Students

[mcjwills]

you what..?

 

Thought that was waht they did in the army in your days, unlike the brave fighting men of today.

 

Seriously I do respect the members of the armed forces, and was always willing consider them for a position, except some of the middle ranking sailors who were so far up there own arses they could not be flexible in the modern world. It was either the Navy way or no way.

[Thedelldays]

Thought that was waht they did in the army in your days, unlike the brave fighting men of today.

 

Seriously I do respect the members of the armed forces, and was always willing consider them for a position, except some of the middle ranking sailors who were so far up there own arses they could not be flexible in the modern world. It was either the Navy way or no way.

I am not in the Army, have never been in the army and never wish to join the army

 

what I do matters not..but in your eyes, unless I have been on the pop for 3 years got a 2:1 in a degree in the history of pointlessness then I am not a hard worker

[Sour Mash]

Have said this before

 

A school mate of mine went to uni to do a degree in the history of art he got a 2:1 (what ever that is)...he is now a manager of some nothing degree at Argos in town..and earns a pittance

 

I know a fair few people who have done that degree and got on to have really successful careers in completely different industries. The vast majority of you, including some of the students on here, seem to miss the point of a degree. To an extent (and excluding the obvious doctors/lawyers etc), it almost doesn't matter what your degree is in.

[JackFrost]

I reckon that you are deluded and have wasted lots of time and money of not just yours, but the taxpayers too.

 

There is always the chance to put things right though, the only way I can see this is if you use your degree to do teaching. Because sorry to break it to you, but most employers won't give a toss about your English Literature degree unless it has anything to do with their Industry and the job you are applying for.

 

which is what a hell of a lot of recently graduated ex-students are finding out.

 

The vast majority of employers prefer experience to qualifications, especially in these times

 

A friend of mine recently graduated from uni, one of his housemates was doing a 'degree' in golf course design.

[mcjwills]

I am not in the Army, have never been in the army and never wish to join the amry

 

what I do matters not..but in your eyes, unless I have been on the pop for 3 years got a 2:1 in a degree in the history of pointlessness then I am a hard worker

 

Never said that, if you read my earlier post I didn't go to Uni until I was 33 and I considered myself a hard worker, some of the best people I work with currently do not have degrees. Personally I think Media Studies and similar wimpy degrees are a waste of time, and a good hard worker without a degree, but relevant experience is a better option than someone with Media Studies.

Media Studies = Lazying About

Engineering/Medicine/Law = Working your Ass Off

Edited 22 January, 2010 by mcjwills

[SuperMikey]

Did you go to university Stu? Students work very hard to gain a degree, and while there are some pointless ones like Golf Management knocking around, there are a lot of very intelligent people studying very hard subjects which will ultimately lead to very trying careers. Not sure your 'bloody layabout students' thesis is completely generalisable, don't think all the medicine students out there would agree.

 

I'm personally off to university in September to study Anthropology for 3/4 years depending on where I end up, and then spend another 2 years doing some postgraduate study in Marketing or Advertising. These are subjects which will hopefully stand me in good stead for getting a nice, comfortable job which i'm happy with and which will make me a good contributor to society. This is also what 99% of university students out there are aiming to do as well. Very, very few students see university as a chance to doss about for a couple of years, living off your student loan and getting drunk in the student union bar at 10am.

 

Perhaps it might be a good learning experience for you to talk to some students about their work instead of just coming on here and slagging them off.

 

Thank you, and goodnight.

[Wiltshire Saint]

Does Stu's lack of interest in education and learning explain why he is going out with some young slapper who is on pub watch? Does it explain why his life seems to be every episode of the Jeremey Kyle show rolled into one? Yes is the answer. Thick, fat, spade faced loser destined to remain as part of the underclass for the rest of his sorry life.

[Bath Saint]

On Maslow's hierarchy of needs, he is right down at the bottom, accumulating the basics at the expense of any self-actualisation. His needs are clearly very minimal.

[CB Saint]

On Maslow's hierarchy of needs, he is right down at the bottom, accumulating the basics at the expense of any self-actualisation. His needs are clearly very minimal.

 

Best of all, it probably personally cost Stu £1 to teach you that.

[bridge too far]

Being awarded a good degree demonstrates to a prospective employer that the student / graduate has excellent self-discipline, application, independent thought and good communication skills. All highly valuable to a successful company.

 

My son was awarded a First in Philosophy - he is now European VP of a a multi-national software company.

 

My daughter was awarded a First in Maths - she is now a senior project manager for a Housing Association.

