School Closures

[Whitey Grandad]

The difference of course being that they are not the school's liability when they are out in the snow at their own or their parents' behest. Of course, I'd imagine you knew this and weren't so retarded as to overlook it.

This has always been the case since I was at school. We never had any school closures in the fifties and sixties so what has changed?

[View From The Top]

This has always been the case since I was at school. We never had any school closures in the fifties and sixties so what has changed?

 

Had an accident at work that wasn't you fault? Suffered a tumble or fall? Then call....................................

[Saintandy666]

I have an exam on tuesday and if the amount of snow predicted over the weekend comes I probably won't be allowed to take it for another 5 months

[Jillyanne]

I have an exam on tuesday and if the amount of snow predicted over the weekend comes I probably won't be allowed to take it for another 5 months

 

Barton Peveril are saying that students HAVE to go in for exams next week or retake the whole module?

[Saintandy666]

Barton Peveril are saying that students HAVE to go in for exams next week or retake the whole module?

 

Yes, that is the idea, if you can't do it, you do in may/june instead. However, if invigilators can't get in or only a small handfull of people can't get in then it is likely it will be called off, as then it just becomes a postcode lottery as to whether you can sit your exam or not. That's the problem with colleges; people come from all over the region, unlike a primary school where most people live within walking distance.

[Thorpe-le-Saint]

You noticed! The point is that modern teaching methods are not as effective as whole class teaching. If you're talking to the class then it's the same for 20 or 40 pupils. Having dedicated classrooms for subjects is another problem. At the end of the lesson the whole class has to move whereas in my day it was just the teachers. We had our own desks where we stored the books so they didn't often leave the classroom and would last for 20 or 30 years. This modern free-for-all has a lot to answer for.

 

Erm, not really. If a class is already in a classroom, you have lost the upper hand straight away as (these days anyway) you have no 'effect' if you were to just walk in; it is one of the main reasons I think why the majority of cover teachers have such a problem. If you line your pupils up outside and insist on silence before they enter you are in control from the off and are the 'alpha' of the group. It's sets the tone for the rest of the lesson, if they play up while queueing you just bring the whole lot, or individuals, back at lunch time/after school. Or if they talk on the way in, just send them back out and line them up once again, sooner rather than later they will get the hint that you are not going to be messed around. Where I work, if I was to walk in and a try to gain control of say 30 year 9 pupils who were already sat down, it would perhaps take me a good 15 mins until they were all in the right frame of mind, where doing what I asked of them and therefore ready to learn. I'm not one of your 'Daily Express' types as you let well know by now, but there is significant weight to the argument I think that teachers have lost a certain degree of 'threat'.

 

But anyway, that's not what the thread is about

[trousers]

Had an accident at work that wasn't you fault? Suffered a tumble or fall? Then call....................................

 

There's a simple answer to that one....get those parents who want to "risk" sending their kids to school in "bad" weather to sign a liability waiver form at the beginning of the school year so that the parents assume responsibilty.

 

[View From The Top]

There's a simple answer to that one....get those parents who want to "risk" sending their kids to school in "bad" weather to sign a liability waiver form at the beginning of the school year so that the parents assume responsibilty.

 

 

Define "bad weather"?

 

When does inclement weather become bad weather?

[trousers]

Define "bad weather"?

 

When does inclement weather become bad weather?

 

Fair point - I probably made the waiver more complicated than it needed to be....just make the parents sign a form that makes any accident their responsibility and not the school's.

 

Ah - I'll stop myself there - I can see where this is going now..."Define an 'accident' "

 

As I said yesterday, time to throw in the towel on this country's libel laws as there's always a loophole waiting to be exploited by some half wit parent.

[Lord Duckhunter]

I dont think anyone is saying that schools should remain open under any circumstances. However, there are areas of the Country where they can, Poole being one of them.So why the school shut at 1pm is beyond me.We're turning our children in to a bunch of softies.

 

If it is because of worries over Childrens safety, then get the teachers in and have a teacher training day, then cancel one from later in the year (they have enough to choose from). If the teachers can't get in, then dont pay them. My staff have been told they can stay off, but it's unpaid. Surprise surprise, they all made it in, bar one bloke who lives in Sailsbury.Yet the school closed early so the teachers could get home.

