America on the NHS

[Saintandy666]

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2009/aug/11/nhs-united-states-republican-health

 

The rightwing in America has been attacking the NHS to try and derail Obama's healthcare reforms, but some of the ******** they have come out with is just unfounded.

 

For example, one of the many lies put around about why the NHS is so bad is because they say if you are over 59 you can't get a heart bypass or operation... oh right because my Grandad wasn't 70 at the time of his triple heart bypass.

 

Apparently, also... the NHS values 6 months of life at $22,750 and if the treatment costs more than that, then they leave the person to die. What absolute ******** again.

 

The list goes on and on.

 

The NHS is one of the great things about this country, and they can make up all this crap about treatments we don't give, but I'd rather live in a country where I know I will always be treated and given a chance before my wallet is checked. Where you know you won't have to end up on the streets because your Mother contracts cancer.

 

Yes, the NHS isn't perfect, but people just don't realise how good we have it. And it's a darnsight better than what the US has. A system that works well for the rich, but forgets the poor.

[Baj]

Another corker:

 

The article's author went on to assert that "people such as scientist Stephen Hawking wouldn't have a chance in the UK, where the National Health Service would say the life of this brilliant man, because of his physical handicaps, is essentially worthless."

As the Atlanta Journal-Constitution's Jay Bookman quickly pointed out, Prof Hawking was born in the UK, and has lived and worked there for his entire life.

[revolution saint]

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2009/aug/11/nhs-united-states-republican-health

 

The rightwing in America has been attacking the NHS to try and derail Obama's healthcare reforms, but some of the ******** they have come out with is just unfounded.

 

For example, one of the many lies put around about why the NHS is so bad is because they say if you are over 59 you can't get a heart bypass or operation... oh right because my Grandad wasn't 70 at the time of his triple heart bypass.

 

Apparently, also... the NHS values 6 months of life at $22,750 and if the treatment costs more than that, then they leave the person to die. What absolute ******** again.

 

The list goes on and on.

 

The NHS is one of the great things about this country, and they can make up all this crap about treatments we don't give, but I'd rather live in a country where I know I will always be treated and given a chance before my wallet is checked. Where you know you won't have to end up on the streets because your Mother contracts cancer.

 

Yes, the NHS isn't perfect, but people just don't realise how good we have it. And it's a darnsight better than what the US has. A system that works well for the rich, but forgets the poor.

 

This is what happens when you take on the health care companies in the US. It's sad.

[Doctoroncall]

This is what happens when you take on the health care companies in the US. It's sad.

 

I've obviously missed something, what's the connection to healthcare companies?

[jeff leopard]

I strongly recommend people watch 'Sicko' (even if you've been suffering from an adversion to Michael Moore). There is a scene where they play a recording of Richard Nixon when he was Pres and it goes along these lines…

 

Adviser 'We're thinking about starting a health insurance scheme'

Nixon 'Look, you know how I feel about health cover'

Adviser ' Well, how it works is that people will pay insurance their whole lives, but when they get sick the companies will refuse to pay them anything'

 

And the US helath care system was born. The Health Care corps hire the best lawyers and private investigators to block any sizeable pay outs, or if they can't do that, they string the case out until, you guessed it, the person in question dies of their medical condition. God Bless America.

[OldNick]

I strongly recommend people watch 'Sicko' (even if you've been suffering from an adversion to Michael Moore). There is a scene where they play a recording of Richard Nixon when he was Pres and it goes along these lines…

 

Adviser 'We're thinking about starting a health insurance scheme'

Nixon 'Look, you know how I feel about health cover'

Adviser ' Well, how it works is that people will pay insurance their whole lives, but when they get sick the companies will refuse to pay them anything'

 

And the US helath care system was born. The Health Care corps hire the best lawyers and private investigators to block any sizeable pay outs, or if they can't do that, they string the case out until, you guessed it, the person in question dies of their medical condition. God Bless America.

