Pompey Takeover Saga

[dubai_phil]

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/competitions/fa-cup/8998367/Chelsea-v-Portsmouth-FA-Cup-rematch-a-chance-for-Pompey-chimes-to-ring-again.html

 

Ooh how did we miss this article 4 days ago

 

thx to one of my tweeter stalkers for posting the link

 

WARNING it contains a small interview with & picture of TCWTB

 

BUT it also puts into print about broken pledges etc

[pedg]

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/competitions/fa-cup/8998367/Chelsea-v-Portsmouth-FA-Cup-rematch-a-chance-for-Pompey-chimes-to-ring-again.html

 

Ooh how did we miss this article 4 days ago

 

thx to one of my tweeter stalkers for posting the link

 

WARNING it contains a small interview with & picture of TCWTB

 

BUT it also puts into print about broken pledges etc

 

I don't think this quote is correct is it?

 

The Premier League's parachute payments have been going directly to football creditors but Portsmouth will also directly receive £28 million from that pot before the end of the 2013-14 season.

[JackFrost]

I don't think this quote is correct is it?

 

They were given parachute payments when they were still in the PL to keep the club alive. I'm sure someone who has been tracking it more thoroughly than I have could list how much they've already had/yet to have.

 

That figure did strike me as somewhat optimistic.

[rallyboy]

I did see the paper and the headline in that is the slightly more damning 'portsmouth yet to honour vow to repay their debts to charities'.

Ouch.

 

Hindsight is a great thing but I do like the rather hollow sounding pre-match battle cry -

"We are like a wounded animal," said Westwood. "When we have our backs to the wall, it makes us stronger. All the pressure is on Chelsea. We can't lose and there could be an upset''.

 

Maybe John, though in reality your brave and plucky boys got wiped off the pitch bigtime by a half-hearted, misfiring bunch of overpaid lowlife - in front of the bestest half-allocation of away supporters since mighty Wigan hit town.

[Gemmel]

I don't think this quote is correct is it?

 

I thought that was wrong as well (The standard staging of the parchute payments would mean there is less than that - without ever looking at how much or many times they had drawn on future years parachute money (I think it was confirmed they definately had in year one and that Paul Duffen said they had done the same in year two, after looking at the accounts) but given it was from the Telegraph and the article gets close to the other figures, than many I have read - lets assume it is correct, with a couple of highlights;

 

1) CVA repayments total 34 million which is a 6 million shortfall against the parachute payments

2) Seems to be no mention of the 10 million loan from Lithuania

3) aa says the club is washing it's face........... It just doesnt have any money to pay annoying things like wages and bills.

4) aa says the club is washing it's face............ Just forget to mention that apart from not having any money, it needed 10.8 million cash injection, to wash it's face.

 

That said the figures published are probably better than we thought (Assuming the parchute payment figure is correct), then 16 million required to cover outstanding debt, plus the selling price (Could be a low as nothing, as chinny would have his money from CVA), plus the working capital (that aa referes to) , plus any infrastructure improvments and plus any enhancements to the squad.

[holepuncture]

I don't think this quote is correct is it?

 

Sales talk, hence the avoidance of the Russian debt, and stating that £11m would secure the long term future... its a sales pitch!

 

Any news on the latest buyer from AA?

[Channon's Sideburns]

I thought that was wrong as well (The standard staging of the parchute payments would mean there is less than that - without ever looking at how much or many times they had drawn on future years parachute money (I think it was confirmed they definately had in year one and that Paul Duffen said they had done the same in year two, after looking at the accounts) but given it was from the Telegraph and the article gets close to the other figures, than many I have read - lets assume it is correct, with a couple of highlights;

 

1) CVA repayments total 34 million which is a 6 million shortfall against the parachute payments

2) Seems to be no mention of the 10 million loan from Lithuania

3) aa says the club is washing it's face........... It just doesnt have any money to pay annoying things like wages and bills.

4) aa says the club is washing it's face............ Just forget to mention that apart from not having any money, it needed 10.8 million cash injection, to wash it's face.