 

It's the Nanny state gone mad. The school have a text service to let you know if it's open or not. The one today said it was open and then went onto add "come to school carefully as the roads and pazements are icy". Lucky I got that, otherwise I wouldn't have known and would have driven dangerously.

[Whitey Grandad]

There's a simple answer to that one....get those parents who want to "risk" sending their kids to school in "bad" weather to sign a liability waiver form at the beginning of the school year so that the parents assume responsibilty.

Good idea! Make them all sign a disclaimer at the beginning or their kids don't get taught.

[View From The Top]

I would suggest you lot look up the new OFSTED criteria on Safeguarding and you'll soon see why the schools are shut.

 

Schools that would normally be open, especially infants and juniors, are shut, in part, due to it.

[Whitey Grandad]

I would suggest you lot look up the new OFSTED criteria on Safeguarding and you'll soon see why the schools are shut.

 

Schools that would normally be open, especially infants and juniors, are shut, in part, due to it.

As some of us have said, the country is going downhill fast.

[View From The Top]

As some of us have said, the country is going downhill fast.

 

Don't let the door hit your arse on the way out then.

[Whitey Grandad]

I would suggest you lot look up the new OFSTED criteria on Safeguarding and you'll soon see why the schools are shut.

 

Schools that would normally be open, especially infants and juniors, are shut, in part, due to it.

Yep, just read it. It's all about Child abuse, not Health and Safety. There's absolutely nothing in there about snow in the playgrounds.

[Whitey Grandad]

Don't let the door hit your arse on the way out then.

The trouble is that we older members of society know what this country used to be like. Very little has changed for the better in the last 50 years.

[View From The Top]

Yep, just read it. It's all about Child abuse, not Health and Safety. There's absolutely nothing in there about snow in the playgrounds.

 

Ummm. No, it's not.

 

Still, what would a Head of Faculty know about the new OFSTED criteria in his institutions OFSTED year.

[Whitey Grandad]

Ummm. No, it's not.

 

Still, what would a Head of Faculty know about the new OFSTED criteria in his institutions OFSTED year.

Anything about snow?

[Kadeem Hardison]

The trouble is that we older members of society know what this country used to be like. Very little has changed for the better in the last 50 years.

 

I don't know about that. It seems that people are able to read reports and pick out the salient points a bit better these days.

[Whitey Grandad]

I don't know about that. It seems that people are able to read reports and pick out the salient points a bit better these days.

Anything about snow?

[Barry the Badger]

I work at a school although I am not a teacher. When we had the snow in February the school remained open while others in the area closed.

 

The school received a lot of criticism for opening as by doing so they apparently put 'pressure' on parents to get their kids to school in 'unsafe' conditions.

 

So this time they closed, and are criticised for it.

 

You can't win.

[Whitey Grandad]

I work at a school although I am not a teacher. When we had the snow in February the school remained open while others in the area closed.

 

The school received a lot of criticism for opening as by doing so they apparently put 'pressure' on parents to get their kids to school in 'unsafe' conditions.

 

So this time they closed, and are criticised for it.

 

You can't win.

Indeed. Parents have a lot to answer for...

[Barney Trubble]

Indeed. Parents have a lot to answer for...

 

I am in total agreement Whitley:D

 

I guess the attitude of parents depends on their own level of intelligence and ambition. The more they have then the easier and more reasonable I find them.

 

I was at a school last in North Birmingham and the attitudes of parents was shocking. It was as if they saw schools as a free baby sitting service rather than a place to educate their offspring:p The odd thing for me is that the families who have at least one parent working seemed more adaptable then those who had little else to do.

 

One mother stated " I've had him all forking night, I need a break and then the schools shut and I have to have him all day too - he's a nightmare to look after":smt083. Oh really, well that's hardly the schools fault that you didn't install strong discipline and respect in him:rolleyes: Its not as if he has any special needs.

 

I don't know, it seems the poorer they are then the more they feel it's the responsibility of the state to feed, water, educate and generally tend to the needs of their children. There is just no ambition to better themselves and this unfortunately manifests itself in their children and the cycle of state dependency continues to the next generation and so on.