I dont think that is quite right, it seems to me that is the reverse to the yanks are saying about our NHS.Scaremongering, although i deo understand the concept of trying to waste time until the patient dies.

The NHS is brilliant but terribly wasteful.I would like them to just become a little more efficient with our money.

In the US when i have been the people are resentful of paying high fees to subsidise the ones who are illegal or not pay into the system.

I suggest if we had never had the NHS and the government wanted us to pay more tax to pay for others to get treatment we ourselves would be up in arms.I myself resent people using loopholes to come in from abroad to give birth opr get treatment for free on us,sorry but that is the way I feel

[Baj]

Ive seen (and used) the Belgian healthcare system a couple of times.

 

As much as I want to get involved with this debate I dont have the time, however, I will show you 2 photos from the hospital in Antwerp I visited at the weekend, this is the '****' one.

 

 

It really as as clean and expansive as that... however, you also don't get these in the NHS

 

 

[Johnny Bognor]

however, you also don't get these in the NHS

 

 

 

That's right, the NHS is totally free and the budget for running it magically appears out of thin air.

 

Perish the thought of actually having to pay for healthcare - who would do that?

 

I just don't get these johnny foreigners, they should copy our system of a zero cost healthcare system.

 

 

We may not have one of these.......

 

But we do have one of these.......

 

The difference being that at least in the first scenario they need your PIN before they rob you blind, unlike the second scenario where they simply help themselves to your pay packet.

Edited 13 August, 2009 by Johnny Bognor

[Thedelldays]

That's right, the NHS is totally free and the budget for running it magically appears out of thin air.

 

Perish the thought of actually having to pay for healthcare - who would do that?

 

I just don't get these johnny foreigners, they should copy our system of a zero cost healthcare system.

good point well made..

 

what out of our mega taxes actually goes to the NHS..?

is it our national insurance..?

[Johnny Bognor]

good point well made..

 

what out of our mega taxes actually goes to the NHS..?

is it our national insurance..?

 

What do you mean Delldays? Are you suggesting that we actually pay for our healthcare system?

Surely this cannot be, as all the lefties keep telling us it's free.

 

Seriously, I think total annual spend is about £100bn per annum, which equates to about 3.5 Northern Rocks

Edited 13 August, 2009 by Johnny Bognor

[Thedelldays]

What do you mean Delldays?

 

Are you suggesting that we actually pay for our healthcare system?

 

Surely this cannot be, as all the lefties keep telling us it's free.

i know this..but I wonder what my contribution compares to that of a full service in the USofA

[Special K]

good point well made..

 

what out of our mega taxes actually goes to the NHS..?

is it our national insurance..?

 

110bn this year or 23.3% of central govnt spending goes on healthcare.

[Thedelldays]

110bn this year or 23.3% of central govnt spending goes on healthcare.

im on about my personal contribution to that of full cover of the same sort of deal in yank land

 

do I pay more..?

[Johnny Bognor]

im on about my personal contribution to that of full cover of the same sort of deal in yank land

 

do I pay more..?

 

 

Very difficult to calculate as what they don't take off you now, they will only borrow and you will be paying it back for years.

 

Very crudely, though, if you take the spend of £110,000,000,000 (as per Special K) and divide it by the population, lets say 60,000,000, then the NHS spend per head is nearly £1834 per annum.

 

Working out your contribution is quite difficult as it may be more or less than £1834 depending on your circumstances / salary etc.

Edited 13 August, 2009 by Johnny Bognor

[revolution saint]

Well we could all go on a rant about whether the NHS is good/bad and expensive/free but isn't the original post about treatment being based not on need but on cost effectiveness and the relative merit of treating the patient in question?

 

Isn't it about whether it's true or not that the NHS would refuse certain treatment for elderly patients?

[Thedelldays]

Very difficult to calculate as what they don't take off you now, they will borrow and you will be paying it back for years.

i do get annoyed when people dismiss the american system out of hand and claim ours is free..

 

im sure ours is very farking expensive to be fair...

