Rupert and co saying the right things

[OldNick]

There, I've highlighted it for you.

 

People should just respect others right to voice their opinions about going/not going without all the melodramatic bull.

to be fair the money is important.The support is also vital but if those fans heads are so full of dislike for the chairman they are hardly going to help the grouds atmosphere in support of the team.

[Guest Hacienda]

I am still missing the use of the word only. If I say someone likes a drink it does not mean they spend all day drinking because that is the only thing they do. I am sure those that have stayed away provided valuable support to the team when they did attend but if it does not mean you have to mention that every time you discuss the situation. Your extrapolation of what was written to 'All the club wants is you money' is just that, baseless extrapolation so you could have something to be indignant about.

 

My post clearly show how indignant I am.

 

In fact, I'm so indignant I might have to right to the Daily Mail.

[Guest Hacienda]

FWIW for every Hacienda (who is entitled to do what he wants) there are others like my son. He's not been to SMS for about 3 years, he went to the Rovers cup game and said never again.

He hasn't been to any pre-season games, but he's been watching and reading and has been chasing me almost daily to get him a ticket for the Brum game along with two of his mates who he's dragging along.

His motivation - it sounds like they are going to have players out there on the pitch who may actually be trying to play footbal and win a game, I don't care if they're rubbish, only that they make me want to watch them.

So the corners won't fill up until everyone comes back but for every one who is negative for politics there is one who may actually be ready to go for the fact they may be entertained or see some passion that they can actually get behind.

Who knows who's right?

 

Passion, skill, commitment. Isn't that all we've always asked for?

[Guest Hacienda]

to be fair the money is important.The support is also vital but if those fans heads are so full of dislike for the chairman they are hardly going to help the grouds atmosphere in support of the team.

 

Oh please Nick, that is just daft.

 

So my support of my team on Saturday isn't worth owt?

[saintcrris]

FWIW for every Hacienda (who is entitled to do what he wants) there are others like my son. He's not been to SMS for about 3 years, he went to the Rovers cup game and said never again.

He hasn't been to any pre-season games, but he's been watching and reading and has been chasing me almost daily to get him a ticket for the Brum game along with two of his mates who he's dragging along.

His motivation - it sounds like they are going to have players out there on the pitch who may actually be trying to play footbal and win a game, I don't care if they're rubbish, only that they make me want to watch them.

So the corners won't fill up until everyone comes back but for every one who is negative for politics there is one who may actually be ready to go for the fact they may be entertained or see some passion that they can actually get behind.

Who knows who's right?

 

For every one that stayes away, maybe more will replace them we do not know.

But your son deserted them once, so is it really any different?

[OldNick]

Frankly i couldn't care tuppence what a Lowe Luvvie thinks of my stance.

Realist, Lowe Realist thankyou. I support SFC, i spend my money at SFC so I can help in my little way to help it survive financially.I can also feel justified to complain if the money is not spent in the right areas etc etc. You may go and spend money to help other clubs survive and compete stronger against the team you follow.

Your position may be just in your mind but in the real world you are making the opposition stronger and our club weaker.That is why I have contempt or lack of respect for your stand.

SFC needs all the help it can get, and people like yourself should try and think beyond the predudice.

Answer me this, didyou go when we were in the PL, moved to the new stadium, enjoyed the good times? I agree the relegation season was a disaster and there were many factors, but that is life.This debate should be defunct anyway if the new men do as supposed to be happening.

When RL is gone are you going to buy a s/t then?

[OldNick]

Oh please Nick, that is just daft.

 

So my support of my team on Saturday isn't worth owt?

I dont know, if your dislike of RL is so deep you might sing Swing Lowe instead of OWTS , that wouldn't help.Cardiff will be pleased with you though, they are in a financial mess and will be glad of your £30+

[OldNick]

Plenty did it at Leeds as a protest at ticket prices and their away support is 'kin awesome compared to their home.

 

 

.

So are you saying all those Leeds fans dont go to the home games!!!!!! They had superb home gates last season, thier principles disappeared with winning games,

[dubai_phil]

For every one that stayes away, maybe more will replace them we do not know.

