Man who attacked robber is freed on appeal

[INFLUENCED.COM]

BBC News:-

A businessman who was jailed for permanently injuring an intruder who attacked him and his family has been freed by the Court of Appeal.

 

Munir Hussain 53, was sentenced to 30 months for grievous bodily harm with intent after he hit Walid Salem with a cricket bat in 2008.

 

Hussain and his family had been tied up by three intruders at their home in High Wycombe, Buckinghamshire.

 

His jail sentence has been replaced with a two-year suspended term.

 

Lord Chief Justice Lord Judge, who was sitting with two other judges in London, said he had shown "mercy" to Hussain.

 

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Will they try and get it right first time around the next time such an incident comes before the court ?

His brother only had his sentance reduced by 15 months so still 2 years, their mercy didn't extend far enough imo.

[bungle]

This is the guy who, having got rid of the intruder, and untied his family, then chased up the road and using a cricket bat caused permanent damage when he was no longer in any danger.

 

Vigilante justice. Not as cut and dried as you think.

[Sergei Gotsmanov]

If somebody ties up my family and threatens them with a knife then they will get what is coming to them. They should lose their right to protection of the law. If that is vigilante justice then so be it.

[Hatch]

If somebody ties up my family and threatens them with a knife then they will get what is coming to them. They should lose their right to protection of the law. If that is vigilante justice then so be it.

 

 

This, even if it takes years to get my revenge, I will get it.

[INFLUENCED.COM]

Munir Hussain's family had been subjected to a "serious and wicked offence" but the judge said he had carried out a "dreadful, violent attack" on the offender.

 

bungle, either the guy was very very slow or events didn't unfold as you suggest, I have to accept the threat has reduced somewhat after the offenders left the property but the initial attack was about 'revenge' so where was it going to stop, when a member of his own family was seriously harmed ?

[thesaint sfc]

If this had happened in his house, not when the robber was running away I honestly think it would be a whole different story. You can't dish out punishment as you please. Fair enough if it was self defence, but it wasn't. He took the law into his own hands. IMO he should have done time for it, no where near as long as he got though.

[thesaint sfc]

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1235782/Millionaire-Munir-Hussain-fought-knife-wielding-burglar-jailed-intruder-let-off.html

 

Have a read through that and I think you'll be more inclined to agree with me.

[thesaint sfc]

He fit the intruder who had fled the property so hard over the head with a cricket bat that the cricket bat broke into 3 pieces, causing brain damage to him. If you don't do time for that our justice system is f*cked.

[Crab Lungs]

**** the intruder - the person who commits the first crime and instigates the whole sorry episode is surely more accountable and forgoes their human rights/protection of the law.

 

It's that ****ing simple - why the ridiculous lily-livered red tape?

 

In a nutshell, Walid Salem had it coming to him. He's a c()nt and he got what he deserved, simple. If my family are threatened by someone I would make sure the emergency services have to remove the cricket bat from the body...

[bungle]

If this had happened in his house, not when the robber was running away I honestly think it would be a whole different story. You can't dish out punishment as you please. Fair enough if it was self defence, but it wasn't. He took the law into his own hands. IMO he should have done time for it, no where near as long as he got though.

 

Indeed, had he injured him this seriously in self-defense the issue would be different. However, at the point the intruder had fled and was posing no danger. People can't just take justice into their own hands.

 

It is very difficult, obviously heat of the moment and all that.

[Sergei Gotsmanov]

and he will not reoffend.

 

It is all very easy to look at things in the cold light of day. You do not think that having your family threatened like that you would have stopped giving chase. I would have given the b*astard a few more cover drives and a reverse sweep in the boll*cks.

[bungle]

and he will not reoffend.

 

It is all very easy to look at things in the cold light of day. You do not think that having your family threatened like that you would have stopped giving chase. I would have given the b*astard a few more cover drives and a reverse sweep in the boll*cks.

 

Indeed, but you can make much more rational judgments in the cold light of day, hence the rule of law should apply, and people shouldn't take justice into their own hands.

[Crab Lungs]

and he will not reoffend.

 

It is all very easy to look at things in the cold light of day. You do not think that having your family threatened like that you would have stopped giving chase. I would have given the b*astard a few more cover drives and a reverse sweep in the boll*cks.