 

That said the figures published are probably better than we thought (Assuming the parchute payment figure is correct), then 16 million required to cover outstanding debt, plus the selling price (Could be a low as nothing, as chinny would have his money from CVA), plus the working capital (that aa referes to) , plus any infrastructure improvments and plus any enhancements to the squad.

 

Yep - you'd still need to be a millionaire with an obsession to become poor again to take it on.

[sussexsaint]

I thought that was wrong as well (The standard staging of the parchute payments would mean there is less than that - without ever looking at how much or many times they had drawn on future years parachute money (I think it was confirmed they definately had in year one and that Paul Duffen said they had done the same in year two, after looking at the accounts) but given it was from the Telegraph and the article gets close to the other figures, than many I have read - lets assume it is correct, with a couple of highlights;

 

1) CVA repayments total 34 million which is a 6 million shortfall against the parachute payments

2) Seems to be no mention of the 10 million loan from Lithuania

3) aa says the club is washing it's face........... It just doesnt have any money to pay annoying things like wages and bills.

4) aa says the club is washing it's face............ Just forget to mention that apart from not having any money, it needed 10.8 million cash injection, to wash it's face.

 

That said the figures published are probably better than we thought (Assuming the parchute payment figure is correct), then 16 million required to cover outstanding debt, plus the selling price (Could be a low as nothing, as chinny would have his money from CVA), plus the working capital (that aa referes to) , plus any infrastructure improvments and plus any enhancements to the squad.

 

A nicely made summary cheers for that.

 

Still not a very attractive business venture though

[Minsk]

I don't think this quote is correct is it?

 

I am certain that I remember Lampitt stating last month that they have 2x8m parachute payments still to come.

 

So, that would ALMOST cover the unsecured creditors: then there's Chinny, Gaddy, CSI, wages, taxes, other bills, etc, etc - a tad more than 11m methinks!!!!!

[alpine_saint]

This thread is mental. 47,000 posts.

[Sevvy]

http://uk.search.yahoo.com/r/_ylt=A7x9Qb.0HQxPVjcAd9ZLBQx.;_ylu=X3oDMTE0MW0yZDhjBHNlYwNzcgRwb3MDMwRjb2xvA2lyZAR2dGlkA1FJVUswMV83Mw--/SIG=13f6ulqdd/EXP=1326222900/**http%3a//www.guardian.co.uk/football/2010/mar/17/portsmouth-nine-point-penalty-administration

 

http://uk.search.yahoo.com/r/_ylt=A7x9Qb.0HQxPVjcAedZLBQx.;_ylu=X3oDMTE0OGVtbm85BHNlYwNzcgRwb3MDNARjb2xvA2lyZAR2dGlkA1FJVUswMV83Mw--/SIG=150q52rum/EXP=1326222900/**http%3a//www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-1250363/Portsmouth-rescue-mission-Premier-League-set-hand-debt-ridden-Pompey-lifeline.html

 

This is all i could find on the advance of the parachute and TV money, probably more out there,

[Channon's Sideburns]

This thread is mental. 47,000 posts.

 

Mental but fun Alps...

[Minsk]

And wait, what's this?:

 

The Telegraph can even disclose that a pledge made in 2010 that small creditors owed less than £2,500 and charities would be paid in full remains unfulfilled.

I'm certain that the Ho assured us that the charities had all been paid. Therefore, I expect The Telegraph to apologise for this statement, or for Lampitt to sue them, unless..............

[trousers]

They were given parachute payments when they were still in the PL to keep the club alive.

 

Isn't the original intention of the PL parachute payments to protect a club from the reduction in FUTURE revenue caused as a result of relegation from the PL....?

 

What Pomepy have done / are doing is using the PL parachute payments to plug gaps in PAST financial mis-management.

 

Doesn't the PL have any rules that prevent clubs from "mis-using" the parachute payments? (*chortle*)

 

Surely, if the parachute payments aren't being used for the purpose that they were created for then the system is inherently subject to abuse? (*chuckle*)

 

Yours rhetorically (yet again)...