But your son deserted them once, so is it really any different?

 

Did you watch the Rovers game?

He (was) a student and so the train fare and the ticket fare were the key denominator. As he said a fiver for the movies where you know you will be entertained or 40 quid inc train fare to watch say the Charlton game (which I saw)

Point is he goes now in the hope of entertainment, not because he is a die hard better than us fan:-)

[Guest Hacienda]

I dont know, if your dislike of RL is so deep you might sing Swing Lowe instead of OWTS , that wouldn't help.Cardiff will be pleased with you though, they are in a financial mess and will be glad of your £30+

 

And it shows.

[OldNick]

And it shows.

meeeoowww, pass him some milk

[Guest Hacienda]

So are you saying all those Leeds fans dont go to the home games!!!!!! They had superb home gates last season, thier principles disappeared with winning games,

 

Nothing to do with a change in prices then?

 

I would suggest you do your research.

Watch this turn out to be wrong now.

[dubai_phil]

Passion, skill, commitment. Isn't that all we've always asked for?

 

And what has been in very short supply of late.

 

How passionate were say Davenport & Bernard????...... etc etc etc etc etc etc

 

:-)

 

TBH I stopped going back in the Branfoot days when it was akin to trying to watch a bloke playing pin-ball machine. Wasn't a protest, just decided that going shopping with the wife was marginally less painful

[OldNick]

Nothing to do with a change in prices then?

 

I would suggest you do your research.

I dont bother with other clubs. Bates brought ticket prices down then did he?,more importantly winning so many games would have made a difference.

Are you categorically saying you will be gettoing a S/T when RL leaves?

[Guest Hacienda]

Are you categorically saying you will be gettoing a S/T when RL leaves?

 

I will do every Saturday home game.

 

I can't do Sunday or midweek games, home or away.

[OldNick]

I will do every Saturday home game.

 

I can't do Sunday or midweek games, home or away.

Ill be glad when you join us again, your stand will not help the club when we really not need it ,but lets hope it is soon.

[Cabrone]

Ditto that comment.

 

I'm going to Cardiff on Saturday and plan to do quite a few away games, but i won't be spending a penny at home games on principle.

 

Yes me too, looking forward to quite a few aways.

 

The day Lowe goes is the day that the doors of SMS open up again to lots of fans.

 

As has been said on here before, support the team - not the board.

[pedg]

Yes me too, looking forward to quite a few aways.

 

The day Lowe goes is the day that the doors of SMS open up again to lots of fans.

 

As has been said on here before, support the team - not the board.

 

So ignore the board and go to home matches and support the team then? Or do you think that all the money you pay goes straight into Lowe's wallet and the players wages appear out of thin air??

Edited 6 August, 2008 by pedg

[Saint Bones]

Yes me too, looking forward to quite a few aways.

 

The day Lowe goes is the day that the doors of SMS open up again to lots of fans.

 

As has been said on here before, support the team - not the board.

 

Isn't that rather contradictory ?

 

You are staying away because of the board ?

[Ponty]

Yes me too, looking forward to quite a few aways.

 

The day Lowe goes is the day that the doors of SMS open up again to lots of fans.

 

As has been said on here before, support the team - not the board.

 

Well that makes naff all sense mate. How can you support the team, either vocally or financially, if you're not there? You do realise that Rupert will get the same wage regardless of how many people turn up, right?

[stevegrant]

The day Lowe goes is the day that the doors of SMS open up again to lots of fans.

 

As has been said on here before, support the team - not the board.

I think the award for the most contradictory post of the year has already been sealed.

 

Oh, and here's a statistic to throw a spanner in the works...

 

Average attendance figures:

2005-6 (Lowe here) - 23,614

2006-7 (Lowe gone) - 23,556

2007-8 (Lowe gone) - 21,254

[Wes Tender]

The thread only stayed on topic for a few posts, but then what did we expect? It was invevitable that it would turn into a pro/anti debate rather than discussing whether he said the "right things". Personally, I don't know what is being referred to by the right things. We have known for some time that we are broke and it therefore became inevitable that we would have to dispense with the services of those costing more in wages than we could afford.