 

also, is it true some people have had sex changes funded by the NHS..?

[Baj]

That's right, the NHS is totally free and the budget for running it magically appears out of thin air.

 

Perish the thought of actually having to pay for healthcare - who would do that?

 

I just don't get these johnny foreigners, they should copy our system of a zero cost healthcare system.

 

 

We may not have one of these.......

 

But we do have one of these.......

 

The difference being that at least in the first scenario they need your PIN before they rob you blind, unlike the second scenario where they simply help themselves to your pay packet.

 

I think you completely missed the point of my post. I was stating that no money is required when entering a leaving a hospital, hence chip n pin machines arent needed in them.

[Thedelldays]

I think you completely missed the point of my post. I was stating that no money is required when entering a leaving a hospital, hence chip n pin machines arent needed in them.

true..it is pre paid for

[Johnny Bognor]

true..it is pre paid for

 

Exactly.

[Saintandy666]

Yes, it's paid in taxes but because it's spread out you don't suddenly have to find £40,000 to pay for an operation, you know you are going to be treated regardless of whether you have to money. You say it's wasteful but we spend less per head on healthcare here in the uk than in the USA and still have a higher life expectancy and better healthcare system.

 

My original main point wasnt that there system is ****(I think it is though) but the lies a scared rightwing will spout to stop change, think up some real reasons why not instead of lies.

Edited 13 August, 2009 by Saintandy666

[Johnny Bognor]

Well we could all go on a rant about whether the NHS is good/bad and expensive/free

 

Something that costs £110bn a year is not free.

 

but isn't the original post about treatment being based not on need but on cost effectiveness and the relative merit of treating the patient in question? Isn't it about whether it's true or not that the NHS would refuse certain treatment for elderly patients?

 

NHS refuse treatment???

 

Never!

 

http://www.thisisstaffordshire.co.uk/news/Cancer-mum-loses-treatment-appeal/article-1177937-detail/article.html

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/health/healthnews/5955840/Patients-forced-to-live-in-agony-after-NHS-refuses-to-pay-for-painkilling-injections.html

 

 

Don't worry though, the lefties will pay for one of these.....

http://www.express.co.uk/posts/view/112058/-10m-NHS-bill-as-sex-change-operations-soar

[Thedelldays]

Yes, it's paid in taxes but because it's spread out you don't suddenly have to find £40,000 to pay for an operation, you know you are going to be treated regardless of whether you have to money. You say it's wasteful but we spend less per head on healthcare here in the uk than in the USA and still have a higher life expectancy and better healthcare system.

 

My original main point wasnt that there system is ****(I think it is though) but the lies a scared rightwing will spout to stop change, think up some real reasons why not instead of lies.

but if you have insurance (say a full cover) in the USA, surely you dont fork out £40k for an operation..?

[Wade Garrett]

Thank god for our NHS. It may be wasteful, to a degree. The hospitals may look nicer in other countries, but so what.

 

Our funding model for the NHS may be flawed, but better our model than the one in the USA. Why do you think Obama is trying to change it.

 

I have recently seen for myself what skilled and dedicated people we have working at the Southampton General. We're lucky to have them, end of story.

[Saintandy666]

but if you have insurance (say a full cover) in the USA, surely you dont fork out £40k for an operation..?

 

Key word: if, I think it is 40 million americans that don't have insurance because they can't afford it etc. Many might have it from their jobs... what if you lose your job half way through say a treatment, if the money stops the treatment stops and it's put on the streets, home and probably death.

 

All the richies don't seem to see it's not one of the other, they can still have their private separate hospitals while every else can afford the NHS eqivilent ones. However, I guess the healthcare companies would see different seeing as they'd lose alot of business, yes, in America healthcare is a business run for profit. In the USA, sick people are customers and that disgusts me.