 

Both very responsible jobs requiring a great deal of intelligence - and skills not necessarily provided by their degrees' subject matter but rather by their experience at university.

 

And I know I'm boasting - but I'm bloody proud of the pair of them

Edited 22 January, 2010 by bridge too far

[Colinjb]

Did you go to university Stu? Students work very hard to gain a degree, and while there are some pointless ones like Golf Management knocking around, there are a lot of very intelligent people studying very hard subjects which will ultimately lead to very trying careers. Not sure your 'bloody layabout students' thesis is completely generalisable, don't think all the medicine students out there would agree.

 

I'm personally off to university in September to study Anthropology for 3/4 years depending on where I end up, and then spend another 2 years doing some postgraduate study in Marketing or Advertising. These are subjects which will hopefully stand me in good stead for getting a nice, comfortable job which i'm happy with and which will make me a good contributor to society. This is also what 99% of university students out there are aiming to do as well. Very, very few students see university as a chance to doss about for a couple of years, living off your student loan and getting drunk in the student union bar at 10am.

 

Perhaps it might be a good learning experience for you to talk to some students about their work instead of just coming on here and slagging them off.

 

Thank you, and goodnight.

 

Having been a student at a university that is only strong in a few areas and weak in several I can tell you for a fact that there are a large proportion of students who do go simply because they have no real idea of what they wish to do next, so they meander through on a course that sounds reasonable getting drunk, doing the minimum of work and leaving with a 3rd class degree or 2:2 that means essentially nothing.

 

Your 99% view is almost certainly true of the subjects which do have a need for a degree, such as nursing, medicine, engineering, law, mathematics and the sciences. But degrees in 'media,' 'performaing arts,' and 'travel and tourism' have no real weight or relevance beyond their more recognised universities. Yet many people take them and wonder why their 3rd Class Degree in Dance from Aston University cannot get them any work beyond burger flipping and light admin.

 

I wish you luck at uni, and trust from your comments that you will work hard and fullfill your goals. I appreciate Stu is heavy handed and somewhat clumsy in his views but he does have a valid point beneath it all, the university system is far too big, far too swelled and achieves less then a well applied apprenticeship and vocational system would deliver in 70 odd percent of cases. I am sure the experiences you gain will help you to be less nieve.

[Bath Saint]

Best of all, it probably personally cost Stu £1 to teach you that.

 

Money well spent.

[rich saints]

i love the students as run 30 houses in soton that brings in a fair few pounds happy days

[anothersaintinsouthsea]

If you didn't go to Uni you might have had the brains to look at the link I posted where it refers to Universities costing the income tax payer £400 a year.

 

that'll teach me!

[The Majestic Channon]

i love the students as run 30 houses in soton that brings in a fair few pounds happy days

 

Meaning?

[saintkiptanui]

Meaning?

meaning he's being vulgar.

[SuperMikey]

Having been a student at a university that is only strong in a few areas and weak in several I can tell you for a fact that there are a large proportion of students who do go simply because they have no real idea of what they wish to do next, so they meander through on a course that sounds reasonable getting drunk, doing the minimum of work and leaving with a 3rd class degree or 2:2 that means essentially nothing.

 

Your 99% view is almost certainly true of the subjects which do have a need for a degree, such as nursing, medicine, engineering, law, mathematics and the sciences. But degrees in 'media,' 'performaing arts,' and 'travel and tourism' have no real weight or relevance beyond their more recognised universities. Yet many people take them and wonder why their 3rd Class Degree in Dance from Aston University cannot get them any work beyond burger flipping and light admin.

 

I wish you luck at uni, and trust from your comments that you will work hard and fullfill your goals. I appreciate Stu is heavy handed and somewhat clumsy in his views but he does have a valid point beneath it all, the university system is far too big, far too swelled and achieves less then a well applied apprenticeship and vocational system would deliver in 70 odd percent of cases. I am sure the experiences you gain will help you to be less nieve.

 

*naive

 

[saintjinksie]

90% of my mates are students, and all they do is drink and then complain their skint, go to about 3 lectures a week and **** away the rest of the week. All on government money. Sounds like a good life to me.

 

same here, a lot of my mates dont live in the real world. dont know what its like to do some hard full time graft...

[Colinjb]

*naive

 

 

This is why I achieved a 2:1 Honours in Engineering, and you are doing English.

 

The lesson endeth.

[SuperMikey]

This is why I achieved a 2:1 Honours in Engineering, and you are doing English.

 

The lesson endeth.

