Lawrie Mac's Centre For Football Research

[Give it to Ron]

I am due to meet Lawrie next week....I will let you know if he is rude or not!

[OldNick]

LM a hero to me until he walked. Since then has not been my favourite.I do agree he spent a good time here and so that should be commended.Istill didnt like him going though.

[ottery st mary]

To me Lawrie Mac will always be a BIG man...A very BIG man.

 

I always found him to be firm but fair BUT NOT suffering fools gladly ....especially at Pro am/Charity Golf days and all that.....Most peeps get back what they give.....courtesy and respect...Did tell me off once ..a few years back....I looked up to him and said..YES Sir....Respect.

 

Mind you a lot of The Lowe clan for sum reason do not like him....Like The Crouchey opposition really.....Funny that.

Edited 17 September, 2009 by ottery st mary
spellin

[Dibden Purlieu Saint]

To me Lawrie Mac will always be a BIG man...A very BIG man.

 

I always found him to be firm but fair BUT NOT suffering fools gladly ....especially at Pro am/Charity Golf days and all that.....Most peeps get back what they give.....courtesy and respect...Did tell me off once ..a few years back....I looked up to him and said..YES Sir....Respect.

 

Mind you a lot of The Lowe clan for sum reason do not like him....Like The Crouchey opposition really.....Funny that.

 

Can't ever deny he's a big man. I'm 6'3" and 240 pounds, and he makes me look small. To be fair I was very polite to him, in general I am. And generally when a speaker at a pro/am, he should expect the odd question/meet and greet. Maybe he was just having a bad day. Either way, he was very abrupt and rude, and I don't see why I can't judge someone on the only time I've met him. How am I to know any different?

[ottery st mary]

Can't ever deny he's a big man. I'm 6'3" and 240 pounds, and he makes me look small. To be fair I was very polite to him, in general I am. And generally when a speaker at a pro/am, he should expect the odd question/meet and greet. Maybe he was just having a bad day. Either way, he was very abrupt and rude, and I don't see why I can't judge someone on the only time I've met him. How am I to know any different?

 

Lets just Luv the Saints from now on and be friends.... big boy.

 

I am still growing but alas time is not on my side...I am sure you would like big Lawrie if you met him in different circumstances. Standing on his bunnions..probably didn't help. I will not mention Rupes again...but as I move on ...LM is twice the man Lowey is:D

 

Keep up the good work... big fella.

[sadoldgit]

Lawrie gave me the best memories I have of Saints and gave us, in my opinion, our best squad ever. For that I shall be eternally grateful.

 

But there is an old saying that you should never go back and I don't think Lawrie should have.

[krissyboy31]

Lawrie gave me the best memories I have of Saints and gave us, in my opinion, our best squad ever. For that I shall be eternally grateful.

 

But there is an old saying that you should never go back and I don't think Lawrie should have.

 

I agree except I think it was the second return that was the bad decision. As DoF above Alan Ball and Graeme Souness I thought he did a good job.

[Fan The Flames]

What is snide about DPS's posts, he is judging him on personal experience, why are you getting so unnecessary ?

 

His first comment about LM and expenses, which is plainly provocative and then he gets all up himself when people get cross.

 

For me LM was the best manager this club has ever had, without him Southampton would be a Reading pre Madejski or like Luton Town or Carlise United, a football backwater. We would be probably be floundering winless at the bottom of the Div One; without the magnificant 27 top flight years beating the best, the cup win and finals the European games, St Marys, Matt Le Tissier etc etc. LM got us into the top flight at the right time and kept us there.

 

I bet other clubs with a standout hero don't have the detracters we have. Everyone is entitled to their opinions and I'm entitled to mine.

[saint1977]

LM was a fantastic manager for us and the only one ever to win anything. Never met him as a man so couldn't comment there. Solent have gambled here - it could work well if they can pick up a lot of consultancy from CCC clubs and lower-end PL. Developing Foundation Degrees, particularly if they are FA accredited, might be an option to blow the smaller Universities that offer Sports Science in the region out of the water. The research funding pool for Sports Science is quite heavily fished in though. Might be scope to work with Saints though at Staplewood in bite-sized projects.

 

I think its appeal might be mostly local or regional at present but I wish the Centre and Solent well. I've criticised Solent on here in the past but they are heading in a better direction these days.

[Dibden Purlieu Saint]

His first comment about LM and expenses, which is plainly provocative and then he gets all up himself when people get cross.

 

For me LM was the best manager this club has ever had, without him Southampton would be a Reading pre Madejski or like Luton Town or Carlise United, a football backwater. We would be probably be floundering winless at the bottom of the Div One; without the magnificant 27 top flight years beating the best, the cup win and finals the European games, St Marys, Matt Le Tissier etc etc. LM got us into the top flight at the right time and kept us there.

 

I bet other clubs with a standout hero don't have the detracters we have. Everyone is entitled to their opinions and I'm entitled to mine.

