up a bit in the Micky Channon suite or even a box!

 

I'm not the one that described St Mary's as "state of the art". You are the one that has to explain that statement!?

 

St Mary's is a good, relatively new stadium. But it certainly isn't a high spec stadium compared to many other national and intrnational stadia.

[St. Jason]

But with the stadium built other leisure opportunities have the room to spring up around it. Perhaps these other facilities would make you visit.

 

To be honest and I'm not trying to be argumentive but no, I don't see it. If I want to see a film I got to leisure world, bowling I'll got to Eastliegh, a night out I'll go to town, can't see what they could build that'd make me want to drive 5 miles out of town. More to the point I think it could actually ruin the ground. My whole day starts at 11, a pint up my local, taxi to the Bedfords, walk down to the Ostrich, walk down to the Alfred then walk to the ground, its ideal!

[krissyboy31]

I don't see what future revenue would be generated from an "out of town" stadium as opposed to SMS. Out of town would have no hotels, resturaunts, bars etc. Yes you could build all that but who would use them when nothing was on? Lets be honest, would you phone your mates a nd say "i've an idea, lets all go to sms Friday night, lets get a taxi 4 miles out of town to a big field for a pint" I wouldn't!

 

There's out of town and out of town. Somewhere near where the current park and rides off Bursledon Road, Botley Road, or around the VT Sports ground off Portsmouth Rd (Old Netley/Sholing) would be ideal and you would be able to build a 'Hollywood Bowl' a multi-screen, several bars, restaurants and get a decent sized car-park, for the big events which could also continue to hold the carboot sale (with land rent going to the club) and non-match-day park and ride for town.

[krissyboy31]

To be honest and I'm not trying to be argumentive but no, I don't see it. If I want to see a film I got to leisure world, bowling I'll got to Eastliegh, a night out I'll go to town, can't see what they could build that'd make me want to drive 5 miles out of town. More to the point I think it could actually ruin the ground. My whole day starts at 11, a pint up my local, taxi to the Bedfords, walk down to the Ostrich, walk down to the Alfred then walk to the ground, its ideal!

 

Some of our days start a damn sight earlier (8.30 yesterday) and end with being stuck on the Avenue for nearly an hour. But if you're alright then it seems the likes of Delldays and myself have lost the argument.

[St. Jason]

Some away fans in L1 might think it impressive, but back in the Premiership St Marys is a nothing stadium. It cost peanuts to build and it shows. Have you been to Mk Dons and seen their stadium? - you can stand on the concourse and watch the game - it's much much better than St Marys.

 

BUT its soulless, and to be fair i think your being a bit mean to sms, I'm sure if you stood sms up against Burnley, Fulham, Hull, Portsmuff, Everton, wigan, Blackburn it would be better!

[dune]

To be honest and I'm not trying to be argumentive but no, I don't see it. If I want to see a film I got to leisure world, bowling I'll got to Eastliegh, a night out I'll go to town, can't see what they could build that'd make me want to drive 5 miles out of town. More to the point I think it could actually ruin the ground. My whole day starts at 11, a pint up my local, taxi to the Bedfords, walk down to the Ostrich, walk down to the Alfred then walk to the ground, its ideal!

 

Southampton used to have the highest proportion of season ticket holders who lived outside the catchment area. We held the premiership record for this. So on that basis out of town does make sense. I like my beer so wouldn't really want an out of town stadium and I don't even like out of town stadiums, but from a comercial point of view and for the long term future of the club it makes sense. All i ask is that a few pubs are built in the area!

[dune]

BUT its soulless, and to be fair i think your being a bit mean to sms, I'm sure if you stood sms up against Burnley, Fulham, Hull, Portsmuff, Everton, wigan, Blackburn it would be better!

 

Stadium MK is souless because they A) have no fans and B) the fans they have are all weirdos. It's built by the same people that built the Emirates and you can tell - it just has those little details that say quality - St Marys just oozes cheap and basic.

[St. Jason]

Some of our days start a damn sight earlier (8.30 yesterday) and end with being stuck on the Avenue for nearly an hour. But if you're alright then it seems the likes of Delldays and myself have lost the argument.

 

It's not an argument and it's certainly not a "I'm al right fook the rest of you" post either, just an opinion. If you move the ground your still going to have traffic problems. I'm just asking how could moving the stadium improve our day out @ the footy?

[dune]

It's not an argument and it's certainly not a "I'm al right fook the rest of you" post either, just an opinion. If you move the ground your still going to have traffic problems. I'm just asking how could moving the stadium improve our day out @ the footy?

 

We can win more games and compete at the top level.

 

As it stands St Marys will only ever allow us to be a club on the fringes of sucess. With a super stadium we can grow.