Frank's cousin Posted 20 July, 2009 Share Posted 20 July, 2009 I wholeheartedly concur. Chickens continue to run about or twitch for minutes after they are beheaded and this is akin to what we are witnessing on here with all the Loweites. Hopefully, they will soon tire of it, I predict shortly after the start of the new season, when there will be other more important things to discuss. Dont think thats right Wes, The honest answer is there is no real such thing as 'Loweites' just some that a) did not really hate him and b) recognised merit in some of the approaches if not the execution - and maybe most importantly c) which just try and can some semblance of balance accepted - eg post responses against the ridiculous bias of posts such as 'To have Lowe luvvies on here complaining about someone's ego, strikes me as a bit ironic. At least Lawrie's ego brought us Keegan, Ball, Osgood and Shilton. Lowe's brought us Wiggley, Portfliet, Woodward and Clifford.' Whilst the above is true, its perhaps more balanced if you include some of some of Lawries carp signings and then go on to say Strachan, Hoddle, Neimi etc which just makes it sound a bit different... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
um pahars Posted 20 July, 2009 Share Posted 20 July, 2009 Whilst the above is true' date=' its perhaps more balanced if you include some of some of Lawries carp signings and then go on to say Strachan, Hoddle, Neimi etc which just makes it sound a bit different...[/quote'] I think Strachan, Hoddle and maybe even Redknapp could be thrown out as a counter argument, but NOT Niemi!!!!!!!!!!! The Chairman pushing Niemi (whether he was a success or not is irrelevant) is IMHO a prime example of his interfering ways. He should never be involved in the identification of players, that has to be the managers domain. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
um pahars Posted 20 July, 2009 Share Posted 20 July, 2009 Dont think thats right Wes' date=' The honest answer is there is no real such thing as 'Loweites' ...[/quote'] But nutjobs like Sundance Beast come close it (although that is to fulfill their own trolling rationale) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wes Tender Posted 20 July, 2009 Share Posted 20 July, 2009 Dont think thats right Wes, The honest answer is there is no real such thing as 'Loweites' just some that a) did not really hate him and b) recognised merit in some of the approaches if not the execution - and maybe most importantly c) which just try and can some semblance of balance accepted - eg post responses against the ridiculous bias of posts such as 'To have Lowe luvvies on here complaining about someone's ego, strikes me as a bit ironic. At least Lawrie's ego brought us Keegan, Ball, Osgood and Shilton. Lowe's brought us Wiggley, Portfliet, Woodward and Clifford.' Whilst the above is true, its perhaps more balanced if you include some of some of Lawries carp signings and then go on to say Strachan, Hoddle, Neimi etc which just makes it sound a bit different... This execution you talk about, Frank; is that where the headless chickens come in? I know that you fall into category © yourself Frank and I've got nothing against that, but where the balance is lacking is where you have no category for those who have opinions towards Lowe who actually loved him and cannot admit that he did any wrong. Those same people are the few who despise Crouch and Lawrie as the anti-heroes. They also despised Wilde until he became the Quisling, whereupon they saw him in an entirely different light. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bearsy Posted 20 July, 2009 Share Posted 20 July, 2009 I wonder if Lowe CDAJFU as a scout? Niemi and Peter Crouch were both excellent shouts by the big man. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
once_bitterne Posted 20 July, 2009 Share Posted 20 July, 2009 But nutjobs like Sundance Beast come close it (although that is to fulfill their own trolling rationale) "nutjobs". Classy Steve, very classy....... Someone admits on here admits he has mental health issues and you really go to town on it don't you...... Re: LM, he was a very good manager for us but from the day he left the post of manager has done nothing but be a hinderance to the club. Since he left the period we have had by far the most success, under WGS and Hoddle, was when LM wasn't even going to the games. Co-incidence? I do not think so. I guess you have to have a huge ego to be a succesful manager (or mediocre accountant turned teacher) and you have to laugh at how LM awarded himself a testominial, but I'm sure you will see Fergie at Man Yoo take a back seat when he leaves knowing that having him hanging around for the next 20 years will not benefit the club at all. LM always seems to group himself with Clough and Paisley as some sort of holy trinity of 80s managers, but in terms of acheivements he is not fit to lace their boots. In fact a cv of 1 FA Cup final win, one promotion to the top flight and one relegation from the top flight coupled with an obsession with money could well apply to LM or a certain H Redknapp. