Should Pardew rest players in JPT game ahead of Leeds?

[L1Minus10]

You can rest some players without seriously weakening the team. For this game for example, I'd go with...

 

-----------------------Bart

Thomas--------Perry----------Trotman-------Harding

---------------------Wotton------------------------

-----------Hammond----------Mellis-----------------

Waigo---------------Lambert--------------------Mills

[Red and White Army]

either way...to suggest it is a long shot when you are 9 points away and clearly better than nearly all in the league (added to additions in jan) is a bit daft..

 

to be fair, right now, I will be deflated if we dont make the playoffs

 

You're so inflated that the hot air from your deflation would significantly add to global warming. No reason we can't try for both.

 

Looking at last season, we would have needed 76 point to finish 6th. This is not an atypical number. We have 25 now, with 25 games left to play. That means we need over 2 points a game for the remainder of the season which is searing form by anyone's standards... and this will only scrape us into 6th.

 

We should go for this, but not bank on it and waste a great chance to win something and have a trip to Wembley.

[AussieDog]

Statistics are useless, but if you want to play that game, we have acquired 31 points in the past 15 games, and if we carry that ratio forward we will acquire another 51.5 (not quite sure how we get half a point, but that's another matter! lol) in the remaining games. Of course if you base it over the last 12 where we have got 29 points, then we will acquire another 58 points in the next 24 games, and we can all have a party for the last game of the season because we will already be in the playoffs with 83 points

[ericofarabia]

It'll be very interesting to see how Norwich approach the fixture, considering they really are in the mix for play offs or even automatic spot.

 

Just how strong is the lure of a Wembley Final for them? Where will their priorities lie?

 

Our situation is complicated, not just by the possibility of resting players in a busy fixture list, but the chance of 4 or 5 players getting suspended. We have 4 more games left before the end of the month, and it is likely that at least 2 of those players will not go that long without another booking so we have to face up to that possibility regardless.

 

If any of those players were booked on Tues they'd miss the Leeds game where we really need to be at our best and strongest to get anything at all. But losing to them would be no disgrace and in my mind the key game will be Colchester, one of the spots we are chasing, forget top spot. In all honesty I'd rather we had our best team for that one rather than the Leeds game if we were given a choice. You can't simply not play a player to protect him from a booking. So strongest line up available on Tues unless anybody is actually carrying a knock, and ideally of course no more bookings till Jan would be nice

Edited 14 December, 2009 by ericofarabia

[shurlock]

To start talking about playoffs in December is nonsense - how feasible they are will become only clear in February. We should take Norwich seriously not just because its a shot at Wembley but as much because they're big fish (and I rate them above Leeds and Charlton).

 

No doubt our victories against Charlton and Brizzle in cup competitions -teams that had either beaten us or are above us in the league- have contributed to maintaining the good run and everyone's favourite "winning mentality". There's no better way to go into Saturday than doing a job on Tuesday.

[opthomps]

To start talking about playoffs in December is nonsense - how feasible they are will become only clear in February. We should take Norwich seriously not just because its a shot at Wembley but as much because they're big fish (and I rate them above Leeds and Charlton).

 

No doubt our victories against Charlton and Brizzle in cup competitions -teams that had either beaten us or are above us in the league- have contributed to maintaining the good run and everyone's favourite "winning mentality". There's no better way to go into Saturday than doing a job on Tuesday.

 

I agree with this. Provided everyone is fit ad WANTS to play then the best team should be put out. Being at home is a great advantage. We should make the most of it, irrelevant of potential suspensions.

[Torrent Of Abuse]

Can we lose to Norwich and get to Wembley?: NO

Can we lose to Leeds and get to the playoffs?: YES

 

I don't believe in resting players as we don't have the depth of squad to rest players and still make a fist of things. If you're this close to Wembley and you're resting people then you're as good as waving a white flag. That's not what our clubs attitude is all about. ALL matches count. ALL matches will be contested home or away. The effort and belief and will to win is what we're about now.

 

If we're worried about the league, then our January purchases should be geared towards that last push to the end of the season.

[david in sweden]

Put Thomas in for Jaidi and Wotton in for Morgan. That'll do, thanks.

 

I'd go along with that and give a few more bench-sitters more than just 5 mins at the end. If the worse comes to the worst and we have more injuries they'll need match practice anyway. (if tactics allow -of course).

[John B]

You can rest some players without seriously weakening the team. For this game for example, I'd go with...