 

Hang on, you said earlier that I couldn't judge someone on the back of meeting them, yet "everyone is entitled to their opinions"..?

 

It was a very tongue in cheek comment. Sorry I'm not very good with the smiley face things. Christ, if everyone got so uppity about the odd comment here and there this really would be a battleground.

 

I got cross at this:

 

"how i wish for those great days and cannot believe we have so called saints fans knocking that great era when we overacheived big timethey must be barkin mad."

 

I said numerous times I wasn't having a go at what he did for this club, as I recognise those achievements. So yes, I got angry at being wrongly accused by those too lazy to read the thread and just want to shove there tongues up people's arses as they follow around like sheep.

[Alain Perrin]

Stop taking the moral high ground, yes you are sad for judging someone you have met briefly and not stopping to think that there may be more to them.

 

In fairness that didn't stop a raft of posts on here regarding Lowe's personality flaws. It seems you might be exercising double standards.

 

Personally I don't like him because of his funny accent.....

[Alain Perrin]

For me RL was the best chairman this club has ever had, without him Southampton would be a Reading pre Madejski or like Luton Town or Carlise United, a football backwater. We would be probably be floundering winless at the bottom of the Div One; without the magnificant 27 top flight years beating the best, the cup final and European games, St Marys, Anthony Pulis etc etc. LM got us into the top flight at the right time and RL kept us there.

 

Genius....

[Nineteen Canteen]

Apart from the thousands of pounds that a box costs of course.

 

And you believe that McMenemy made any contribution to those thousands of pounds? I don't, my guess would be that Crouch paid and took McMenemy as his guest because Crouch likes to consider himself as part of the Saints dynasty as it were - bought in or otherwise of course.

 

Would McMenemy even allow Crouch to breathe the same air as him if Crouch wasn't loaded and gave McMenemy the opportunity for a free ride? IMO I don't think so and now the gravy train has departed the stadium what next for McMenemy? The personal purchase of a season ticket or membership? I doubt if he is even on the ticket office records.

[Micky]

Met him once and he was an absolute gentleman - took time to chat to me and my two boys. Got to agree with FTF, he gave us everlasting great memories and built a side that played some great stuff.

[Fan The Flames]

In fairness that didn't stop a raft of posts on here regarding Lowe's personality flaws. It seems you might be exercising double standards.

 

Personally I don't like him because of his funny accent.....

 

Its no surprise you dislike Lawrie, first rule of Lowe Club. I think you will find people disliked Lowe's average running of the club, two relegations and admin, remember.

 

Genius....

 

Pathetic seeing the summer we had.

[Micky]

And you believe that McMenemy made any contribution to those thousands of pounds? I don't, my guess would be that Crouch paid and took McMenemy as his guest because Crouch likes to consider himself as part of the Saints dynasty as it were - bought in or otherwise of course.

 

Would McMenemy even allow Crouch to breathe the same air as him if Crouch wasn't loaded and gave McMenemy the opportunity for a free ride? IMO I don't think so and now the gravy train has departed the stadium what next for McMenemy? The personal purchase of a season ticket or membership? I doubt if he is even on the ticket office records.

 

You summed it up there NC, you are guessing, assuming, sticking a finger in the air, whilst all the time allowing a guess to form your opinion and pass judgment.

 

Does anybody know the facts?

Edited 18 September, 2009 by Micky
**** poor grammar...!!!

[Nineteen Canteen]

You summed it up there NC, your guessing, assuming, sticking a finger in the air, whilst all the time allowing a guess to form your opinion and pass judgment.

 

Does anybody know the facts?

 

Not me Micky that's why I said a guess. 99% of what gets posted on here is assumptions and second guessing what the club or individuals are going to do. I don't bet but isn't picking a horse to win a race a guess based on a punters interpretation of past performances? Sometimes he gets it right especially if he his shrewd and not blinded by a horses name alone.

 

People chastise Lowe for not making any monetray contribution to the club and in fact accuse him of the opposite. From day one of Lowe's arrival was McMenemy seriously any different? IMO he was always quick to chide and undermine whilst cashing in his voting rights that afforded him the ability to make a difference. Meanwhile, Lowe built the club to a new peak and as we came down off that peak McMenemy was quick to turn the screws publicly instead of taking his issues to Lowe directly who was probably and rightly a bit miffed that a potentially senior director could cash in on the club and the new beginnings so easily. There was no love lost on either side but Lowe in this instance had more justification IMO.

 

Again, I have no idea if all this is true but would like to know if I am on the right lines and based on my interpretation of past form my guess is I am.

 

As others have said I am more than grateful for McMenemy's managerial contribution and some great memories but as has been proven men who rest on past reputations alone have a tendency of either getting found out for being complacent or becoming bitter and twisted.

 

Form is temporary, class if permanent an adage that fits all situations in life and McMenemy post his managerial duties was not the most classy of individuals although his form as our best manager to date is unequalled but hopefully about to be broken as part of the brave new dawn.

[saints triumph]

There are two clear camps on this. You either like him ..or you don't.