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clifford Nelson Posted 20 July, 2009 Share Posted 20 July, 2009 The thing about speaking your mind is that you have to at least remain calm and accurate if you want to a) appeal to all and b) maintain credibilty... and just because you happen to agree with what he has said does not mean everyone does... he fell into that urban myth trap for example with the 'where has all the money gone' rhetoric on radio when a review of the audited accounts would have provided a more detailed response than the schophants nodding 'wisely' in the media? Thats why he would have been better to stay out of it... Not quite sure what you mean by the last sentance... very feckin arrogant if you are implying that those who in effect dont agree with you are not welcome as fans - if thats what you mean, its the likes of you we can do without, because The new era is about inclusiveness and togetherness, not this ongoing divisive boll ox... dont you get the VERY simple fact that fans can have different opinions on these issues? Its called 'Grown Up' debate and is based on reason and common sense..... After what this club has been through with the arrogant RL, his henchmen and those afraid to speak out we have finally been saved. I have nothing but contempt for those who still feel some kind of absurd affection for them. When that spills out into tirades against LM my blood boils over and, yes, if you are one of them I wouldn't mind seeing you leave. The appalling sniping from the sidelines which has been so prevalent on this thread has nothing to do with a different point of view, and even less about 'grown up' debate. It can only be understood as deliberate provocation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
um pahars Posted 20 July, 2009 Share Posted 20 July, 2009 "nutjobs". Classy Steve, very classy....... Someone admits on here admits he has mental health issues and you really go to town on it don't you...... You must be confused. I was talking about Sundance Beast, who judging by his posts (and the fact he was subsequently banned) was clearly a nutjob. The poster who has admitted he has/had mental health problems is Nineteen Canteen. Apparently they are not the same person (unless of course you have evidence they are;)) Since he left the period we have had by far the most success, under WGS and Hoddle, was when LM wasn't even going to the games. Co-incidence? I do not think so. But as successful as they were (and relatively speaking they were a success) they never managed to scale the heights that McMenemy did. Before Lawrie, we had relative success, with Bates leading us to the top flight and Europe for the first time in our history, and with Strachan, relative success again. Nothing to do with co-incidences. LM always seems to group himself with Clough and Paisley as some sort of holy trinity of 80s managers, but in terms of acheivements he is not fit to lace their boots. In fact a cv of 1 FA Cup final win, one promotion to the top flight and one relegation from the top flight coupled with an obsession with money could well apply to LM or a certain H Redknapp. Whilst his success was never on a par with Paisley and Clough, your abbreviation of his successful tenure is somewhat rewriting history. I never thought of McMenemy as being up there with Clough, Paisley et al (and I must have missed him grouping himself in with those successful managers), but he was certainly a very successful manager with us, particularly given the status of Southampton as a fairly small provincial Club. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wes Tender Posted 20 July, 2009 Share Posted 20 July, 2009 LM always seems to group himself with Clough and Paisley as some sort of holy trinity of 80s managers, but in terms of acheivements he is not fit to lace their boots. In fact a cv of 1 FA Cup final win, one promotion to the top flight and one relegation from the top flight coupled with an obsession with money could well apply to LM or a certain H Redknapp. You fail to mention for some reason that there was that year when we finished runner up to the champions, Liverpool, having led for much of the season. Also you do not give any credence to the fact that both Liverpool and Nottingham Forest were considerably bigger clubs than us at the time, making the achievement of getting us anywhere near contention with them a minor miracle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miserableoldgit Posted 20 July, 2009 Share Posted 20 July, 2009 You fail to mention for some reason that there was that year when we finished runner up to the champions, Liverpool, having led for much of the season. Also you do not give any credence to the fact that both Liverpool and Nottingham Forest were considerably bigger clubs than us at the time, making the achievement of getting us anywhere near contention with them a minor miracle. Yeah but that was nothing either. And don`t forget Saints are always succesful when LM isn`t around It`s not just coincidence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Duckhunter Posted 20 July, 2009 Share Posted 20 July, 2009 WGS got us to one Cup Final, which we lost, 8th in the League and yet he's considered untouchable and Saints legend. 