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Pompey Takeover Saga

Fitzhugh Fella

By Fitzhugh Fella,
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sidthesquid

sidthesquid

Posted
Posted
“

YOU SIGNED KITSON AND LAWRENCE ON 40 GRAND A WEEK YOU GIMP, NOT THE FL.

 

My thoughts exactly.

A bit of back-of-the-fag-packet maths leads me to think that their wage bill is at least double what was proposed in the CVA, plus their income from player sales and support from the 'best fans in the world TM was has been far less than they needed so there was never any prospect of the CVA promises being met.

You do wonder if they are not still asking Peter Storrie's advice.

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rallyboy

rallyboy

Posted
Posted

So they couldn't fool the FL like they did the Prem - I reckon the signing of Lawrence and Kitson may have been the final straw - a clear two fingers to creditors and other clubs.

 

Their wages are too high.

The figures don't stack up.

They made no effort to address debt.

AA is Chanrai's puppet and creditors interests haven't been top of his agenda.

 

Then again, you didn't have to be Sherlock Holmes to notice these things!!

Interesting times.

Not convinced that it's the end game and the FL now have a problem.

The club is committed to players and contracts they can't afford and the fixture list has to be honoured.

 

the few need a big high-interest loan - nothing to pay until 2014.

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toofarnorth

toofarnorth

Posted
Posted
“The league are saying Portpin have to waive their securities in favour of the Company Voluntary Arrangement (CVA) payments, which is never going to happen in a million years,” said a frustrated Andronikou.

 

“It is rather like in the Liverpool situation for the Premier League to ask the Royal Bank of Scotland to waive its £280million. There is absolutely no difference in the two scenarios.

 

“The league know the situation we are in. We have no cash flow, and as administrators we cannot continue to trade with thin air. They have put us in a position where it is virtually impossible to keep trading as a club.

 

“I get the feeling that the Football League and Premier League are either completely naive or they are telling us to shut Portsmouth Football Club.

“The Football League know Mr Chainrai, he has been vetted by them and they are happy with him. They also have an undertaking from him to provide £5m to the club. In the past they have asked for everything from the purchaser – now they have asked for one thing too many.”

 

A league statement read: “As with any club that goes into administration, the Football League are focused on ensuring that any takeover delivers a sustainable future for the club that is fair to creditors and fans of all clubs. This is what our requirements in this case aim to achieve.” Andronikou will inform Chainrai of the league’s decision today, and fully expects the Hong Kong businessman to end his interest in buying Pompey.

 

Chainrai has already made it clear he only wants the club short-term to try to restore stability, and then sell it on to someone with long-term plans for the club. But the bleak prospect is that Pompey, founded in 1898, may have only days left before being forced out of business.

 

“The only thing I can see now is for the purchaser to reject the Football League demands and walk away, and if he has anyone advising him, then I am sure that is what they will say,” said Andronikou. “Why would anyone want to buy the club under these circumstances?

 

“If the Football League want us to close the club I wish they were more direct in their approach, and just tell us to do it. I am not going to continue in this situation, and it is not a case of ‘will not’ it is more a case of ‘cannot’.

 

“We cannot trade into next month. By the end of this month we will not have sufficient funds to pay wages. There is no one else out there prepared to buy the club and provide the working capital to keep us going and satisfy these impossible terms.

 

YOU SIGNED KITSON AND LAWRENCE ON 40 GRAND A WEEK YOU GIMP, NOT THE FL.

 

I bet lawrence is glad that paperwork didn't go through in time. He'll still have an employer at stoke.

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dubai_phil

dubai_phil

Posted
Posted
So they couldn't fool the FL like they did the Prem - I reckon the signing of Lawrence and Kitson may have been the final straw - a clear two fingers to creditors and other clubs.

 

Their wages are too high.

The figures don't stack up.

They made no effort to address debt.

AA is Chanrai's puppet and creditors interests haven't been top of his agenda.