[swannymere]

But you would still have to pay the premiums when your retired, someone will have to pay them for you between being born to starting your first job, and if you're unfortunate enough to be made unemployed you still have to find the money from somewhere. I'm sure if you're fit and healthy your whole life then you feel like you're being ripped off, as soon as you start needing the NHS if becomes a whole different ball game. I had pneumonia a few years ago which led to cardiac complication for 2 yours, i wouldn't be able to afford the insurance premiums if i was in the US.

[Thedelldays]

But you would still have to pay the premiums when your retired, someone will have to pay them for you between being born to starting your first job, and if you're unfortunate enough to be made unemployed you still have to find the money from somewhere. I'm sure if you're fit and healthy your whole life then you feel like you're being ripped off, as soon as you start needing the NHS if becomes a whole different ball game. I had pneumonia a few years ago which led to cardiac complication for 2 yours, i wouldn't be able to afford the insurance premiums if i was in the US.

do you know what this would cost..?

 

im not being flippant just generally want to know what health care cover costs in america..

[Weston Super Saint]

Key word: if, I think it is 40 million americans that don't have insurance because they can't afford it etc.

 

And how many of those that 'can't afford it' spunk the money that they could easily put towards health insurance on booze and fags instead?

[bridge too far]

do you know what this would cost..?

 

im not being flippant just generally want to know what health care cover costs in america..

 

I don't know what the cover costs. But I do know that my ex sister-in-law, who has lived and worked in the US for 40 odd years and paid health insurance, couldn't afford to come home for her mother's funeral because of the personal cost of her treatment for breast cancer. Her insurance didn't cover the cost of treatment.

 

Her family have had to help her with the cost.

 

A stark contrast to the cost of my mother's treatment for leukaemia - around £30,000 a year for the past 9 years and not costing her a penny.

 

Thank goodness for the NHS for all it's perceived failings (many of which are media scaremongering).

[jeff leopard]

And how many of those that 'can't afford it' spunk the money that they could easily put towards health insurance on booze and fags instead?

 

thank god we've not fallen back upon lazy tabloid stereotypes, that would be terrible.

 

let me guess your next point, the poor need to be shaved, sterilised and destroyed.

[revolution saint]

Something that costs £110bn a year is not free.

 

 

 

NHS refuse treatment???

 

Never!

 

http://www.thisisstaffordshire.co.uk/news/Cancer-mum-loses-treatment-appeal/article-1177937-detail/article.html

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/health/healthnews/5955840/Patients-forced-to-live-in-agony-after-NHS-refuses-to-pay-for-painkilling-injections.html

 

 

Don't worry though, the lefties will pay for one of these.....

http://www.express.co.uk/posts/view/112058/-10m-NHS-bill-as-sex-change-operations-soar

 

Does the NHS refuse heart bypass operations for people over 59?

 

Does the NHS value 6 months of life at $22,750?

 

Wasn't that the original point? Clearly you want to be angry at the NHS and that's fine but it wasn't really the point of the post in the first place. Try counting to ten or something.

[Saintandy666]

And how many of those that 'can't afford it' spunk the money that they could easily put towards health insurance on booze and fags instead?

 

I don't know but our system of funding is much better than theirs where you are at the mercy of whether the insurance company thinks your treatment is covered under your policy and whether you'll have to fork out thousands or not. Yes, someone may come back with you're at the mercy of the NHS but it's different because it isn't a run for profit organisation. The NHS has a moral/governmental obligation to treat you.

[LVSaint]

And how many of those that 'can't afford it' spunk the money that they could easily put towards health insurance on booze and fags instead?

 

Untrue.

 

If you are self employed or have an employer who don't offer subsidised health insurance you are faced with hundreds of dollars a month to be covered with a very inferior plan where you would still need to meet a 'deductible' for any surgeries (say $2,500). At that point you would be facing 10 or 20% of the inflated costs from there on. It is revolting and even more revolting that the right wing ****pots can even start criticsing socialised healthcare.

 

I don't see how there can be an NHS in America but affordable insurance needs to be offered to ALL and the horrible 'pre-existing conditions' nightmare totally dropped - this is the thing that screws most up over here.

[OldNick]

Untrue.

