Stay away fans

[northam soul]

Who is it who counts the away fans as i think they need to go back to school.

No way was there 820 as the OS states esprcially as they had ipswich down for 1036 the other night.

[Guest Hacienda]

Yes in my opinion. Your choice if you don't want to go anymore and in fairness if you don't find it enjoyable you're probably best off with the other 6/7/8 thousand who can't be arsed and who we'll no doubt see at the drop of a hat when/if the good times come again

 

When you grow up you'll understand what a stupid statement that is.

[alpine_saint]

alpine you paedo leave my kids alone.

 

all-in-all you're just a-nother brick in the wall...

[Dicko]

I've been shocked and disappointed at the number of fairweather supporters we have.

 

The club is in the mire, they need your support more than ever

[Legod Second Coming]

Lol - suddenly we have 'discerning fans'...

 

Only prepared to go to watch wins.

 

Only prepared to go to be 'entertained'.

 

Well done all the Brian Sewells.

 

It never once crossed my mind watching players like Kenna, Monkou, Tessem, Benali, Heaney, Shipperly... that I wasn't being entertained or watching good football.

 

Just that I was supporting my club and hoping beyond hope for a win. A spectacular win even better.

[wild-saint]

I find it amazing how many people whine and moan aboutlowe, wilde, crap football , formations, the manager etc etc etc and then it turns out they dont go to the matches anyway. IMO your opinion is worthless and generally unwanted by those that watch and support thier team.

 

get to the games or shut the fu.ck up

[alpine_saint]

I find it amazing how many people whine and moan aboutlowe, wilde, crap football , formations, the manager etc etc etc and then it turns out they dont go to the matches anyway. IMO your opinion is worthless and generally unwanted by those that watch and support thier team.

 

get to the games or shut the fu.ck up

 

LOL

[Snowballs2]

I've been shocked and disappointed at the number of fairweather supporters we have.

 

The club is in the mire, they need your support more than ever

 

The supporters who stay away did not get the club in the mire...they have no responsibility to pay to watch substandard results...they have every right to come back IF things ever improve.

[Dicko]

The supporters who stay away did not get the club in the mire...they have no responsibility to pay to watch substandard results...they have every right to come back IF things ever improve.

 

Yeah, that's the problem though

 

With the club being skint, fans staying away is causing the club even more problems

[alpine_saint]

The supporters who stay away did not get the club in the mire...they have no responsibility to pay to watch substandard results...they have every right to come back IF things ever improve.

 

Indeed. Lowe pioneered viewing fans as "customers", and customers vote with their feet.

 

If restaurant serves up crap food, it will go bust if it doesnt buck its ideas up, get a new chef, improve the menu, and do some serious marketing/advertising to win back lost customers.

[surrey1saint]

I've been shocked and disappointed at the number of fairweather supporters we have.

 

The club is in the mire, they need your support more than ever

 

Agreed,we need your support guys!

[Snowballs2]

Yeah, that's the problem though

 

With the club being skint, fans staying away is causing the club even more problems

 

 

Then Lowe and Wilde had better do something and quick, its not the fans who are causing the problem, its not the fans who got us into the mess. Our responsibility is over, until they sort out the mess

[Guest Hacienda]

I've been shocked and disappointed at the number of fairweather supporters we have.

 

The club is in the mire, they need your support more than ever

 

The sad thing is, to me, is that how so many no longer care about SFC and I include mates of mine in that.

 

Only I'm going to Rotherham and only two of us are going to Doncaster. None are going to the Norwich game.

 

Some see football as an expensive luxury which they can't afford at the moment, others no longer want to watch a doomed experiment and some won't go due to Lowe.

 

These were men who have travelled home and away for years, including the Branfoot years and have now rapped their tits in.

 

It's very sad but I'm not surprised.

[Guest Hacienda]

Indeed. Lowe pioneered viewing fans as "customers", and customers vote with their feet.

 

Very true.

[Snowballs2]

Indeed. Lowe pioneered viewing fans as "customers", and customers vote with their feet.

 

If restaurant serves up crap food, it will go bust if it doesnt buck its ideas up, get a new chef, improve the menu, and do some serious marketing/advertising to win back lost customers.

