landford.saint Posted 3 February, 2011 Share Posted 3 February, 2011 You don't think they would actually have read any of his work, do you? Dickens are what they give their sisters after a night out. Burst out laughing at work, they now think the 'old man' is losing his marbles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mickn Posted 3 February, 2011 Share Posted 3 February, 2011 At Locks Heath? No, Horton Heath Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miserableoldgit Posted 3 February, 2011 Share Posted 3 February, 2011 No, Horton Heath Oh yes. Sorry. I knew that it was some "blasted heath" or other! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TopGun Posted 3 February, 2011 Share Posted 3 February, 2011 (edited) I guess they've delayed the first cva payments to make time to reduce the wagebill further. If Lampitt is attempting to meet the cva, (and there has been no indication yet that the club intend to address any debts), he desperately needs the forthcoming player clearout in the summer. He can then get the wagebill to a sensible level, though signing players on £3K a week will be difficult as this regime has already sanctioned £20K a week. Their rebuffed offers in the transfer window demonstrated that by already overpaying loanees etc, no one will take a paycut to come to a sinking ship. Who wants to take £5K a week knowing there are others in the squad on three, four or five times that? That would suggest the post-exodus starting squad for next season could be desperate journeymen unwanted by proper clubs, and kids, all on peanuts - plus a very miffed Lawrence and Kitson, and a grossly-overpaid middle-aged immobile Nigerian. Meanwhile further parachute payments will have to be utilised to cover the lack of transfer income - or is Chanrai going to chuck more money in the bottomless well?... Are they about £12M down on the proposed income from two windows? That leaves a whacking great hole in the cva figures! Getting the wages sustainable will be a start but Cotterill is close to cracking. His comment the other day that they need to remember that the club is a football club and not a bank means he has been told he has to cut costs and the squad will suffer. Lampitt can go either way in the summer - try and cut costs and address debt, or continue to sanction overpaid signings. The inactivity this week might indicate that it is finally reality check time - has the madness finally ended? No more big wages, no more expensive loanees, just a battle for club survival. To sum up - nothing has changed in a year - as it was in Feb 2010 - The only answer is still cash on the table, and lots of it. They must still be trading insolvently. The current manager still doesn't understand how a business works. Many of the fans don't understand how a business works. Creditors have got nothing, and they are still idiots. They still have the taxman on their backs. They still have tax evasion charges hanging around. They are still blaming previous owners, even though they are now one of them. An investigation still needs to take place. They are heading for a firesale/clearout in the summer. oh hang on, a couple of things have changed since Feb 2010 - a year ago they were fighting relegation, but it was from the division above with a life-saving cushion of four years of big money. And they could fill their little ground back then. If they get their act together I will look forward to Cotterill's rousing little speech on the pitch when they survive on the final day, glossing over the fact that they needed to go up, not stay up.... It'll be like carnival time, as if the prossie-botherer never left - the flags, the extra thumbs, the cheers - just drowned out by the sound of fifteen ferraris leaving the rented car park for the last time and taking the club's entire income with them. the few's 2011 doesn't look great on paper - and it was all gambled, and still being gambled for a solitary fa cup. At least Leeds aimed high. It looks pretty dismal for them. They have 19 players out of contract in the summer and most of them will leave for nothing. That will leave them with 9 players in contract at the club and no money to buy or pay new ones. They'll lose Cotterill and bring in Poortvliet!! Edited 3 February, 2011 by TopGun Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JackFrost Posted 3 February, 2011 Share Posted 3 February, 2011 maybe we could loan them Pulis & Forecast to help them out Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