 

Then again, you didn't have to be Sherlock Holmes to notice these things!!

Interesting times.

Not convinced that it's the end game and the FL now have a problem.

The club is committed to players and contracts they can't afford and the fixture list has to be honoured.

 

the few need a big high-interest loan - nothing to pay until 2014.

 

But that is the problem. Chanrai's charge on the assets is because he ALREADY gave them a big high interest loan.

 

That, and Footballing debts = $48mil = 4 years of parachute payments.

 

They have ALWAYS been trying to sell a collection of smoke & mirrors, there was nothing left apart from Hope, and they tried to find a deluded fool of a "Rich Man" to buy into it

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angelman

angelman

Posted
Posted

and it comes full circle to when they went up for their first liquidation hearing and were told that they were trading insolvently. They should have been closed down then and there, but no, the judiciary let things drag on, incurring huge court costs on the country (HMRC and the courts time) etc etc, and for what? To be warned that the will be insolvent in 2 weeks time unless some money mysteriously appears.

 

As they have the best fans in the world ™, surely the 250,000 odd that they surely must have, can dip into their pocket and produce a fiver every month to keep the club running????

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andysstuff

andysstuff

Posted
Posted
so if the FL continue to withhold the golden share, is it a case of having a sweepstake for which creditor is going to submit the first winding up order?

 

Favourite has got to be our friends at HMRC hasn't it. I'm guessing nothing would give them more pleasure to go back to court and say 'we told you so'

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marc_saint

marc_saint

Posted
Posted
so if the FL continue to withhold the golden share, is it a case of having a sweepstake for which creditor is going to submit the first winding up order?

 

They can't do that whilst they are in admin as they are protected from that. But the AA could liquidate them. (I believe that's correct)

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Ken Tone

Ken Tone

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This whole thing has just been mind-boggling. It is clear to anyone with half a brain that Pompey have continued to overspend whilst in administration (of course they can't afford Lawrence and Kitson) and that chainrai has been far too closely involved with the administrator.

 

Does no one oversee administrators? Are they not regulated ?

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Gemmel

Gemmel

Posted
Posted
This whole thing has just been mind-boggling. It is clear to anyone with half a brain that Pompey have continued to overspend whilst in administration (of course they can't afford Lawrence and Kitson) and that chainrai has been far too closely involved with the administrator.

 

Does no one oversee administrators? Are they not regulated ?

 

The icing on the cake, would be that Andriod, is liable for any additional debt incurred whilst in Admin.

Don't see this as the end, but im not sure what andriod expected after spending 6 months, giving the PL, FL and FA the bird.

 

I at least want them to last until the court case where Storrie costs them another 12 points

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Ken Tone

Ken Tone

Posted
Posted
The icing on the cake, would be that Andriod, is liable for any additional debt incurred whilst in Admin.

Don't see this as the end, but im not sure what andriod expected after spending 6 months, giving the PL, FL and FA the bird.

 

I at least want them to last until the court case where Storrie costs them another 12 points

 

I'm looking forward to Redknapp missing out on the England job because of his court case. The so-called expert commentators seem to have forgotten all about this. How could we possibly have a national manager with that hanging over him?

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Wes Tender

Wes Tender

Posted
Posted
and it comes full circle to when they went up for their first liquidation hearing and were told that they were trading insolvently. They should have been closed down then and there, but no, the judiciary let things drag on, incurring huge court costs on the country (HMRC and the courts time) etc etc, and for what? To be warned that the will be insolvent in 2 weeks time unless some money mysteriously appears.

 

As they have the best fans in the world ™, surely the 250,000 odd that they surely must have, can dip into their pocket and produce a fiver every month to keep the club running????

 

You're right. It is all the fault of that stupid woman who had the opportunity to have shut them down right at the outset of this saga when she heard the petition to wind them up, but allowed herself to be bamboozled so that the Android could put them into administration. And then the idiot Injustice Mann missed the opportunity to disallow the CVA which has since been shown to be a farce and unsustainable since the Skates still refuse to live within their financial means.

