Our Position Or Pompey's?

[dubai_phil]

Do you really think it is financially viable to redevelop portsmouth?!?

 

Even if they take on your debt (how many millions god only knows), rebuild your team to one with a decent chance of staying up (£30mill?) and build a new ground (£50mill?), only then you have a club with an income comparible to Stoke - How are you going to make a profit? Sell more pies?

 

I'm sorry but the hard facts are Gaydamak wants his money back, the banks want their money back. Either you go into admin, sell all you players and go down then into admin, or find a billionare happy to chuck millions down a black hole. there is no other way out unless Hart is a genius.

 

 

And even IF they find a billionaire, HOW long does he have left to buy the players they will need to be competitive in the PL?

 

It's all well and good buying the club now, but the cost vs risk factor that they could be dead and buried before they can sign Ronaldo, Becham, Terry, Defoe (oh) et al in January

 

Redevelopment opportunities are all very well but there is this minor matter of the recession to deal with,

 

Hell you can buy Dubai for 40 cents in the dollar right now

[Justin C]

This is a good read about poopey, we get a mention bu the guy sums it all up well. IMO

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/mattslater/2009/08/end_in_sight_for_pompeys_blues.html

[spyinthesky]

As an aside, anyone know how the Portsmouth New's campaign ..'Arise Sir Harry' is going.?

 

Apparently still a live item on the paper's web site!!

[Eyes k8]

But Leibherr bought us out of Administration for around £16 million (this years interest on his personal fortune), no debt, no stadium to build and no training complex to develop. The only further outlay is to fund the playing budget over the year (a percentage being self funding anyway) and in 4, 5, 6 years all being well he will own a Premier League club worth several times his outlay.

 

The guys buying you will have to pay SG around £40 million, take on a similar value in debts and liabilities fund a stadium which will cost £80/100 million a training complex @ approx £15/20 million before any cash goes into funding the football team. If it's going to take £50 million to rebuild the squad to where you were under Redknapp then that's going to cost these guys a quarter of a billion. I think Stoke is a safer bet TBH.

 

So how much money is this old swiss guy going to blow over the next 4,5,6 years on the gamble of trying to get two promotions. Transfers and wages are not cheap. At the moment he's got in a manager that took his club down a couple of divisions, how much would he need to pay a decent manager? How much is Mr L going to bet?

[Nineteen Canteen]

So how much money is this old swiss guy going to blow over the next 4,5,6 years on the gamble of trying to get two promotions. Transfers and wages are not cheap. At the moment he's got in a manager that took his club down a couple of divisions, how much would he need to pay a decent manager? How much is Mr L going to bet?

 

Mr Liebherr doesn't gamble or make loans allegedly and we will fund our rise through the divisions by the profits we generate from our consistently loyal fanbase and the fact we have no operating debt to service. You could have the richest owner in the world but it means nothing in terms of speed of promotion if he doesn't want to commit funds beyond their original investment which surely is the shrewd thing to do looking at it dispassionately.

 

Looking at Pompey's position it seems to me you have two hopes. Gaydamak has a change of heart and stays or you go into administration and shamelessly screw those stupid enough to lend you the money in the first place. As we have found -10 points seems a small price to pay to be debt free but it is a disgrace tbh and no doubt many small businesses lose out.

[Torrent Of Abuse]

Well obviously money.

 

You may have to spend about 150m in maintenance and building a ground but if you end up with a 40k ground with good access and 90% attenance you have something worth 300m.

 

Rupert built you St mary's for similar reasons because it's worth more than the dell and can hold a greater capacity.

 

You have to have the money first however the credit crunch put pay to Sacha. You make money by changing things. No point in buying us if you are going to leave the cow shed as it is. If these guys come on board it will be because they believe they can make money out of developing us, they'd hardly do it otherwise would they. We'll see if it happens.

 

You're quite the optimist - which is understandable given your love for the club. That said, you have to realise that building a 40,000 stadium doesn't get you anything like that kind of attendance. You would get around 27,000 average IF you were still in the PL. it takes a generation at least to build the fan base. In 3 years, the fans you found/rediscovered would actually end up back watching games on TV Instead of attending. It's a sad truth which we found for ourselves.

 

You've had a nightmare preparation to the season which will see you strugging (perhaps without chance of escape) come Christmas. From there, buying up every player won't save you as you will already have that downward momentum. Then relegation would see yet more challenges.

 

You need a new stadium and new team and time to bring the together. I think the stuffing around of SAF has pretty much damned your season in the same way that Pinnacle klilled our promotion chances. Another season in Div 3 for us will be hard given that we have brought in players ambitious for success. I think relegation would, however, knock your guys out for another 10 years.

 

I seriously doubt you have anyone able to fund all you need to keep you afloat. And I don't think you have time on your side.

[Eyes k8]

Mr Liebherr doesn't gamble or make loans allegedly and we will fund our rise through the divisions by the profits we generate from our consistently loyal fanbase and the fact we have no operating debt to service. You could have the richest owner in the world but it means nothing in terms of speed of promotion if he doesn't want to commit funds beyond their original investment which surely is the shrewd thing to do looking at it dispassionately.