 

Although the double Dutch cost less than Pearson together apparently, I have not heard any convincing argument supporting the case that we could not afford Pearson's continuance, nor indeed that he would not have been prepared to play the youngsters. He didn't seem to me to be the sort to walk away from a challenge.

 

So what were the things that Lowe said that thedelldays agreed with? Was it the same sort of platitudes uttered by Wilde, so full of the statement of the bloody obvious, so much waffle and little substance?

[Andy Durman]

What is a decent player? Euell, Skacel, Rasiak or Schneiderlin, Gillett, Thompson, James

 

Who would you want in the starting eleven for Sat?

 

The thing is those players we thought were good and paid them accordingly are now second choice players in the new football system.

 

Maybe these boys have come of age, but Burley had good young players in Cranie, Best and others and instead chose to put our club in the financial state we are now

[Ian the Red]

Get behind the team, no matter what you may think of Lowe and Wilde it is the team that matters. Pesonally I have not been as excited about teh start of teh season for years. Indeed I have not posted on here for 18 months; simply reading what was said and watching Saints. at last we have had a clear out and got rid of teh dead wood and those players who simply did not care for eth club. With the blend of a few experienced players and youth I am sure we will see passion for the club form the players who care. get behind the team no matter who is in charge. Come on you reds!!!!

Edited 8 August, 2008 by Ian the Red

[pedg]

Was it the same sort of platitudes uttered by Wilde, so full of the statement of the bloody obvious, so much waffle and little substance?

 

I think you read them as waffle because that is what you want to believe they contain. Compared to the statements by Crouch they are relative mine of information.

[um pahars]

I think the award for the most contradictory post of the year has already been sealed.

 

Oh, and here's a statistic to throw a spanner in the works...

 

Average attendance figures:

2005-6 (Lowe here) - 23,614

2006-7 (Lowe gone) - 23,556

2007-8 (Lowe gone) - 21,254

 

Does anyone know what our season ticket take up was for those three seasons??????

 

I would suggest the three seasons attendances were to do with:

 

2005-06 Pemiership hangover, with quite a few season tickets already bought when in Prem

 

2006-7 A bit of optimism at the start, and a relatively successful season on the pitch.

 

2007-8 Decent level of season tickets (our best since relegation???) , but shi7e on the pitch.

 

What this shows is that IMHO it is success or failure on the pitch that has the biggest effect on attendances. Some will stay away on principle, some will come afresh, but getting up the table is the best way of filling SMS.

[stevegrant]

What this shows is that IMHO it is success or failure on the pitch that has the biggest effect on attendances.

Exactly.

 

Regardless of what the less rational among us might think, the lineup of the board makes absolutely bugger all difference to the attendance. A very small number (perhaps a couple of hundred) might decide not to go if they didn't like who was in charge, and a similar sort of number might decide that they are going to return because they now DO like who's in charge. It pretty much cancels itself out, in my opinion.

 

The real factors that determine the average attendance over the course of the season are almost entirely dependent on the performances on the pitch and the appearance of the league table. Of course, you get one-off games like the Sheffield United game where there's a lot riding on the outcome, but generally if the team is struggling, attendances are poorer than if the team is playing well and getting results.

 

Since when has principles ever had anything to do with football anyway? 99% of the fanbase was quite happily singing "Harry and Jim" in 04-05 (and even continued to sing Redknapp's name despite relegation!) despite what they'd done at Pompey. 99% of the fanbase was quite happily singing "Glenn Hoddle's red and white army" back in 1999/2000 despite having been sacked by England for gross misconduct. Football fans are the most hypocritical section of society, since when do principles matter in football?

[CB Fry]

Does anyone know what our season ticket take up was for those three seasons??????

 

I would suggest the three seasons attendances were to do with:

 

2005-06 Pemiership hangover, with quite a few season tickets already bought when in Prem

 

2006-7 A bit of optimism at the start, and a relatively successful season on the pitch.