 

I hope the schools are open on Monday but I am hearing that some have already started to make the decision to close schools already....oh well!:rolleyes:

[Whitey Grandad]

I am in total agreement Whitley:D

 

I guess the attitude of parents depends on their own level of intelligence and ambition. The more they have then the easier and more reasonable I find them.

 

I was at a school last in North Birmingham and the attitudes of parents was shocking. It was as if they saw schools as a free baby sitting service rather than a place to educate their offspring:p The odd thing for me is that the families who have at least one parent working seemed more adaptable then those who had little else to do.

 

One mother stated " I've had him all forking night, I need a break and then the schools shut and I have to have him all day too - he's a nightmare to look after":smt083. Oh really, well that's hardly the schools fault that you didn't install strong discipline and respect in him:rolleyes: Its not as if he has any special needs.

 

I don't know, it seems the poorer they are then the more they feel it's the responsibility of the state to feed, water, educate and generally tend to the needs of their children. There is just no ambition to better themselves and this unfortunately manifests itself in their children and the cycle of state dependency continues to the next generation and so on.

 

I hope the schools are open on Monday but I am hearing that some have already started to make the decision to close schools already....oh well!:rolleyes:

That's getting to sound like East Germany. After the re-unification they had terrrible troubles adjusting to the new western ways. Previously everything had been arranged for them, work, housing, food, clothing, even leisure.

[dubai_phil]

With kids as thick as this one in Skatesmouth, is there ANY point in wasting all that money and having schools in the first place?

 

Perhaps he would have been safer at school

 

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1241684/Prancing-ice-The-pictures-stupidity-boy-stomping-way-frozen-lake.html

[Johnny Bognor]

Just been down to my girls school and saw the head and deputy head, shovels in hand, trying to clear the pavements along with some volunteers and school govenors.

 

Fair play I say and the school will now definately open tomorrow.

[bridge too far]

Just been down to my girls school and saw the head and deputy head, shovels in hand, trying to clear the pavements along with some volunteers and school govenors.

 

Fair play I say and the school will now definately open tomorrow.

 

My son-in-law has spent the day at the school at which he teaches, shovelling snow and salting the paths too.

[Ewell]

I have been told that many years ago in such adverse weather conditions those teachers would just head to a local school and see how they could do to help. In the majority of cases there were enough teachers able to get in to work to look after the kids and keep them occupied even if it meant they all mucked in and spent all day in their main hall.

 

It is funny how we have lost this common sense approach! A mate works for a bank and could not make it in to work. He was told to report to the branch 5 minutes walk away. It is funny how the banks get slated for many things but our schools and other businesses could learn a lot from adopting this 'almost lost' common sense approach!

[Hamilton Saint]

As some of us have said, the country is going downhill fast.

 

On skis?

[sotonjoe]

I have been told that many years ago in such adverse weather conditions those teachers would just head to a local school and see how they could do to help. In the majority of cases there were enough teachers able to get in to work to look after the kids and keep them occupied even if it meant they all mucked in and spent all day in their main hall.

 

It is funny how we have lost this common sense approach! A mate works for a bank and could not make it in to work. He was told to report to the branch 5 minutes walk away. It is funny how the banks get slated for many things but our schools and other businesses could learn a lot from adopting this 'almost lost' common sense approach!

 

 

CRB checks would prevent this from happening. Teachers don't necessarily carry, or even hold, paper copies of their CRB check (it is usually held by employers) and without this sort of documentation they wouldn't be allowed to turn up to a 'local school' and start working with children.

[Thedelldays]

its all PC gone mad

[Ponty]

I have been told that many years ago in such adverse weather conditions those teachers would just head to a local school and see how they could do to help. In the majority of cases there were enough teachers able to get in to work to look after the kids and keep them occupied even if it meant they all mucked in and spent all day in their main hall.

 

It is funny how we have lost this common sense approach! A mate works for a bank and could not make it in to work. He was told to report to the branch 5 minutes walk away. It is funny how the banks get slated for many things but our schools and other businesses could learn a lot from adopting this 'almost lost' common sense approach!

 

Exactly what my sister did. She lives in Farnborough and works in Woking but she walked to the Farnborough branch during the snow days. She couldn't do her 'job' from there but she did man the cashiers positions in the absence of their own staff. Wise decision that one from the bank... for a change.