 

Looking at Pompey's position it seems to me you have two hopes. Gaydamak has a change of heart and stays or you go into administration and shamelessly screw those stupid enough to lend you the money in the first place. As we have found -10 points seems a small price to pay to be debt free but it is a disgrace tbh and no doubt many small businesses lose out.

 

Agree with you about the small businessmen. Mr L is not with you to balance the books from profits generated from your consistently loyal fan base(What % fall did you have last year). I doubt if fan income would balance the books for the squad MR L inherited. The good news for you guys is that like Milan with us he is going to put in money to fund transfers and wages to get promotion which increases the value of the club which in turn gives him a profit when he sells up. SO seriously how much money do you think he will need to subsidise the club each year for your promotion pushes? And how much do you think the club would be worth in the three divisions-L1, champ and prem? I've just looked at your position in the table you better do L" as well.

[Master Bates]

So Pompey no longer train at Eastleigh, they train at King Edward VI School.

 

To train, Portsmouth use the facilities of the King Edward VI School. This may not matter - they won the FA Cup from here - but when manager Paul Hart sat in a schoolboy-sized changing room yesterday and spoke of Arsenal, he described them as a club 'with a structure'.

 

 

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-1208261/Are-Chimes-tolling-death-knell-Pompey.html?ITO=1490#ixzz0OtLQnbO4

Edited 22 August, 2009 by Master Bates

[dubai_phil]

So Pompey no longer train at Eastleigh, they train at King Edward VI School.

 

 

 

 

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-1208261/Are-Chimes-tolling-death-knell-Pompey.html?ITO=1490#ixzz0OtLQnbO4

 

Nice article MB...

 

Also it does raise one interesting point that we as Saints fans should take on board.

 

Gaydamark was supposed to have a rich Daddy. So the fans thought that he was pumping in his cash. As a private club, they had no need to tell the world it was all done through debt.

 

With Saints, a realistic business plan to get back to and produce a squad capable of staying IN the PL would need around 80 mil over about 5 years. Some 20mil of that woould be covered by the increased TV revenues but the investment without developing our own stars would be needed.

 

Now with a billionaire using cash, at the bottom of the recession, that is a sustainable plan, as the asking value for a PL club is between 100-150mil.

 

The DANGER would come if the investment came in the form of loans as happened in Portsmouth, to an extent in Chelsea and also in a way at Liverpool & Man U. An owner with wealth can equally act as the security for the loans of his business, not much different from most small busiinessmen. While you have a plan, sensible sustainable development and an every expanding stram of TV income, it is fine. But when boredom sets in, or tough times come around or simply it is time to stand on your own two feet, life can become very harsh. Chelsea don't spend like they did and Kenyon keeps telling anyone who will listen that they are working to break even.

 

Sensibly done, it can work. Unfortunately the sorry tale of the Sk*tes shows that not much sense was used with these obvious results, and the deja vu moment for them is that the people who made the unwise decisions are still around trying to keep the keys to the train set

[CHAPEL END CHARLIE]

Agree with you about the small businessmen. Mr L is not with you to balance the books from profits generated from your consistently loyal fan base(What % fall did you have last year). I doubt if fan income would balance the books for the squad MR L inherited. The good news for you guys is that like Milan with us he is going to put in money to fund transfers and wages to get promotion which increases the value of the club which in turn gives him a profit when he sells up. SO seriously how much money do you think he will need to subsidise the club each year for your promotion pushes? And how much do you think the club would be worth in the three divisions-L1, champ and prem? I've just looked at your position in the table you better do L" as well.

 

If you really think that 63 year old Markus Liebherr acquired this club because of some overwhelming need to turn a quick profit then you've little understanding of the true natural of his and his family's (extreme) wealth . Why he did buy SFC is an interesting (unanswered) question however - for now I can only guess SFC is some kind of retirement hobby or that he places so much trust in Nicola Cortese's judgement that he'd back him in whatever business NC took an interest in .

 

To return to the original point of this thread 'Our position or Pompey's ?' - whatever the reason behind ML's purchase of SFC the fact remains we are (for the foreseeable future anyway) in a infinitely more secure financial position than PFC . I'm not at all sure how much of that security I'd be prepared to surrender to enjoy the all too fleeting glory that is EPL membership .

Edited 22 August, 2009 by CHAPEL END CHARLIE

[Wes Tender]

So how much money is this old swiss guy going to blow over the next 4,5,6 years on the gamble of trying to get two promotions. Transfers and wages are not cheap. At the moment he's got in a manager that took his club down a couple of divisions, how much would he need to pay a decent manager? How much is Mr L going to bet?

 

How much is this young Arab going to blow over the next 4,5,6 years on the gamble of trying to keep you afloat in the top division? Transfers and wages in the Premiership are not cheap. At the moment you've got in a manager more used to coaching youngsters or lower league clubs. How much would the fake sheik have to pay a decent manager? How much is SAF going to bet of money he doesn't have?