 

2007-8 Decent level of season tickets (our best since relegation???) , but shi7e on the pitch.

 

What this shows is that IMHO it is success or failure on the pitch that has the biggest effect on attendances. Some will stay away on principle, some will come afresh, but getting up the table is the best way of filling SMS.

 

Quite right, but still worth reinterating for clarification that the notion that

"The day Lowe goes is the day that the doors of SMS open up again to lots of fans" is a load of of old pony.

 

If five or six divs want to stay away because our howwible posh chairman, then fill your boots lads.

 

But they are as unrepresentative as the overseas based wind up merchants on here praising Lowe to skys who, ironically enough, never seem to go to games either and just churn out drivel on here.

 

Both sets of extreme fans, all ten of them, are as unrepresentative and irrelevent as each other.

[Wes Tender]

I think you read them as waffle because that is what you want to believe they contain. Compared to the statements by Crouch they are relative mine of information.

 

Well, I've stated my opinion on them, that they were a collection of cliches, platitudes and waffle. I picked up on them because there was a terrific ironic element in much of what he said, particularly as he stressed the need for unity when he had personally been the architect of the biggest change in our recent history and had returned a short while later to bring about another massive change in the opposite direction.

 

I'd be obliged if you would be prepared to pick out anything else that didn't fall under any of those categories. There wasn't much to disagree with, as he hardly said anything controversial, did he?

 

We have to cut our cloth according to our means, the players should wear the shirt with pride, we need you all to get behind us at this vital time, blah,blah,blah.

[stevegrant]

There wasn't much to disagree with, as he hardly said anything controversial, did he?

 

We have to cut our cloth according to our means, the players should wear the shirt with pride, we need you all to get behind us at this vital time, blah,blah,blah.

To be fair, what could he have said along those lines that you wouldn't label as platitudes, etc?

[Guest Hacienda]

Has Wilde just churned out a bog standard start of season rallying call?

 

Can't see what all the fuss is about myself.

[pedg]

Well, I've stated my opinion on them, that they were a collection of cliches, platitudes and waffle. I picked up on them because there was a terrific ironic element in much of what he said, particularly as he stressed the need for unity when he had personally been the architect of the biggest change in our recent history and had returned a short while later to bring about another massive change in the opposite direction.

 

I'd be obliged if you would be prepared to pick out anything else that didn't fall under any of those categories. There wasn't much to disagree with, as he hardly said anything controversial, did he?

 

We have to cut our cloth according to our means, the players should wear the shirt with pride, we need you all to get behind us at this vital time, blah,blah,blah.

 

Sorry I was going to reply but realised that your post was just a collection of cliches and waffle.

[slickmick]

Quite right, but still worth reinterating for clarification that the notion that

"The day Lowe goes is the day that the doors of SMS open up again to lots of fans" is a load of of old pony.

 

If five or six divs want to stay away because our howwible posh chairman, then fill your boots lads.

 

But they are as unrepresentative as the overseas based wind up merchants on here praising Lowe to skys who, ironically enough, never seem to go to games either and just churn out drivel on here.

 

Both sets of extreme fans, all ten of them, are as unrepresentative and irrelevent as each other.

 

 

The rebels without a cause only have 3 members, so I really don't think their protest is going to get noticed to much.

[Pongo]

The rebels without a cause only have 3 members, so I really don't think their protest is going to get noticed to much.

 

Maybe not, but the considerable majority who are against Lowe (you know the ones who booed him at Claus's testimonial) are not going to suddenly change their minds. Face it me old mucker SAINTS ARE DIVIDED CLUB BECAUSE OF RUPERT LOWE, and that division will not go away until Lowe has packed his bags and gone. I don't know about anyone else but i'll never forgive Lowe and will boo him from the stands at every opportunity.

 

Shame on those who don't.

[pedg]

Maybe not, but the considerable majority who are against Lowe (you know the ones who booed him at Claus's testimonial) are not going to suddenly change their minds. Face it me old mucker SAINTS ARE DIVIDED CLUB BECAUSE OF RUPERT LOWE, and that division will not go away until Lowe has packed his bags and gone. I don't know about anyone else but i'll never forgive Lowe and will boo him from the stands at every opportunity.