 

 

 

I have to smile at your restaurant simile...I have just got back from Kardemena, the best restaurant there (IMO) is called the Alexander, I went in got served by a waitress from Pompey...she told me that a Saints supporter came in ready to order, when he found out she was from Portsmouth he got up said nothing and walked out.

[Legod Second Coming]

The supporters who stay away did not get the club in the mire...they have no responsibility to pay to watch substandard results...they have every right to come back IF things ever improve.

 

And thank the fans who kept it afloat for them??

 

When our club goes bust, you and Alpine will be the first to mourn its passing and blame everyone but the people who decided to deprive it of income at the VERY time its needed most.

 

Quite, quite bizarre and beyond any comprehension to football fans the world over I would imagine.

[Snowballs2]

Agreed,we need your support guys!

 

The results will improve the finances...Lowe and Wilde leaving will improve them even more. Nuff said. People should not be expected to pay top dollar to watch a failing experiment...another of Lowes manic ideas

[Snowballs2]

And thank the fans who kept it afloat for them??

 

When our club goes bust, you and Alpine will be the first to mourn its passing and blame everyone but the people who decided to deprive it of income at the VERY time its needed most.

 

Quite, quite bizarre and beyond any comprehension to football fans the world over I would imagine.

 

I liken you and all the other positives to pacifism...and your attitude reminds me of the guy who went to Munich , came back with a letter and said "peace in our time" ..we all know what happened next.

Once you wise up things will improve, because they have to

[Guest Hacienda]

And thank the fans who kept it afloat for them??

 

When our club goes bust, you and Alpine will be the first to mourn its passing and blame everyone but the people who decided to deprive it of income at the VERY time its needed most.

 

Quite, quite bizarre and beyond any comprehension to football fans the world over I would imagine.

 

So it's up to the fans to shell out their money to sort out the financial mess created by those in the Board Room?

 

Why don't we all just send a cheque in then?

 

You really do talk s h i t e.

[Legod Second Coming]

I liken you and all the other positives to pacifism...and your attitude reminds me of the guy who went to Munich , came back with a letter and said "peace in our time" ..we all know what happened next.

Once you wise up things will improve, because they have to

 

Tell me then, what is being a football fan to you?

[Legod Second Coming]

So it's up to the fans to shell out their money to sort out the financial mess created by those in the Board Room?

 

Why don't we all just send a cheque in then?

 

You really do talk s h i t e.

 

1. Supporting a club only comes down to money IF you cannot afford to go. It is not a trade. I will pay only if we win...

 

2. I do not care nor have I ever given a to55 who is in the boardroom. I support the club - which to me is the people on the pitch. And a 'thing' which is indefinable which is 'the club', which yes, I will pay to support and keep afloat.

 

3. Were you asked to pay a bonus to the club for getting to the Cup Final??

[Snowballs2]

Tell me then, what is being a football fan to you?

 

Supporting a club which is well run, and the paying customer is valued as a major partner in the future, and someone whoes support is neither EXPECTED or TAKEN FOR GRANTED

[Guest Hacienda]

 

1. Supporting a club only comes down to money IF you cannot afford to go. It is not a trade. I will pay only if we win...

 

2. I do not care nor have I ever given a to55 who is in the boardroom. I support the club - which to me is the people on the pitch. And a 'thing' which is indefinable which is 'the club', which yes, I will pay to support and keep afloat.

 

3. Were you asked to pay a bonus to the club for getting to the Cup Final??

 

1. Some if supporting a club isn't about money WTF are you bleating on about?

 

2. "The Club" to many, has gone, which is very sad.

 

3. What has a Cup Final, 5 years ago, got to do with anything now? Nothing is the answer and it's a pathetic point but typical of a sanctimonious **** like you.

[Legod Second Coming]

1. Some if supporting a club isn't about money WTF are you bleating on about?

 

2. "The Club" to many, has gone, which is very sad.

 

3. What has a Cup Final, 5 years ago, got to do with anything now? Nothing is the answer and it's a pathetic point but typical of a sanctimonious **** like you.

 

So tell me what being a fan is?

 

Perhaps you could have a sensible debate if that's possible?

 

Tell me, why you and others staying away is benefitting:

 

1. My club now.

2. My club in the future.

3. The team who play now.

[Legod Second Coming]

Supporting a club which is well run, and the paying customer is valued as a major partner in the future, and someone whoes support is neither EXPECTED or TAKEN FOR GRANTED

 

Tell me when this club was well run and by whom?

