St Will Posted 30 September, 2009 Posted 30 September, 2009 None taken. It's my opinion. It's just not good enough at the moment, whether we were 'excellent for 70mins' etc last night 9pts from 10 games is very very poor Sacking the manager ISN'T that answer though. It really isn't. Let's put this is terms that you and I both understand. Faldo worked with Leadbetter to change his technique so he was good enough to win majors. It took him 2 years to see the benefits. I'm not saying Pardew will need 2 years, and in that time we'll get relegated, but the truth is, new coach, a few new players, a new system, a new way of training...lot's of new things. It will take time for the new things to have effect, because the old things were so terrible. If we change the manager, there will be a whole load of new things, and we'll have to start all over again.
saint_stevo Posted 30 September, 2009 Posted 30 September, 2009 Sacking the manager ISN'T that answer though. It really isn't. Let's put this is terms that you and I both understand. Faldo worked with Leadbetter to change his technique so he was good enough to win majors. It took him 2 years to see the benefits. I'm not saying Pardew will need 2 years, and in that time we'll get relegated, but the truth is, new coach, a few new players, a new system, a new way of training...lot's of new things. It will take time for the new things to have effect, because the old things were so terrible. If we change the manager, there will be a whole load of new things, and we'll have to start all over again. Ok ok i agree, but i have doubts over whether AP is the man to take us forward, even given time and (more) money
St Will Posted 30 September, 2009 Posted 30 September, 2009 Ok ok i agree, but i have doubts over whether AP is the man to take us forward, even given time and (more) money I think the performances show he is the man to take us forward. First you learn to hit the ball straight, then you learn to shape your ball, get up and down better, hole more putts. Apart from yesterday, we've shown we've improved drastically in defense - the only thing is scoring more goals. We created more chances from open play yesterday than we have all season. We're getting there - we will get there. Maybe it's just me, but I try to come away from every game and see what we've done well. If you look at it that way, you can see we're going in the right direction.
John B Posted 30 September, 2009 Posted 30 September, 2009 Sacking the manager ISN'T that answer though. It really isn't. Let's put this is terms that you and I both understand. Faldo worked with Leadbetter to change his technique so he was good enough to win majors. It took him 2 years to see the benefits. I'm not saying Pardew will need 2 years, and in that time we'll get relegated, but the truth is, new coach, a few new players, a new system, a new way of training...lot's of new things. It will take time for the new things to have effect, because the old things were so terrible. If we change the manager, there will be a whole load of new things, and we'll have to start all over again. Well I think you could be wrong In lots of cases sacking the manager improves the situation but of course not always . If it was such a bad idea Chairman would not do it that often. Norwich seem to be doing OK at the moment as do Colchester and Charlton after sacking Pardew Dont know any other new managers in League 1 Harry is not doing too bad at Spurs either after they sacked Ramos The only place it does not seem to work is at St Mary's so perhaps we should have kept Wotte or even JP
saint_stevo Posted 30 September, 2009 Posted 30 September, 2009 I think the performances show he is the man to take us forward. First you learn to hit the ball straight, then you learn to shape your ball, get up and down better, hole more putts. Apart from yesterday, we've shown we've improved drastically in defense - the only thing is scoring more goals. We created more chances from open play yesterday than we have all season. We're getting there - we will get there. Maybe it's just me, but I try to come away from every game and see what we've done well. If you look at it that way, you can see we're going in the right direction. I hope your right i really do! Some interesting golf analogies as well! I think i hit a fade....once!
St Will Posted 30 September, 2009 Posted 30 September, 2009 Well I think you could be wrong In lots of cases sacking the manager improves the situation but of course not always . If it was such a bad idea Chairman would not do it that often. Norwich seem to be doing OK at the moment as do Colchester and Charlton after sacking Pardew Dont know any other new managers in League 1 Harry is not doing too bad at Spurs either after they sacked Ramos The only place it does not seem to work is at St Mary's so perhaps we should have kept Wotte or even JP Yeah but I'm pretty certain that the teams you mentioned have a much stronger behind the scenes structure than we had before Pardew became manager. He's had to basically rebuild EVERYTHING in the club - scouting, coaching, academy....the list goes on.