 

Shame on those who don't.

 

If the teams starts playing well then 99% of those people will probably come back. So it may end up a club divided but with a ratio of 99 to 1 not down the middle as you appear to believe.

[slickmick]

Maybe not, but the considerable majority who are against Lowe (you know the ones who booed him at Claus's testimonial) are not going to suddenly change their minds. Face it me old mucker SAINTS ARE DIVIDED CLUB BECAUSE OF RUPERT LOWE, and that division will not go away until Lowe has packed his bags and gone. I don't know about anyone else but i'll never forgive Lowe and will boo him from the stands at every opportunity.

 

Shame on those who don't.

 

 

Sad bitter man.

 

I don't like BWP, Nathan Dyer or Kelvin Davies. Would it be acceptable to boo them at every opportunity ?

[Pongo]

If the teams starts playing well then 99% of those people will probably come back. So it may end up a club divided but with a ratio of 99 to 1 not down the middle as you appear to believe.

 

Whooooah. I don't believe the club is divided down the middle. In the real world (you know away from the internet) i've yet to meet a single saints fan who wants Lowe at the club.

[Franny's Tash]

Ditto that comment.

 

I'm going to Cardiff on Saturday and plan to do quite a few away games, but i won't be spending a penny at home games on principle.

And exactly what 'principle' would that be then?

[stevegrant]

Whooooah. I don't believe the club is divided down the middle. In the real world (you know away from the internet) i've yet to meet a single saints fan who wants Lowe at the club.

It depends on how the question is posed as to the answer you get. For example, if you were given the option of Lowe or, say, Keith Wiseman, at this moment in time, many (I suspect) would say Lowe. However, if you were given the option of Lowe or someone who was prepared to **** their own money down the drain to ensure the club was successful, Lowe wouldn't ever be the option chosen.

 

I would suspect (and I have absolutely no evidence to back this up, it's merely a guess/assumption) a majority of Saints fans wouldn't have Lowe as chairman by choice, but - in the interests of sorting the mess we've found ourselves in - are willing to see how this season pans out. There's also the fact that there is sod all we can really do about it given the share distribution.

[pedg]

Whooooah. I don't believe the club is divided down the middle. In the real world (you know away from the internet) i've yet to meet a single saints fan who wants Lowe at the club.

 

I think we are back to the old chestnut of want vs accept.

 

I want to win the lottery. But I accept that I am probably not going to and live my life accordingly.

 

Most people do not want Lowe at the club but they have come to accept that he is there at the moment.

[trousers]

Whooooah. i've yet to meet a single saints fan who wants Lowe at the club.

 

What question do you ask them to solicit their view on Lowe being at the helm?

 

If you pose the question: "In principle, do want Lowe at the helm?" then I tend to agree in that the vast majority of people would probably reply "No".

 

But ask them the question: "Given our current financial straits, do you think that Lowe is doing a good job at steadying the ship and therefore are you OK with him being on board in the short term?" then the vast majority would probably answer "Yes".

 

It's easy to load a question in order to get the answer one wants to hear.

[trousers]

It depends on how the question is posed as to the answer you get.

 

Great minds thinking alike I see....!

[Guest Hacienda]

Most people do not want Lowe at the club but they have come to accept that he is there at the moment.

 

That is a very fair assessment.

[pedg]

A more obvious analogy is if you ask people if they want to do to the dentists most will say no. Ask the same people if they accept going to the dentist will help with their painful decay and most will say yes.

[Mole]

There's also the fact that there is sod all we can really do about it given the share distribution.

 

I think you put too much weight on the power of Lowe and his share block. In the past when the club was profitable Lowe and his cronies would have been all powerful depending on which head Worzel Gummidge Wilde was wearing at the time. The club is now a loss making entity and that is unsustainable. Think of those who boycott as clingons sapping Lowes power. The less money that is coming into the starship St Marys the less chance Lowe has of placating Barclays for another year. This situation in effect turns Lowe and his share block into lame ducks on a duck hunt and increases the possibilty that Lowe and Wilde will have to play ball with the Merrington consortium on the terms of the Merrington consortium.