8th in the League would have been a very average season for Lawrie, and his style of football was far and away better than anything we've seen since. The fact that other Club's supporters hold Lawrie in higher regard, than some Saints supporters is very sad. What's the great man done to deserve this poison spread about him? Speak out against Rupert Lowe (who let's not forget was Chairman during 2 relegations and led us into admin) thats what. Clough, Revie, Bobby Robson, Bill Shankley were fantastic footballers, like Jose, Lawrie had to get the buy in from players on the strength of his personality as his football ability was limited. The fact he managed to get World Class footballers to sign for a provincial club playing at The Dell, is testiment to his personality and ability to get the best out of people. Where he differes from other similar Managers Like "Big Ron" and Redknapp, was the young players he also devolped and brought on during his regin at the Club. He was not in the same league as Sir Bobby or Cloughie, but was the nearest we'll ever have to them. There will never be another Lawrie Mac at this Club and he should be treated with respect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frank's cousin Posted 20 July, 2009 Share Posted 20 July, 2009 After what this club has been through with the arrogant RL, his henchmen and those afraid to speak out we have finally been saved. I have nothing but contempt for those who still feel some kind of absurd affection for them. When that spills out into tirades against LM my blood boils over and, yes, if you are one of them I wouldn't mind seeing you leave. The appalling sniping from the sidelines which has been so prevalent on this thread has nothing to do with a different point of view, and even less about 'grown up' debate. It can only be understood as deliberate provocation. I dont understand how you must see everything in black or white - there are shades of gray with all the protagonists as well.. eg. You can admire and respect and have affection for Lawrie because of all his achievements yet still NOT agree with everything he has said and done in the media - trust me that is possible. With Lowe, I cant say I had any like or dislike towards a man I did not know and did nothing to me personally... he made a lot of errors of judgement that directly impacted on the performance of a football club, and that contributred greatly to our decline, but he also had some ideas that had merit but struggled to be implemented often because of old school mentalities and in some cases prejudices + he did get a few things right - and put very simply I cant argue with a policy that invested heavily in youth, and tried to live within its means financially. That is NOT supporting a man, but supporting a strategy the two are DIFFERENT. As to attacking LM or Crouch, Can you not see how criticising or questioning their actions should be down independently and on theirown merits and have feck all do with how dirrrent they might be from Lowe's approach? Just because it was diofferent to Lowe, does not automatically make it good... same as just because some like myself criticised Couch et al did not mean I blindly supported Lowe... its this illogical crap that gets my goat... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frank's cousin Posted 20 July, 2009 Share Posted 20 July, 2009 But as successful as they were (and relatively speaking they were a success) they never managed to scale the heights that McMenemy did. Before Lawrie, we had relative success, with Bates leading us to the top flight and Europe for the first time in our history, and with Strachan, relative success again. Nothing to do with co-incidences. . To be fair though you cant compare the two eras - in 1980 you could attract the current European player of the year for an annual salary of 140K - equivalent today of about £15-20k a week... so it was possible for a smaller club to compete - we also got have the gate of every game so LM did NOT have the financial restrictions that we had when the premiership took hold - when was the last time someone outside the top 4 won something major outside the FA cup or Blackburn' s sugar dddy funded win? So to be fair, getting to the final and finishing 8th is not bad in comparison...ifr you wnat to be fair that is ;-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wes Tender Posted 20 July, 2009 Share Posted 20 July, 2009 With Lowe' date=' I cant say I had any like or dislike towards a man I did not know and did nothing to me personally... he made a lot of errors of judgement that directly impacted on the performance of a football club, and that contributred greatly to our decline...[/quote'] You see, Frank, there in a nutshell is where you and I differ and I suspect that many others will find some sympathy with what I'm about to say. I consider that he did something to me personally because his errors of judgement directly impacted on the performance of the football club that I love. I found the two relegations to be a painful experience emotionally and he is the main reason for the club's decline. Now, it might be that you do not feel any antagonism towards him for that, but that's your prerogative. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sotonjoe Posted 20 July, 2009 Share Posted 20 July, 2009 The thing about speaking your mind is that you have to at least remain calm and accurate if you want to a) appeal to all and b) maintain credibilty... and just because you happen to agree with what he has said does not mean everyone does... he fell into that urban myth trap for example with the 'where has all the money gone' rhetoric on radio when a review of the audited accounts would have provided a more detailed response than the schophants nodding 'wisely' in the media? Thats why he would have been better to stay out of it... Not quite sure what you mean by the last sentance... very feckin arrogant if you are implying that those who in effect dont agree with you are not welcome as fans - if thats what you mean, its the likes of you we can do without, because The new era is about