[Wes Tender]

According to the latest edition of The News, Fahim's spokesman says that German Investment Banker Holger Heims was not interested in buying Pompey, but merely advising the fake shiek.

 

Furthermore, Hong Kong billionaire Richard Li also denies any interest in taking over the Skates.

 

Are there any other names of billionaires that delusioned Skate fans might pull out of the hat before the transfer window closes? It has got to the stage that some clubs are reticent about selling their players to Pompey in case they won't be paid, but thankfully the FA has stepped in with guarantees that the payments can be deducted from TV recipts. This is assuming that that money has not already been earmarked for debt repayment to other lenders.

[aintforever]

A big problem the skates will have now is that they are a much worse prospect now than even a few months ago. Even though they have reduced the debt, because the season has started and their squad is a mess, their one and only asset (PL status) is looking less and less secure.

 

Even if someone takes over now they wont pass the FPP test before the transfer deadline and even if they spunk millions on a decent manager and a load of loan signings, staying up is still much more of a gamble now that it would have been if they had bought the club in June.

[rallyboy]

none of us know what the Barclays debt is exactly but I seem to recall them being prepared to wind up similar companies when it got to £5M.

If they follow that trend it's all over in nine days time, and Gaydamak's desperate asset-stripping is his only payback - and illegal.

 

Is Peter 'Story' still undermining other bidders to make a fast buck for himself or has he settled for his atronomical wages?

 

What a mess, and we should know as we have watched one long drawn out train crash already.

 

''But we are in the Prem!!''

yes, it's the ONLY value in the business, lose it at your peril.

 

If Sky had trading problems at 9am tomorrow, Pompey would be in administration by lunchtime.

[Nineteen Canteen]

According to the latest edition of The News, Fahim's spokesman says that German Investment Banker Holger Heims was not interested in buying Pompey, but merely advising the fake shiek.

 

Furthermore, Hong Kong billionaire Richard Li also denies any interest in taking over the Skates.

 

Are there any other names of billionaires that delusioned Skate fans might pull out of the hat before the transfer window closes? It has got to the stage that some clubs are reticent about selling their players to Pompey in case they won't be paid, but thankfully the FA has stepped in with guarantees that the payments can be deducted from TV recipts. This is assuming that that money has not already been earmarked for debt repayment to other lenders.

 

Wes, delusional Skate fans? And what about us Saints fans - 'We are a premiership club' . Paul Allen and all that.

[Nineteen Canteen]

Agree with you about the small businessmen. Mr L is not with you to balance the books from profits generated from your consistently loyal fan base(What % fall did you have last year). I doubt if fan income would balance the books for the squad MR L inherited. The good news for you guys is that like Milan with us he is going to put in money to fund transfers and wages to get promotion which increases the value of the club which in turn gives him a profit when he sells up. SO seriously how much money do you think he will need to subsidise the club each year for your promotion pushes? And how much do you think the club would be worth in the three divisions-L1, champ and prem? I've just looked at your position in the table you better do L" as well.

 

Eyes K8, I was being slightly ironic about the consistency of our fanbase and I seriously believe Liebherr will invest very little beyond the purchase price and structure he has put in place. We will spend what we earn, end off, and hopefully those deluded by his wealth will show some patience. Just my totally impartial and unconnected opinion.

[OldNick]

none of us know what the Barclays debt is exactly but I seem to recall them being prepared to wind up similar companies when it got to £5M.

If they follow that trend it's all over in nine days time, and Gaydamak's desperate asset-stripping is his only payback - and illegal.

 

Is Peter 'Story' still undermining other bidders to make a fast buck for himself or has he settled for his atronomical wages?

 

What a mess, and we should know as we have watched one long drawn out train crash already.

 

''But we are in the Prem!!''

yes, it's the ONLY value in the business, lose it at your peril.

 

If Sky had trading problems at 9am tomorrow, Pompey would be in administration by lunchtime.

Pompeys value now is PL status only. It is now a pivotal period for them.If they get cut adrift at the bottom of the table and no HR to save the day their value will be almost worthless.I still thionk they will somehow scrape through , they have had so much luck in the last few years it is bound not to run out yet.

[hypochondriac]

Eyes K8, I was being slightly ironic about the consistency of our fanbase and I seriously believe Liebherr will invest very little beyond the purchase price and structure he has put in place. We will spend what we earn, end off, and hopefully those deluded by his wealth will show some patience. Just my totally impartial and unconnected opinion.

 

I don't think we can really say either way. I don't think he will in league one but once in the prem who knows?

[Eyes k8]

Nice article MB...

 

Also it does raise one interesting point that we as Saints fans should take on board.

 

Gaydamark was supposed to have a rich Daddy. So the fans thought that he was pumping in his cash. As a private club, they had no need to tell the world it was all done through debt.

 

With Saints, a realistic business plan to get back to and produce a squad capable of staying IN the PL would need around 80 mil over about 5 years. Some 20mil of that woould be covered by the increased TV revenues but the investment without developing our own stars would be needed.