Edited 10 January, 2012 by trousers

[suewhistle]

? (*chortle*) (*chuckle*)

 

Those two words sum up this thread for me.

 

(*giggle*) (*s*******)

[Wes Tender]

Andronikou in that Telegraph article:

 

"The alternative to keeping the club alive is that the creditors will receive nothing and Portsmouth will be deprived of an institution that the city is built around. It's essential to the economy and wellbeing of the city."

 

The unsecured creditors have received nothing so far anyway and most have probably written their debts off already, as it's such a paltry amount spread over such a long time.

 

But what a load of guff about the City of Portsmouth being built around the football club. We're taling about a history of the city going back centuries, built around the port and its prominence as a Naval Port, not some poxy little football club thats been there little over a century. As for the bit about it being essential for the wellbeing of the City, what a load of tosh. It's a drain on the City's resources, a blight on their image and a cause of mental strife on its citizens who support it. However, it is also a considerable factor in the increased wealth of a highly unethical administrator, so that is a good enough reason for Andronikou to spout this tosh.

[suewhistle]

In case you were wondering snig ger.

[Guided Missile]

Here's a laugh out loud post from the past, that will keep the comedy gold that this thread has become, alive:

 

Not going to heppen, certainly not signing Eto'o/ Villa etc but wouldn't be surprised to see Maradona acting as some sort of "ambassador" (call it what you want) for PFC as he is allegedly quite good friends with Al Fahim. Only in the short term though. From what I hear the new investment Al Fahim wants to bring in will possibly be buying him out even by the Jan transfer window. It's clear there were always investors behind him who were providing the funding and whilst he's not exactly a pauper he's not got the funds to plough into the club that was talked about at the start.

[Weston Super Saint]

Here's a laugh out loud post from the past, that will keep the comedy gold that this thread has become, alive:

 

No doubt he'll reply that what he wrote there was just a rumour that he was passing on - even though there is no mention of that in the post.

 

Also he'll concoct some scenario to try and claim he's not responsible for what he's written, or that it was just a joke, or some other feeble reason why we're all a bunch of lunatics and it's a conspiracy to try and make him look bad.

 

You know, the usual corspe bullocks that he spouts after posting a load of smelly brown stuff.

 

Either that or he'll just deny he ever wrote it, like he tries to do many times.

[Sour Mash]

Those two words sum up this thread for me.

 

(*giggle*) (*s*******)

Why is it funny? Read the latest AA quotes, they're continuing to take the f****g p**s!

[Verbal]

This thread is mental. 47,000 posts.

 

The sign of true love.

[aintforever]

"The Premier League's parachute payments have been going directly to football creditors but Portsmouth will also directly receive £28 million from that pot before the end of the 2013-14 season. Further funding had been coming from CSI but, following the arrest last November of their main shareholder Vladimir Antonov, new investment is needed. It is estimated that around £11 million would secure Portsmouth's long-term future.

"The parachute payments will effectively deal with the obligations of the CVA," said Andronikou. "We need someone to come in and deal with working capital. On a PNL basis (profit and loss) – on a pure performance basis – the club is washing its face. The existing board have done a fantastic job but it still needs working capital."

 

So they spunk all CSI's investment on a load of new players to help out perform their relegation rivals, yet are still not a sustainable business?

 

I can't believe the other FL clubs will let them get away with it, cheating c*nts.

[saintjay77]

And wait, what's this?:

 

The Telegraph can even disclose that a pledge made in 2010 that small creditors owed less than £2,500 and charities would be paid in full remains unfulfilled.

I'm certain that the Ho assured us that the charities had all been paid. Therefore, I expect The Telegraph to apologise for this statement, or for Lampitt to sue them, unless..............

 

Hold that thought a second as although the Telegraph seems like a reliable source it looks like its got plenty of holes in it and not very well researched. Its already been pointed out on here that the Parachute payments seem well off and what is still owed to various creditors seems under too. So on the flip side its fairly likley that the wording above hasnt been looked into that well and should be taken with a pinch of salt.

 

Cant take that bit as gospel while ripping into the rest can we.