Others have pointed out negatives but he did give us our only trophy, and that wasn't luck either, MU and Tommy Docherty

had a good side out and we were Div.2 (CCC).

 

The later years in the era of the " Five England captains " gave those of us who remember it - the finest football of that / or any other generation. 1983/4 season we finished second to Liverpool by only three points, and there are fans who say ..had the season been two weeks longer - we would have won the league title. It was no surprise that he eventually left (for his ill-fated return to Sunderland) when - as Kevin Keegan pointed out - the directors wouldn't approve more money for big signings. Sunderland weren't called " the Bank of England club " for nothing! He had come to the end of his tether.

I was disappointed - but not surprised. Historically the Saints' Board has always failed the club over money at crucial times - even back in 1948/9, and here was another betrayal.

 

As for those who think him arrogant, he said on his appointment (1973) that his brash Geordie style would ruffle a few feathers - and it did. However, he came on Ted Bates' recommendation and in hindsight I think he was the best choice. LM had confidence in his ideas and his players and wasn't afraid to say so. Many players lifted their game under his guidance and what he did to lift the club's morale and image may never be repeated. He has had phases of unpopularity - and others of a higher ethical standing, as when the Board / Rupert Lowe refused to allow Graham Souness money to buy players, and he quit in protest, along with GS.

 

Maybe it's the old North v. South squabble..we can't get along with them, and they don't like our " stupid " accents. Personally, I think LM deserves a lot more credit than some give him, and rate as one of the best managers the club has had......arrogance or not. His contempories as managers had respect for him ; (Sir) Bobby Robson, Brian Clough, Jack Charlton, Ron Atkinson and Graham Taylor - even though they didn't always agree on everything - in public.

 

A generation of " younger fans" who are quick to decry his contribution to the clubs history are only looking at half the story.

 

A fair and decent reply.

[Fan The Flames]

People chastise Lowe for not making any monetray contribution to the club and in fact accuse him of the opposite. From day one of Lowe's arrival was McMenemy seriously any different? IMO he was always quick to chide and undermine whilst cashing in his voting rights that afforded him the ability to make a difference. Meanwhile, Lowe built the club to a new peak and as we came down off that peak McMenemy was quick to turn the screws publicly instead of taking his issues to Lowe directly who was probably and rightly a bit miffed that a potentially senior director could cash in on the club and the new beginnings so easily. There was no love lost on either side but Lowe in this instance had more justification IMO.

 

Again, I have no idea if all this is true but would like to know if I am on the right lines and based on my interpretation of past form my guess is I am.

 

As others have said I am more than grateful for McMenemy's managerial contribution and some great memories but as has been proven men who rest on past reputations alone have a tendency of either getting found out for being complacent or becoming bitter and twisted.

 

But equally you chastise LM at every oportunity whilst lauding Lowe, yet financially they made the same contribution but LM showered us with success and Lowe gave us mediocrity.

 

Average top flight position before Lowe 12th after Lowe 13th. Facts is facts not much of a Lowe peak is it, especially when you add in two relegations and admin.

 

What is the past reputation that you are resting on.

[Nineteen Canteen]

But equally you chastise LM at every oportunity whilst lauding Lowe, yet financially they made the same contribution but LM showered us with success and Lowe gave us mediocrity.

 

Average top flight position before Lowe 12th after Lowe 13th. Facts is facts not much of a Lowe peak is it, especially when you add in two relegations and admin.

 

What is the past reputation that you are resting on.

 

Compare the game before Lowe which was during the infancy of the Premiership and Sky and compare it post Lowe. There has been such a sea change during that period that you can't compare but if you do 13th as an average top flight position with very little money or the resources to compete with the big guns was fantastic.

 

In fact comparing achievement vs revenue/resources, what we achieved as a club up to our cup final appearance in 2003 against a team where the value of their star striker could have bought our squad was awesome and the equal and more IMO of anything McMenemy achieved and perhaps some would argue should have achieved far more. We build him up to such great heights and such a sage but in this day and age would he have lasted so long with his managerial track record? An FA Cup win and a one off runners up spot which now is beyond the ability of all but 5 maybe 6 clubs at most even considering the Chelsea ban on transfers. He couldn't achieve the runners up spot now, no manager could at Saints and one knockout trophy today is nothing compared to boring mid table Premiership as infamously the Charlton fans are finding out to their costs after dumping Curbishley. The competition for mid table obscurity in the top flight is intense because of the revenues and need to meet player greed and the influx of foreign investment and the rise of the Champions league all show that we had some spectacular achievements in our early years at SMS.

 

Lowe took us down but player and fan greed/power didn't help and eventually as for all clubs our size all those near misses were eventually going to hit the target so we would have gone eventually without massive investment or an acceptance of relative mediocrity and survival as the objective and which Charlton painfully demonstrated to themselves is not an easy thing to do in football.