 

Now with a billionaire using cash, at the bottom of the recession, that is a sustainable plan, as the asking value for a PL club is between 100-150mil.

 

The DANGER would come if the investment came in the form of loans as happened in Portsmouth, to an extent in Chelsea and also in a way at Liverpool & Man U. An owner with wealth can equally act as the security for the loans of his business, not much different from most small busiinessmen. While you have a plan, sensible sustainable development and an every expanding stram of TV income, it is fine. But when boredom sets in, or tough times come around or simply it is time to stand on your own two feet, life can become very harsh. Chelsea don't spend like they did and Kenyon keeps telling anyone who will listen that they are working to break even.

 

Sensibly done, it can work. Unfortunately the sorry tale of the Sk*tes shows that not much sense was used with these obvious results, and the deja vu moment for them is that the people who made the unwise decisions are still around trying to keep the keys to the train set

It seems Phil you're the only one prepared to answer the questions about saints, most of the rest just want to drivel on about Pompey. I think your figures are round about right that it's going to cost Mr L about 80 to get a return of 100-150 but there is of course no guarantee of a return. If for the sake of argument you are prepared to grant us a value of 125-175 it doesb't leave us any room for manouve if my estimate of 150 for new ground and squad maintainence is correct. we will see.

[dubai_phil]

It seems Phil you're the only one prepared to answer the questions about saints, most of the rest just want to drivel on about Pompey. I think your figures are round about right that it's going to cost Mr L about 80 to get a return of 100-150 but there is of course no guarantee of a return. If for the sake of argument you are prepared to grant us a value of 125-175 it doesb't leave us any room for manouve if my estimate of 150 for new ground and squad maintainence is correct. we will see.

 

You're not worth 150mil. Sorry. Other clubs with developed infrastructure are on the market for less, who also have an upside potential medium/long term for development of property or other "incremental revenue streams".

 

You need a stadium build, you want 40,000 so using the basic maths thats what it cost us - 32,000/32mil plus inflation of say 20% you need close to 48mil build cost.

 

Then you need the land, ours was free, yours?

 

So the undisclosed debt is way above 25 mil, and your squad is shorn of the players and needs another 25 mil to stay up in the next 7 days

 

So, no land, no idea on the debts other than Standard and not enough players (14 fit first teamers - Paul Hart)

 

So ground 48, known debt and squad 50, already you are at the limit of what your competition for buyers is at.

 

Add the cost of buying any land, and in all likelihood more debt due to PL clubs....

 

That's your problem.

 

SBT does not have the funds, think that is pretty clear now to everyone.

 

Why did I laugh when you all started getting excited about him and when you all commented on him turning up at Fratton for tea and sandwiches all those months back?

 

I tell you, the truth's gonna REALLY hurt. :cool:

 

So, you could be bought, but I really don't think you'll get bought with the funding for a stadium in the CURRENT climate, which means you won't get the World Cup and you will have to live in your means on 20,000 crowds. Either you'll all be paying 3 grand a year for ST's or ........

 

Oh, as for that budgetted figure, did I ever mention I think our boys have a damned good business plan? And good luck to them with it I say

[NickG]

including money owed to agents?

 

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-1208368/Now-Portsmouth-make-agents-wait-money.html

[Eyes k8]

You're not worth 150mil. Sorry. Other clubs with developed infrastructure are on the market for less, who also have an upside potential medium/long term for development of property or other "incremental revenue streams".

 

You need a stadium build, you want 40,000 so using the basic maths thats what it cost us - 32,000/32mil plus inflation of say 20% you need close to 48mil build cost.

 

Then you need the land, ours was free, yours?

 

So the undisclosed debt is way above 25 mil, and your squad is shorn of the players and needs another 25 mil to stay up in the next 7 days

 

So, no land, no idea on the debts other than Standard and not enough players (14 fit first teamers - Paul Hart)

 

So ground 48, known debt and squad 50, already you are at the limit of what your competition for buyers is at.

 

Add the cost of buying any land, and in all likelihood more debt due to PL clubs....

 

That's your problem.

 

SBT does not have the funds, think that is pretty clear now to everyone.

 

Why did I laugh when you all started getting excited about him and when you all commented on him turning up at Fratton for tea and sandwiches all those months back?

 

I tell you, the truth's gonna REALLY hurt. :cool:

 

So, you could be bought, but I really don't think you'll get bought with the funding for a stadium in the CURRENT climate, which means you won't get the World Cup and you will have to live in your means on 20,000 crowds. Either you'll all be paying 3 grand a year for ST's or ........

 

Oh, as for that budgetted figure, did I ever mention I think our boys have a damned good business plan? And good luck to them with it I say

 

According to the Mirror quoting Storrie, it's not Al Fahim but an individual from a family in the middle east. I know you've got your ear to the sand Phil, any rumours out there as to who?

[dubai_phil]

According to the Mirror quoting Storrie, it's not Al Fahim but an individual from a family in the middle east. I know you've got your ear to the sand Phil, any rumours out there as to who?

 

Well, if they're from Saudi ...