[Torres]

Isn't the "new" parachute payment schedule (which Pompey were the first club to recieve):

 

Year 1 - £16m

Year 2 - £16m

Year 3 - £8m

Year 4 - £8m

 

Now, some or all of Year 1 at least was forwarded to them in 09/10, if not more. Anything remaining from Year 2 would have been paid in 10/11. Year 3 is this season, Year 4 next season.

 

Of that, they've got £16m maximum due but will have been given part of Year 3 already this season.

 

On top of that, a whole load of that was directed straight to the football creditors by the Premier League without even passing through Pompey's grubby mits. I fail to see how they're due £28m in parachute payments now.

[Torres]

Crap, can't edit the above.

 

I'm clearly a year out in my thinking above, ignore me.

[Torres]

Although, having said that, if they were advanced Year 1 payments, is it reasonable to assume that subsequent payments have also been/are scheduled to be paid early? Or are we to believe that they received no parachute payments during 10/11? Perhaps my original post was (inadvertently) correct after all?

[pedg]

Although, having said that, if they were advanced Year 1 payments, is it reasonable to assume that subsequent payments have also been/are scheduled to be paid early? Or are we to believe that they received no parachute payments during 10/11? Perhaps my original post was (inadvertently) correct after all?

 

2009-2010 Still in prem but reports of being paid first years parachute payments. 1st 16 million

2010-2011 2nd 16 million

2011-2012 1st 8 million, assume paid in instalments so have about 4 million to come.

2012-2013 8 million

 

By my back of an envelope calculations they probably have about 12 million to come assuming full advance of 16 million in the 2009-2010 season.

[Bearsy]

I remember back in the day AA claiming football debts at £20m so I guess that's why people think Pompey are due the remaining £28m. Wouldn't surprise me if they put in a cheaky bid for Torres off the back of it.

[trousers]

I remember back in the day AA claiming football debts at £20m so I guess that's why people think Pompey are due the remaining £28m. Wouldn't surprise me if they put in a cheaky bid for Torres off the back of it.

 

He's a good poster on here TBH. They could do worse.

[Torres]

I have no intention of signing for Pompey Online.

[trousers]

I have no intention of signing for Pompey Online.

[saint si]

According to the articles it was around March/April 2010 that they were advanced parachute money.

 

So this should be shown in the CVA report of 28th May 2010. Can anyone find it?

 

What is clear is that the amount being diverted to football creditors is £22.4m, leaving at most £25.6m for "other".

[sussexsaint]

Andronikou in that Telegraph article:

 

 

 

 

Sorry , me being dim again. If he is the administrator for CSI surely his responsibility is to CSI and not to the people of Portsmouth ???

[The Cat]

not strictly takeover related, but can I suggest you buy/read this months edition of When Saturday Comes. Nice article about the derby game in there by James De Mellow.

 

Great front cover too.

 

Can't find an image of it online yet as it only plopped through the letterbox today, however it features a picture of a ponderous looking Redknapp with the strapline "NEXT ENGLAND MANAGER?" while Harry thinks "The jury's still out."

 

Nice to see their cover from April 2010 is (Premier League aside) still relevant:

 

[Gemmel]

That figure has been confirmed by former Hull City chairman Paul Duffen, who has pinned his colours to the mast as a potential new buyer for the club, who said he had seen documents which show Pompey had drawn 8m of the 16m it can expect to get from the league for 2011

http://www.portsmouth.co.uk/sport/pompey_dip_into_next_year_s_cash_to_save_the_club_1_2300458

Edited 10 January, 2012 by Gemmel

[Scummer]

That figure has been confirmed by former Hull City chairman Paul Duffen, who has pinned his colours to the mast as a potential new buyer for the club, who said he had seen documents which show Pompey had drawn 8m of the 16m it can expect to get from the league for 2011

http://www.portsmouth.co.uk/sport/pompey_dip_into_next_year_s_cash_to_save_the_club_1_2300458

 

That's a story from October 2010?

[pedg]

According to the articles it was around March/April 2010 that they were advanced parachute money.