 

For the period during which it reached it's highest league position for a decade and a Cup Final and Europe perhaps?

 

And what stops you now supporting the same boardroom which delivered that?

 

By whom have you been 'taken for granted'?

 

Which football fans have NOT been taken for granted - name the clubs.

[jam]

Then Lowe and Wilde had better do something and quick, its not the fans who are causing the problem, its not the fans who got us into the mess. Our responsibility is over, until they sort out the mess

 

The problem is we are skint.

 

According to various posts on here, fans are staying away as they don't want to put money into the club while Lowe is here. The fact that there is reduced revenue is exacerbating the problem. The fans who are refusing to go are responsible for to reduction in revenue. Therefore they are helping to keep the club in this mess.

[surrey1saint]

The problem is we are skint.

 

According to various posts on here, fans are staying away as they don't want to put money into the club while Lowe is here. The fact that there is reduced revenue is exacerbating the problem. The fans who are refusing to go are responsible for to reduction in revenue. Therefore they are helping to keep the club in this mess.

 

Hit the nail on the head mate!

[Wes Tender]

Yeah, that's the problem though

 

With the club being skint, fans staying away is causing the club even more problems

 

Some can blame the fans all they like, but nobody can force people to pay their hard earned cash to watch a team of kids who could be watched for free last season. The attendance of any individual is entirely up to them as is their decision to stay away. Many will not go because of who is running the club. Again, their decision. But the club being where we are is not the fault of the poor bloody foot soldiers; the blame attaches to the generals who have not invested in the club or the team at the right time, taken the wrong decisions at vital stages in our development and are now clinging by their fingernails to power to protect their selfish interests.

 

If we go under because people are staying away, Lowe and his cohorts can blame us all he likes, but he ought to have the intelligence to realise that people will only pay money to see his experimental set up if it is producing results. People are getting fed up with seeing attractive football that looks as if it will get us relegated.

[Graffito]

Some can blame the fans all they like, but nobody can force people to pay their hard earned cash to watch a team of kids who could be watched for free last season. The attendance of any individual is entirely up to them as is their decision to stay away. Many will not go because of who is running the club. Again, their decision. But the club being where we are is not the fault of the poor bloody foot soldiers; the blame attaches to the generals who have not invested in the club or the team at the right time, taken the wrong decisions at vital stages in our development and are now clinging by their fingernails to power to protect their selfish interests.

 

If we go under because people are staying away, Lowe and his cohorts can blame us all he likes, but he ought to have the intelligence to realise that people will only pay money to see his experimental set up if it is producing results. People are getting fed up with seeing attractive football that looks as if it will get us relegated.

 

All of this may well be true but please explain how withdrawing your support doesn't further damage the club.

[Legod Second Coming]

Some can blame the fans all they like, but nobody can force people to pay their hard earned cash to watch a team of kids who could be watched for free last season. The attendance of any individual is entirely up to them as is their decision to stay away. Many will not go because of who is running the club. Again, their decision. But the club being where we are is not the fault of the poor bloody foot soldiers; the blame attaches to the generals who have not invested in the club or the team at the right time, taken the wrong decisions at vital stages in our development and are now clinging by their fingernails to power to protect their selfish interests.

 

If we go under because people are staying away, Lowe and his cohorts can blame us all he likes, but he ought to have the intelligence to realise that people will only pay money to see his experimental set up if it is producing results. People are getting fed up with seeing attractive football that looks as if it will get us relegated.

 

I don't attach 'blame' to anyone but this is all false argument in my view.

 

For 30 years I have had the misfortune to support this club.

 

No-one EVER put a gun to my head and made me choose this club. Nor did they make me go.

 

But for my sins I'm saddled with it.

 

For some of the time, I have had amazing good fortune. To see Paine, Channon, Ball, Keegan, Moran (my hero), Shearer and recently Le Tiss.

 

I had a Cup Final and a flirt with Europe too.

 

And then it went back to being the dross that was served up for plenty of that time.

 

And still I go.

 

Out of a sense of duty? Maybe.

 

But to suddenly assume a 'customer' mentality is a ****-poor reflection of what this country had become - people interested only in celebrity and success.

 

No-one stayed away in the Premiership when Lowe wasn't investing his money in the club. There are friends of mine who could not get tickets for Cardiff despite the fans who refused to go as their vote against the incumbent board...