 

Thank God that the Football League have the balls to disallow them their golden share. It would be nice to believe that they might have been influenced by the many letters they must have received from fans of other clubs, incredulous at the way that they have raised two fingers to the football establishment, thinking that they could get away with it again. Also some attention might have been given to comments from boardroom level from other clubs, such as this from Gold at West Ham:-

 

Gold said: "One of their [Hicks and Gillett] failures is they haven't delivered their promises. I think that's when the fans turned on them. Once that process started there was no stopping it.

 

"If you are using debt to cheat that's different. You can argue that Portsmouth built debt to cheat. They were buying players and spending extreme amounts of money and building debt.

 

"Portsmouth outbid people to buy those players. Is that not cheating? I see it as a form of cheating."

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stevegrant

stevegrant

Posted
Posted
They can't do that whilst they are in admin as they are protected from that. But the AA could liquidate them. (I believe that's correct)

Correct. If it gets to the stage where there's no realistic prospect of finding a buyer, he could just pull the plug.

 

I'm not convinced it'll come to that in the near future, it'll get strung out until at least the end of the season, IMO.

 

That said, they would still be losing £1m a month if it wasn't for Chainrai putting in that £7m loan, so perhaps the situation is (for once) as AA says it is, i.e. end of this month or bust.

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stevegrant

stevegrant

Posted
Posted
You're right. It is all the fault of that stupid woman who had the opportunity to have shut them down right at the outset of this saga when she heard the petition to wind them up, but allowed herself to be bamboozled so that the Android could put them into administration. And then the idiot Injustice Mann missed the opportunity to disallow the CVA which has since been shown to be a farce and unsustainable since the Skates still refuse to live within their financial means.

Unfortunately, I think Mann was right to throw out HMRC's appeal on the case that they presented to them. I'm no legal expert, but it seemed to me that they went at it from completely the wrong angle. With the players being allowed to claim for the money they would be owed over the remainder of their contract, HMRC should have counterclaimed for the PAYE/NI payable on those wages.

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Gemmel

Gemmel

Posted
Posted
Correct. If it gets to the stage where there's no realistic prospect of finding a buyer, he could just pull the plug.

 

I'm not convinced it'll come to that in the near future, it'll get strung out until at least the end of the season, IMO.

 

That said, they would still be losing £1m a month if it wasn't for Chainrai putting in that £7m loan, so perhaps the situation is (for once) as AA says it is, i.e. end of this month or bust.

 

Steve, i'm not sure it counts for much but android is on record as saying the 7 million was not from Chanircrying .

 

The pompey take on this money was that it came from the PL as an advanced parachute payment

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stevegrant

stevegrant

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Steve, i'm not sure it counts for much but android is on record as saying the 7 million was not from Chanircrying .

 

The pompey take on this money was that it came from the PL as an advanced parachute payment

I'd be very wary of taking things AA says at face value. I was led to believe that the advanced parachute payment was paid to them before they went into administration, and that Chainrai had said he would guarantee £7m during the administration period.

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marc_saint

marc_saint

Posted
Posted
if they manage to get to the end of the season, and into next, would they be due a massive points penalty for starting a season in admin and without a CVA?

 

I dont think any clubs are allowed to start two seasons in a row in admin. They would be demoted out of the league.

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stevegrant

stevegrant

Posted
Posted
if they manage to get to the end of the season, and into next, would they be due a massive points penalty for starting a season in admin and without a CVA?

They won't be able to start next season in administration, although I guess there would be scope for allowing it on the acceptance of a massive points deduction.

 

The CVA has been agreed, so there's no danger of any CVA-related sanctions.

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JackFrost

JackFrost

Posted
Posted
if they manage to get to the end of the season, and into next, would they be due a massive points penalty for starting a season in admin and without a CVA?

 

If their still in admin at that time they won't be allowed to start next season full stop. You cannot start to 2 consecutive seasons in admin.