inclusiveness and togetherness, not this ongoing divisive boll ox... dont you get the VERY simple fact that fans can have different opinions on these issues? Its called 'Grown Up' debate and is based on reason and common sense..... Good post; someone with a bit of common sense and objectivity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thedelldays Posted 20 July, 2009 Share Posted 20 July, 2009 You see, Frank, there in a nutshell is where you and I differ and I suspect that many others will find some sympathy with what I'm about to say. I consider that he did something to me personally because his errors of judgement directly impacted on the performance of the football club that I love. I found the two relegations to be a painful experience emotionally and he is the main reason for the club's decline. Now, it might be that you do not feel any antagonism towards him for that, but that's your prerogative. ffs..it is only a game Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nineteen Canteen Posted 20 July, 2009 Share Posted 20 July, 2009 Probably a cold but you wanted it to sound important :-) Thank you Manji - you've made my week. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wes Tender Posted 20 July, 2009 Share Posted 20 July, 2009 ffs..it is only a game It's only a game that you me and plenty of others spend a fair amount of our time commenting on on here. I'm sure I don't need to remind of what Bill Shankly would have responded to your comment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thedelldays Posted 20 July, 2009 Share Posted 20 July, 2009 It's only a game that you me and plenty of others spend a fair amount of our time commenting on on here. I'm sure I don't need to remind of what Bill Shankly would have responded to your comment. more fool you if rupert lowe has distrubed you personally.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wes Tender Posted 20 July, 2009 Share Posted 20 July, 2009 more fool you if rupert lowe has distrubed you personally.. Quote: Thedelldays: if he get us promoted by by the end of next season..i could not careif he lived on the moon The club and the game obviously don't mean very much to you...or does it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wes Tender Posted 20 July, 2009 Share Posted 20 July, 2009 quote Thedelldays: who cares i want a winning team..which if you look at it, does not happen unless you get good managemnt Methinks he doth protest his lack of passion for the success (or failure) of the club too much Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thedelldays Posted 20 July, 2009 Share Posted 20 July, 2009 Quote: Thedelldays: The club and the game obviously don't mean very much to you...or does it? it does...but to suggest someone at the club has done something that distrubs me personally is taking it a bit far IMO.. yes im happy when we win yes i hat it when we lose yes i want saints in the prem yes i wamt markus to get his big fat cheque book open at the end of the day..after the frustrations and joy of watching football...it is just that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wes Tender Posted 20 July, 2009 Share Posted 20 July, 2009 it does...but to suggest someone at the club has done something that distrubs me personally is taking it a bit far IMO.. yes im happy when we win yes i hat it when we lose yes i want saints in the prem yes i wamt markus to get his big fat cheque book open at the end of the day..after the frustrations and joy of watching football...it is just that If you would care to read carefully what I said in response to Frank's post, the word disturbed is one that you have introduced and is suggestive of mental strife or worse. Frank said that Lowe had done nothing to him personally and I responded that he had done something to me by causing me to be upset at our two relegations. Now, you have admitted above that winning makes you happy and that you hat (hate?) it when we lose. (Pretty strong emotion that) So when we were relegated (twice) did you just shrug your shoulders and say that it is only a game, or did it sadden/depress/or make you annoyed? If so, those are the emotions of which I speak and I suspect that most others felt the same way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
um pahars Posted 20 July, 2009 Share Posted 20 July, 2009 To be fair though you cant compare the two eras - in 1980 you could attract the current European player of the year for an annual salary of 140K - equivalent today of about £15-20k a week... so it was possible for a smaller club to compete - we also got have the gate of every game so LM did NOT have the financial restrictions that we had when the premiership took hold - when was the last time someone outside the top 4 won something major outside the FA cup or Blackburn' s sugar dddy funded win? So to be fair' date=' getting to the final and finishing 8th is not bad in comparison...ifr you wnat to be fair that is ;-)[/quote'] Of course it's very difficult (if not impossible) to compare the two eras, and you have demonstrated one clear difference, in that the gulf between the haves and have nots has become even greater over the years. But even allowing for a much narrower disparity between the haves and the have nots, then Lawrie's success over a lengthy period was still a very decent perfromance, and was by far the most successful period in this Club's history. To have someone dismiss it as "one promotion, one relegation and a Cup Final" win is extremely revisionist (and that's being polite), and one which in no way reflects the true story of the Club's most successful and enjoyable era in its 125 year history. Although you appear to accept Lawrie's legacy as a manager can't be ignored, there does appear to be a minority who can't even accept that! (and looking at the 80's, which was our most successful period, it was still dominated by big clubs with only Liverpool, Arsenal, Everton and Villa winning the League during that period). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nineteen Canteen Posted 20 July, 2009 Share Posted 20 July, 2009 Of course it's very difficult (if not impossible) to compare the two eras, and you have demonstrated one clear difference, in that the gulf between the haves and have nots has become even greater over the years. But even allowing for a much narrower disparity between the haves and the have nots, then Lawrie's success over a lengthy period was still a very decent perfromance, and was by far the most successful period in this Club's history. To have someone dismiss it as "one promotion, one relegation and a Cup Final" win is extremely revisionist (and that's being polite), and one which in no way reflects the true story of the Club's most successful and enjoyable era in its 125 year history. Although you appear to accept Lawrie's legacy as a manager can't be ignored, there does appear to be a minority who can't even accept that! (and looking at the 80's, which was our most successful period, it was still dominated by big clubs with only Liverpool, Arsenal, Everton and Villa winning the League during that period). For us Lawrie McMenemy was a successful manager but assessed against his peers in that same period he was just a good manager. Look where Derby and Forest were before Clough got hold of them. McMenemy couldn't match that but arguably had similar resources as Clough. Anyway McMenemy's achievements cannot be argued with but what can be debated is that was he as great as the other managers of his era? No IMO. Therefore, should he be held in such high regard as some kind of 'patron saint' for 12 years service? No IMO. Should we hold him in the same high esteem as Bates and Le Tissier or even Benali and Dodd? No IMO. Post his managerial term has he conducted himself as an elder statesman? A diplomat and arbitrator working for the good of the club? No IMO. I believe McMenemy's biggest fan is himself and IMO his record in FOOTBALL does not warrant the praise some afford him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisobee Posted 20 July, 2009 Share Posted 20 July, 2009 I believe McMenemy's biggest fan is himself and IMO his record in FOOTBALL does not warrant the praise some afford him. Possibly the most stupid comment of all time !! As they say everyone is entitled to their opinion, just that yours is ridiculous. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
up and away Posted 20 July, 2009 Share Posted 20 July, 2009 WGS got us to one Cup Final, which we lost, 8th in the League and yet he's considered untouchable and Saints legend. 8th in the League would have been a very average season for Lawrie, and his style of football was far and away better than anything we've seen since. The fact that other Club's supporters hold Lawrie in higher regard, than some Saints supporters is very sad. What's the great man done to deserve this poison spread about him? Speak out against Rupert Lowe (who let's not forget was Chairman during 2 relegations and led us into admin) thats what. Clough, Revie, Bobby Robson, Bill Shankley were fantastic footballers, like Jose, Lawrie had to get the buy in from players on the strength of his personality as his football ability was limited. The fact he managed to get World Class footballers to sign for a provincial club playing at The Dell, is testiment to his personality and ability to get the best out of people. Where he differes from other similar Managers Like "Big Ron" and Redknapp, was the young players he also devolped and brought on during his regin at the Club. He was not in the same league as Sir Bobby or Cloughie, but was the nearest we'll ever have to them. There will never be another Lawrie Mac at this Club and he should be treated with respect. This has absolutely nothing to do with Lowe. I don't know of anyone who wants Lowe remotely near the club now. His time has gone and he has nothing to offer. There are several who have no time for either Lowe or Mcmenemy past his point as manager, because he has such a negative effect. That does not diminish what he did as manager and has to be the greatest from that point of view ever. For all the good he did as manager show me one decent thing he did subsequently? That said with the current set up we have now I can see no harm coming from him now as he is effectively neutered. Let him sit in the directors box for recognition as his time as manager and as long as he does not try to interfere, let him stay there and bask in the recognition from those great years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnny Bognor Posted 20 July, 2009 Share Posted 20 July, 2009 (edited) For us Lawrie McMenemy was a successful manager but assessed against his peers in that same period he was just a good manager. Look where Derby and Forest were before Clough got hold of them. McMenemy couldn't match that but arguably had similar resources as Clough. Anyway McMenemy's achievements cannot be argued with but what can be debated is that was