100%Red&White Posted 3 February, 2011 Share Posted 3 February, 2011 Oh yes. Sorry. I knew that it was some "blasted heath" or other! More likely Hampstead Heath these days and I'm sure we've all heard what goes on up there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sidthesquid Posted 3 February, 2011 Share Posted 3 February, 2011 Oh yes. Sorry. I knew that it was some "blasted heath" or other! What always impresses me about this site is the better class of post we get - not only references to Dickens, but now Thomas Hardy.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miserableoldgit Posted 3 February, 2011 Share Posted 3 February, 2011 What always impresses me about this site is the better class of post we get - not only references to Dickens, but now Thomas Hardy.... TBF I was thinking of Macbeth, but I am sure that TH had one as well! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
suewhistle Posted 3 February, 2011 Share Posted 3 February, 2011 TBF I was thinking of Macbeth, but I am sure that TH had one as well! I was think of Macheath in The Beggar's Opera... a Pompey pub scene... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
for_heaven's_Saint Posted 3 February, 2011 Share Posted 3 February, 2011 Looks like a Devils fork and it might be a broom on fire?!.... whatever that means to the blue few. Ah no I get it, it's a trident! The word "trident" comes from the French trident, which in turn comes from the Latin tridens or tridentis: tri "three" and dentes "teeth". What better way to represent the people of Portsmouth than through their world-renowned lack of dental hygiene? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danish Saint Posted 3 February, 2011 Share Posted 3 February, 2011 Ah no I get it, it's a trident! The word "trident" comes from the French trident, which in turn comes from the Latin tridens or tridentis: tri "three" and dentes "teeth". What better way to represent the people of Portsmouth than through their world-renowned lack of dental hygiene? Aaah..... they really are a clever bunch So it will take the Devil and lack of dental hygiene to save Pompey! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doctoroncall Posted 3 February, 2011 Share Posted 3 February, 2011 First payment for the unsecured creditors coming up on the 28th Feb, THREE million pounds sterling. I wonder where they'll get the money for that, player sales perhaps, afterall the well regarded Utaka has been sold. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigShadow Posted 3 February, 2011 Share Posted 3 February, 2011 First payment for the unsecured creditors coming up on the 28th Feb, THREE million pounds sterling. I wonder where they'll get the money for that, player sales perhaps, afterall the well regarded Utaka has been sold. I think you'll find that payment has been deferred to April 2012. Now you know where the phrase 'credit on the never, never' comes from. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doctoroncall Posted 3 February, 2011 Share Posted 3 February, 2011 I think you'll find that payment has been deferred to April 2012. Now you know where the phrase 'credit on the never, never' comes from. link? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JackFrost Posted 3 February, 2011 Share Posted 3 February, 2011 I've heard it's been deferred til April 2012 also, I think it got confirmed on this thread a few pages back Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
angelman Posted 3 February, 2011 Share Posted 3 February, 2011 What always impresses me about this site is the better class of post we get - not only references to Dickens, but now Thomas Hardy.... I am not sure if it has been posted before, but Dickens's opening of A Tale of Two Cities seems very apt at the moment: It was the best of times, it was the worst of times, it was the age of wisdom, it was the age of foolishness, it was the epoch of belief, it was the epoch of incredulity, it was the season of Light, it was the season of Darkness, it was the spring of hope, it was the winter of despair, we had everything before us, we had nothing before us,......... Think that about sums it up Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigShadow Posted 3 February, 2011 Share Posted 3 February, 2011 link? PFC 'Taking-the-P!ss' November Update Page 5 is what you are looking for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gaz Posted 3 February, 2011 Share Posted 3 February, 2011 It looks pretty dismal for them. They have 19 players out of contract in the summer and most of them will leave for nothing. That will leave them with 9 players in contract at the club and no money to buy or pay new ones. They'll lose Cotterill and bring in Poortvliet!! Open trials on the common this summer then! Good chance to sign up the promising 12-16 year old locals with their superior jumping ability gained by their webbed feet.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colinjb Posted 3 February, 2011 Share Posted 3 February, 2011 It seems we all had the wrong idea when David Lampitt left the FA to join the Skates. He isn't trying to save them, he is trying to ensure their filthy hides are driven out of existence for good. Double agent Lampitt, continue your good work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mack rill Posted 3 February, 2011 Share Posted 3 February, 2011 maybe we could loan them Pulis & Forecast to help them out Kin-ell! we got enuf hand outs down this end of the ally without avin any of yours TA, Now if your talking say Lamb bow, we could give him a run out for yer! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doctoroncall Posted 3 February, 2011 Share Posted 3 February, 2011 PFC 'Taking-the-P!ss' November Update Page 5 is what you are looking for. Thanks - according to that document, no payments have been missed, as the first is due on the 28th of this month and then installments to pay the £13.5m balance over four years three months (starting in April 2012). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gemmel Posted 3 February, 2011 Share Posted 3 February, 2011 Thanks - according to that document, no payments have been missed, as the first is due on the 28th of this month and then installments to pay the £13.5m balance over four years three months (starting in April 2012). Not sure where you are reading that from. First payment is April 1st 2012 http://www.uhy-uk.com/media/download/turnaround-and-recovery/PFC%20-%20November%20report.pdf Where are you getting the 28th of this month from Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doctoroncall Posted 3 February, 2011 Share Posted 3 February, 2011 Not sure where you are reading that from. First payment is April 1st 2012 http://www.uhy-uk.com/media/download/turnaround-and-recovery/PFC%20-%20November%20report.pdf Where are you getting the 28th of this month from I saw it in the final (version 2) CVA report under section 6.10 How many updates have they made! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigShadow Posted 3 February, 2011 Share Posted 3 February, 2011 (edited) I saw it in the final (version 2) CVA report under section 6.10 How many updates have they made! OK...this is the summary.... Originally the CVA called for a payment of £3m within nine months IF that money was raised from Player Sales in August. Then the balance of £13.5m to be paid in six monthly instalments starting Sept 2011. (sorry - meant half yearly not monthly for six months) The revised CVA document in November 2010 confirms that they did not raise the required £3m from Player Sales. Therefore, the entire balance of £16.5m will now be paid in instalments commencing April 2012 and ending June 2015. Note: even these payments are heavily weighted towards the back-end... 15% in 2012 25% in 2013 30% in 2014 30% in 2015. The dumb creditors signed up to this arrangement whereby AA could modify the CVA terms so they will get exactly what is coming to them - which seems quite likely to be nothing. Edited 3 February, 2011 by BigShadow Clarification Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pedg Posted 3 February, 2011 Share Posted 3 February, 2011 The dumb creditors signed up to this arrangement whereby AA could modify the CVA terms so they will get exactly what is coming to them - which seems quite likely to be nothing. As I understand it, probably wrong, those businesses owed money could offset their loses to pompey against tax once the CVA was sorted so if that's the case they may well be saving much more money on their tax bills compared to the pennies they may get from pompey which may be viewed as a bonus if it ever arrives. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clapham Saint Posted 3 February, 2011 Share Posted 3 February, 2011 OK...this is the summary.... Originally the CVA called for a payment of £3m within nine months IF that money was raised from Player Sales in August. Then the balance of £13.5m to be paid in six monthly instalments starting Sept 2011. (sorry - meant half yearly not monthly for six months) The revised CVA document in November 2010 confirms that they did not raise the required £3m from Player Sales. Therefore, the entire balance of £16.5m will now be paid in instalments commencing April 2012 and ending June 2015. Note: even these payments are heavily weighted towards the back-end... 15% in 2012 25% in 2013 30% in 2014 30% in 2015. The dumb creditors signed up to this arrangement whereby AA could modify the CVA terms so they will get exactly what is coming to them - which seems quite likely to be nothing. The first payment is now due in 1 April 2012. Until then a newly formed Company ("PFCR") owns a football club buisness. A football club for which it has (as yet) paid absolutely nothing. What's the likelyhood of either: a) The club being sold on before 1 April. The PFCR would still owe the agreed 20% to the old company. b) No sale being agreed, the club not being promoted and there being insufficient funds to make the first payment resulting in PFCR eventually being placed into administration, although this will no doubt be strung out for a while after the first payment should have been made. In the case of a) the owners of PFCR can get a return on their "investment" before they even have to pay for it. In the case of b) they haven't had to put any money in anyway so don't actually lose anything further. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clapham Saint Posted 3 February, 2011 Share Posted 3 February, 2011 As I understand it, probably wrong, those businesses owed money could offset their loses to pompey against tax once the CVA was sorted so if that's the case they may well be saving much more money on their tax bills compared to the pennies they may get from pompey which may be viewed as a bonus if it ever arrives. If you make a loss becuase you don't get paid then this reduces your profits, and as a result you pay lower taxes. They'd still rather be paid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anothersaintinsouthsea Posted 3 February, 2011 Share Posted 3 February, 2011 As I understand it, probably wrong, those businesses owed money could offset their loses to pompey against tax once the CVA was sorted so if that's the case they may well be saving much more money on their tax bills compared to the pennies they may get from pompey which may be viewed as a bonus if it ever arrives. Not really. If you've made a loss you can carry that forward to offset future profits and avoid tax on those profits. Let's say you make an average profit of 10% of your revenue. Carrying forward your losses saves you a future 30% of your future 10% profit - 3.3% of your revenue. But you've actually lost 75% of previous revenue - so 75% versus 3.3% and then it's questionably whether you get the remaining 25% or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
St Jim Posted 3 February, 2011 Share Posted 3 February, 2011 OK...this is the summary.... Originally the CVA called for a payment of £3m within nine months IF that money was raised from Player Sales in August. Then the balance of £13.5m to be paid in six monthly instalments starting Sept 2011. (sorry - meant half yearly not monthly for six months) The revised CVA document in November 2010 confirms that they did not raise the required £3m from Player Sales. Therefore, the entire balance of £16.5m will now be paid in instalments commencing April 2012 and ending June 2015. Note: even these payments are heavily weighted towards the back-end... 15% in 2012 25% in 2013 30% in 2014 30% in 2015. The dumb creditors signed up to this arrangement whereby AA could modify the CVA terms so they will get exactly what is coming to them - which seems quite likely to be nothing. How the f*** to they get away with devising a CVA where they can change the payment dates and installment amounts. How the f*** did this ever get approved............oh yeah I forgot they most of the creditors are from Pompey http://www.untoldentertainment.com/blog/img/2009_03_05/inbred.jpg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pedg Posted 3 February, 2011 Share Posted 3 February, 2011 Not really. If you've made a loss you can carry that forward to offset future profits and avoid tax on those profits. Let's say you make an average profit of 10% of your revenue. Carrying forward your losses saves you a future 30% of your future 10% profit - 3.3% of your revenue. But you've actually lost 75% of previous revenue - so 75% versus 3.3% and then it's questionably whether you get the remaining 25% or not. So I was wrong(ish). I think my point was that yes the creditors would have liked 100% of what they were owed but it was fairly obvious that they were only going to get a very small (at current rate zero) percent of their debt back whatever happened with the CVA and at least they could, unlike the inland revenue, make some positive use of the loss. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danish Saint Posted 3 February, 2011 Share Posted 3 February, 2011 They are still up a sh*t creek with a Devils fork and bad dental hygiene for a paddle...... or however that goes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint J 77 Posted 3 February, 2011 Share Posted 3 February, 2011 A lot of the skates fans keep saying they don't mind the trouble they are in now because at least it brought them success beyond their dreams, with promotion and the FA cup. Its that thought that keeps them going in these dark days (dark days for them anyway). I think it would be very humorous and only fair really if they were to be offfically stripped of the FA cup win. It would send out a clear message of not spend beyond your means to win a competiton. Michel Platini himself said that Pompey had cheated ""When I was younger, I remember seeing people with no money buy Ferraris — and then, because of the Ferrari, they would get the best girls! That's not correct, but it's what has happened in football: you don't have the money to buy the players, but you get the players and in the end