 

Fans not paying becuase they are not seeing winning football is an alien concept to me.

 

I stop buying products and services if they are poor. A football club is not an economic purchase, it is a 'spiritual' or 'religious' or 'emotional' one.

 

It is clear that this club needs money. If people think that depriving the club of money will further its success, then so be it.

 

I don't see how it can.

 

If people cannot afford to go, fine. No-one can ever justify the cost of football. But deliberate withdrawal of affordable investment? Hmmm, I have to be convinced this is a cogent argument.

[surrey1saint]

I don't attach 'blame' to anyone but this is all false argument in my view.

 

For 30 years I have had the misfortune to support this club.

 

No-one EVER put a gun to my head and made me choose this club. Nor did they make me go.

 

But for my sins I'm saddled with it.

 

For some of the time, I have had amazing good fortune. To see Paine, Channon, Ball, Keegan, Moran (my hero), Shearer and recently Le Tiss.

 

I had a Cup Final and a flirt with Europe too.

 

And then it went back to being the dross that was served up for plenty of that time.

 

And still I go.

 

Out of a sense of duty? Maybe.

 

But to suddenly assume a 'customer' mentality is a ****-poor reflection of what this country had become - people interested only in celebrity and success.

 

No-one stayed away in the Premiership when Lowe wasn't investing his money in the club. There are friends of mine who could not get tickets for Cardiff despite the fans who refused to go as their vote against the incumbent board...

 

Fans not paying becuase they are not seeing winning football is an alien concept to me.

 

I stop buying products and services if they are poor. A football club is not an economic purchase, it is a 'spiritual' or 'religious' or 'emotional' one.

 

It is clear that this club needs money. If people think that depriving the club of money will further its success, then so be it.

 

I don't see how it can.

 

If people cannot afford to go, fine. No-one can ever justify the cost of football. But deliberate withdrawal of affordable investment? Hmmm, I have to be convinced this is a cogent argument.

 

Well said that man.

[Verbal Kint]

But to suddenly assume a 'customer' mentality is a ****-poor reflection of what this country had become - people interested only in celebrity and success.

 

Rupert was the one who treated this club as nothing more than a business. Rupert was the one who saw the fans as nothing more than customers. Well now it's coming back to bite him in the arse.

 

**** him and **** Wilde too.

[saint1977]

It is clear that this club needs money. If people think that depriving the club of money will further its success, then so be it - exactly but you have the wrong target LGS. It won't get anything from Askham and Wilde, despite the huge wealth Askham made after putting nowt in. How's the £2m coming along Mike? I still go but after the diabolical performance yesterday and persistent wrangling at boardroom level, I can understand why many long-time attenders have lost patience. Anyway, the bank won't tolerate the current situation much longer either and bar Lallana and Davis, there ain't much left to sell: Thus one of two options are left

 

1) Wilde and Askham (remember Lowe is only a 6% part of a 24% proxy, Lowe is merely Askham's figurehead as the old coward doesn't like taking stick. That's why I retain a modicum of respect for Rupert) take a low offer before the bank swoops

2) We are put into administratio and certain League 1 next season and God only knows what happens. I've consistently heard that this has not been far away, particularly if the other clubs at the bottom pull away from us in the next few games which is already happening.

 

People can argue all they like about stay-away fan and customer service but the reality is that we are approaching crunch time and as fan we can only watch and wait. Wilde and co. are in very weak position right now.

Edited 21 September, 2008 by saint1977

[Legod Second Coming]

Rupert was the one who treated this club as nothing more than a business. Rupert was the one who saw the fans as nothing more than customers. Well now it's coming back to bite him in the arse.

 

**** him and **** Wilde too.

 

 

That's a very poor argument my friend.

 

There are good and bad businesses.

 

Do you think there is Chairman who does not run his club as a 'business' in some way shape or form? Do you think John Madjeski just signs cheques every week and never asks where the money is going? On whom and why??

 

I am NOT here to support Lowe. But if you treat supporters as customers you do not do so for the WRONG reasons. Some of the things he did for his customers (and that includes ALL the customers of the club, not just us foot-soldliers) were welcome.

 

In treating the club as a business, he did not make it a failure did he??

 

Otherwise every club that is run as a business would fail. QPR is a business. Sunderland is a business, etc, etc.