 

*Anthropology

 

 

(I'll stop now)

[Colinjb]

*Anthropology

 

 

(I'll stop now)

 

You arse! Yes, do stop

[sotonjoe]

boring

[Minty]

Speaking as an employer, both within large national and multi-national companies, and smaller local (but still successful) ones, personally speaking, when employing in ANY position, whilst experience and qualifications can often give pointers towards an individuals suitability, especially where the experience of qualification is directly relevent to the job, the single most important thing that I judge is the person and their personality, and look for clues to this in their experience and qualifications and subsequent interview and recruitment process.

 

Sometimes a degree may be in a non-related or seemingly superfluous subject but if the individual has applied themselves well then that be significant. I have rejected highly qualified individuals who needed to learn mroe basic human qualities because I knew they would be extremely bad for business.

 

Finding out about the person is the single most important thing in the recruitment process. Everything else simply helps build that picture. Sometimes the qualification is not the important thing, it is how they gained it and what they learnt on the way.

 

The UK education system is far from perfect, but no matter what state it is in, what is more important to me is how any individual applies themselves to whatever academic path they choose.

[for_heaven's_Saint]

Top 10 for English you say?

 

Top ten of what exactly - surely not universities if they allow you to start a sentence with 'and' :smt102

 

Oh, I'm sorry, I didn't realise that this thread was going to be submitted as part of my degree. In that case, perhaps you should do some research into the use of question marks?

 

AND, for what it's worth, there is not a problem with starting a sentence with a conjunctive, only prescriptive linguists, like yourself, like to try to make one. I suppose you're the sort of person who writes complaints to companies for saying '10 items or less' or splitting the infinitive.

 

Is that the only mistake you could find?

 

If you have nothing better to do then try to nit-pick my sentences to catch me out, I suggest in future you keep it to yourself. Especially if you are going to show an appalling grasp of punctuation in your attacks.

[OttawaSaint]

I got a 2:1 in Neuroscience at U of Aberdeen, partied like hell in the first 2 years, but boy I had to knuckle down and work like a madman in those last 2 years. In my entire time at Aberdeen I didn't miss a single lecture. Some ****s missed lectures all the time but they were kicked out after 2 years.

 

Uni isn't just about the **** ups etc, you grow up a lot over the course of those 3 or 4 years.

 

I went on and bagged an MSc and a PhD as well, and my job now isn't that close to my education.

 

Sure some of those ****s are annoying with their antics but the real students stop partying after the first year or so and knuckle down, you have to if you want to get your qualification. The ones you see on the street are fresh out of mummy and daddies house and are just experiencing freedom, just leave them alone, they'll sort themselves out. I mean, squaddies don't sit on their cots in the barracks all night mugging up on machine gunning and ballistics, no they are out on the town getting ****ed and fighting the locals...

[Gemmel]

And I know I'm boasting - but I'm bloody proud of the pair of them

 

 

And so you should be. Nice one.

[oxfordshire_saint]

I can't find the figures for all of Britain, but alcohol abuse costs the taxpayers in Scotland £3.56bn a year, so god knows what the figure is for here too.

 

Should we stop people getting boozed up?

 

In all honesty, I'd rather my taxes went to funding further education than patching up ****heads or paying for their criminal damage (and I didn't even go to Uni)

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gwDRBm-qbQI

[bridge too far]

I can't find the figures for all of Britain, but alcohol abuse costs the taxpayers in Scotland £3.56bn a year, so god knows what the figure is for here too.

 

Should we stop people getting boozed up?

 

In all honesty, I'd rather my taxes went to funding further education than patching up ****heads or paying for their criminal damage (and I didn't even go to Uni)

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gwDRBm-qbQI

 

And another thing - tax fraud costs each of us (honest folk) £600 a year too!

[SuperMikey]

I got a 2:1 in Neuroscience at U of Aberdeen, partied like hell in the first 2 years, but boy I had to knuckle down and work like a madman in those last 2 years. In my entire time at Aberdeen I didn't miss a single lecture. Some ****s missed lectures all the time but they were kicked out after 2 years.

 

Uni isn't just about the **** ups etc, you grow up a lot over the course of those 3 or 4 years.

 

I went on and bagged an MSc and a PhD as well, and my job now isn't that close to my education.

 

Sure some of those ****s are annoying with their antics but the real students stop partying after the first year or so and knuckle down, you have to if you want to get your qualification. The ones you see on the street are fresh out of mummy and daddies house and are just experiencing freedom, just leave them alone, they'll sort themselves out. I mean, squaddies don't sit on their cots in the barracks all night mugging up on machine gunning and ballistics, no they are out on the town getting ****ed and fighting the locals...