 

Are you saying that minus Lowe and with McMenemy at the helm in some capacity we could have once again finished second in the top flight in the past ten years? In any event in terms of achievement I will take an average position of 13th in the Premier league the the average of 12th before Lowe simply because the achievement bar so was placed somewhere in the stratosphere in the late 90's. So thanks for proving my argument with those stats and in the case one place up does not make all the difference in proving life before Lowe was any better.

 

Lowe even made the right call that prudence was best after relegation but he had a manager who can't manage these days unless he can spend fortunes and a major shareholder revolt backed by a mob rule of fans unable to look dispassionately at the reality of the situation. Lowe resided over one almost inevitable relegation but the second was determined and guaranteed when Lowe's war chest was emptied in a desperate attempt to buy promotion via the play offs and the rest is history.

 

Now what was your point I can't remember after all that.

[Dibden Purlieu Saint]

Compare the game before Lowe which was during the infancy of the Premiership and Sky and compare it post Lowe. There has been such a sea change during that period that you can't compare but if you do 13th as an average top flight position with very little money or the resources to compete with the big guns was fantastic.

 

In fact comparing achievement vs revenue/resources, what we achieved as a club up to our cup final appearance in 2003 against a team where the value of their star striker could have bought our squad was awesome and the equal and more IMO of anything McMenemy achieved and perhaps some would argue should have achieved far more. We build him up to such great heights and such a sage but in this day and age would he have lasted so long with his managerial track record? An FA Cup win and a one off runners up spot which now is beyond the ability of all but 5 maybe 6 clubs at most even considering the Chelsea ban on transfers. He couldn't achieve the runners up spot now, no manager could at Saints and one knockout trophy today is nothing compared to boring mid table Premiership as infamously the Charlton fans are finding out to their costs after dumping Curbishley. The competition for mid table obscurity in the top flight is intense because of the revenues and need to meet player greed and the influx of foreign investment and the rise of the Champions league all show that we had some spectacular achievements in our early years at SMS.

 

Lowe took us down but player and fan greed/power didn't help and eventually as for all clubs our size all those near misses were eventually going to hit the target so we would have gone eventually without massive investment or an acceptance of relative mediocrity and survival as the objective and which Charlton painfully demonstrated to themselves is not an easy thing to do in football.

 

Are you saying that minus Lowe and with McMenemy at the helm in some capacity we could have once again finished second in the top flight in the past ten years? In any event in terms of achievement I will take an average position of 13th in the Premier league the the average of 12th before Lowe simply because the achievement bar so was placed somewhere in the stratosphere in the late 90's. So thanks for proving my argument with those stats and in the case one place up does not make all the difference in proving life before Lowe was any better.

 

Lowe even made the right call that prudence was best after relegation but he had a manager who can't manage these days unless he can spend fortunes and a major shareholder revolt backed by a mob rule of fans unable to look dispassionately at the reality of the situation. Lowe resided over one almost inevitable relegation but the second was determined and guaranteed when Lowe's war chest was emptied in a desperate attempt to buy promotion via the play offs and the rest is history.

 

Now what was your point I can't remember after all that.

 

Please let's not get into another Lowe debate (I know you didn't start it), and he's now history. We have a new and impressive Chairman now, and no LM either (which makes me happy).

[aintforever]

Does anyone else think this Nineteen Canteen nutjob should just be banned?

 

No true Saints fan could possibly compare Lowe to Lawrie Mac, one got us relegated twice and sent the club into administration and the other won our only trophy and basically put us on the map.

 

This bell end is just on a wind up, mods do us all a favour and kick him off here.

[Micky]

Does anyone else think this Nineteen Canteen nutjob should just be banned?

 

No true Saints fan could possibly compare Lowe to Lawrie Mac, one got us relegated twice and sent the club into administration and the other won our only trophy and basically put us on the map.

 

This bell end is just on a wind up, mods do us all a favour and kick him off here.

 

It's called freedom of speech - this is an internet forum, potentially open to every internet connected person on the globe. NC is entitled to his opinions, they may not all be mainstream and he often finds himself in the minority. That said, I personally think that he makes some valid points and tries (in the main) to contribute. It may not be what you want to hear, it may differ vastly from your own opinion - but sometimes that is just life.

 

As for banning him - I vote not. Like a TV set, you have the option to change the channel or use the 'on/off' button if it is not to your taste. Here you might consider the 'ignore' option.

[Nineteen Canteen]

Does anyone else think this Nineteen Canteen nutjob should just be banned?

 

No true Saints fan could possibly compare Lowe to Lawrie Mac, one got us relegated twice and sent the club into administration and the other won our only trophy and basically put us on the map.

 

This bell end is just on a wind up, mods do us all a favour and kick him off here.

 

The map McMenemy put us on has changed as a result of a massive continental shift and the creatures that walked the football fields of those days are long extinct.

 

The nutjob is the person who can't reason that you cannot even compare the two because in the world of football McMenemy operated in a time so long ago in geographical terms its the equivalent to when the Isle of Wight was still an area of Southampton and you could walk to France without getting your feet wet.