 

If you are self employed or have an employer who don't offer subsidised health insurance you are faced with hundreds of dollars a month to be covered with a very inferior plan where you would still need to meet a 'deductible' for any surgeries (say $2,500). At that point you would be facing 10 or 20% of the inflated costs from there on. It is revolting and even more revolting that the right wing ****pots can even start criticsing socialised healthcare.

 

I don't see how there can be an NHS in America but affordable insurance needs to be offered to ALL and the horrible 'pre-existing conditions' nightmare totally dropped - this is the thing that screws most up over here.

I would not wish for the NHS to go.What percentage of our wages should be taken to pay for the nations healthcare.I think the Yanks see it as the ones who work hard yet again paying for those who can't/won't do anything to help themselves.I can understand that.I myself am happy to pay towards the people who really are vulnerable but the hangers on I dont want to contribute toward.

There has to be a balance IMO

[Johnny Bognor]

Does the NHS refuse heart bypass operations for people over 59?

 

Does the NHS value 6 months of life at $22,750?

 

Wasn't that the original point? Clearly you want to be angry at the NHS and that's fine but it wasn't really the point of the post in the first place. Try counting to ten or something.

 

Sorry, I didn't get back to you sooner, but I was eating my sandwich which incidentally was FREE at the point of use - how about that?

(the fact I bought it on my way to work this morning has nothing to do with it)

 

I have no problem with the NHS, well apart from the wastage but that can be sorted easily enough and is an argument for another day.

 

However, I have a problem with the leftie liars that try to pretend it is free - This leftie lie is part of a whole smokescreen to make thick voters believe they will get something for nothing in life and then we wonder why there are so many idle scroungers????

 

Our governement lies are greater than those of the loony right in the good ole u s of a.

Edited 13 August, 2009 by Johnny Bognor

[Baj]

Johnny, you're the only one on here getting worked up about someone saying its free, which none of us have, you appear to be having and argument with yourself...

[Johnny Bognor]

Johnny, you're the only one on here getting worked up about someone saying its free, which none of us have, you appear to be having and argument with yourself...

 

My last post kind of gets to the point.

 

In short, everyone is wetting themselves over US Right Wing Lies about the NHS (particularly the lefties) when our very own goverment lie every time they peddle the old "free at the point of use" bull.

 

Thankfully I am posting on a forum that is free at the point of use (except for when my subscription is due).

Edited 13 August, 2009 by Johnny Bognor

[Saintandy666]

Not at all. Thankfully I am posting on a forum that is free at the point of use (except for when my subscription is due).

 

My last post kind of gets to the point.

 

In short, everyone is wetting themselves over US Right Wing Lies about the NHS (particularly the lefties) when our very own goverment lie every time they peddle the old "free at the point of use" bull.

 

No-one is lying in the government or otherwise that a proportion of our taxes is what funds the NHS. It's this system that makes it affordable for every single person in this country.

 

In contrast the U.S rightwing has just made up absolute bull**** from which has no basis in fact at all.

[revolution saint]

My last post kind of gets to the point.

 

In short, everyone is wetting themselves over US Right Wing Lies about the NHS (particularly the lefties) when our very own goverment lie every time they peddle the old "free at the point of use" bull.

 

Thankfully I am posting on a forum that is free at the point of use (except for when my subscription is due).

 

free at the point of use is different to free. No one said it wasn't.

[Johnny Bognor]

free at the point of use is different to free. No one said it wasn't.

 

"Free at the point of use" is a leftie smokescreen which infers that healthcare is free, when in fact, it is not.

 

It is in fact "pre-paid" if you are a tax payer. If is only free if you are a non-contributor to society.

 

I just wish the lefties would be honest about it, that's all. As Clown and Co don't know the meaning of honest, why is every one getting their knickers in a twist over the septics????

[bridge too far]

And the most admirable part of 'free at the point of use' is that treatment is based on need and not on how wealthy you are / aren't.