 

I've applied to Aberdeen but not had a chance to go up there and see the uni for myself. Would you recommend it?

[StuRomseySaint]

Sorry but when I returned to Education at 33 years old, to do my degree and I got a Upper Second (2:1). I was going to Lectures for 10 hours a week, but out of Lectures I was working on average 70 hours a week doing research. A so called five hour assignment would take best part 100 hours to conduct proper research, 10 hours to write, a further 5 hours to hone to a finish product before you got somebody to proof read it. I missed a First because I spent the last 8 weeks in hospital having heart surgery. So you are talking B*llocks.

 

1) You are in the minority of students that would apply themselves like that, and to be honest, I think you are talking absolute b*llocks. 10 hours a day, 7 days a week?

 

2) Even if you did apply that time over a long period of time... it is still not a patch on what someone in the forces can be expected to do... for example when I was in Belfast 97/98... first patrol went out at 7 in the morning and last patrol would come in about 2 in the morning, this was 7 days a week for 6 months, with only 5 days leave during that 6 months... you students don't know the meaning of hard work. :cool:

[aintforever]

My mate was in the forces and sent to Northern Ireland, he said he spent most of the time sat around the barracks bored out of his mind doing **** all.

[Nexstar]

My mate was in the forces and sent to Northern Ireland, he said he spent most of the time sat around the barracks bored out of his mind doing **** all.

 

Surely it was more like the 133 hour weeks that Stu was talking about, when trying to make his point about people in the army doing their jobs when students would rather pursue other careers paths, and being the enemy for making that choice.

[bridge too far]

1) You are in the minority of students that would apply themselves like that, and to be honest, I think you are talking absolute b*llocks. 10 hours a day, 7 days a week?

 

2) Even if you did apply that time over a long period of time... it is still not a patch on what someone in the forces can be expected to do... for example when I was in Belfast 97/98... first patrol went out at 7 in the morning and last patrol would come in about 2 in the morning, this was 7 days a week for 6 months, with only 5 days leave during that 6 months... you students don't know the meaning of hard work. :cool:

 

How many patrols covered that period? How long was each patrol? What did each patrol do when it wasn't patrolling?

[Joensuu]

Remove the students and in 15 years time the UK economy would take a massive hit. No doubt military cuts would result. As such, student of today keep soldiers of tomorrow in work.

 

So next time you're supping down on a pint remember that by buying that beer, you've willing chosen to give more than a penny to support universities. The more you drink, the more you support students.

[StuRomseySaint]

My mate was in the forces and sent to Northern Ireland, he said he spent most of the time sat around the barracks bored out of his mind doing **** all.

 

I would happily put my mortgage that this was after the Good Friday agreement and not in Belfast then, and he was not an Infantry soldier but more likely some REMF nobber.

Edited 23 January, 2010 by StuRomseySaint

[Guided Missile]

An individual's contribution to society and their value therein, can't be measured by a broad generalisation of their current occupation, nor the cost to the public purse of maintaining that group.

 

Using this criteria is often a lazy way of reinforcing personal predujices, thereby providing some self-worth to the person making the generalisation.

 

It is a hard thing in life to celebrate the diversity in our society and the acknowledgement of the value of those other individual's contribution to our own life.

 

Very often, the first step is to accept our own shortcomings, rather than seeking to voice the shortcomings of others.

 

All I do know is that the persuit of education, in all it's forms, is the future of our nation.

 

The persuit of foreign wars, in all their forms, is probably not...

[StuRomseySaint]

How many patrols covered that period? How long was each patrol? What did each patrol do when it wasn't patrolling?

 

In that period there would be 6 or 7 scheduled patrols (lasting between 1 hour and 3 hours ), plus responding to incidents ( which in West Belfast / Falls Road was 2 or 3 times daily.

 

There was a 'round robin' where one fire-team had a patrol off every 6 or so... and what did we do when we were off? Well not alot seeing as we were completely confined to the second floor of a police station. 1 television to watch between 40 of us and that's about it... although The Sun did send us some gym equipment at Xmas.

 

Does that answer all your questions sweetie? xx

Edited 23 January, 2010 by StuRomseySaint

[aintforever]

I would happily put my mortgage that this was after the Good Friday agreement and not in Belfast then, and he was not an Infantry soldier but more likely some REMF nobber.

 

He was a Grenadier, so I guess that means his job is to chuck hand grenades at the bad guys. My point was I know **** all about being in the army so couldn't possibly judge on how good a job they do.

 

Just like you know **** all about how much hard work goes into getting a degree.