 

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/newsbysector/banksandfinance/6074549/Saudi-families-square-up-over-20bn-fraud.html

 

From Dubai, then the release of figures last week of the debt level at Dubai Holding has pushed estimates of the debt Dubai quasi Gov operations up to around $100BILLION.

 

Much of the local families were heaviliy into property (obviously) but funded through Eurobonds which are starting to come up so their problems are pretty simple.

 

http://business.maktoob.com/20090000360291/UAE_property_prices_fall_in_Q2;_revival_off/Article.htm?utm_campaign=Day-Newsletter&utm_medium=Main-News1&utm_source=Day-Newsletter&utm_content=

 

The local banking sector has all but dried up sources of lending, so that locals cannot leverage their book assets, most of the others will have their money tied up in securities and that leaves you looking for having to sell stocks to raise cash.

 

The Bahrainis have looked at investment but at a low and grow level, the Qataris have already jumped in with both feet with Notts County, people from football have been banging down the doors in Kuwait for years (including Ashley when he was wealthy).

The Saudi's have also looked in detail at football, and a number of research projects were under way before the crash last year and one of those looked to continue as they were in behind the scenes talks with one of this season's CCC clubs

 

So, that would leave SBT with his only real contacts - the Abu Dhabi families.

 

He burnt his bridges with them over the Man City deal, would the FA be so stupid as to allow a cousin or uncle of His Excellency Sheikh Khalifa to buy a club?

And would a local business family WANT to go head to head with the ruler of his country?

What could happen if Man City played them needing 4 clear goals and 3 points at the end of the season to get into the CL.... (don't use British standards when answering that)

 

The only other possible names linked to ownership are H.E. Sheikh Mohammed (very publicly with Liverpool in the past) and less publicly his brother Sheikh Ahmed was allude to by SBT previously.

 

There is simply no way that the ruler of Dubai would look to blow $250 million on a football club at this point in time. They have a team working very hard to re-build the PR image of Dubai and are putting a huge amount of effort and what little funds they have left into sorting out the problems here.

 

That leaves Sheikh Ahmed, who as CEO of Emirates could have the personal wealth and marketing budget. However, they also see no benefit in getting into a p*ssing contest with Etihad and Abu Dhabi. They have a lot of people with the skills and experience to do something in football, but again, unlike SBT, they have a touch of PR sense as well. This one is a possibility, but I would be very surprised. As I mentioned before, the Value Add scenario simply does not fit any messaging that Emirates or Dubai would want to show in the current climate.

 

So the only other source would be a Dubai family with an issue politically. The Al Habtoors, are one of those, but they were never really interested unless there was a $750million plus property project related to the purchase.

 

SBT's two sources of funds were Thaksin or Abu Dhabi. It looks as if it was hoped that an SPV could have been constructed to hide the "Beneficial Owner", but the FA weren't THAT stupid

 

All IMHO of course and based on analysis, friends, contacts and local media sources

[SaintRobbie]

Pompeys value now is PL status only. It is now a pivotal period for them.If they get cut adrift at the bottom of the table and no HR to save the day their value will be almost worthless.I still thionk they will somehow scrape through , they have had so much luck in the last few years it is bound not to run out yet.

 

I dont. Said all along their manager isnt good enough, their players are not good enough, their fans are deserting in droves and they are unlikely to have any closure on ownership for a while. That uncertainty will lower morale and further erode their chances.

 

Unless they get serious money and a new manager I think we can enjoy watching the results like yesterday's continue to roll in. HR was their talisman - a good manager for them and will be for Spurs too. HR is gone. So soon will Pompey from the Premiership. I predict us playing them in the CCC in 2 years time.

[pfc123]

Well, if they're from Saudi ...

 

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/newsbysector/banksandfinance/6074549/Saudi-families-square-up-over-20bn-fraud.html

 

From Dubai, then the release of figures last week of the debt level at Dubai Holding has pushed estimates of the debt Dubai quasi Gov operations up to around $100BILLION.

 

Much of the local families were heaviliy into property (obviously) but funded through Eurobonds which are starting to come up so their problems are pretty simple.

 

http://business.maktoob.com/20090000360291/UAE_property_prices_fall_in_Q2;_revival_off/Article.htm?utm_campaign=Day-Newsletter&utm_medium=Main-News1&utm_source=Day-Newsletter&utm_content=

 

The local banking sector has all but dried up sources of lending, so that locals cannot leverage their book assets, most of the others will have their money tied up in securities and that leaves you looking for having to sell stocks to raise cash.

 

The Bahrainis have looked at investment but at a low and grow level, the Qataris have already jumped in with both feet with Notts County, people from football have been banging down the doors in Kuwait for years (including Ashley when he was wealthy).

The Saudi's have also looked in detail at football, and a number of research projects were under way before the crash last year and one of those looked to continue as they were in behind the scenes talks with one of this season's CCC clubs

 

So, that would leave SBT with his only real contacts - the Abu Dhabi families.

 

He burnt his bridges with them over the Man City deal, would the FA be so stupid as to allow a cousin or uncle of His Excellency Sheikh Khalifa to buy a club?