Mr X Posted 30 September, 2009 Posted 30 September, 2009 On paper we have one of, if not the best team in this league agreed? So whats so drastically wrong? do we have a team of individuals
John B Posted 30 September, 2009 Posted 30 September, 2009 Yeah but I'm pretty certain that the teams you mentioned have a much stronger behind the scenes structure than we had before Pardew became manager. He's had to basically rebuild EVERYTHING in the club - scouting, coaching, academy....the list goes on. I doubt that you have any idea New managers usually bring in new staff when they are appointed
RedAndWhite91 Posted 30 September, 2009 Posted 30 September, 2009 Well the new manager would obviously not have had a pre-season, would need a transfer window to bring in his own players, and need time to adapt to league 1......... Pardew hardly had a pre-season. Pardew has bought in new players, Hammond, Trotman, Lambert, etc Pardew is adapting. He hasn't been managing at this level since 2002 when he got Reading promoted.
O_RLY Posted 1 October, 2009 Posted 1 October, 2009 We won't get better in League 1. Stick with him...dont forget what a shambles he took over.
spyinthesky Posted 1 October, 2009 Posted 1 October, 2009 Worth considering that both Ted Bates and Lawrie Mac had their bad times when supporters were v unhappy However they were generally far more patient then and there was no Saints Forum etc. V disappointed (and concerned) about our current position but continuity and stability is v important
Give it to Ron Posted 1 October, 2009 Posted 1 October, 2009 Well I think you could be wrong In lots of cases sacking the manager improves the situation but of course not always . If it was such a bad idea Chairman would not do it that often. Norwich seem to be doing OK at the moment as do Colchester and Charlton after sacking Pardew Dont know any other new managers in League 1 Harry is not doing too bad at Spurs either after they sacked Ramos The only place it does not seem to work is at St Mary's so perhaps we should have kept Wotte or even JP That would be the Colchester that were near the top of the table when their manager left not a team that had suffered 2 relegations. That would be the Charlton who stuck with a manager who never won a game in 20 yet you want sacked in 10 despite only losing 3. That would be the Harry Redknapp that did such a good job here? The only case here where we improved after a manager was sacked was WGS and look how long that took him to get us going! Have we learnt nothing from Gray, Sturrock, Wigley, Dodd, Gorma, JP, Wotte?? I am not saying that AP should be stuck with blindly but we have to give him time and the chance to turn this club around. We are in League 1 with a Premiership class manager who has his faults but we are improving, once he can get past that no pace and no wingers in the side set up we will get better I am sure.
whoateallthepies Posted 1 October, 2009 Posted 1 October, 2009 6 games unbeaten before tonight and performances improving game after game. We also played well tonight save the last 20 mins and were undone by a strong team. Played well = opinion We lost = fact We started 10 points from safety and 10 games in we are STILL 10 points from safety - fact Doesn't matter how much you keep improving, if you can't win you lose confidence and then you stop improving. We need to start winning...don't care if we play like muppets as long as we get 3 points.
The9 Posted 1 October, 2009 Posted 1 October, 2009 I honestly cannot believe the number of people starting to call for Pardew to go! How many managers in the last 10 years? and where did it get us? FFS I know it's not great at the moment but I really don't get why do so many people think change will automatically make everything better? We can't just keep scrabbling around changing manager twice a season, sooner or later you have to give a manager a chance to build a proper team. Quite. And any mistakes he may have arguably made pale into insignificance compared to the effort and drive shown by the majority of Saints players compared to last season.
St_Tel49 Posted 1 October, 2009 Posted 1 October, 2009 I can understand why people might suggest sacking Pardew but I think that they are profoundly wrong. Pardew took over a team that developed throwing away leads into an art form. They lost belief in their ability to win in my opinion. We still have a lot of those players and that mental fragility is still evident - as is the actual physical ability of those players. The latter is the reason why AP believes in them but turning around the psychological weakness is his biggest battle and its one that no incoming manager would be any more likely to fix IMHO bearing in mind thay cannot sign anyone new.
SaintRobbie Posted 1 October, 2009 Posted 1 October, 2009 Anyone calling for AP to go now is just barking mad or a Pompey fan looking for good news. COYRs!
