Saint in Paradise Posted 6 November, 2009 Share Posted 6 November, 2009 Emma Rowley, Sky News Online The massive machine at the centre of the world's biggest scientific experiment has malfunctioned again – derailed by a bit of bread dropped by a bird. But now the Real reason :- The difficulties faced by those working on the project have prompted some members of the scientific community to speculate, in all seriousness, that the machine is sabotaging itself - from the future. The theory is that the particle that physicists hope to produce might be "abhorrent to nature", so that once created it would work backwards through time to put a stop to whatever created it. The link is way to long to post but have a look on Sky News Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baj Posted 6 November, 2009 Share Posted 6 November, 2009 i read that theory too, certainly a mind ****! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint in Paradise Posted 6 November, 2009 Author Share Posted 6 November, 2009 Yes very interesting, wish John Nada still posted I am sure he would have had a theory as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Verbal Posted 6 November, 2009 Share Posted 6 November, 2009 They're searching for, among other things, the Higg's Bosun, a particle that only ever existed at or very near the beginning of time. Worries about what would happen if it were in effect re-produced led, for example, to the book version of Flashforward. Just a piece of clever science fiction of course - but some scientists seem spooked enough to have considered it to have some basis in science-reality. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
badgerx16 Posted 6 November, 2009 Share Posted 6 November, 2009 They're searching for, among other things, the Higg's Bosun, a particle that only ever existed at or very near the beginning of time. Worries about what would happen if it were in effect re-produced led, for example, to the book version of Flashforward. Just a piece of clever science fiction of course - but some scientists seem spooked enough to have considered it to have some basis in science-reality. Good science fiction is always well grounded in science fact, the question in this instance is whether you accept or understand enough of Quantum Mechanics to see that as fact. At the atomic level QM does some very spooky, and clearly reproducable, stuff. As Baj alludes to above, some of the 'deeper' stuff does end up as a bit of a mind f&@k. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ponty Posted 7 November, 2009 Share Posted 7 November, 2009 I'm looking forward to the day they get it working, tbh. Hopefully it'll put some theories to bed forever. If we stop trying to learn and understand then we're as good as dead as a species, and what could be more exciting to discover than clues to the happening of our existence? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aintforever Posted 7 November, 2009 Share Posted 7 November, 2009 A bunch of geeky scientists spent a fortune on something that doesn't work and they don't want to admit it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smirking_Saint Posted 7 November, 2009 Share Posted 7 November, 2009 I'm looking forward to the day they get it working, tbh. Hopefully it'll put some theories to bed forever. If we stop trying to learn and understand then we're as good as dead as a species, and what could be more exciting to discover than clues to the happening of our existence? I agree with this and being a science based bloke myself i hope this thing works eventually. However, as humans we have the ability to destroy ourselves and this planet and it is not inconvievable that we actually will !! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hypochondriac Posted 7 November, 2009 Share Posted 7 November, 2009 I agree with this and being a science based bloke myself i hope this thing works eventually. However, as humans we have the ability to destroy ourselves and this planet and it is not inconvievable that we actually will !! I wouldn't worry. It's not like we would be around to complain! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smirking_Saint Posted 7 November, 2009 Share Posted 7 November, 2009 Well i suppose, if they make a black hole it will be a free blowjob for all i suppose Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pancake Posted 7 November, 2009 Share Posted 7 November, 2009 Oh right, so you lot argue that there is no God, but you believe in a sub atomic part that no one has ever seen and a machine that travels backwards in time to sabotage itself! I jest of course... I do like the proposition that it's some kind of future shock coming back to turn itself off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Huffton Posted 7 November, 2009 Share Posted 7 November, 2009 ness, [/b]that the machine is sabotaging itself - from the future. The theory is that the particle that physicists hope to produce might be "abhorrent to nature", so that once created it would work backwards through time to put a stop to whatever created it. Its far too early in the morning to even begin to try and figure that out:confused: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saint lard Posted 7 November, 2009 Share Posted 7 November, 2009 The day that it works will be the end of the world. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldNick Posted 7 November, 2009 Share Posted 7 November, 2009 where does all that money come from to work on it? It must have cost a fortune and still more.It would be better if they spent the money on giving us all sky tv for free and we could watch the discovery channel about the creation of the world Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ponty Posted 7 November, 2009 Share Posted 7 November, 2009 Oh right, so you lot argue that there is no God, but you believe in a sub atomic part that no one has ever seen and a machine that travels backwards in time to sabotage itself! I jest of course... I do like the proposition that it's some kind of future shock coming back to turn itself off. I can't be bothered to cross-reference this thread with the God thread but, AFAIAC, I'll believe in the Higgs Bosun when they actually find proof of one's existence. At least they're trying to do that rather than just tell us it exists and that we're all doomed to Hell if we refuse to believe them. I'm more comfortable knowing that if they fail to find any proof they'll put their hands up and admit it rather than tell us it's because science moves in mysterious ways. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dubai_phil Posted 7 November, 2009 Share Posted 7 November, 2009 Old story, this theory has been around a while now, I read about it months ago unless oh oh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dubai_phil Posted 7 November, 2009 Share Posted 7 November, 2009 No, but REALLY, it is old news - see found it! http://www.telegraph.co.uk/science/science-news/6318034/Could-the-Large-Hadron-Collider-be-held-back-by-its-own-future.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sheaf Saint Posted 7 November, 2009 Share Posted 7 November, 2009 I can't be bothered to cross-reference this thread with the God thread but, AFAIAC, I'll believe in the Higgs Bosun when they actually find proof of one's existence. At least they're trying to do that rather than just tell us it exists and that we're all doomed to Hell if we refuse to believe them. I'm more comfortable knowing that if they fail to find any proof they'll put their hands up and admit it rather than tell us it's because science moves in mysterious ways. But what if it turns out that the Higgs Bosun and God are in fact one and the same? If, as speculated, the HB particle is actually responsible for creating the universe, is it possible that ancient civilisations knew this and the idea of God being an all-knowing, all-powerful spirit came about through a mis-translation of this knowledge that, like chinese whispers, became more and more distorted the more it was repeated? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Verbal Posted 7 November, 2009 Share Posted 7 November, 2009 But what if it turns out that the Higgs Bosun and God are in fact one and the same? If, as speculated, the HB particle is actually responsible for creating the universe, is it possible that ancient civilisations knew this and the idea of God being an all-knowing, all-powerful spirit came about through a mis-translation of this knowledge that, like chinese whispers, became more and more distorted the more it was repeated? Yes, Bexy, that's exactly what happened. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RonManager Posted 7 November, 2009 Share Posted 7 November, 2009 Yes, Bexy, that's exactly what happened. Well that's that sorted then. What are we going to do for the rest of the weekend? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smirking_Saint Posted 7 November, 2009 Share Posted 7 November, 2009 OK, here we go.......... So, the problem is like the time tourist conundrum, if we had the ability of time travel then surely there would be people from the future wandering around right now etc. So, if that theory is applied, then how can a sub-atomic particle (with i assume, due to the restrictions of science currently has no consciousness etc) travel back in time to 'put a stop to what created it ?' If this were the case, surely it would already have managed to put a stop to it ?? Etc etc, oh sh*t, now i am confusing myself. Do you get my point ?? I need a cup of tea Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RonManager Posted 7 November, 2009 Share Posted 7 November, 2009 OK, here we go.......... So, the problem is like the time tourist conundrum, if we had the ability of time travel then surely there would be people from the future wandering around right now etc. Maybe there are. Maybe I'm one of them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trader Posted 7 November, 2009 Share Posted 7 November, 2009 Maybe there are. Maybe I'm one of them. And so am I. Just to prove it, I've had a look in my history books and I can tell you all that Saints will not win the cup this season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RonManager Posted 7 November, 2009 Share Posted 7 November, 2009 And so am I. Just to prove it, I've had a look in my history books and I can tell you all that Saints will not win the cup this season. Now you know full well your not supposed to do that, you signed a piece of paper to that effect before coming to 2009 on your Cook's Time Holiday. You know what happens next - your memory is wiped, you are given a new ID and your stuck here forever. By the way, he's fibbing, we do win the Cup this season..............D'Oh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benjii Posted 7 November, 2009 Share Posted 7 November, 2009 The Higg's Boson, as postulated, seems to have a rather strange interaction with sapce-time itself (and matter). I've been to CERN. It's nice. No decent flange though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Verbal Posted 7 November, 2009 Share Posted 7 November, 2009 The Higg's Boson, as postulated, seems to have a rather strange interaction with sapce-time itself (and matter). I've been to CERN. It's nice. No decent flange though. I've been there too - while the LHC was under construction. While I was down in one of the caverns the Spanish constructors managed to tip over a three-storey crane. Someone or something really doesn't want that thing to fire up! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint in Paradise Posted 7 November, 2009 Author Share Posted 7 November, 2009 Just a small thought but how vunerable is CERN to an outside attack if a bird with a piece, not a whole loaf, can cause such a large machine to have to be stopped Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smirking_Saint Posted 8 November, 2009 Share Posted 8 November, 2009 Was talking about this today, and got pretty confused about this. I was thinking...... If it WERE to come back in time to sabotage itself, it obviously has not managed it, or else there would be nothing to come back in time in order to sabotage itself ?? Unless, it did come back in time to sabotage itself and managed to do it, which resulted in a new time path within which we managed to create a different Higgs-bosun (not the original, as this has already sabotaged itself) which would then attempt to go back in time in order to sabotage itself ??? And so....... if managed.......... would then create a different................................ oh you get the idea. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bridge too far Posted 8 November, 2009 Share Posted 8 November, 2009 Oh ****! I was just reading out some of this to Mr TF and now he won't shut up! Wittering on about something called a 'multiverse' :confused: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Verbal Posted 8 November, 2009 Share Posted 8 November, 2009 Oh ****! I was just reading out some of this to Mr TF and now he won't shut up! Wittering on about something called a 'multiverse' :confused: Is he from the eleventh dimension? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Verbal Posted 8 November, 2009 Share Posted 8 November, 2009 Was talking about this today, and got pretty confused about this. I was thinking...... If it WERE to come back in time to sabotage itself, it obviously has not managed it, or else there would be nothing to come back in time in order to sabotage itself ?? Unless, it did come back in time to sabotage itself and managed to do it, which resulted in a new time path within which we managed to create a different Higgs-bosun (not the original, as this has already sabotaged itself) which would then attempt to go back in time in order to sabotage itself ??? And so....... if managed.......... would then create a different................................ oh you get the idea. A tricky problem for physics, Mr Smirk, until someone came up with this reasoning. If time traveller came back from the future to alter an event in some way, everything from that moment on would split off into a universe of its own. That universe alone - not ours - would include the altered event. Which is why, incidentally, we haven't met anyone from the future. Read Michio Kaku on parallel universes for the best explanation - but it's all down to the paradoxes of the quantum world we live in (or not)... Question is: is it possible to traverse these parallel universes in some way? That may be an explanation for the repeated failures at LHC. Confused? you will be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Dark Sotonic Mills Posted 8 November, 2009 Share Posted 8 November, 2009 Reading 'A Brief History of Time', (yes I read it all), Hawking states that in his belief, time travel is a possibility. However, you could only travel back in time to when time travel was first made a reality. Hence no time traveller is around on the streets today. Unless time travel has already been invented and we don't know about it of course. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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