[Ewell]

CRB checks would prevent this from happening. Teachers don't necessarily carry, or even hold, paper copies of their CRB check (it is usually held by employers) and without this sort of documentation they wouldn't be allowed to turn up to a 'local school' and start working with children.

 

They are teachers FFS. If they are a qualified teacher then they must have been CRB checked! Surely they have ID or paperwork to say so and if not why not? As Dellays says PC gone bloody mad!

[Under Weststand]

I think its got a lot to do with the liability culture that is about today. My Mrs is a school caretaker & they were open on Monday & on Tuesday the teachers all struggled in & they managed to get one entrance cleared & gritted for the Kids, the headteacher stood with my Mrs & said well we've done it were open, only for one of the parents to come up & harangue her for opening(they were 1 of the only school's open in Stockport that day)asking if they has enough food to feed them if they couldn't pick them up? Also if you slip on untreated Snow/ice you can't sue, but if someone had slipped on the path that they had opened & gritted/salted then the school would have been liable(crazy isn't it) So they shut Wed & Thurs, but opened once again on Friday with governors Teachers clearing the pathways Etc.

I think people today look for an excuse not to do, rather than trying to do! take the easy option.

[Thedelldays]

This PC nonsense has just gone too far in my opinion. Next thing you know, Europe will say it's illegal to masturbate on public tansport, sh1t by your rear nearside tyre, hit priests full in the face and interfere with those mahoosive poodles with the wacky hair cuts. I didn't fight in two world wars for this sort of thing. I didn't fight in two world wars but that's not the point. Both of my Grandfathers did and they fought for MY RIGHT to do all that i have listed. One of my best friends is a black, disabled, single parent lesbian and she agrees with me. The way things are going, we should have let the Hun win that fukking world war. If they did, i wouldn't have to keep signing on at my local Police station as i would have been shot.

[Under Weststand]

They are teachers FFS. If they are a qualified teacher then they must have been CRB checked! Surely they have ID or paperwork to say so and if not why not? As Dellays says PC gone bloody mad!

As I've said above my Mrs is a caretaker, just checked with her & she holds her CRB paperwork, the school's get a copy of it. So there should not be a problem for teachers to go to another school with their paperwork. HTH

[sotonjoe]

As I've said above my Mrs is a caretaker, just checked with her & she holds her CRB paperwork, the school's get a copy of it. So there should not be a problem for teachers to go to another school with their paperwork. HTH

 

 

As I said, the current system does not require teachers to physically hold a hard copy of CRB documents. As a rule they are held on file by employers as there's no need for a teacher to hold a hard copy. When changing jobs, the prospective employer will arrange for a new check to be done which is then held on file.

 

Bear in mind as well, Mr A can easily walk into a school where he'e not known and claim to be Mr B who is a qualified and checked teacher. There's no such thing as a teacher photo id and all other forms of id are easily stolen.

 

The current system would be in no way prepared for teachers from one school going to another.

 

Anyway, why on earth should they? At secondary level for instance, how on earth can a teacher walk in to another school and start teaching kids they have no prior experience of. This sort of suggestion assumes that all students at all schools are taught exactly the same material and this simply isn't true.

 

If you're not going to teach them it's pointless bothering at all, remember schools aren't a free babysitting service.

 

And remember that just because the schools were 'closed' it doesn't mean that some teachers weren't either still working in schools or working from home.

[hamster]

I have just read an e-mail from the Head of Adull Services, praising the resolve and resourcefulness of some of the staff, some quite heartening accounts of near heroic acts. And not just by staff, in some cases partners have gone quite literally the extra mile.

 

I wish i could reproduce it as it makes not one mention of Health and Safety, and PC'ness, just a big thank you to those involved. But I am not allowed to, trust me, their are some pretty decent folks out there.

 

I would urge anyone who knows of a vulnerable person who may be stranded to try to contact them and if need be get in tough with Social Services if they need any support. It could be as simple as a loay of bread and a couple of pints of milk, but it could also be that they are running low on their insulin or other medicine.

[Hamilton Saint]

Everyone's been to school - and, therefore, (apparently) everyone's an expert on schools, teachers, teaching, education and the administration of education.