 

I agree that there are people in boardoom who should be considering what THEY can do.

 

But to use the boardroom to justify not suppporting the team? To say 'hahah Rupert, you wanted us to be customers so now we will vote with our feet and support...' Exactly. Support whom? Watch Jeff Stelling maybe? Or Sunderland v Middlesborough?? What??

 

Call me old-fashioned, but this club could and should be here long after Lowe. I'm not going to tell my grandchildren that it went bust while I was watching Westwood and Garcia... IF it still goes bust. Well, that's life. I tried and still turned out for the REAL REASON I am there - to support the lads who play in the shirt I would kill to wear.

[VectisSaint]

Fans not paying becuase they are not seeing winning football is an alien concept to me.

 

I stop buying products and services if they are poor. A football club is not an economic purchase, it is a 'spiritual' or 'religious' or 'emotional' one.

Apart from a few who think boycotting the club because of Lowe, I don't really think anyone seriously believes staying away is going to help the club. And the Lowe boycotters are really a very very small number, in my opinion. But I don't understand your comment about fans not paying because they are not seeing winning football. It has been ever thus. The problem is that over the last 3 years or so we have become so poor at home, that people are losing interest, a phenomenon unknown to Southampton supporters over the past 42 years that I have been involved. We have always, always been a team that has won more than its fair share of games at home, I don't ever recall a mentality where people did not go to a game on a Saturday without expecting to win, or at least get a draw. OK, sometimes it went wrong and we lost, obviously, but by and large we always knew we had a chance, even against whoever were the big teams of the day. Indeed when Man U, Liverpool or Nottm Forest (at the time) came to The Dell we all knew that there was every chance we would turn them over.

 

But now, over the past 2, probably 3 seasons, we have become a team that is scared to play at home, unable through poor tactical understanding of the various managers and poor players to overcome the stifling tactics of very mediocre teams. People have turned up at St Marys, week in week out, to cheer on their team, but slowly more and more have realised that we have lost the siege mentality at home, and away teams now know they can come here and at worst pick up a point. It was dire under Burley, it got worse under Gorman/Dodd, and was just beginning to pick up under NP. I like the ideas of JP, but after 4 home games this season we have picked up 2 points. There is only so much most people are prepared to take, and yes you can call them fair weather fans if you like, but there has never been a period in our history (in my lifetime at least) that you can compare with the last 2 years. Even in the Branfoot era we managed to win/draw more games at home than we lost, and even then there was at least one exciting player drawing in the crowds, at least when IB agreed to play him.

 

I admire people who are so dedicated to the cause that they will continue to attend games at all costs. I felt very much the same when we were relegated the last time, and attended much more regularly during our 4 seasons in Division 2 than I ever did before or since, but then it also coincided with the time when I was single, footloose and fancy free and had a bunch of mates who never considered doing anything else on a Saturday afternoon, or even when there was a midweek game up north for instance (Leeds away in a blizzrad sticks in my mind).

 

But people need to understand the world has changed, football has changed and whether you like it or not, football has become part of the entertainment business. Our customer base has become disaffected, coupled with other factors at the moment. What we are seeing now is the core support, as it has probably always been, about 14000. Only success, on the field, will start to fill the stadium again. Wins = bums on seats, there is no other recipe.

 

The core support like you, will continue to attend and bemoan the stay aways, but in the end the stay aways will come back when things improve. How we get to that stage is a difficult question. Lowe has his plan, but it is clearly not working at the moment, Crouch had his plan, at least it gave us some breathing space and kept us in this division this season. Wilde had his plan, which backfired spectacularly. Maybe JP can turn things around very soon and get his team picking up points regularly at home, I truly hope so, otherwise we will be relegated, and I suspect that will happen before Administration. But, for sure if we are relegated, we will then go into Admin as well.

 

Losing/drawing consistently at home will mean relegation, and will mean dwindling crowds. Thats a fact, and the sooner people come to terms with that the more chance we have of doing something about it, or getting something done about it. That might mean Lowe having to realise that he must bring in an experienced player or two to help the kids, and understanding that he or Wilde may need to stump up some of the money for this themselves, in order to avoid a bigger financial catastrophe.

Edited 21 September, 2008 by VectisSaint

[Snowballs2]

I don't attach 'blame' to anyone but this is all false argument in my view.