 

-----------------------Bart

Thomas--------Perry----------Trotman-------Harding

---------------------Wotton------------------------

-----------Hammond----------Mellis-----------------

Waigo---------------Lambert--------------------Mills

 

 

Yes I agree but I think Perry maybe rested

[ottery st mary]

I think we will beat Norwich and Leeds...We are that good now.....Pards.It's over to you.

 

COYRs.

[Lets B Avenue]

 

However, if we have an injury such as Murty's against Birmingham (again a cup game) then there will be accusations that players should have been rested for the promotion push.

 

I'd prefer to see us play a strong team, though I'm all to aware of the risks it poses.

 

However, Murty's latest injury was done in training. will the same people say that should be avoided as well.

 

Strongest team, including Waigo for Antonio and then we can have the "16 game thread" tomorrow night.

[chocco boxo]

Full strength team against both...............10080 minutes in a week and they need to perform for only 180 of them?????

[SaintRichmond]

Apologies if there's already a recent thread on this but couldn't see it...

 

I've always said we should concentrate 100% on getting into the play-offs whilst it's still mathematically possible, and that means resting key players in less important games such as the JPT semi-final.

 

If it's a good enough tactic for the likes of Ferguson and Wenger then it's good enough for me.

 

No doubt everyone shares my thoughts on this and the thread will wither into the night with little or no debate on the subject. It's that clear cut....

 

I agree .. The League is FAR FAR more important than the JPT

 

Now that we are edging closer to sixth spot ( 9 points to go ), it would be crazy to jeapoardise our chances now:)

Edited 14 December, 2009 by SaintRichmond

[mikec]

Correct, except the stadium announced (Glavin?) kept saying that we need decent support on Tuesday to cheer the boys onto a decent first-leg advantage. :confused:

 

He got that wrong then. As you say it's only 1 leg against Norwich. If we win that we are not at Wembley yet. We would then play the winners of Hereford/MK Dons for the Southern final and that IS over 2 legs. If we win that (as we should), we then play the winners of the Northern final at Wembley.

[saint_stevo]

is the norwich game on TV?

[Lets B Avenue]

is the norwich game on TV?

 

No. Buy a ticket, Tightwad.

[saint_stevo]

Just checking first.....

 

£18 tomorrow or drive to the ground today and pay £12....hmmm

[wild-saint]

Who's to say a player left out wont get injured in a freak accident left at home. Didnt beasant drop a jar of salad cream on his foot.

 

Who's to say the player coming into the team to replace an injury wont turn out to be a game winner. When KD got injured I was cursing our luck but Bart has done a sterling job.

 

Although if Lambert gets injured on Tuesday I think our season is over. Decisions Decisions eh, I guess thats why pardew get paid a big fat wad of money.

[Ozkeith2]

We need to give some of the squad members a run. They will have important (bit) parts to play over the next 25-30 games what with injuries, suspensions, etc.

Remember too, Pards was (i think) pleasantly surprised over Perry's performance in the last JPT game & has kept him in the team since.

So I think he'll play Thomas, Trots & Melis (if they're not going in Jan), Wotton & maybe Mills or Holmes.

Pard's will expect whatever team he puts out to play to our current standard and achieve a result.

[Andyb1]

Why not go for both?

 

If we loose at Leeds saturday it doesnt mean we wont get promoted!

[JRM]

Just checking first.....

 

£18 tomorrow or drive to the ground today and pay £12....hmmm

 

 

 

you can call up today and get a ticket for £12 and just collect it from the ticket office before the game tomorrow. Normally on match day queues to buy can be long, but collections not so bad.

[a1ex2001]

Only players I'd consider resting are connolly and lallana, conolloy could use all the time he can get after such a long lay off and Lallana is only young still and can't be expected to perform every game for a season.

[aintforever]

It's a great chance of a trip to Wembley so I would play a full strength side.

 

We should use the FA Cup to rest important players.

[Sour Mash]

I don't suppose anyone has any inside knowledge on whether Norwich are planning on resting players? Or if Leeds are planning on resting anyone for their game at Carlisle?

[Charlie2008]

It's a great chance of a trip to Wembley so I would play a full strength side.

 

"Agree"

 

We should use the FA Cup to rest important players

 

"Disagree".

 

 

 

Saints should never play an under-strength side IMO.

 

Only 'rest' players at risk of suspension if tactically necessary.

 

COYR:cool:

[Tamesaint]

Saints should never play an under-strength side IMO.

 

Only 'rest' players at risk of suspension if tactically necessary.

 

COYR:cool:

 

I agree.