 

I agree with Dibden's post above and once again I have been drawn into the Lowe debate and offered my opinion as oppose to bringing his name up unsolicited to incite ill-feeling in those unable to reason their own arguments.

 

BTW the last time I was called a bell end it had something to do with being able to go like the clappers. You should try it.

 

For now I will take Dibden's advice in the absence of any sensible comments happy to accept that the puerile abuse stengthen's my opinion has having at least some merit. Thanks, I thought it was just me.

[Wes Tender]

Lowe took us down but player and fan greed/power didn't help and eventually as for all clubs our size all those near misses were eventually going to hit the target so we would have gone eventually without massive investment or an acceptance of relative mediocrity and survival as the objective and which Charlton painfully demonstrated to themselves is not an easy thing to do in football.

 

So who was at fault here? The fans, or the chairman for not showing respect to them and offering them a product that they no longer wished to contribute to financially?

 

Lowe even made the right call that prudence was best after relegation but he had a manager who can't manage these days unless he can spend fortunes and a major shareholder revolt backed by a mob rule of fans unable to look dispassionately at the reality of the situation. Lowe presided over one almost inevitable relegation but the second was determined and guaranteed when Lowe's war chest was emptied in a desperate attempt to buy promotion via the play offs and the rest is history.

 

I'm getting fed up of challenging this opinion, but there is no way that I'll allow it to go unchallenged, no matter how many times it's repeated. Even on the limited funding that was available following our failure to gain promotion back to the Premiership, relegation to the third division was not inevitable. Granted it became almost inevitable following Lowe's dismissal of Pearson and replacing him with the clueless double Dutch duo and playing the youth team in his bizarre total football experiment, but it was not the only course of action that remained, so Lowe must accept total responsibility for the policy's failure.

 

Getting back to the reason why Lowe and McMenemy did not get on, it was simply ego, Lowe not being able to tolerate the adulation and esteem that most fans hold for McMenemy.

[rpb]

Getting back to the reason why Lowe and McMenemy did not get on, it was simply ego, Lowe not being able to tolerate the adulation and esteem that most fans hold for McMenemy.

 

What actually happened to make McMenemy leave after Souness went to Italy? I never did understand that...

[Depressed of Shirley]

Compare the game before Lowe which was during the infancy of the Premiership and Sky and compare it post Lowe. There has been such a sea change during that period that you can't compare but if you do 13th as an average top flight position with very little money or the resources to compete with the big guns was fantastic.

 

In fact comparing achievement vs revenue/resources, what we achieved as a club up to our cup final appearance in 2003 against a team where the value of their star striker could have bought our squad was awesome and the equal and more IMO of anything McMenemy achieved and perhaps some would argue should have achieved far more. We build him up to such great heights and such a sage but in this day and age would he have lasted so long with his managerial track record? An FA Cup win and a one off runners up spot which now is beyond the ability of all but 5 maybe 6 clubs at most even considering the Chelsea ban on transfers. He couldn't achieve the runners up spot now, no manager could at Saints and one knockout trophy today is nothing compared to boring mid table Premiership as infamously the Charlton fans are finding out to their costs after dumping Curbishley. The competition for mid table obscurity in the top flight is intense because of the revenues and need to meet player greed and the influx of foreign investment and the rise of the Champions league all show that we had some spectacular achievements in our early years at SMS.

 

Lowe took us down but player and fan greed/power didn't help and eventually as for all clubs our size all those near misses were eventually going to hit the target so we would have gone eventually without massive investment or an acceptance of relative mediocrity and survival as the objective and which Charlton painfully demonstrated to themselves is not an easy thing to do in football.

 

Are you saying that minus Lowe and with McMenemy at the helm in some capacity we could have once again finished second in the top flight in the past ten years? In any event in terms of achievement I will take an average position of 13th in the Premier league the the average of 12th before Lowe simply because the achievement bar so was placed somewhere in the stratosphere in the late 90's. So thanks for proving my argument with those stats and in the case one place up does not make all the difference in proving life before Lowe was any better.

 

Lowe even made the right call that prudence was best after relegation but he had a manager who can't manage these days unless he can spend fortunes and a major shareholder revolt backed by a mob rule of fans unable to look dispassionately at the reality of the situation. Lowe resided over one almost inevitable relegation but the second was determined and guaranteed when Lowe's war chest was emptied in a desperate attempt to buy promotion via the play offs and the rest is history.

 

Now what was your point I can't remember after all that.

 

It seems to me that where you stand on this issue depends on your age, and the Saints games you actually went to.

 

For me it is quite simple. In 1976 I saw the greatest moment in the clubs history, and in 1983/84 the greatest season. The one constant from both of these was Lawrie (and Nick Holmes) . Having attended 40 games in 1983/84, I can assure those of you not old enough to have been there, that we were the second best team in England for a whole season. We were undone by injuries to Steve Williams in April, and the fact that Frank Worthington couldn't shoot. In fact without the injury to Williams, we may well have won both the league and cup in that season.