And would a local business family WANT to go head to head with the ruler of his country?

What could happen if Man City played them needing 4 clear goals and 3 points at the end of the season to get into the CL.... (don't use British standards when answering that)

 

The only other possible names linked to ownership are H.E. Sheikh Mohammed (very publicly with Liverpool in the past) and less publicly his brother Sheikh Ahmed was allude to by SBT previously.

 

There is simply no way that the ruler of Dubai would look to blow $250 million on a football club at this point in time. They have a team working very hard to re-build the PR image of Dubai and are putting a huge amount of effort and what little funds they have left into sorting out the problems here.

 

That leaves Sheikh Ahmed, who as CEO of Emirates could have the personal wealth and marketing budget. However, they also see no benefit in getting into a p*ssing contest with Etihad and Abu Dhabi. They have a lot of people with the skills and experience to do something in football, but again, unlike SBT, they have a touch of PR sense as well. This one is a possibility, but I would be very surprised. As I mentioned before, the Value Add scenario simply does not fit any messaging that Emirates or Dubai would want to show in the current climate.

 

So the only other source would be a Dubai family with an issue politically. The Al Habtoors, are one of those, but they were never really interested unless there was a $750million plus property project related to the purchase.

 

SBT's two sources of funds were Thaksin or Abu Dhabi. It looks as if it was hoped that an SPV could have been constructed to hide the "Beneficial Owner", but the FA weren't THAT stupid

 

All IMHO of course and based on analysis, friends, contacts and local media sources

 

I think from what you've said Phil that with all the cultural differences and complications that they entail, investment from a western background sounds a better bet. Trouble is, money's tighter everywhere. We'll probably have to take whatever we can get...

[dubai_phil]

I think from what you've said Phil that with all the cultural differences and complications that they entail, investment from a western background sounds a better bet. Trouble is, money's tighter everywhere. We'll probably have to take whatever we can get...

 

Actually you can work with and understand the culutral differences, but the problem is always that Brits have an oh so superior attitude and exepct the world to work their way... demanding Watney's bleedin Red Ball while on holiday in Malaga was the classic example.

 

But if you have people in charge who actually listen rather than talk then it can work out very well.

 

Your only chance from this part of the world is possibly Israeli money....

 

Oh you've been there haven't you

[Wes Tender]

According to the Mirror quoting Storrie, it's not Al Fahim but an individual from a family in the middle east. I know you've got your ear to the sand Phil, any rumours out there as to who?

 

It's not that guy from London who lived at home with his mother, is it? His family came from the middle East, Israel - wasn't it?

[pfc123]

Actually you can work with and understand the culutral differences, but the problem is always that Brits have an oh so superior attitude and exepct the world to work their way... demanding Watney's bleedin Red Ball while on holiday in Malaga was the classic example.

 

Yep, I do cringe at Le Mans every year when Brits go up to French stallholders and say something like "Allright mate, ow much is that t-shirt?"

 

To their credit, as it's business and there are 50,000 of us there every year, they always brush the ignorance off, but it is nice to see their faces light up sometimes when you at least attempt a bit of broken French, they really do appreciate it.

 

And when in southampton I always try to slip into scummer mode and talk like I've just come off the farm when I'm in Smiths to buy Tractor monthly and Horse & Pony. I find I fit right in straightaway

[Daren W]

Yep, I do cringe at Le Mans every year when Brits go up to French stallholders and say something like "Allright mate, ow much is that t-shirt?"

 

To their credit, as it's business and there are 50,000 of us there every year, they always brush the ignorance off, but it is nice to see their faces light up sometimes when you at least attempt a bit of broken French, they really do appreciate it.

 

And when in southampton I always try to slip into scummer mode and talk like I've just come off the farm when I'm in Smiths to buy Tractor monthly and Horse & Pony. I find I fit right in straightaway

 

Me too, I always dress like a member of the blazing Squad when in Pompey, fake burberry, gold plated jewelry and a dog on a rope... I fit right in...

[Wes Tender]

Yep, I do cringe at Le Mans every year when Brits go up to French stallholders and say something like "Allright mate, ow much is that t-shirt?"

 

To their credit, as it's business and there are 50,000 of us there every year, they always brush the ignorance off, but it is nice to see their faces light up sometimes when you at least attempt a bit of broken French, they really do appreciate it.

 

And when in southampton I always try to slip into scummer mode and talk like I've just come off the farm when I'm in Smiths to buy Tractor monthly and Horse & Pony. I find I fit right in straightaway

 

Whereas I agree with your comments about the arrogance of small-minded Brits expecting everybody else to speak English abroad, Southampton is not quite the agricultural environment you paint. In fact, industrially and commercially, it is ahead of Portsmouth; it is just that as every inch of the former island is covered with terraced housing, there is little room for the odd chicken run or pig in your back gardens in Portsmouth.

 

Anyway, why would you be buying Horse and Pony? You're not part of the County set, are you? Caravanning Weekly, more like it.