 

For 30 years I have had the misfortune to support this club.

 

No-one EVER put a gun to my head and made me choose this club. Nor did they make me go.

 

But for my sins I'm saddled with it.

 

For some of the time, I have had amazing good fortune. To see Paine, Channon, Ball, Keegan, Moran (my hero), Shearer and recently Le Tiss.

 

I had a Cup Final and a flirt with Europe too.

 

And then it went back to being the dross that was served up for plenty of that time.

 

And still I go.

 

Out of a sense of duty? Maybe.

 

But to suddenly assume a 'customer' mentality is a ****-poor reflection of what this country had become - people interested only in celebrity and success.

 

No-one stayed away in the Premiership when Lowe wasn't investing his money in the club. There are friends of mine who could not get tickets for Cardiff despite the fans who refused to go as their vote against the incumbent board...

 

Fans not paying becuase they are not seeing winning football is an alien concept to me.

 

I stop buying products and services if they are poor. A football club is not an economic purchase, it is a 'spiritual' or 'religious' or 'emotional' one.

 

It is clear that this club needs money. If people think that depriving the club of money will further its success, then so be it.

 

I don't see how it can.

 

If people cannot afford to go, fine. No-one can ever justify the cost of football. But deliberate withdrawal of affordable investment? Hmmm, I have to be convinced this is a cogent argument.

 

 

So let those who own the major part of the shares invest more of THEIR money in the club to make it more attractive to the paying customers, without expecting the long suffering customers to continuing to prop up a club that they the major shareholders have jointly ruined

[Verbal Kint]

That's a very poor argument my friend.

 

There are good and bad businesses.

 

Do you think there is Chairman who does not run his club as a 'business' in some way shape or form? Do you think John Madjeski just signs cheques every week and never asks where the money is going? On whom and why??

 

I am NOT here to support Lowe. But if you treat supporters as customers you do not do so for the WRONG reasons. Some of the things he did for his customers (and that includes ALL the customers of the club, not just us foot-soldliers) were welcome.

 

In treating the club as a business, he did not make it a failure did he??

 

Otherwise every club that is run as a business would fail. QPR is a business. Sunderland is a business, etc, etc.

 

I agree that there are people in boardoom who should be considering what THEY can do.

 

But to use the boardroom to justify not suppporting the team? To say 'hahah Rupert, you wanted us to be customers so now we will vote with our feet and support...' Exactly. Support whom? Watch Jeff Stelling maybe? Or Sunderland v Middlesborough?? What??

 

Call me old-fashioned, but this club could and should be here long after Lowe. I'm not going to tell my grandchildren that it went bust while I was watching Westwood and Garcia... IF it still goes bust. Well, that's life. I tried and still turned out for the REAL REASON I am there - to support the lads who play in the shirt I would kill to wear.

 

 

When the Chairman starts calling 'customers' the lunatic fringge you can't expect them to continue to support the business. It's hugely insulting and a lot of fans simply won't put up with it. On top of that, his business plan (playing kids) is flawed on so many levels that fans simply won't be prepared to support it.

[surrey1saint]

Losing/drawing consistently at home will mean relegation, and will mean dwindling crowds. Thats a fact, and the sooner people come to terms with that the more chance we have of doing something about it, or getting something done about it. That might mean Lowe having to realise that he must bring in an experienced player or two to help the kids, and understanding that he or Wilde may need to stump up some of the money for this themselves, in order to avoid a bigger financial catastrophe.

 

This quote is spot on IMO.

[Weston Super Saint]

So let those who own the major part of the shares invest more of THEIR money in the club to make it more attractive to the paying customers, without expecting the long suffering customers to continuing to prop up a club that they the major shareholders have jointly ruined

 

To be fair, apart from those that bought the initial shares [at 5p per share] to raise capital for the company, they haven't invested a single penny into the club.

 

They have however contributed to other individual's retirement funds, by buying the shares for more than the club sold them for. Then there's the stockbroker profits....

 

Then they've had the dividends [during the good years], so technically I would imagine that most of them have had more money OUT of the club than they've actually put IN.

 

If they subsequently lose money because of administration or whatever, then there won't be any sympathy from me... Like any gambler, you pays your money and takes your pick...