 

Exactly - I mean, what does the guy do? Take a step back, calm himself and negotiate with the CAREER criminals?

 

I don't think so. If Salem suffering brain damage acts as a deterrents to other would-be criminals then good.

[bungle]

Exactly - I mean, what does the guy do? Take a step back, calm himself and negotiate with the CAREER criminals?

 

I don't think so. If Salem suffering brain damage acts as a deterrents to other would-be criminals then good.

 

Er, no. He just doesn't chase them down the road when they have already fled. No-one is saying they did anything wrong while they were still in the house, but it is what happened AFTER they had run away which is the issue here.

[Crab Lungs]

Er, no. He just doesn't chase them down the road when they have already fled. No-one is saying they did anything wrong while they were still in the house, but it is what happened AFTER they had run away which is the issue here.

 

From a legal perspective, you are correct.

 

From a moral perspective, our 'career criminals' deserved everything he got - whether inside the house, down the road or anywhere else.

[bungle]

From a legal perspective, you are correct.

 

From a moral perspective, our 'career criminals' deserved everything he got - whether inside the house, down the road or anywhere else.

 

I believe that morals are subjective, rather than objective, and I would believe he was morally wrong in what he did.

[View From The Top]

This is the guy who, having got rid of the intruder, and untied his family, then chased up the road and using a cricket bat caused permanent damage when he was no longer in any danger.

 

Vigilante justice. Not as cut and dried as you think.

 

Hasn't stopped the perpetrator continuing to commit crime, 54 offences and counting and also awaiting trial on a number of charges.

 

Didn't hit him hard enough IMHO.

[Sergei Gotsmanov]

Then Bungle we will never agree. That man tied up an honest law abiding man's family and used a knife to bully and threaten them. By doing this in my opinion he forfeited his right to be treated as a normal citizen and was dealt with appropriately.

[bungle]

Then Bungle we will never agree. That man tied up an honest law abiding man's family and used a knife to bully and threaten them. By doing this in my opinion he forfeited his right to be treated as a normal citizen and was dealt with appropriately.

 

I do disagree, but as I have stated I do believe it is a difficult decision and a difficult situation to be in. I have confidence in my moral standpoint, and believe I am right, but that is not to say that I must be right.

 

In response to a post above, there is a failing within our criminal justice system re: re-offending rates, but that is a separate debate.

[Sheaf Saint]

I believe that morals are subjective, rather than objective, and I would believe he was morally wrong in what he did.

 

Maybe he was morally wrong Bungle, but who are you, or I, or anybody to judge the actions of somebody who has just seen his family tied up and threatened? How can you know how you would react in that situation?

 

There is, I believe, precedent in the UK legal system that sentences can be reduced on grounds of diminished responsibility. Well I believe that the pure rage he must have been feeling after witnessing what this intruder did to his family is more than sufficient to claim that he was not of sound mind and judgement when he reacted in the way that he did.

[bungle]

Maybe he was morally wrong Bungle, but who are you, or I, or anybody to judge the actions of somebody who has just seen his family tied up and threatened? How can you know how you would react in that situation?

 

Do you understand the meanings of the words "believe", "subjective" and "objective".

 

I ask, because if you do then your opening statement makes absolutely no sense at all.

[alpine_saint]

He fit the intruder who had fled the property so hard over the head with a cricket bat that the cricket bat broke into 3 pieces, causing brain damage to him. If you don't do time for that our justice system is f*cked.

 

b*ll*cks. If the burglar hadnt violated his house and family, he wouldnt have put himself in harms way.

[View From The Top]

I have confidence in my moral standpoint, and believe I am right, but that is not to say that I must be right.

 

That's the fairest statement ever posted on this site.

[Saints11]

b*ll*cks. If the burglar hadnt violated his house and family, he wouldnt have put himself in harms way.

 

I second that.

 

**** anyone who breaks into my home, ties up my family etc, him and his brother chased him down the street and gave him a good beating, basically what he deserved.

 

I can't understand how people have sympathy for burgulars etc, **** the lot of them

[bridge too far]

I second that.

 

**** anyone who breaks into my home, ties up my family etc, him and his brother chased him down the street and gave him a good beating, basically what he deserved.

 

I can't understand how people have sympathy for burgulars etc, **** the lot of them

 

Nobody has sympathy for burglars (no-one in their right mind that is). I don't have time for summary, vigilante justice. The two shouldn't be linked.