[pfc123]

Me too, I always dress like a member of the blazing Squad when in Pompey, fake burberry, gold plated jewelry and a dog on a rope... I fit right in...

 

touche

[pfc123]

Whereas I agree with your comments about the arrogance of small-minded Brits expecting everybody else to speak English abroad, Southampton is not quite the agricultural environment you paint. In fact, industrially and commercially, it is ahead of Portsmouth; it is just that as every inch of the former island is covered with terraced housing, there is little room for the odd chicken run or pig in your back gardens in Portsmouth.

 

Anyway, why would you be buying Horse and Pony? You're not part of the County set, are you? Caravanning Weekly, more like it.

 

Ooh yes! There's a new Sprite 4 berth out this month and......

[Wes Tender]

Ooh yes! There's a new Sprite 4 berth out this month and......

 

Your squad could use it as a changing room....Perhaps Fahim will buy it for you.

[mcjwills]

I think from what you've said Phil that with all the cultural differences and complications that they entail, investment from a western background sounds a better bet. Trouble is, money's tighter everywhere. We'll probably have to take whatever we can get...

 

I know of a nice gentleman in Gloucestershire looking for a decent investment to get himself back in the game.

[rallyboy]

I fear that the ruddy-cheeked whizzkid might consider the financial arrangements down the road slightly too precarious even by his standards, and he certainly wouldn't want to go into a consortium with peasants like a sweating swarthy ice cream vendor and a second hand car dealer.

Maybe he should lead the newlook buyout and bring in Chris Boardman or Ben Ainslie as director of football?

It's worth getting his advice, he's the man for a crisis, and if you haven't got one he could make it happen for you fairly quickly.

[Wes Tender]

Tomorrow's the day apparently, when all will be revealed about the Skates' new owner. Even now on their fan websites, they have heard rumours that it is an Arab Prince and are speculating as to which it can be.

 

One wonders why if there were such people about at the time that Gaydamak got tired of them, why they didn't surface then.

[hypochondriac]

Wont he have to pass the FAPP test?

[dubai_phil]

Tomorrow's the day apparently, when all will be revealed about the Skates' new owner. Even now on their fan websites, they have heard rumours that it is an Arab Prince and are speculating as to which it can be.

 

One wonders why if there were such people about at the time that Gaydamak got tired of them, why they didn't surface then.

 

 

I did have a chuckle, one idea (The Lounge) is the Crown Prince of Qatar. That fits, they have the Aspire Academy and will look at leveraging their own development aims.

 

The fun and games will start when the benefical owner test comes up...

 

Who owns Notts County?

Munto Finance

Who owns Munto Finance?

 

As I said in the Lounge, oops

[um pahars]

I did have a chuckle, one idea (The Lounge) is the Crown Prince of Qatar. That fits, they have the Aspire Academy and will look at leveraging their own development aims.

 

That's if they've got any money left as they seem to be ploughing it all in to Qatar Airways. Have to say I was mightily impressed by the planes we flew in recently, best out of the Middle East group IMHO.

[tonibell]

they appear so unprofessional, you do wonder if they will be first prem side into admin.

 

 

Would be nice admin for them Regards Toni

[dubai_phil]

That's if they've got any money left as they seem to be ploughing it all in to Qatar Airways. Have to say I was mightily impressed by the planes we flew in recently, best out of the Middle East group IMHO.

 

 

Aircrew are good as well. Won't go in to a "who is the best" argument except to say to anyone else on here no matter what the price, Gulf Air isn't worth it, and the ONLY planes with Emirates worth paying Business Class fares on are their new A-380's. We don't use Qatar much because it takes 10 hours to UK instead of 7, but they ARE good. Mind you, you should have seen them when they first started, one 747 all economy class. They decided to stop in Cairo & Beirut to pick up some passengers on one trip I was on. Totally unscheduled!

 

Hope the hols were good, I got airmiles tickets for a "tour" on Emirates to that part of the world for 36 quid to get out of here during Ramadan, so will be pretty much following your footsteps.

 

My post was more a point that the FL haven't actually worked out yet who owns Munto. It will in some way be related to Qatar's SWF, that would give the FA some real issues when they come to do a FAPP.

 

Besides Amanda Staveley, some other people at many levels have looked into some of this stuff in detail and it is a minefield.

 

If the naive go in rather than the wise then the fun down the road could continue for a while yet!

[Wes Tender]

 

Aircrew are good as well. Won't go in to a "who is the best" argument except to say to anyone else on here no matter what the price, Gulf Air isn't worth it, and the ONLY planes with Emirates worth paying Business Class fares on are their new A-380's. We don't use Qatar much because it takes 10 hours to UK instead of 7, but they ARE good. Mind you, you should have seen them when they first started, one 747 all economy class. They decided to stop in Cairo & Beirut to pick up some passengers on one trip I was on. Totally unscheduled!