 

I still remember the case of the little American boy who died needing dental treatment because his parents couldn't afford insurance (in the Michael Moore documentary).

 

I also remember lying on a stretcher in the Emergency Room in a hospital in Austria, in agony, and not being treated until they'd established that I'd got travel insurance!

[bridge too far]

"Free at the point of use" is a leftie smokescreen which infers that healthcare is free, when in fact, it is not.

 

It is in fact "pre-paid" if you are a tax payer. If is only free if you are a non-contributor to society.

 

I just wish the lefties would be honest about it, that's all. As Clown and Co don't know the meaning of honest, why is every one getting their knickers in a twist over the septics????

 

If you're a child, for example?

 

If you're a pensioner?

[revolution saint]

"Free at the point of use" is a leftie smokescreen which infers that healthcare is free, when in fact, it is not.

 

It is in fact "pre-paid" if you are a tax payer. If is only free if you are a non-contributor to society.

 

I just wish the lefties would be honest about it, that's all. As Clown and Co don't know the meaning of honest, why is every one getting their knickers in a twist over the septics????

 

As far as I can see you're the only person getting your knickers in a twist protesting something that no one here has claimed. Back to the original claim (and point of the thread):

 

Does the NHS refuse heart bypass operations for people over 59?

 

Does the NHS value 6 months of life at $22,750?

[Johnny Bognor]

As far as I can see you're the only person getting your knickers in a twist protesting something that no one here has claimed. Back to the original claim (and point of the thread):

 

Does the NHS refuse heart bypass operations for people over 59?

 

It's only a matter of time.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/1576704/Dont-treat-the-old-and-unhealthy-say-doctors.html

 

Does the NHS value 6 months of life at $22,750?

 

The NHS place a monetary value on someone's life?

You're pulling my leg aren't you?

 

http://www.thisisbristol.co.uk/health/Bristol-grandmother-refused-cancer-drug/article-935954-detail/article.html

Mrs Jarvis, 66, said: "They are saying that for the sake of £10,000 a year my life is not worth saving. How could they put that price on my life?"

 

This one is for the Americans on here....

http://news.sky.com/skynews/Home/UK-News/American-Man-Offers-To-Pay-For-Cancer-Drug-Refused-by-NHS-So-Dad-Jack-Rosser-Can-See-Daughter-Grow/Article/200812215174349

 

 

 

Look, I would rather have the NHS than not have the NHS, but people need to be honest and stop pretending it is something which it is not. This is no different to what they are doing over the pond.

[Clapham Saint]

I think the Yanks see it as the ones who work hard yet again paying for those who can't/won't do anything to help themselves.I can understand that.I myself am happy to pay towards the people who really are vulnerable but the hangers on I dont want to contribute toward.

There has to be a balance IMO

 

Completely agree with this bit.

Opinions do tend to get very polarised on things like the NHS. I’ve never worked for/with the NHS and so will concede that I have absolutely no expert knowledge on this but…

Ultimately if everybody has to pay their own way there will be people with genuine need who are unable to pay for treatment and suffer unfairly and unjustifiably.

Equally if the government/tax payer fund everything there will be spongers who take a lot more than they put in. Some because they contribute nothing (which others resent) and some because they have treatment which may be considered unnecessary/luxury (e.g. cosmetic surgery).

The other issue is that although the NHS as is doesn’t seek to make a profit as a private company does (obviously) it is, or appears to me anyway, to be amazingly inefficient. IMO private providers would be able to offer the same services for much less than it costs the NHS.

IMO there it must be possible to work out a system of “national insurance” whereby the government will pay for a basic level of cover for all through a panel of private companies (competing with each other). Although these companies would be seeking to make a profit they should be able to do so by having a much lower cost base rather than charging more than it currently costs the NHS.

The details would have to be sorted out by others who know more about healthcare than I but I would envisage this covering cancer treatments, A&E, broken legs that I would term “basic/essential need treatments”.

If people then want to be covered for “discretionary treatments” like cosmetic surgery to correct a broken nose or a sex change operation then they can fund that themselves.