[Legod Second Coming]

Apart from a few who think boycotting the club because of Lowe, I don't really think anyone seriously believes staying away is going to help the club. And the Lowe boycotters are really a very very small number, in my opinion. But I don't understand your comment about fans not paying because they are not seeing winning football. It has been ever thus. The problem is that over the last 3 years or so we have become so poor at home, that people are losing interest, a phenomenon unknown to Southampton supporters over the past 42 years that I have been involved. We have always, always been a team that has won more than its fair share of games at home, I don't ever recall a mentality where people did not go to a game on a Saturday without expecting to win, or at least get a draw. OK, sometimes it went wrong and we lost, obviously, but by and large we always knew we had a chance, even against whoever were the big teams of the day. Indeed when Man U, Liverpool or Nottm Forest (at the time) came to The Dell we all knew that there was every chance we would turn them over.

 

But now, over the past 2, probably 3 seasons, we have become a team that is scared to play at home, unable through poor tactical understanding of the various managers and poor players to overcome the stifling tactics of very mediocre teams. People have turned up at St Marys, week in week out, to cheer on their team, but slowly more and more have realised that we have lost the siege mentality at home, and away teams now know they can come here and at worst pick up a point. It was dire under Burley, it got worse under Gorman/Dodd, and was just beginning to pick up under NP. I like the ideas of JP, but after 4 home games this season we have picked up 2 points. There is only so much most people are prepared to take, and yes you can call them fair weather fans if you like, but there has never been a period in our history (in my lifetime at least) that you can compare with the last 2 years. Even in the Branfoot era we managed to won/drew more games at home than we lost, and at least then there was at least one exciting player drawing in the crowds, at least when IB agreed to play him.

 

I admire people who are so dedicated to the cause that they will continue to attend games at all costs. I felt very much the same when we were relegated the last time, and attended much more regularly during our 4 seasons in Division 2 than I ever did before or since, but then it also coincided with the time when I was single, footloose and fancy free and had a bunch of mates who never considered doing anything else on a Saturday afternoon, or even when there was a midweek game up north for instance (Leeds away in a blizzrad sticks in my mind).

 

But people need to understand the world has changed, football has changed and whether you like it or not, football has become part of the entertainment business. Our customer base has become disaffected, coupled with other factors at the moment. What we are seeing now is the core support, as it has probably always been, about 14000. Only success, on the field, will start to fill the stadium again. Wins = bums on seats, there is no other recipe.

 

The core support like you, will continue to attend and bemoan the stay aways, but in the end the stay aways will come back when things improve. How we get to that stage is a difficult question. Lowe has his plan, but it is clearly not working at the moment, Crouch had his plan, at least it gave us some breathing space and kept us in this division this season. Wilde had his plan, which backfired spectacularly. Maybe JP can turn things around very soon and get his team picking up points regularly at home, I truly hope so, otherwise we will be relegated, and I suspect that will happen before Administration. But, for sure if we are relegated, we will then go into Admin as well.

 

Losing/drawing consistently at home will mean relegation, and will mean dwindling crowds. Thats a fact, and the sooner people come to terms with that the more chance we have of doing something about it, or gettig something done about it. That might mean Lowe having to realise that he must bring in an experienced player or two to help the kids, and understanding that he or Wilde may need to stump up some of the money for this themselves, in order to avoid a bigger financial catastrophe.

 

Thank you. That is the first really cogent argument I have seen on this subject for some time.

 

I did not go through the previous relegation so perhaps this is my version of your earlier experience.

 

I do not go expecting to see us lose, of course. And I totally understand the motivation of the modern football fan who will ally themselves only with success (perhaps it were ever thus and we never noticed before because we had such a small ground??)

 

What this shows is that there only ever were about 14,000 loyal fans of this club. The kind who will trudge through snow and tears to be there - that's all the city can muster. A vast bulk of the remainder were attracted by the glamour of the Premiership and all that entailed.

 

That's all I want people to admit. That staying away is no protest or principled high office. It is about where we are and what we are.

 

And I agree that winning will bring many of those people back. But only if there is a chance of promotion to the Premiership.

 

Yes, the SFC fans has been kicked in the nuts too often in the recent past. And when we have seen a victory away and people have turned up at home, they have been let down.

 

But someone (and I include you and me in this) needs to establish why we have lost that siege mentality at home, or how it could be recaptured. And my gut feel tells me, bigger crowds would help!!