 

So this should be shown in the CVA report of 28th May 2010. Can anyone find it?

 

What is clear is that the amount being diverted to football creditors is £22.4m, leaving at most £25.6m for "other".

 

Question is when were they advanced the parachute payment?

 

The 22.4 million is I assume football creditors at the point they went into admin?

 

If some of the first parachute payment was released before admin to go towards football creditors then part of their parachute pot would have been spent before admin so the total for football creditors to take out of the parachute payments could be greater than the 22.4? don't know.

[BigShadow]

Whilst there were 'reports' of advanced parachute monies in 09/10 - I can't find any evidence that this happened - what I did find was a PL denial that any parachute monies had been advanced to PFC whilst still in the PL. I think the 'advance' might have been an early payment of TV monies due for that season anyway.

 

So....£48m parachute payments due - £22.4m in Football Creditors as per CVA report.

 

2010/11 - £16m - all to Football Creditors

11/12 - £16m - £6.4m to football creditors - £9.6m to PFC

12/13 - £8m to PFC

13/14 - £8m to PFC

 

So given that I believe parachute payments are made in two instalments each year - it would be reasonable to assume PFC have £8m remaining due this year. Plus £8m for each of the next two years. So £24m remaining.

 

The CVA needs £16.5m - which leaves £7.5m for the following to fight over.

 

Chinny - £17m+

Gadymack - £2.5m?

Lithuanian Savers - £10.6m - (Note: If funds are proven to have been stolen, CSI being placed in administration will not necessarily protect these funds from being reclaimed - unlikely though)

Plus - Instalments due on new transfer deals ???

 

Now - the above assumes Pompey are running at break-even financially - but we all know that is not the case, so some of these parachute monies will be needed to fund day-to-day expenses - how much we do not know.

 

What all this tells me is that it is Chinny who holds the cards to Poopeys future. It would appear that he will maximise the repayment of his debt by keeping PFC alive until the all the parachute monies are in at some point in the 2013/14 season. At which point - he could run off with his cash (+ interest) and leave the final couple of CVA payments with no funding, at which time PFC will be on the precipice once more.

 

However - it ALL depends on how much money they are losing each month to determine how much will be left for Chinny to make off with.

[Gemmel]

That's a story from October 2010?

 

Yes drawing from the 16 million due in 2011.

[Weston Super Saint]

Question is when were they advanced the parachute payment?

 

The 22.4 million is I assume football creditors at the point they went into admin?

 

If some of the first parachute payment was released before admin to go towards football creditors then part of their parachute pot would have been spent before admin so the total for football creditors to take out of the parachute payments could be greater than the 22.4? don't know.

 

Well, from the article linked above - October 2010 - it would appear they had half the first parachute payment of £8m to get through that season.

 

So, still due :

 

£8m - the other half.

£16m

£8m

£8m

 

However, £22.8m is due to football creditors, so they won't see a penny of that.

 

That leaves :

 

8+16+8+8 = £40m - £22.8m = £17.2m [at best, if they haven't already taken more in advance].

 

However, they still owe 20% of £80m in CVA, which equals roughly £16m - I know the 20% is less expenses, but that is what will be paid to the creditors, the expenses will still need to be paid!!!!

 

That leaves, by my calculations, a mere £1.2m from all those parachute payments.

 

How much is gaydamack owed, about £1.5m isn't it?

 

That leaves them needing to find £300k just to pay the basic amounts owed. All this while needing £10.8m cash injection this season [i've not included that as a debt as no-one has asked for it back yet!], just to continue playing

 

Once again, the figures DO NOT add up, although I'm sure the corpse will continue to claim they are debt free and a very attractive proposition for someone to buy!!!

 

ps, all those figures don't include any of the money owing to Chinny and his lucrative interest rates as that money is allegedly covered by his charge over the arena!

[trousers]

Don't forget that our friend the administrator will command a healthy fee too....

[Gemmel]

Although not Saints related I thought, today of all days, this news (which has just come to me from an excellent well-placed source in P*mpey) deserves a position on the main forum. I am told news of the collapse will officially emerge in the next few days.