[Window Cleaner]

Anyway, our squad in nowhere near homogeneous enough to even consider

squad rotation.It works for Man U and Chelsea, it doesn't work for anybody else, you need 20 players of roughly equal ability to even think about it,even for minor cup games.

[aintforever]

Saints should never play an under-strength side IMO.

 

Only 'rest' players at risk of suspension if tactically necessary.

 

COYR:cool:

 

I wouldn't put our a weakened team for the sake of it but if I was manager, and thought some players would benefit from a rest, I would choose the FA Cup game because it's the least important.

 

All managers prioritise games at some point, you never see Arsene Wenger say "we must win every game" then end up with half his team injured or suspended for a vital League match because they had to turn out for a Coca-Cola cup fixture a few days before hand.

[CB Saint]

I agree that the League is more important than the JPT, However I also beleive we have a far more realistic chance of winning the cup than we do getting to the play offs.

 

As I said in a previous post, making up the 9 points on the playoff teams will be difficult as they are all picking up points each week.

 

On that basis - first team on Tuesday. No malingering

[Window Cleaner]

I agree that the League is more important than the JPT, However I also beleive we have a far more realistic chance of winning the cup than we do getting to the play offs.

 

As I said in a previous post, making up the 9 points on the playoff teams will be difficult as they are all picking up points each week.

 

On that basis - first team on Tuesday. No malingering

 

.Enough players are about to get forced rest because they have 4 cards and another 4 games before the amnesty,I can't see any one of the 5 players concerned going another 4 games without getting a card so they'll get an obligatory rest.

[Cabrone]

I couldn't care less about the cups so I'd rest any players that might need it - be it for medical or disciplinary reasons.

 

For me it's all about the league and a determined push for the play offs.

 

I want out of this league ASAP.

[Chez]

Very interesting question.

The league is the priority for me and we need to protect players as it is a busy schedule. Any changes are not going to be for kids they are for fringe players like Mellis and Mills who are always on the bench and would actually benefit from a full game. We are going to need these guys to start at some point down the line so the more game time they get now the better.

 

I'd rest all four players on four yellows, Perry and Lambert, who looks a little tired to me. Connelly should also be treated with kid gloves. I think Mellis deserves to get some game time as he was looking decent before he went away wih the England U19s. Mills needs this game to keep his eye in case we lose Harding at some point. Patterson was lambested for his earlier showings, but I still feel he is a great prospect and if Lambert is injured he might just step up to the plate. If Davis was fit (he's not) he would come in to get him back in the swing of thigs.

 

Bart

James Trottman Thomas Mills

Antonio Hammond Mellis Lallana

Waigo Patterson

Edited 14 December, 2009 by Chez

[SNSUN]

No. I'm dragging mine and my Norwich supporting girlfriends arse to St Marys tomorrow, and I do not want to be humiliated. Full team please, rest people in the FA Cup.

[Charlie2008]

 

Bart

James Trottman Thomas Mills

Antonio Hammond Mellis Lallana

Waigo Patterson

 

IMO a good call, backed with a strong bench. Would be inclined to start with Lambert and keep Patto and Connolly in reserve.

 

Whatever the case, I trust Pards' judgement 100% and who wouldn't the way things have been going? Winning pretty and ugly is the way forward.

 

:cool:

[JibMcdo]

Harding, Jaidi, Hammond, James and Schneiderlin are all on 4 yellows so they shouldn't play tomorrow. Perry should be rested and the only other option is Aaron Martin.

 

--------------------Bart

Thomas-----Martin?-------Trotman-------Mills

Waigo------Wotton--------Mellis-------Lallana

------------Lambert------Connolly

[merrimd]

OK, so we rest the 4 on 4 yellows tomorrow and they play against Leeds. Each one then gets their 5th in a tough encounter ending in a draw. 1 point, and 4 players now unavailable against what would have been an easily winnable game against Exeter.

 

or

 

Play the 4 tomorrow, they get their 1 game out of the way against leeds, we lose heroically, but have a full squad to choose from against Exeter, ending in a win.

 

One option gives us 1 point and no JPT final, the other gives us 3 points and still in with a shot of wembley.

 

Its never, ever straight forward..............

[Matthew Le God]

Some people in this thread have forgotten or are unaware that...

 

Clubs must include in their starting line-ups at least 6 of the 11 players that have started most often in first team games this season.

[ericofarabia]

No. I'm dragging mine and my Norwich supporting girlfriends arse to St Marys tomorrow, and I do not want to be humiliated. Full team please, rest people in the FA Cup.

 

Rule 1 .