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Sevvy

Sevvy

Posted
Posted
They won't be able to start next season in administration, although I guess there would be scope for allowing it on the acceptance of a massive points deduction.

 

The CVA has been agreed, so there's no danger of any CVA-related sanctions.

 

Agreed but if they fail to meet any payments etc then they are in trouble

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JackFrost

JackFrost

Posted
Posted
They won't be able to start next season in administration, although I guess there would be scope for allowing it on the acceptance of a massive points deduction.

 

The CVA has been agreed, so there's no danger of any CVA-related sanctions.

 

Even if the CVA is a complete farce and not adhered to?

 

I'm aware the person overlooking AA's CVA is being kept to is AA but what action could a creditor take if they do not get what they agreed to in the CVA whilst Pompey are in administration? If the admin blocks them from submitting a winding up order, what other action could they take?

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stevegrant

stevegrant

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Posted
Even if the CVA is a complete farce and not adhered to?

 

I'm aware the person overlooking AA's CVA is being kept to is AA but what action could a creditor take if they do not get what they agreed to in the CVA whilst Pompey are in administration? If the admin blocks them from submitting a winding up order, what other action could they take?

Not entirely sure, I don't think they have to start making the CVA payments until they exit administration anyway (hopefully Clapham Saint can confirm), so there's probably not a great deal the creditors can do right now. The administrator will be liable for any debts accrued during administration if things go tits up before the CVA is paid.

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sidthesquid

sidthesquid

Posted
Posted

I wrote this earlier and f()ck me if some CHEATING skate supporter hasn't nicked what I wrote!

 

My thoughts exactly.

A bit of back-of-the-fag-packet maths leads me to think that their wage bill is at least double what was proposed in the CVA, plus their income from player sales and support from the 'best fans in the world TM was has been far less than they needed so there was never any prospect of the CVA promises being met.You do wonder if they are not still asking Peter Storrie's advice.

 

Skate News site...

59 dockyardpaul,

at work 15/10/2010 09:53:03

Lets face it AA has contradicted himself so many times and fed us some much claptrap you cannot believe him.

A bit of back-of-the-fag-packet maths leads me to think that the wage bill is at least double what was proposed in the CVA, plus the income from player sales and support has has been far less than needed so there was never any prospect of the CVA promises being met and the FL have now called our bluff. Lets also be clear all that was after we had shafted creditors for 80% of what we owed.

Think what the RN in the dockyard could do with the £30m+ we have taken from the taxman when the defence cuts come next week. Our jobs taken by what was our club.

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Doctoroncall

Doctoroncall

Posted
Posted
Not entirely sure, I don't think they have to start making the CVA payments until they exit administration anyway (hopefully Clapham Saint can confirm), so there's probably not a great deal the creditors can do right now. The administrator will be liable for any debts accrued during administration if things go tits up before the CVA is paid.

 

Not an expert like Clapham, but yes, payments will only start when out of admin. So is Tom Lever still waiting in the wings?

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Crab Lungs

Crab Lungs

Posted
Posted

 

"This whole thing stinks and l think that there is a conspiracy between the PL and FL to drive us out of business UEFA and FIFA need to urgently step in and sort this nonsense out."

 

Absolutely priceless... I mean, seriously, are this lot for real? You overspent AGAIN and did so knowingly. It is your own fault, not anyone elses.

 

Prized bell-ends, they really are...

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hutch

hutch

Posted
Posted
I'd be very wary of taking things AA says at face value. I was led to believe that the advanced parachute payment was paid to them before they went into administration, and that Chainrai had said he would guarantee £7m during the administration period.

I don't believe so. The following is taken from Mann's Judgement:

 

17. After several weeks of the administration, the administrators entered into an agreement with the Premier League for the payment of sums to them by the League to finance the continuation of the club’s activities. It was dated 18th March 2010. It was agreed that the League would pay an Advance of sums to which the club would be entitled from the League’s funds for 2011 (i.e. the next year). There were to be three payments of £2m (roughly monthly) and a fourth of some £886,000 odd. It was a term of the agreement that the sums would be used to pay player wages.

so I guess it's probably accurate.