Joesaint Posted 1 October, 2009 Posted 1 October, 2009 He has done a very good job, we all knew it would take time, I want AP for the long term. Please be realistic please. COYR
John B Posted 1 October, 2009 Posted 1 October, 2009 (edited) That would be the Colchester that were near the top of the table when their manager left not a team that had suffered 2 relegations. That would be the Charlton who stuck with a manager who never won a game in 20 yet you want sacked in 10 despite only losing 3. That would be the Harry Redknapp that did such a good job here? The only case here where we improved after a manager was sacked was WGS and look how long that took him to get us going! Have we learnt nothing from Gray, Sturrock, Wigley, Dodd, Gorma, JP, Wotte?? I am not saying that AP should be stuck with blindly but we have to give him time and the chance to turn this club around. We are in League 1 with a Premiership class manager who has his faults but we are improving, once he can get past that no pace and no wingers in the side set up we will get better I am sure. I am not suggesting Pardew should be sacked I an just saying that often sacking a manager works. If we had only won 1 game after 10 next season I think there would be a strong case for his removal it depends on the situation and who would be appointed instead. Edited 1 October, 2009 by John B
SaintRobbie Posted 1 October, 2009 Posted 1 October, 2009 I am not suggesting Pardew should be sacked I an just saying that often sacking a manager works. mmmm... not much evidence at this club of that analogy over the last 17 years. Perhaps not 'often' but 'on the odd rare occasion'.. ?
SaintRobbie Posted 1 October, 2009 Posted 1 October, 2009 He has done a very good job, we all knew it would take time, I want AP for the long term. Please be realistic please. COYR Agreed - I will criticise him in 6 years time if we're still festering... but we wont be.
John B Posted 1 October, 2009 Posted 1 October, 2009 mmmm... not much evidence at this club of that analogy over the last 17 years. Perhaps not 'often' but 'on the odd rare occasion'.. ? Not at our club I agree as I posted somewhere else Except when Gray went
Windmill Arm 2 Posted 1 October, 2009 Posted 1 October, 2009 Once we win a few games the forum spastics will disappear. Pardew is heading in the right direction.
John B Posted 1 October, 2009 Posted 1 October, 2009 Once we win a few games the forum spastics will disappear. Pardew is heading in the right direction. Not very PC I would have thought;) and a bit confrontational perhaps
dickyhale Posted 2 October, 2009 Posted 2 October, 2009 My immediate thought after the game. Currently talking a very good game; shame his team aren't playing any good ones. Lucky to beat Yeovil, lucky to nick a point against Carlisle and got what we deserved tonight. Don't get me wrong, I really want Pardew to succeed but the doubts are ever growing in mind... WELL SAID LUCKY TO BEAT YEOVIL LUCKY DRAW AND BEAT BY A TEAM THAT DESERVED TO WIN TONIGHT.
dune Posted 2 October, 2009 Posted 2 October, 2009 Once we win a few games the forum spastics will disappear. Pardew is heading in the right direction. I agree that we've improved, but i don't tink we've improved enough. I understand that it's only 10 games games, but we seem to have hit a brick wall and we're not doing enough to win games. Nobody is calling for AP's head now, but even without the 10 point penalty we'd be in the drop zone and that is not good enough. Fair enough he did inherit a poor team. He did inherit a demoralised team. He didn't have a full pre-season, but there comes a time when old excuses wear thin and the honeymoon is now over. I'm fully prepared to support AP because i like what he says and the way he says it, but ultimately talk is cheap and wins are what he must be judged on. 15 points from the next 10 games is the minimum requirement from AP's team as far as i'm concerned and we must be out of the drop zone by the end of the year. If it transpires both of these targets are missed then serious questions must be asked about AP's ability to do the job. We have a 5 year plan and therefore no time to waste. Treading water isn't an option. Change may be necessary.
southamptonfc Posted 2 October, 2009 Posted 2 October, 2009 It makes me so angry that people are so retarted to think that any manager can come in and have to buy a team of new players and get us winning every week immediately. I just dispair at some Saints fans, your fickle and quite frankly ignorant attitudes have been a big part of the problem at our club for the last few years imo.
Give it to Ron Posted 2 October, 2009 Posted 2 October, 2009 Like it or not Pardew is a loser. Yeah like his time at Reading and West Ham showed....
Seaford Saint Posted 2 October, 2009 Posted 2 October, 2009 All those who want Pardew out now, at this moment are just plain thick. Some people don't have the ability to think, they can only react. I have seen this on here many times. His time might be up at some future date but not now.....for what its worth I thought that Tuesday's game was the best I had seen Saints play in ages. The last 20 minutes showed the lack of confidence......there is still work to be done.
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