 

We don't need to rule 1 yours though

[ericofarabia]

I don't suppose anyone has any inside knowledge on whether Norwich are planning on resting players? Or if Leeds are planning on resting anyone for their game at Carlisle?

 

Looks like all the ITK'ers left the building after the takeover

 

We used to be knee deep in 'em

[Matthew Le God]

I don't suppose anyone has any inside knowledge on whether Norwich are planning on resting players?

 

As close as you will get probably.

 

http://www.eveningnews24.co.uk/content/Sport/story.aspx?brand=ENOnline&category=Sport&tBrand=ENOnline&tCategory=Sport&itemid=NOED14%20Dec%202009%2011%3A37%3A42%3A943

 

Norwich have so far in this comp rested as many 1st team players as the rules allow.

[SAFE_SAINT]

Just checking first.....

 

£18 tomorrow or drive to the ground today and pay £12....hmmm

 

phone/online?

[SAFE_SAINT]

phone/online?

 

as long as there booked- you can still pick them up on the night for the reduced rate

[trousers]

There is a slight difference with the managers in question - they have a squad of world class footballers....

 

11 of which are better than the next best 11. It's all relative. Doesn't matter what division we're talking about, the principle is the same.

[Legod Third Coming]

11 of which are better than the next best 11. It's all relative. Doesn't matter what division we're talking about, the principle is the same.

 

Not always in their case. You can't play Eduardo, Bendner, Walcott, etc in the same team all the time...

 

We have a great first team, then some good cover and then nothing.

 

I accept eleven of theirs are better, but the remaing 11 are still better than many opponents because they are among the best clubs in the world.

 

We aren't.

 

We rest players, we'll get turned over and that does nothing for anyone's morale - players, manager and fans!!!

[Andy_Porter]

The team i'd play:

 

Bart

Thomas - Trottman - Jaidi - Mills

Waigo - James - Schneiderlin - Lallana

Lambert - Connolly

 

Give Harding and Hammond a break and make sure they don't get suspended. The other players on yellows aren't quite as important as those two.

[Legod Third Coming]

I remember the last time we rested players in a cup game.

 

Against United in the FA Cup in our relegation season.

 

The clue as to how that turned out can be found in the previous sentence...

[aintforever]

Not always in their case. You can't play Eduardo, Bendner, Walcott, etc in the same team all the time...

 

We have a great first team, then some good cover and then nothing.

 

I accept eleven of theirs are better, but the remaing 11 are still better than many opponents because they are among the best clubs in the world.

 

We aren't.

 

We rest players, we'll get turned over and that does nothing for anyone's morale - players, manager and fans!!!

 

That's not true, apart from the fact that it's not just the big 4 who rest players for less important games. They have often lost to lesser teams as a result. Arsenal fielded a bunch of kids against Man City despite being weaker on paper.

 

It's good management to rest your best players when needed. That means you prioritize.

[Legod Third Coming]

That's not true, apart from the fact that it's not just the big 4 who rest players for less important games. They have often lost to lesser teams as a result. Arsenal fielded a bunch of kids against Man City despite being weaker on paper.

 

It's good management to rest your best players when needed. That means you prioritize.

 

I prefer the Chelsea approach. You try to win four cups and come up with two.

 

Out of interest, what does Arsene Wenger have more of trophies or empty cabinets...?

 

It's an approach that I personally think is flawed. You cannot determine when players might or might not get injured and the idea that footballers cannot play two games in a week is crazy.

 

I understand the thinking, but I just hate it.

 

When managers say 'now we can concentrate on the league' what does that mean?? Beforehand we were confused about which games we should be winning? Beforehand we didn't know how hard to try in the various competitions??

 

I'd rather win tomorrow and then go into Saturday with six wins behind us than go into a tough game having been stuffed because we played some kids.

 

If Morgan gets a yellow tomorrow so be it. If he gets one on Saturday he'll miss the following game anyway. He might sit on the bench tomorrow and break his ankle in training on Friday. That's life. You can't dictate fate.

[aintforever]

I prefer the Chelsea approach. You try to win four cups and come up with two.

 

The Chelsea starting lineup against QPR in the Carling Cup game this year...

 

Hilario

Ivanovic

Ferreira

Belletti

Hutchinson

J Cole

Mikel

Malouda

Zhirkov

Kalou

Borini

[VectisSaint]

As I said in a previous post, making up the 9 points on the playoff teams will be difficult as they are all picking up points each week.

As long as we beat the teams above us that are fighting for the play-offs in the second half of the season then we only have to make up 6 points. Making up 6 points on some (most) of the teams above us is not far fetched at all.