 

Criticism of public servants and public institutions is de rigueur. And everything annoying, or just slightly irritating (or, heaven forbid, misinterpreted), is "PC gone mad".

 

Go ahead, reach out and blame someone.

Edited 10 January, 2010 by Hamilton Saint
to add a pithy closing statement

[hamster]

/\

thank you. HS I've had it so bloody easy due to the adverse weather and do honestly feel a little guilty that my place of work has been shut, and I was not able to be re-deployed. I will make up for it I promise.

[Hamilton Saint]

/\

thank you. HS I've had it so bloody easy due to the adverse weather and do honestly feel a little guilty that my place of work has been shut, and I was not able to be re-deployed. I will make up for it I promise.

 

Enjoy the snow while you can!

 

[hamster]

Enjoy the snow while you can!

 

 

I will, nowever i'm on call tomorrow so hopefully I'll get to see some action. I amy of course finish fitting the new kitchen, but keepo that to yourself please.

[Barney Trubble]

Everyone's been to school - and, therefore, (apparently) everyone's an expert on schools, teachers, teaching, education and the administration of education.

 

Criticism of public servants and public institutions is de rigueur. And everything annoying, or just slightly irritating (or, heaven forbid, misinterpreted), is "PC gone mad".

 

Go ahead, reach out and blame someone.

 

I agree Hamilton. I have to say that the running of some schools is abysmal, others are brilliant. It's the same as working for a good boss or a bad boss, if you're lucky, you'll get a good one.

 

Had to laugh at the suggestion of teachers/TA's or any other school associated person just turning up at the school just round the corner waving a copy of their enhanced CRB and then just teaching or working with kids.

 

Probably one of the most ill-informed suggestion I have ever read on here. I won't go into the details why, it's just too plainy obvious but maybe you should read up on the safeguarding of children, in the Childrens act 2004 [Every child matters].

 

I won't sleep tonight thinking about that as my mind conjures up all the pitfalls of that nonsense idea.

 

Just as an aside - If I leave one school and go to work at another I have to complete another CRB, even if it's only a few weeks old. A CRB is only as vaild as the day it was printed - it means jack **** in the greater scheme of thing's.

[Hamilton Saint]

I will, nowever i'm on call tomorrow so hopefully I'll get to see some action. I amy of course finish fitting the new kitchen, but keepo that to yourself please.

 

Amazing coincidence, my kitchen is being renovated too - although I have a builder doing it for me! A couple more weeks before everything is complete.

[View From The Top]

They are teachers FFS. If they are a qualified teacher then they must have been CRB checked! Surely they have ID or paperwork to say so and if not why not? As Dellays says PC gone bloody mad!

 

CRB is relevant to the institution you work.

 

They are not portable, which is ******s, but that's CRB for you.

 

You also, now, have the safeguarding authority paperwork issues.

Edited 10 January, 2010 by View From The Top

[View From The Top]

Probably one of the most ill-informed suggestion I have ever read on here. I won't go into the details why, it's just too plainy obvious but maybe you should read up on the safeguarding of children, in the Childrens act 2004 [Every child matters]..

 

WG has read it, and the new OFSTED safeguarding criteria.

 

He's an expert.

[Thorpe-le-Saint]

They are teachers FFS. If they are a qualified teacher then they must have been CRB checked! Surely they have ID or paperwork to say so and if not why not? As Dellays says PC gone bloody mad!

 

I have a copy of my CRB, but as far as I'm aware, it is only eligible for the school I work at...(someone might be able to clarify this for me). All I know is that if I moved back to a school in Hampshire, Hampshire LEA would need to do another CRB check.

 

My QTS certificate certificate on the hand is held by my employer so I couldn't use that, and apart from that, there isn't a lot else you can use I'm afraid.

Edited 10 January, 2010 by Thorpe-le-Saint

[Thedelldays]

what is a CRB and why do you have to have one..?

[Give it to Ron]

Criminal Records Bureau check for any history of criminal records. You have to have one if you are going to be a governor, teacher or even if you are going to help coach kids at sport. Costs a £10.....means bugger all really.

 

You need one for every thing you do - I have had to have 2 one for the football team I coach and one for the school where I also help coach.

[Thedelldays]

why do you have to have more than one at any time..?