 

Now I agree that you cannot comapre the post Sky era with what went before in terms of money, but to acheive what we did in 83/84, still required a very good manager. I doubt that anyone that Lowe employed could have matched what Lawrie acheived in 83/84.

 

However, for me the debate is whether, as a football fan, you aspire to winning things, or being financially sound as a club, happy to finish 12th. In that respect give me Lawrie's view of the football world than Lowe's any time.

 

I don't believe that Lowe was all bad for the club, but his spiteful actions last summer ensured we would be where we are now. For that reason, I would argue that Lowe lost any previous respect he may have earned, and we are far better off that he's no longer anywhere near the club.

[Gemmel]

What actually happened to make McMenemy leave after Souness went to Italy? I never did understand that...

 

I think it was Turkey...but thats by the the by.....

He resigned out of principle (Something which i would have thought 19c would find very honorable)

[Channon's Sideburns]

I said earlier on, I just really don't like his personality, and his attitude. Come across him at a couple of Pro/Am's and he is not very approachable in any way, shape or form.

 

Have to disagree. Approached him after a charity event in Lymington, during a conversation and he couldn't have been nicer.

 

Came across once he'd finished with the others and spent 15mins talking to my family about Saints and the old days.

 

You take as you find - not a problem in my book.

[Dibden Purlieu Saint]

Have to disagree. Approached him after a charity event in Lymington, during a conversation and he couldn't have been nicer.

 

Came across once he'd finished with the others and spent 15mins talking to my family about Saints and the old days.

 

You take as you find - not a problem in my book.

 

You obviously caught him on a better day than I did, which is fair enough. I can only judge from the situation I was in.

[Channon's Sideburns]

You obviously caught him on a better day than I did, which is fair enough. I can only judge from the situation I was in.

 

I think sometimes perhaps those after dinner speeches probably do grate.

 

It depends I guess on who you are speaking to - at the one I was at, it was full of yachties, some of which preferred to talk about how wonderful Chelski were...I was sat there thinking 'Fook me, you invite a guy who has been involved in local and national footie, and you talk just about Chelski?'

 

So I got a question in about how they kept the Keegan signing quiet - the funniest thing ever, Lawrie looked happy as Larry that someone had asked about Saints - even Leon gave me a wry smirk. This was a few days after we'd gone into Admin.

 

Half the people there had no idea we'd ever signed Keegan. Priceless.

 

I just thought..there you go, stick your big spending Chelski up your ar$e. I'm Saints and proud of it.

 

Good times!

[Fan The Flames]

Please let's not get into another Lowe debate (I know you didn't start it), and he's now history. We have a new and impressive Chairman now, and no LM either (which makes me happy).

 

Of course he started it, its what he does. Who was the first to mention Lowe, 19 C in post 13, one or two Lowe luvie references aside no else does, so 19C ramps it up with his little provocative 'Lowe peak' speech, which I unfortunately bit on and then he claims he has been drawn into the Lowe debate again. These are the little games he plays. People spent years debunking the myths he perpetrated during the end of the Lowe reign and now its over, Lowe is now an irrelevance to the future of SFC and therefore 19C views on him are as well so I for one will disengage from dialogue with him.

Btw I never said you couldn't judge someone you met just that you were sad to do so, a slight difference. Anyway I'm fed up with this nonsense I'm off for a w#nk.

Up the Saints.

[rpb]

I think it was Turkey...but thats by the the by.....

He resigned out of principle (Something which i would have thought 19c would find very honorable)

 

No, Torino is definitely an Italian club.

 

What was the principle that he resigned on? That's the bit I don't understand...

[Gemmel]

No, Torino is definitely an Italian club.

 

What was the principle that he resigned on? That's the bit I don't understand...

 

Apologies i always thought it was Turkey...and stand corrected.

 

Souness claimed Lowe went back on his word with regard to what funds would be made available and resigned. LM claimed to resign out of principle as he was him that bought Souness to Saints and he didn't want to work for a liar (lowe).

[Scummer]

Apologies i always thought it was Turkey...and stand corrected.

 

Galatasaray in Turkey came later.

[Nineteen Canteen]

Of course he started it, its what he does. Who was the first to mention Lowe, 19 C in post 13, one or two Lowe luvie references aside no else does, so 19C ramps it up with his little provocative 'Lowe peak' speech, which I unfortunately bit on and then he claims he has been drawn into the Lowe debate again. These are the little games he plays. People spent years debunking the myths he perpetrated during the end of the Lowe reign and now its over, Lowe is now an irrelevance to the future of SFC and therefore 19C views on him are as well so I for one will disengage from dialogue with him.

Btw I never said you couldn't judge someone you met just that you were sad to do so, a slight difference. Anyway I'm fed up with this nonsense I'm off for a w#nk.

Up the Saints.

 

Oh dear, that's a long w*nk hope Fan the Flames didn't post this on his smart phone whilst taking the dog for a walk.