This is not a wind-up. I don't usually "do" gloating but with the mod's permission can I indulge myself just a little?

 

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[TD=bgcolor: #e7eaef]BigSmokeBlue Posted on 10/01/2012 14:42

Takeover[/TD]

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[TD=bgcolor: #e7eaef, colspan: 2]I heard a rumour that the deal AA was on about last week (you know the one...to be completed in 48 hours!) has collapsed. They are desparately trying to agree a deal with the two other interested parties

 

Takes me back to the very opening post on this thread :) [/TD]

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[latter day saint]

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[TD=bgcolor: #e7eaef]BigSmokeBlue Posted on 10/01/2012 14:42

Takeover[/TD]

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[TD=bgcolor: #e7eaef, colspan: 2]I heard a rumour that the deal AA was on about last week (you know the one...to be completed in 48 hours!) has collapsed. They are desparately trying to agree a deal with the two other interested parties

 

Takes me back to the very opening post on this thread :)[/TD]

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[trousers]

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[TD=bgcolor: #e7eaef]BigSmokeBlue Posted on 10/01/2012 14:42

Takeover[/TD]

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[TD=bgcolor: #e7eaef, colspan: 2]I heard a rumour that the deal AA was on about last week (you know the one...to be completed in 48 hours!) has collapsed. They are desparately trying to agree a deal with the two other interested parties

 

Takes me back to the very opening post on this thread :)[/TD]

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Source?

[holepuncture]

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[TD=bgcolor: #e7eaef]BigSmokeBlue Posted on 10/01/2012 14:42

Takeover[/TD]

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[TD=bgcolor: #e7eaef, colspan: 2]I heard a rumour that the deal AA was on about last week (you know the one...to be completed in 48 hours!) has collapsed. They are desparately trying to agree a deal with the two other interested parties

 

Takes me back to the very opening post on this thread :) [/TD]

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As above, I guess they saw straight through Andronikous lies and realised the figures dont stack up!

 

Unless the skates are up for a bit of Chanrai and more years of corruption and despair, it has to be liquidation and relocation to Moneyfields...

 

[Gemmel]

Source?

 

http://fansonline.net/portsmouth/mb/view.php?id=399135

[Gemmel]

As above, I guess they saw straight through Andronikous lies and realised the figures dont stack up!

 

Actually holepuncture, I think it was you that said this morning, that the piece in the telegraph was a "Salespitch". After re-reading it, I have to agree. Not quite the deal in 48 hour speech we got last week.

[trousers]

http://fansonline.net/portsmouth/mb/view.php?id=399135

 

[dubai_phil]

An interesting point about money....

 

So the research into possible Parachute payments paid in advance and football creditors seems to show that potentially poopey received 9 mil into their operation THIS year.

 

So THIS is REALLY good news for those of you who like Toast. Suddenly the maths becomes much more fun....

 

10.8mil from the poor starving Lithuanian Pensioners

9 mil from Parachute payments

 

And yet STILL AA is "not convinced" that they can pay the wages at the end of this month...

 

So they are actually burning ALMOST double what we imagined would make an investor run away.....

 

Of course this analysis is based only on conjecture on this last page but...........

 

ROFL if that is the case

[Chopper71]

An interesting point about money....

 

So the research into possible Parachute payments paid in advance and football creditors seems to show that potentially poopey received 9 mil into their operation THIS year.

 

So THIS is REALLY good news for those of you who like Toast. Suddenly the maths becomes much more fun....

 

10.8mil from the poor starving Lithuanian Pensioners

9 mil from Parachute payments

 

And yet STILL AA is "not convinced" that they can pay the wages at the end of this month...

 

So they are actually burning ALMOST double what we imagined would make an investor run away.....

 

Of course this analysis is based only on conjecture on this last page but...........

 

ROFL if that is the case

 

Don't think that's quite right as they keep telling us CVA is funded by parachute money, so surely they would have put that money safely aside to pay the CVA?

 

Sorry, forgot this is poopey so stupid question