he as great as the other managers of his era? No IMO. Therefore, should he be held in such high regard as some kind of 'patron saint' for 12 years service? No IMO. Should we hold him in the same high esteem as Bates and Le Tissier or even Benali and Dodd? No IMO. Post his managerial term has he conducted himself as an elder statesman? A diplomat and arbitrator working for the good of the club? No IMO. I believe McMenemy's biggest fan is himself and IMO his record in FOOTBALL does not warrant the praise some afford him. For us Lowe was a successful Chairman to some extent but assessed against his peers in that same period he was just a good chairman. Look where Pompey were before Manderic got hold of them. Lowe couldn't match that because he was just a bean counter in a world of football chairman with serious wealth and demonstrable business success. Anyway Lowe's achievements cannot be argued with (the stadium built with a loan and we were one of 10+ clubs that got new stadia in that timeframe) but what can be debated is that was he as great as the other chairman of his era? No IMO. Therefore, should he be held in such high regard as some kind of 'patron chairman' for his service? No IMO. Should we hold him in the same high esteem as Ibramovich, Sugar/Levy, Manderic, Duffen, Al Fayed, Madjedski or Coates? No IMO. Post his chairmanship has he conducted himself as an elder statesman? A diplomat and arbitrator working for the good of the club? No IMO. I believe Lowe's biggest fan is you, followed by himself and IMO his record in destroying shareholder value does not warrant the praise some afford him. All IMHO of Course x Edited 20 July, 2009 by Johnny Bognor Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aintforever Posted 20 July, 2009 Share Posted 20 July, 2009 For us Lawrie McMenemy was a successful manager but assessed against his peers in that same period he was just a good manager. Look where Derby and Forest were before Clough got hold of them. McMenemy couldn't match that but arguably had similar resources as Clough. Anyway McMenemy's achievements cannot be argued with but what can be debated is that was he as great as the other managers of his era? No IMO. Therefore, should he be held in such high regard as some kind of 'patron saint' for 12 years service? No IMO. Should we hold him in the same high esteem as Bates and Le Tissier or even Benali and Dodd? No IMO. Post his managerial term has he conducted himself as an elder statesman? A diplomat and arbitrator working for the good of the club? No IMO. I believe McMenemy's biggest fan is himself and IMO his record in FOOTBALL does not warrant the praise some afford him. You are a nutcase. Lawrie Mac is unquestionably our best manager ever, Ted Bates built the club up but Lawrie put SFC on the map. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
macthesaint Posted 20 July, 2009 Share Posted 20 July, 2009 No one laughed at us when Lawrie was manager. I,like many others on here had some amazing times following SFC back in the day. Everyones entitled to an opinion,but some of the disrespectful garbage I,ve read about Lawrie makes me feel sick. Can you imagine posting stuff like that about Bobby Robson on an Ipswich board? Or Johhny Lyle at West Ham? Maybe I just imagined all the good hidings we gave top sides,or the top names that sprayed the ball around with such class.Some REAL characters who some old manager persuaded to play for little old Saints. Next time he's on the radio,I will listen,as I always do when there is someone who cares about Saints and their fans.(Cue sarcastic response from cyber geeks?) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
um pahars Posted 20 July, 2009 Share Posted 20 July, 2009 Possibly the most stupid comment of all time !! As they say everyone is entitled to their opinion, just that yours is ridiculous. I'd say it's on a par with that nutjob Sundance Beast!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisobee Posted 20 July, 2009 Share Posted 20 July, 2009 I'd say it's on a par with that nutjob Sundance Beast!!!! Lol, whatever happened to him Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
um pahars Posted 20 July, 2009 Share Posted 20 July, 2009 Lol, whatever happened to him Apparently the nutjob got banned. No idea what for, but some of his ramblings were mentalist (as were his unslicited PM's he used to send out). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisobee Posted 21 July, 2009 Share Posted 21 July, 2009 Apparently the nutjob got banned. No idea what for, but some of his ramblings were mentalist (as were his unslicited PM's he used to send out). Lol, well it seems to me you have to try really hard before eventually getting banned on here so I think I can safely assume nutjob is a euphemism for many worse terms Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