 

The cheaper the Merrington consortium can get the shares, the more money there is to invest in SFC. For this simple reason the fans who are boycotting are doing a great service to the future of the club.

[pedg]

I think you put too much weight on the power of Lowe and his share block. In the past when the club was profitable Lowe and his cronies would have been all powerful depending on which head Worzel Gummidge Wilde was wearing at the time. The club is now a loss making entity and that is unsustainable. Think of those who boycott as clingons sapping Lowes power. The less money that is coming into the starship St Marys the less chance Lowe has of placating Barclays for another year. This situation in effect turns Lowe and his share block into lame ducks on a duck hunt and increases the possibilty that Lowe and Wilde will have to play ball with the Merrington consortium on the terms of the Merrington consortium.

 

The cheaper the Merrington consortium can get the shares, the more money there is to invest in SFC. For this simple reason the fans who are boycotting are doing a great service to the future of the club.

 

What a load of bullocks.

 

The current expenditure is being reduced and Lowe and Wilde have obviously convinced Barcleys that we can get to the point where we can live within out means. On top of this you have to remember that the formal exit from the bid situation was after Wilde/Lowe had talked to Barclays etc and so its likely they were less that impressed in what was on offer from the consortium and how long it was taking them to get the money together (cheque is in the post honest!). I would suggest to you that the real scenario is that the few people boycotting will not hasten in anyway the depature of lowe and are only hurting the club with their pig headed inability to change their mindsets.

[stevegrant]

The cheaper the Merrington consortium can get the shares, the more money there is to invest in SFC.

Which merely suggests to me that that particular consortium doesn't actually have that much money at its disposal.

 

Oh, and not really worth thinking about the future if people are just going to disregard and jeopardise the present, is it?

[dubai_phil]

I think you put too much weight on the power of Lowe and his share block. In the past when the club was profitable Lowe and his cronies would have been all powerful depending on which head Worzel Gummidge Wilde was wearing at the time. The club is now a loss making entity and that is unsustainable. Think of those who boycott as clingons sapping Lowes power. The less money that is coming into the starship St Marys the less chance Lowe has of placating Barclays for another year. This situation in effect turns Lowe and his share block into lame ducks on a duck hunt and increases the possibilty that Lowe and Wilde will have to play ball with the Merrington consortium on the terms of the Merrington consortium.

 

The cheaper the Merrington consortium can get the shares, the more money there is to invest in SFC. For this simple reason the fans who are boycotting are doing a great service to the future of the club.

 

Good point the only problem with it is "hope". As long as there is a hope that the finances can be turned around, then there is a hope that the price the shareholders can achieve could go higher. In reality the only way I see any of the main block selling their shares "at a signifcant loss" is when there truly is no hope other than administration.

In that scenario, it becomes very dangerous, as even when somebody gets funds in place, things can and do still go wrong in takeovers. It would be Brinkmanship of the highest order on all sides, I can't see that being good for the club on the pitch.

 

I do though still think that at the right deal then the shares would be sold. But in this economic environment, there are a lot of better deals out there at the moment.

 

Personall I hope that the JP experiment "half works" and that a new "shareholder/owner" can use the funds to build on the concept of exciting talent WANTING to play. So that we DON'T go paying big bucks for has been pay check collectors but instead pay big bucks for "new Fabregas" types - ie build on what we have, not tear it dow and go back to the last few years

[scooby]

other clubs must laugh when they see our fans staying away for such reasons considering the state of things financially

 

It's nothing more than petty class warfare from the simple-minded fringe. They never gave Lord Lowe his due, even on the eve of our FA Cup final game. It's sickening, but that's the sort of 'fan' we have to put up with.

[pedg]

It's nothing more than petty class warfare from the simple-minded fringe. They never gave Lord Lowe his due, even on the eve of our FA Cup final game. It's sickening, but that's the sort of 'fan' we have to put up with.

 

Thank goodness you are limited to 3 trolling messages a day.