Maybe I’m being naive though.

Of course now that the NHS is in place to close it down/sell it off/get rid of the layers of middle management etc would cost an absolute fortune and so probably isn’t practical.

[Thedelldays]

the fact a sex change is available on the NHS in any capacity is utterly ridiculous

[Clapham Saint]

Ive seen (and used) the Belgian healthcare system a couple of times.

 

 

I was treated by the belgian system once when I needed a scan on my ankle.

 

They were brilliant.

 

Had me in and out straight away and saw the doctor again about 30 miniutes after I had the scan.

 

When I had the same in the UK is was about a month after the scan...

[bridge too far]

It's only a matter of time.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/1576704/Dont-treat-the-old-and-unhealthy-say-doctors.html

 

 

 

The NHS place a monetary value on someone's life?

You're pulling my leg aren't you?

 

http://www.thisisbristol.co.uk/health/Bristol-grandmother-refused-cancer-drug/article-935954-detail/article.html

Mrs Jarvis, 66, said: "They are saying that for the sake of £10,000 a year my life is not worth saving. How could they put that price on my life?"

 

This one is for the Americans on here....

http://news.sky.com/skynews/Home/UK-News/American-Man-Offers-To-Pay-For-Cancer-Drug-Refused-by-NHS-So-Dad-Jack-Rosser-Can-See-Daughter-Grow/Article/200812215174349

 

 

 

Look, I would rather have the NHS than not have the NHS, but people need to be honest and stop pretending it is something which it is not. This is no different to what they are doing over the pond.

 

But we don't know the truth behind this story, do we. I've already mentioned my mother - she had leukaemia treatment at £30,000 a year for 9 years. The treatment started when she was 74!!

 

Unfortunately, some pharma companies encourage people with terminal conditions to press for expensive treatments that haven't been proved to be efficacious over given timespan and it tends to be these drugs that aren't available on the NHS.

 

The leukaemia drugs my mother was prescribed have shown remarkable improvements in life expectancy (she died from an unrelated condition).

 

So it's nothing to do with the age of the patient. It's more to do with the illness and the efficacy of the drugs.

[revolution saint]

It's only a matter of time.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/1576704/Dont-treat-the-old-and-unhealthy-say-doctors.html

 

 

 

The NHS place a monetary value on someone's life?

You're pulling my leg aren't you?

 

http://www.thisisbristol.co.uk/health/Bristol-grandmother-refused-cancer-drug/article-935954-detail/article.html

Mrs Jarvis, 66, said: "They are saying that for the sake of £10,000 a year my life is not worth saving. How could they put that price on my life?"

 

This one is for the Americans on here....

http://news.sky.com/skynews/Home/UK-News/American-Man-Offers-To-Pay-For-Cancer-Drug-Refused-by-NHS-So-Dad-Jack-Rosser-Can-See-Daughter-Grow/Article/200812215174349

 

 

 

Look, I would rather have the NHS than not have the NHS, but people need to be honest and stop pretending it is something which it is not. This is no different to what they are doing over the pond.

 

So despite everything that's still No, the NHS don't descriminate on age and no they don't place an arbitrary price on six months of life at $20,000. Took a while but we got there in the end!

[Doctoroncall]

Part of the problem with the NHS is government interference with constant change of policy WITHOUT consultantion with those on the ground.

 

Just when a new policy is established a new minister wants to put their mark on the way the NHS is run.

 

Did anyone see the "Can Gerry Robinson fix the NHS programmes"? A great insight to where money is wasted and the power struggle of NHS Trusts: http://www.open2.net/nhs/index.html

 

sorry this is off topic but thought there was genuine interest.

Edited 13 August, 2009 by Doctoroncall

[Thedelldays]

So despite everything that's still No, the NHS don't descriminate on age and no they don't place an arbitrary price on six months of life at $20,000. Took a while but we got there in the end!

it may not descriminate on age..but it does refuse treatment...