you cheat and win the competition. That's not correct." http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2010/apr/28/michel-platini-premier-league-portsmouth I have posted this link before but liked it so much I thought I would again. They cheated to win the competition. Although winning the FA cup was only really the tip of the iceberg regarding their cheating and ripping off honest business, I believe stripped them of the cup is the only fair thing to do for the integrity of the competition . If they get liquidated job done I suppose but if they continue on this long slow death I would love to see this happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dark Munster Posted 3 February, 2011 Share Posted 3 February, 2011 I am not sure if it has been posted before, but Dickens's opening of A Tale of Two Cities seems very apt at the moment: It was the best of times, it was the worst of times, it was the age of wisdom, it was the age of foolishness, it was the epoch of belief, it was the epoch of incredulity, it was the season of Light, it was the season of Darkness, it was the spring of hope, it was the winter of despair, we had everything before us, we had nothing before us,......... Think that about sums it up Apart from the best of times, age of wisdom, epoch of belief, season of Light, and the spring of hope, that sums them up perfectly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
St Jim Posted 4 February, 2011 Share Posted 4 February, 2011 A lot of the skates fans keep saying they don't mind the trouble they are in now because at least it brought them success beyond their dreams, with promotion and the FA cup. Its that thought that keeps them going in these dark days (dark days for them anyway). I think it would be very humorous and only fair really if they were to be offfically stripped of the FA cup win. It would send out a clear message of not spend beyond your means to win a competiton. Michel Platini himself said that Pompey had cheated ""When I was younger, I remember seeing people with no money buy Ferraris — and then, because of the Ferrari, they would get the best girls! That's not correct, but it's what has happened in football: you don't have the money to buy the players, but you get the players and in the end you cheat and win the competition. That's not correct." http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2010/apr/28/michel-platini-premier-league-portsmouth I have posted this link before but liked it so much I thought I would again. They cheated to win the competition. Although winning the FA cup was only really the tip of the iceberg regarding their cheating and ripping off honest business, I believe stripped them of the cup is the only fair thing to do for the integrity of the competition . If they get liquidated job done I suppose but if they continue on this long slow death I would love to see this happen. I don't begrudge them the FA Cup win, afterall it was winning the cup that caused the massive player bonuses that in turn caused thm to make a loss in the cup win that in turn has contributed to their downfall! ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
angelman Posted 4 February, 2011 Share Posted 4 February, 2011 Apart from the best of times, age of wisdom, epoch of belief, season of Light, and the spring of hope, that sums them up perfectly. As it is A Tale of Two Cities, those refer to us not them! The other part if them. Maybe not the best of times for us, as those are hopefully yet to come, but it is metaphorical. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rpb Posted 4 February, 2011 Share Posted 4 February, 2011 This sounds a bit familiar... http://www.portsmouth.co.uk/news/local/east-hampshire/bank_error_causes_delay_in_wages_for_pompey_players_1_2380082 Still it was all explained to everyone's satisfaction. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danish Saint Posted 4 February, 2011 Share Posted 4 February, 2011 This sounds a bit familiar... http://www.portsmouth.co.uk/news/local/east-hampshire/bank_error_causes_delay_in_wages_for_pompey_players_1_2380082 Still it was all explained to everyone's satisfaction. Love the fact "it was purely a matter of the bank missing a list of names....." What names could that be? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevegrant Posted 4 February, 2011 Share Posted 4 February, 2011 This sounds a bit familiar... http://www.portsmouth.co.uk/news/local/east-hampshire/bank_error_causes_delay_in_wages_for_pompey_players_1_2380082 Still it was all explained to everyone's satisfaction. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weston Super Saint Posted 4 February, 2011 Share Posted 4 February, 2011 This sounds a bit familiar... http://www.portsmouth.co.uk/news/local/east-hampshire/bank_error_causes_delay_in_wages_for_pompey_players_1_2380082 Still it was all explained to everyone's satisfaction. Hmmm, I wonder why he did not want to be named, perhaps Mr Storyteller has had enough quotes printed in the paper which turned out to be untrue A fan – who did not wish to be named – said: ‘It is good news – it certainly sent shivers down my spine to hear that wages were late again. ‘But I think the guys running the club now are trustworthy, so I’m willing to take their word for it.’ I guess it all depends on your definition of 'trust' really. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint Keith Posted 4 February, 2011 Share Posted 4 February, 2011 This sounds a bit familiar... http://www.portsmouth.co.uk/news/local/east-hampshire/bank_error_causes_delay_in_wages_for_pompey_players_1_2380082 Still it was all explained to everyone's satisfaction. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andysstuff Posted 4 February, 2011 Share Posted 4 February, 2011 This sounds a bit familiar... http://www.portsmouth.co.uk/news/local/east-hampshire/bank_error_causes_delay_in_wages_for_pompey_players_1_2380082 Still it was all explained to everyone's satisfaction. Deja vue? Seems like this time last year all over again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sidthesquid Posted 4 February, 2011 Share Posted 4 February, 2011 I particularly enjoyed this bit - But Pompey’s current finances are looking far more healthy, with the club on course to hit its financial targets for this year. Derr. They are on target for this year because they have put it all off till next year. It is a disease down there, isn't it. Directors, managers, players, fans, even the press, none of them can tell the truth by accident, can they? Or see it, for that matter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JackFrost Posted 4 February, 2011 Share Posted 4 February, 2011 I particularly enjoyed this bit - But Pompey’s current finances are looking far more healthy, with the club on course to hit its financial targets for this year. Derr. They are on target for this year because they have put it all off till next year. It is a disease down there, isn't it. Directors, managers, players, fans, even the press, none of them can tell the truth by accident, can they? Or see it, for that matter. The power of public relations and the media my friend Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chopper71 Posted 4 February, 2011 Share Posted 4 February, 2011 This sounds a bit familiar... http://www.portsmouth.co.uk/news/local/east-hampshire/bank_error_causes_delay_in_wages_for_pompey_players_1_2380082 Still it was all explained to everyone's satisfaction. It truly is the gift that keeps on giving. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pedg Posted 4 February, 2011 Share Posted 4 February, 2011 With the most recent bank error story I do think someone should come up with a pompey game based loosely on Monopoly. Players have to compete going round the board buying up players. Obviously they only start with a little money but gain more each time they pass "Do no pay creditors" and also once the money has run out you can continue to buy anything you like by writing out an IOU. Just wondering what could be used as the game pieces? Small brown envelope, model of their flush new stadium, a rusty lump of iron to represent FP? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shrek Posted 4 February, 2011 Share Posted 4 February, 2011 Since when did banks start emailing customers with details of banking errors?! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whitey Grandad Posted 4 February, 2011 Share Posted 4 February, 2011 Some people have private banking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shrek Posted 4 February, 2011 Share Posted 4 February, 2011 Fair point! I'm just instantly suspicous of anything that comes out of that club! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Minsk Posted 4 February, 2011 Share Posted 4 February, 2011 With the most recent bank error story I do think someone should come up with a pompey game based loosely on Monopoly. Players have to compete going round the board buying up players. Obviously they only start with a little money but gain more each time they pass "Do no pay creditors" and also once the money has run out you can continue to buy anything you like by writing out an IOU. Just wondering what could be used as the game pieces? Small brown envelope, model of their flush new stadium, a rusty lump of iron to represent FP? Toilet Brush? Land Mine? Fake Sheik? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rpb Posted 4 February, 2011 Share Posted 4 February, 2011 Fair point! I'm just instantly suspicous of anything that comes out of that club! Absolutely - there's also rumours on one of their boards that their mini buses have been repossessed... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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