[Weston Saint]

Someone who has mixed in LM's company regularly once said to me "the problem is that Laurie thinks the world owes him a living"

 

I have spoken to Laurie a couple of times recently and found him pleasant and polite. I do know he is very unhappy at having to pay to go to SMS. Don't think he has attended since that happened. By the way I understand Crouch has not attended either but that may be for another reason.

 

On the subject of paying to see Saints there is a consensus that the present ownership have got that wrong and should understand that ex loyal players and long standing past officials should be given a free season ticket to the club. It happens elsewhere. It happens at Hampshire Cricket as well.

 

Time for Mr Oldknow to review this policy. Supporters want to see ex players in the stands. It is part of the "match day experience"

[Gingeletiss]

Someone who has mixed in LM's company regularly once said to me "the problem is that Laurie thinks the world owes him a living"

 

I have spoken to Laurie a couple of times recently and found him pleasant and polite. I do know he is very unhappy at having to pay to go to SMS. Don't think he has attended since that happened. By the way I understand Crouch has not attended either but that may be for another reason.

 

On the subject of paying to see Saints there is a consensus that the present ownership have got that wrong and should understand that ex loyal players and long standing past officials should be given a free season ticket to the club. It happens elsewhere. It happens at Hampshire Cricket as well.

 

Time for Mr Oldknow to review this policy. Supporters want to see ex players in the stands. It is part of the "match day experience"

 

Will that apply to ex season ticket holders;);)..........LM is a Legend...period. IMHO of course.

[Scummer]

Supporters want to see ex players in the stands. It is part of the "match day experience"

 

If it's a part, it's a very small one.

[Crab Lungs]

Most definitely will, knowing Lawrie.

 

I know I'm in the minority, and I know he did a lot for this club, but I still really dislike the man for some reason.

 

Likewise.

[aintforever]

The map McMenemy put us on has changed as a result of a massive continental shift and the creatures that walked the football fields of those days are long extinct.

 

The nutjob is the person who can't reason that you cannot even compare the two because in the world of football McMenemy operated in a time so long ago in geographical terms its the equivalent to when the Isle of Wight was still an area of Southampton and you could walk to France without getting your feet wet.

 

I agree with Dibden's post above and once again I have been drawn into the Lowe debate and offered my opinion as oppose to bringing his name up unsolicited to incite ill-feeling in those unable to reason their own arguments.

 

BTW the last time I was called a bell end it had something to do with being able to go like the clappers. You should try it.

 

For now I will take Dibden's advice in the absence of any sensible comments happy to accept that the puerile abuse stengthen's my opinion has having at least some merit. Thanks, I thought it was just me.

 

I'm not reason my argument because the Lowe debate has been done to death and you have been proved wrong too many times to mention. It's just boring now and I cannot be arsed.

 

My point was that I don't even think that you believe the rubbish you come out with, you are just on the wind up. Continual wind ups like yours ruin this message board.

[offix]

A lot of verbal diarrhea on here about a man who gave us the best years this club has ever known.

[up and away]

Someone who has mixed in LM's company regularly once said to me "the problem is that Laurie thinks the world owes him a living"

 

I have spoken to Laurie a couple of times recently and found him pleasant and polite. I do know he is very unhappy at having to pay to go to SMS. Don't think he has attended since that happened. By the way I understand Crouch has not attended either but that may be for another reason.

 

On the subject of paying to see Saints there is a consensus that the present ownership have got that wrong and should understand that ex loyal players and long standing past officials should be given a free season ticket to the club. It happens elsewhere. It happens at Hampshire Cricket as well.

 

Time for Mr Oldknow to review this policy. Supporters want to see ex players in the stands. It is part of the "match day experience"

 

You are right, it does happen elsewhere but does that make it right. The one thing that really would make me throw in the season ticket is seeing the hangers on waiting to get in on a complimentary, moaning that they have to wait and threatening to walk, just because their dad was special to fans. I really like the fact that I don't see ex players come into functions, stuff their pockets on a nod then off to see what else they can cadge.

 

Make all ex-players and personnel pay, then treat them like VIP's once they are in, with the food, drink and the seats. One thing that has really impressed and has been noticeable is that the politics have been taken out of the club, well done Liebherr.

 

For those fans that don't go into the suites during the game, it does not make a blind bit of difference whether an ex-player or what ever is there. The vast majority never get to see that side of things and are either down the road or meeting up in a pup.

[Nineteen Canteen]

You are right, it does happen elsewhere but does that make it right. The one thing that really would make me throw in the season ticket is seeing the hangers on waiting to get in on a complimentary, moaning that they have to wait and threatening to walk, just because their dad was special to fans. I really like the fact that I don't see ex players come into functions, stuff their pockets on a nod then off to see what else they can cadge.

 

Make all ex-players and personnel pay, then treat them like VIP's once they are in, with the food, drink and the seats. One thing that has really impressed and has been noticeable is that the politics have been taken out of the club, well done Liebherr.