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Doctoroncall

Doctoroncall

Posted
Posted
If Lawrence and Kitson are on 40k a week why did the football league sanction it? Surely they knew it would be financially unviable for Poopy to sustain that kind of debt and pay off the creditors? Maybe they allowed it so they could screw up! :)

 

That's 19K and 21k respectively, not 40k each (as that would be Nugent and Utaka)!

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Gemmel

Gemmel

Posted
Posted
Not entirely sure, I don't think they have to start making the CVA payments until they exit administration anyway (hopefully Clapham Saint can confirm), so there's probably not a great deal the creditors can do right now. The administrator will be liable for any debts accrued during administration if things go tits up before the CVA is paid.

 

First CVA payment is in March

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franny

franny

Posted
Posted
I wrote this earlier and f()ck me if some CHEATING skate supporter hasn't nicked what I wrote!

 

 

 

Skate News site...

59 dockyardpaul,

at work 15/10/2010 09:53:03

Lets face it AA has contradicted himself so many times and fed us some much claptrap you cannot believe him.

A bit of back-of-the-fag-packet maths leads me to think that the wage bill is at least double what was proposed in the CVA, plus the income from player sales and support has has been far less than needed so there was never any prospect of the CVA promises being met and the FL have now called our bluff. Lets also be clear all that was after we had shafted creditors for 80% of what we owed.

Think what the RN in the dockyard could do with the £30m+ we have taken from the taxman when the defence cuts come next week. Our jobs taken by what was our club.

 

He could of course be one of us stirring the pot!

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Gemmel

Gemmel

Posted
Posted

Lol... I loved this from the news comments;

 

Frattonman and others, I, 4-1 agree with comments. There is something that smells about this. Questions need to be asked. Maybe we should get the MP to raise questions in the House?

 

The funny thing is that their MP has just been arrested on suspicion of sex with a mentally challenged person

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stevegrant

stevegrant

Posted
Posted
I don't believe so. The following is taken from Mann's Judgement:

 

17. After several weeks of the administration, the administrators entered into an agreement with the Premier League for the payment of sums to them by the League to finance the continuation of the club’s activities. It was dated 18th March 2010. It was agreed that the League would pay an Advance of sums to which the club would be entitled from the League’s funds for 2011 (i.e. the next year). There were to be three payments of £2m (roughly monthly) and a fourth of some £886,000 odd. It was a term of the agreement that the sums would be used to pay player wages.

so I guess it's probably accurate.

Fair enough. Was that accounted for in the budget, I wonder...

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miserableoldgit

miserableoldgit

Posted
Posted
I wrote this earlier and f()ck me if some CHEATING skate supporter hasn't nicked what I wrote!

 

Skate News site...

59 dockyardpaul,

at work 15/10/2010 09:53:03

Lets face it AA has contradicted himself so many times and fed us some much claptrap you cannot believe him.

A bit of back-of-the-fag-packet maths leads me to think that the wage bill is at least double what was proposed in the CVA, plus the income from player sales and support has has been far less than needed so there was never any prospect of the CVA promises being met and the FL have now called our bluff. Lets also be clear all that was after we had shafted creditors for 80% of what we owed.

Think what the RN in the dockyard could do with the £30m+ we have taken from the taxman when the defence cuts come next week. Our jobs taken by what was our club.

 

I notice that the "best fans in the world TM" bit has been edited out!

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LGTL

LGTL

Posted
Posted (edited)

 

Fantastic point here by "Frattonman";

 

"This whole thing stinks and l think that there is a conspiracy between the PL and FL to drive us out of business UEFA and FIFA need to urgently step in and sort this nonsense out."

 

Bless him.

 

Edit - Didn't see this already mentioned twice before...just shows how funny it is!

Edited by LGTL
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