 

Where would you draw the line with vigilante justice? Would you go down the route of the lot down the road, haranguing a paediatrician in the mistaken belief (or inability to understand) that that's not the same as a paedophile?

 

There are sometimes errors in judgement in law but there'd be far more if we took the law into our own hands.

[INFLUENCED.COM]

The word vigilante goes back to Spanish origin and means Watchman or Guard, unfortunately it is somewhat misrepresented, I see little wrong in protecting me and mine, even if, at times, I have to be proactive oppose to reactive.

[Leicestersaint]

If somebody ties up my family and threatens them with a knife then they will get what is coming to them. They should lose their right to protection of the law. If that is vigilante justice then so be it.

 

Agreed - surely one should be able to defend oneself - if I found soemone in my house, God forbid, I would act first and think about it later.

[bridge too far]

Agreed - surely one should be able to defend oneself - if I found soemone in my house, God forbid, I would act first and think about it later.

 

But the salient point is that the burglar had fled. The man's family were safe by that time. The burglar was chased down the road and caught and had the living daylights beaten out of him.

 

So whilst reasonable self-defence is defendable in law, beating the crap out of someone once self-defence isn't required isn't.

 

It's all about disproportionate revenge. And it had to be tested in law.

[Sheaf Saint]

Do you understand the meanings of the words "believe", "subjective" and "objective".

 

I ask, because if you do then your opening statement makes absolutely no sense at all.

 

Of course I understand them. You 'believe' he was morally wrong, because that is your reasoned opinion after clearly giving the matter some thought. I totally respect that.

 

But whether you are correct or not, do you think he was capable, in the heat of the moment, of thinking "Hmmm, perhaps I had better not give this guy a beating because it might be morally wrong"? Somehow I doubt it.

 

It's all very well you saying that you think he was morally wrong, but in my opinion he wasn't in any position to make such a judgement himself at the time, so it is not for you or I to judge his actions because we clearly have no concept of what emotions he was feeling when he did what he did.

 

I agree that he should have faced some kind of reprimand because what he did to the guy was clearly a violent, unlawful act and nobody should be above the law. But his sentence for it should reflect the circumstances of the case and I am glad that his appeal has been partially successful on that basis.

[Barney Trubble]

He should have let them do what they wanted, take what they wanted and then called the Police when they had left his property. It's the job of the Police to solve crime through taking pictures and using paint brushes to brush over door handles and so on.

 

What if the burglar had bi-polar, he might not have known what he was doing when he broke in...........................

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

...................of course, I am being stupid but i'm sure there will be some weak-minded, wet lettuce on here who agrees with the above[minus the paint brush nonsense].

 

The guy was a career criminal, he got what was coming and tough **** if he got a battering - he has no conscious about the mental and physical pain he imposed on his many victims so I won't be worrying about how he is.

 

Of course, he was judged not fit to stand trial but he was still fit enough to commit more crime, despite his condition.

 

Sometimes I can see where St.George is coming from.

[solentstars]

This is the guy who, having got rid of the intruder, and untied his family, then chased up the road and using a cricket bat caused permanent damage when he was no longer in any danger.

 

Vigilante justice. Not as cut and dried as you think.

 

maybe but the intrude had 50 offences,he should have been jailed ages ago.not on the streets carrying on his evil ways

[.comsaint]

Then Bungle we will never agree. That man tied up an honest law abiding man's family and used a knife to bully and threaten them. By doing this in my opinion he forfeited his right to be treated as a normal citizen and was dealt with appropriately.

 

+1.

 

Karma. What goes around etc etc...

[Hatch]

Coincidently, Someone tried to break into our neighbours house last night, but were disturbed and ran off.

So, if burglars are operating in my area and want to try my house, I'm waiting for them.

They will be leaving the house with less limbs that they entered with.

[AndyNorthernSaints]

Coincidently, Someone tried to break into our neighbours house last night, but were disturbed and ran off.

So, if burglars are operating in my area and want to try my house, I'm waiting for them.

They will be leaving the house with less limbs that they entered with.

 

Are you Duncan Ferguson?

[tpbury]

1) It's not difficult to break a cricket bat in three places, especially if it's from Woolworths

2) I've no idea how I'd react in that situation. Not being used to violence, I would't anticpate behaving like that, but I wouldn't be surprised if I did.