 

For those fans that don't go into the suites during the game, it does not make a blind bit of difference whether an ex-player or what ever is there. The vast majority never get to see that side of things and are either down the road or meeting up in a pup.

 

I am 100% behind this initiative and agree with everything said above. Weston, I'm afraid McMenemy has acted like he has some god given right to free access to the club and had he behaved in a more diplomatic fashion in the years that followed his departure, then maybe things would have been different.

 

If he is upset by the need to the pay to watch SMS then IMO he only has himself to blame and Mr Liebherr can see that he was a symptom of the past problems and not the cure although he had plenty of opportunity to put that right but he sold the rights a bit too easily IMO.

 

As for Leon Crouch, evidence if any was needed that throwing money around does not impress unless it is backed up by a worthy plan. People say he saved the club but only because IMO he was trying to buy a place on the board and if the tyre kickers had not been supported Mr Liebherr and his team would have been in pole position a lot earlier.

 

SMS is a better place without Lowe and Wilde and equally it is better without Crouch and his football dinosaur. Sad but they need to take a close look at themselves before they mention their unhappiness about paying again. I doubt Mr Oldknow will be interested in reversing the decision and as the man generally regarded as bring Mr Liebherr to the club he is the one who should be considered for a lifetime season ticket if nothing else.

[Dibden Purlieu Saint]

SMS is a better place without Lowe and Wilde and equally it is better without Crouch and his football dinosaur. Sad but they need to take a close look at themselves before they mention their unhappiness about paying again. I doubt Mr Oldknow will be interested in reversing the decision and as the man generally regarded as bring Mr Liebherr to the club he is the one who should be considered for a lifetime season ticket if nothing else.

 

I will be ignored by everyone that you said this unfortunately, which is a shame...

[Nineteen Canteen]

I will be ignored by everyone that you said this unfortunately, which is a shame...

 

I know and my stance has always been that Lowe was Hobson's Choice in the absence of the 3 of them working together for the greater good. Of course if we had had a genuine ambassador at the club they could have brokered an invaluable agreement instead of taking sides.

[Leicestersaint]

It gives me no pleasure to say that Southampton Solent University is probably one of the worst universities in the whole country, however you look at it!

[scally]

It seems to me that where you stand on this issue depends on your age, and the Saints games you actually went to.

 

For me it is quite simple. In 1976 I saw the greatest moment in the clubs history, and in 1983/84 the greatest season. The one constant from both of these was Lawrie (and Nick Holmes) . Having attended 40 games in 1983/84, I can assure those of you not old enough to have been there, that we were the second best team in England for a whole season. We were undone by injuries to Steve Williams in April, and the fact that Frank Worthington couldn't shoot. In fact without the injury to Williams, we may well have won both the league and cup in that season.

 

Now I agree that you cannot comapre the post Sky era with what went before in terms of money, but to acheive what we did in 83/84, still required a very good manager. I doubt that anyone that Lowe employed could have matched what Lawrie acheived in 83/84.

 

However, for me the debate is whether, as a football fan, you aspire to winning things, or being financially sound as a club, happy to finish 12th. In that respect give me Lawrie's view of the football world than Lowe's any time.

 

I don't believe that Lowe was all bad for the club, but his spiteful actions last summer ensured we would be where we are now. For that reason, I would argue that Lowe lost any previous respect he may have earned, and we are far better off that he's no longer anywhere near the club.

 

The problem 19c has is that he wasn't around in those days, he was a supporter of some other club. Hopefully his alter ego will mean we get shot of him soon and some other poor sods will have to put up with his total ******

[Nineteen Canteen]

The problem 19c has is that he wasn't around in those days, he was a supporter of some other club. Hopefully his alter ego will mean we get shot of him soon and some other poor sods will have to put up with his total ******

 

You have a choice Scally and I recommend you do what I did when your brother was the big draw on match days. Turn up the ipod or turn up at 3pm.

 

Remember McMenemy is no WWII veteran so most fans under the age of 30 won't give a toss about him as it's football we are supporting and fans tend to only register a fondess for players ad managers that they grow up with as oppose to having an annual reminder of those who thought for king and country.

 

Feel sorry for the under 30's as they don't have an association with McMenemy and now their hero Matt Le Tissier has let them down and can't be bothered to give them a decent explanation as to why.

 

Thank god for Lowe

[miserableoldgit]

And you believe that McMenemy made any contribution to those thousands of pounds? I don't, my guess would be that Crouch paid and took McMenemy as his guest because Crouch likes to consider himself as part of the Saints dynasty as it were - bought in or otherwise of course.

 

Would McMenemy even allow Crouch to breathe the same air as him if Crouch wasn't loaded and gave McMenemy the opportunity for a free ride? IMO I don't think so and now the gravy train has departed the stadium what next for McMenemy? The personal purchase of a season ticket or membership? I doubt if he is even on the ticket office records.

So you don`t actually KNOW, but are prepared to carry on with the denigration on the basis of a guess??? Hmmmm......