[Thedelldays]

to suggest someone in the forces is lazy is utterly stupid....

 

unless they are medically down graded...you tend to work hard in the forces...sure you get good time off, but when you work, you can be worked very hard

[bridge too far]

.................

 

Does that answer all your questions sweetie? xx

 

In part, thank you - and thank you for patronising me too.....

 

 

 

Peanut blloks

[Thedelldays]

I have done my fair share of 120+ hour weeks for say 9 weeks on the trot...

 

the concentration needed for that time for what we do is quite intense also...

[Ludwig]

Stu of Romsey; are all degrees and all students 'pointless'? Should they all be working? What would be your exceptions?

[StuRomseySaint]

Stu of Romsey; are all degrees and all students 'pointless'? Should they all be working? What would be your exceptions?

 

Don't be a typical lazy student, my answer to your question is in this thread more than once.

[Ludwig]

Don't be a typical lazy student, my answer to your question is in this thread more than once.

 

You've talked about 'relevance to jobs' and that degrees are useful if they are appropriate to the vocation upon which one wishes to embark; the Mathematics degree I am going to start next year will be minutely relevant to whatever I choose to do afterwards, unless of course I go into research or similar. Will my degree (and others like it, Natural Sciences, Economics, History, Philosophy), which is well-respected, but doesn't necessarily lend itself towards any specific vocation whatsoever, be 'worthless' in your wizened eyes?

[Minty]

So basically it seems this thread is all about trying to generalise as much as possible and draw pointless conclusions as a result. Excellent.

[Draino76]

Stu, what would you opinion be of my degree and choices for doing it. I did history at Royal Holloway knowing that I was unlikely to ever to go into anything history related as a career. However, without having a degree, I would never have been able to get my job or the prospects it has opened up, as it was for graduates only.

 

Sadly, this is what Labour have done to the degree system. Rather than offering relevant apprenticehsips etc, they have decided that everyone should go to uni, ignoring the fact that mofor most people it isn't appropriate.

 

I agree with your point about crap degrees entirely. In my opinion the only ones that should be offered are the ones that are important enough to do at school.

 

Humanities

Sciences

Maths

English subjects

Technologies

Languages

 

Hey I went to Royal Holloway! Great isn't it? I did Economics and Spanish with a lot of drugs in the evening.

[OttawaSaint]

I've applied to Aberdeen but not had a chance to go up there and see the uni for myself. Would you recommend it?

 

I was up there from 1992 - 1997, and loved the city and surrounding area. University was a very good one with excellent facilities teaching. Night life was decent but not as good as the likes of Edindburgh and Glasgow. Footie was cheap to get into and good entertainment and the weather although cold and windy was rarely wet. I had a great time there, but a lot might have changed in the last 12-13 years so my information may be a wee bit outdated. Takes a while to work out what the locals are saying though as they often throw a bit of "doric" in with the heavily accented English they speak.

[RedAndWhite91]

same here, a lot of my mates dont live in the real world. dont know what its like to do some hard full time graft...

 

You're just jealous that whenever you have work and have to get up at 6am after a midweek game I have a lie in

[SuperMikey]

I was up there from 1992 - 1997, and loved the city and surrounding area. University was a very good one with excellent facilities teaching. Night life was decent but not as good as the likes of Edindburgh and Glasgow. Footie was cheap to get into and good entertainment and the weather although cold and windy was rarely wet. I had a great time there, but a lot might have changed in the last 12-13 years so my information may be a wee bit outdated. Takes a while to work out what the locals are saying though as they often throw a bit of "doric" in with the heavily accented English they speak.

 

Thanks for the reply mate, appreciate that. Ought to have nae problems with the accent because I spend a lot of time in Perth which isn't far from there. Naturally spending a lot of time in Perth, i'm a St Johnstone fan as well as a saints fan (saints connection there) so might go along when they play in the city. The government is throwing money at scottish universities at the moment, decreasing funding and places at english ones and giving it all to scottish ones. Aberdeen itself got a £240m grant from the government recently...not bad eh?

[bridge too far]

Thanks for the reply mate, appreciate that. Ought to have nae problems with the accent because I spend a lot of time in Perth which isn't far from there. Naturally spending a lot of time in Perth, i'm a St Johnstone fan as well as a saints fan (saints connection there) so might go along when they play in the city. The government is throwing money at scottish universities at the moment, decreasing funding and places at english ones and giving it all to scottish ones. Aberdeen itself got a £240m grant from the government recently...not bad eh?

 

Doesn't the funding for Scottish universities come from the devolved Scottish parliament rather than the UK one?