3) Quite angry.

[GenevaSaint]

But the salient point is that the burglar had fled. The man's family were safe by that time. The burglar was chased down the road and caught and had the living daylights beaten out of him.

 

So whilst reasonable self-defence is defendable in law, beating the crap out of someone once self-defence isn't required isn't.

 

It's all about disproportionate revenge. And it had to be tested in law.

 

Indeed, 50 metres away from the initial incident and was cornered by two people. Why not just hand him over to the police. Yes, he'd be annoyed as would I, but this fella picked up a cricket bat and chased him, and beat him to a pulp. A few "slaps" would've been acceptable in my eyes, but the bat was excessive.

[Sergei Gotsmanov]

Why Geneva Saint? the bloke had just threatened to 'slit his family's throats'. Maybe you would perhaps let the occasion get to you a bit. I would give him a medal.

 

Now on to the 'victim' who was too 'brain damaged' to face charges but not it seems to carry out further crimes of fraud.

[Hatch]

Does Munir Hussein have any previous?

[Thedelldays]

so easy to be rational when you are not and have not faced a situation like this

[.comsaint]

Indeed, 50 metres away from the initial incident and was cornered by two people. Why not just hand him over to the police...

 

Probably because once the courts had finished with him - he'd have gotten 60 hrs community service...and that's it!

 

Therefore - the correct 'punishment' was administered.

[Hatch]

Also, how did he know that the bad guy wasn't going to come back again to finish off the burglary.

 

He had to be 'neutralised'.

[lettuce]

To throw another juicey morsel into the melting pot... say you were walking down the street, minding your own business, and someone ran out of a house and took a cricket bat to your head, because they mistakenly believed you had just tied up their family and robbed them... would you expect them to be put away for a long time?

[.comsaint]

Also, how did he know that the bad guy wasn't going to come back again to finish off the burglary.

 

He had to be 'neutralised'.

 

lol. 'Neutralised'. I like it!

[INFLUENCED.COM]

Does Munir Hussein have any previous?

 

Girlfriends, wives ?

[INFLUENCED.COM]

To throw another juicey morsel into the melting pot... say you were walking down the street, minding your own business, and someone ran out of a house and took a cricket bat to your head, because they mistakenly believed you had just tied up their family and robbed them... would you expect them to be put away for a long time?

 

A very unlikely scenario because I don't look like a scum bag when I walk down the street, however, I would take the bat of the individual and go onto discuss the Hussein case and hopefully put them off attempting to hit, not only me, but also the individual who did tie up their family, no doubt in that time the individual he was looking for will be in another persons home tying up their family, so safe from this bat wielding vigilante maniac who had the audacity to be angry over someone threatening the lives of his wife and children.

[lettuce]

A very unlikely scenario because I don't look like a scum bag when I walk down the street,

So all criminals look like scumbags? I have a shaved head and used to have a couple of earrings in one ear, yet I've never been in trouble with the law or committed any serious crime. I wouldn't feel too pleased if somone knocked me into the middle of next week because they mistook me for a "scumbag".

 

Besides, weren't the gang who tied this guy up wearing balaclavas?

 

If the guy who got burgled knew who one of the assailants was, surely it would have been better for him to let the police handle it? The burlglar committed a crime and the evidence that would convict him wasn't going to be any different whether the victim battered him with a cricket bat or not.

[INFLUENCED.COM]

So all criminals look like scumbags? I have a shaved head and used to have a couple of earrings in one ear, yet I've never been in trouble with the law or committed any serious crime. I wouldn't feel too pleased if somone knocked me into the middle of next week because they mistook me for a "scumbag".

 

Based on your description of yourself I believe in that scenario it would more likely to have been a case of gay bashing.

[Arizona]

50 previous offences and he's out on the streets pointing knives at people.

 

I think I'll take vigilante justice over an ASBO and a smacked bottom.

[View From The Top]

I have a shaved head and used to have a couple of earrings in one ear

 

[Sour Mash]

To throw another juicey morsel into the melting pot... say you were walking down the street, minding your own business, and someone ran out of a house and took a cricket bat to your head, because they mistakenly believed you had just tied up their family and robbed them... would you expect them to be put away for a long time?

 

Yes. Next question please.