um pahars Posted 21 July, 2009 Share Posted 21 July, 2009 Lol, well it seems to me you have to try really hard before eventually getting banned on here so I think I can safely assume nutjob is a euphemism for many worse terms There can't be anything wrong with nutjob, mentalist, dinlo and a whole host of fairly innocuous insults. Calling Sundance a nutjob is par for the course IMHO if you recall his behaviour on this forum (up until he was banned). After all, I've seen (and been called a lot worse). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisobee Posted 21 July, 2009 Share Posted 21 July, 2009 There can't be anything wrong with nutjob, mentalist, dinlo and a whole host of fairly innocuous insults. Calling Sundance a nutjob is par for the course IMHO if you recall his behaviour on this forum (up until he was banned). After all, I've seen (and been called a lot worse). No I try to avoid nutjobs, dimlos and the like but you don't seem too bad TBH Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frank's cousin Posted 21 July, 2009 Share Posted 21 July, 2009 You see, Frank, there in a nutshell is where you and I differ and I suspect that many others will find some sympathy with what I'm about to say. I consider that he did something to me personally because his errors of judgement directly impacted on the performance of the football club that I love. I found the two relegations to be a painful experience emotionally and he is the main reason for the club's decline. Now, it might be that you do not feel any antagonism towards him for that, but that's your prerogative. Fair enough - and of course I felt the pain of relegation same as the next man/woman, but effecting me personnally? I know its all relative, but for me relegation IS part of the game and having first started supporting saints when we were NOT in the top flight, I guess I saw the 27 years as a bonus as opposed to a right, especially when you consider how many other clubs have had their downs in that time, and we were/are a relatively small club. The SMS move ironically did raise expectations in that we were suddenly on a par with Boro, Sunderland, and that ilk in terms of revenues, but given that premiership survival was becoming more and more dependent on revenue, I always thought we would struggle without the Sugar Daddy luxury...so maybe I was more prepared for it, who knows? OK so bad management decisions and then the subsequent internal fighting added fuel to those flames, but ultimately without either finding new revenue sources or borrowing (which was my idea of a nightmare) there woudl come a time where we simply did not have the investment necessary just to stand still, let alone progress, so was the club ever going to match fans expectations. Because of his errors, soem totally genuine, others perhaps errors in some fans eyes only, Lowe became the symbol of that failure... My opinions have never been based on support or otherwise of individuals but on trying to uinderstand how and why decisons were made and their consequences - and maybe to present some of those alternative views when the weight of opinion was very much against a man, and if UP is honest, perhaps we would have been more forgiving had Lowe a more likeable personality, or had he personally donated 20mil... yet failure would still be failure and that is surely what is being judged? Finally on to the famous quote ... I suggest as have many (although not many footballers) that the quote was heavily laced with irony? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
um pahars Posted 21 July, 2009 Share Posted 21 July, 2009 and if UP is honest' date=' perhaps we would have been more forgiving had Lowe a more likeable personality, [/quote'] Not sure, it may have made him slightly more amenable, but ultimately I would like to think I would still judge him by his results. I'm sure GM can dig up the quote from way, way back when I was actually relatively supportive of him (I never ever felt he really "got it", but I was still happy to credit him with many things during his tenure). And anyway, as is the case with Lawrie, football is often full of egos and some of the biggest are the most successful. Being brash, rude, arrogant, unsensitive, single minded aren't necessarily bad personality traits in this industry!!! or had he personally donated 20mil... yet failure would still be failure and that is surely what is being judged? Now if he really had been Gibsonesque or Majeskiesque, then I think everyone would have been much more forgiven. When you're pumping in that much, then whilst not above criticism, it certainly buys you a rather large stash of "Get Out Of Jail" cards!!!!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sotonjoe Posted 21 July, 2009 Share Posted 21 July, 2009 is this still going? Surely, coming close to a record for a non-takeover thread? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisobee Posted 21 July, 2009 Share Posted 21 July, 2009 is this still going? Surely, coming close to a record for a non-takeover thread? Clearly still going, the question is where ! :smt102 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NorthamSteve Posted 21 July, 2009 Share Posted 21 July, 2009 This is ****ing ridiculous. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sotonjoe Posted 21 July, 2009 Share Posted 21 July, 2009 Clearly still going, the question is where ! :smt102 Round in circles? Round the bend? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisobee Posted 21 July, 2009 Share Posted 21 July, 2009 Round the bend? Who me or the thread Must be closed shortly !! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sotonjoe Posted 21 July, 2009 Share Posted 21 July, 2009 Who me or the thread Must be closed shortly !! Well it was almost dead and buried until you just brought it back up to the top! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisobee Posted 21 July, 2009 Share Posted 21 July, 2009 Well it was almost dead and buried until you just brought it back up to the top! oops Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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