 

 

Certainly agree that Gulf Air aren't worth the low price. We had our worst flight experience ever when last year we missed the connecting flight to London through mechanical problems on our Gulf Air flight into Bahrain. The delay meant a 8 hour stay there and what was offered were cheap, shoddy serviced appartments, which we refused. They had no decent hotel accomodation to offer because they told us that was all taken by other passengers holed up in Bahrain bcause of problems with Gulf Air flights. A quick look on the internet with other tales of travellers' woes, tells you that if something can go wrong with your Gulf Air flight it probably will and you will not be happy with the arrangements they make, or the offer of compensation.

 

Don't ever fly with Royal Jordanian either unless you are a masochist and a smoker. They also have problems with flight times and Amman airport must be one of the World's worst with smokers everywhere, even security guards lighting up under the no smoking signs.

 

Ethihad have decent service and nicely equipped planes, but we thought that we had an e-ticket and they used old fashioned printed tickets. Despite us being shown on their itinery, having passports to prove identity and proof that we had paid several months before, they refused to let us fly with them and so we missed our flight. We had to buy tickets for three on another airline and claim some of the cost back on our return.

 

But I am led to believe that Emirates is good.

 

Anyway, the announcement about the Skates' new owner is due today, almost close of play and nothing so far.

 

You don't think he's stuck at Qatar airport, perhaps?

[rallyboy]

more likely to be busy showing potential tenants a flat in Barnet...

 

If the bloke appears tonight and slaps a few million on the table they are sorted.

 

If we start hearing about due diligence and fpp test delays then the cavalry has ridden into town on a wheezy donkey.

[Thedelldays]

LOL@ Sol Campbell saying "some" premier league clubs are all over the place..

 

who ever did he mean

 

 

edit.. sol in the highest paid player outside of the prem..jesus

[dubai_phil]

Certainly agree that Gulf Air aren't worth the low price. We had our worst flight experience ever when last year we missed the connecting flight to London through mechanical problems on our Gulf Air flight into Bahrain. The delay meant a 8 hour stay there and what was offered were cheap, shoddy serviced appartments, which we refused. They had no decent hotel accomodation to offer because they told us that was all taken by other passengers holed up in Bahrain bcause of problems with Gulf Air flights. A quick look on the internet with other tales of travellers' woes, tells you that if something can go wrong with your Gulf Air flight it probably will and you will not be happy with the arrangements they make, or the offer of compensation.

 

Don't ever fly with Royal Jordanian either unless you are a masochist and a smoker. They also have problems with flight times and Amman airport must be one of the World's worst with smokers everywhere, even security guards lighting up under the no smoking signs.

 

Ethihad have decent service and nicely equipped planes, but we thought that we had an e-ticket and they used old fashioned printed tickets. Despite us being shown on their itinery, having passports to prove identity and proof that we had paid several months before, they refused to let us fly with them and so we missed our flight. We had to buy tickets for three on another airline and claim some of the cost back on our return.

 

But I am led to believe that Emirates is good.

 

Anyway, the announcement about the Skates' new owner is due today, almost close of play and nothing so far.

 

You don't think he's stuck at Qatar airport, perhaps?

 

Funnily enough, in their early days, one of the Al Thani's was one of the pilots. They were renowned for suddenly diverting to somewhere that he wanted to go to....

 

I assume the new owner isn't announced (at least in this thread) not to worry Friday is coming soon

[S-Clarke]

just reading their forums, it's like the pinnacle bid it's so untrue.

 

On Monday their local paper/station said....''Deal to be completed within 48 hours''

 

yesterday they said it would be completed by close of play ''today''

 

and now...their breaking news is fantastic...

 

''No announcement today - hopeful (yes - hopeful...) of an announcement tomorrow. Distin has expressed a desire to leave and the club have accepted a bid. Tommy smith also coming in for £1.5m.''

 

The whole thing is just cracking me up tbf.

[dubai_phil]

just reading their forums, it's like the pinnacle bid it's so untrue.

 

On Monday their local paper/station said....''Deal to be completed within 48 hours''

 

yesterday they said it would be completed by close of play ''today''

 

and now...their breaking news is fantastic...

 

''No announcement today - hopeful (yes - hopeful...) of an announcement tomorrow. Distin has expressed a desire to leave and the club have accepted a bid. Tommy smith also coming in for £1.5m.''

 

The whole thing is just cracking me up tbf.

 

They were bought in June by their mystery man so it seems (I updated the other thread not typing it all again!)

 

http://footballblips.dailyradar.com/story/mystery_surrounds_reports_of_uae_takeover/

 

Think you're being unfair with the Pinnacle comparison though It's actually almost as good as the Bournemouth one.

[S-Clarke]

They were bought in June by their mystery man so it seems (I updated the other thread not typing it all again!)

 

http://footballblips.dailyradar.com/story/mystery_surrounds_reports_of_uae_takeover/

 

Think you're being unfair with the Pinnacle comparison though It's actually almost as good as the Bournemouth one.

 

Interesting.....

 

why has this not been announced though? Weird takeover.

[The Majestic Channon]

Huge crowd at farton tonight, 6, 000

[kpturner]

Huge crowd at farton tonight, 6, 000

Most of whom were kids who paid a £1 I gather