 

And all we're seeing now is a young team trying their fecking hardest, under pressure and with slimmer support than this club has ever seen.

 

If you know nothing else about me, you will know that I believe in justice and equality.

 

And for the life of me I cannot see that visiting the sins of the father on the son, is in any way shape or form, remotely fair.

Edited 21 September, 2008 by Legod Second Coming

[OldNick]

Indeed. Lowe pioneered viewing fans as "customers", and customers vote with their feet.

 

If restaurant serves up crap food, it will go bust if it doesnt buck its ideas up, get a new chef, improve the menu, and do some serious marketing/advertising to win back lost customers.

That is fine but the restauranteur wanted to change the manager of the establishment but the customers were in uproar (me included) he listened to his customers and made an appointment that was not his first choice but his other partners as a middle ground. this made the food on offer lesser quality and it lost its Michelin star and the food on offer went down and down, and a series of new managers and owners. The customers stayed away and some who never went sent letters to the internet food guide damning it without trying it. The owner then made a bold decisin to get rid of the overpaid primma donna chefs and went with the up and coming enthusiastic chefs who may put in the odd bad ingrediant but loved the restaurant and are determined to get it right.

The people who never have tried the product still write into damning the product but some of the regulars were not overjoyed but understanding enough to see that if they still wanted their restaurant open they should at least try and stay with it a little longer and see if it could get back to its old heights. The others patiently awaited for the standardfs tp raise but were thinking about going to the other one down the road.

[Lunatic Fridge]

Apart from a few who think boycotting the club because of Lowe, I don't really think anyone seriously believes staying away is going to help the club. And the Lowe boycotters are really a very very small number, in my opinion.

[Weston Super Saint]

That is fine but the restauranteur wanted to change the manager of the establishment but the customers were in uproar (me included) he listened to his customers and made an appointment that was not his first choice but his other partners as a middle ground. this made the food on offer lesser quality and it lost its Michelin star and the food on offer went down and down, and a series of new managers and owners. The customers stayed away and some who never went sent letters to the internet food guide damning it without trying it. The owner then made a bold decisin to get rid of the overpaid primma donna chefs and went with the up and coming enthusiastic chefs who may put in the odd bad ingrediant but loved the restaurant and are determined to get it right.

The people who never have tried the product still write into damning the product but some of the regulars were not overjoyed but understanding enough to see that if they still wanted their restaurant open they should at least try and stay with it a little longer and see if it could get back to its old heights. The others patiently awaited for the standardfs tp raise but were thinking about going to the other one down the road.

 

Cuckoo?

[OldNick]

Cuckoo?

WSS you may rightly think that, but it is true.

[Weston Super Saint]

WSS you may rightly think that, but it is true.

 

What was the name of the restaurant and are they making a profit?

[OldNick]

What was the name of the restaurant and are they making a profit?

SFC dont confuse it with KFC

[Weston Super Saint]

SFC dont confuse it with KFC

 

So, this restaurant hasn't made a profit nor had serious investment for many many years, but somehow that is the fault of the customers?

 

Some might argue that they can get the same quality burger and chips down at McDonald's drive thru, for a fraction of the cost, so what motivation do they have to go to this restaurant and spend 6 or 7 times the money??

[Saints foreva]

I don't intend to go anymore and I have a season ticket. Mainly because I was getting abused by a bunch of c*unts who have been given me a hard for sometime now but this has now followed to inside the stadium.

[OldNick]

So, this restaurant hasn't made a profit nor had serious investment for many many years, but somehow that is the fault of the customers?

 

Some might argue that they can get the same quality burger and chips down at McDonald's drive thru, for a fraction of the cost, so what motivation do they have to go to this restaurant and spend 6 or 7 times the money??

The reastaurant would still be michelin star if the customers had not caused such a fuss when a manager was to be appointed(I include myself in that ) It was a bad mistake by us the fans.Morally correct but we are paying for that.I myself probably wouldnt have gone again but the mess we are in is brought on by the fans as well as the board RL the polayers and managers.It is not just down to 1 person.

[OldNick]

I don't intend to go anymore and I have a season ticket. Mainly because I was getting abused by a bunch of c*unts who have been given me a hard for sometime now but this has now followed to inside the stadium.

Move your seat to near me in the Northam the bunch there are a all sound.