sambosa75 Posted 28 October, 2009 Share Posted 28 October, 2009 I really hope they dont go out of business. I just hope to see them slip further and further in to obscurity after years of lauding it up, living well beyond their means and rubbing it in our faces. Meanwhile, it is quite likely that with Liebherr's money, Pardew's expertise and Cortese's leadership our club will flourish and once again establish ourselves as the South Coast's number 1 club in every single way possible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonnyLove Posted 28 October, 2009 Share Posted 28 October, 2009 Can we but hope that Marcus Liebherr needs a new depot or parking space for Liebherr vehicles and purchases Farton Dust Bowl for a pound, and merges the two clubs with Saints taking the Skates place in the Premiership. The Cherry on the cake would be the Skates requiring to apply for the Conference under the new ownership. Ah! What exciting times it is to be a Saints supporter again. I would rather be spit roasted by to encredibly hung blokes than have any association with that team down the road. Nope. We can take our time and rejoin our place at the top by doing what where doing now thank you very much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charliemiller Posted 28 October, 2009 Share Posted 28 October, 2009 They owe money to Watford (for the Williamson transfer), Chelsea (% of Johnson sell on fee) and Arsenal (Diarra sell on fee). But it's all ok, no need to panic skates - a club source has confirmed on SSN that these issues will be resolved shortly, they have the money, but it's just down to a restructuring at the club that these issues have occurred. Excellent. Wouldnt it be fun if the PL witheld the Sky money they are waiting at the end of this week to clear these historic debts Seems the PAYE and wages plan for this month has fallen apart :smt046 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clapham Saint Posted 28 October, 2009 Share Posted 28 October, 2009 I really hope they dont go out of business. I just hope to see them slip further and further in to obscurity after years of lauding it up, living well beyond their means and rubbing it in our faces. Meanwhile, it is quite likely that with Liebherr's money, Pardew's expertise and Cortese's leadership our club will flourish and once again establish ourselves as the South Coast's number 1 club in every single way possible. Spot on. I won't be upset when they go into admin and start the unstoppable slide, however I don't want them to vanish completely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seaford Saint Posted 28 October, 2009 Share Posted 28 October, 2009 I can't gloat....not every Pompey fan laughed at us. Amongst the morons within both sets of fans are those who would not wish what happened/is happening to either club on the other. How else do we get to prove which club is best etc if we don't actually have 2 clubs competing? What is happening to Pompey and what almost happened to us is symptomatic of big problems within football. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldNick Posted 28 October, 2009 Share Posted 28 October, 2009 to be fair to Merovingian he at least has the balls to show up.As for Billy Big Mouth he has gone to ground. No doubt holiday/work/dentist etc has stopped him logging on for quite a few days Lol. We await its return and will be full of 'we are going to sign...' 'Peter Storrie is great..' 'The stadiums foundations have just been dug' 'There will be egg on your faces as an (you put in the nationality) consortium worth billions are about to purchase' Im sure there are more, please feel free to add the one of the dozens I have missed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Merovingian Posted 28 October, 2009 Share Posted 28 October, 2009 we are signing riquelme in January ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldNick Posted 28 October, 2009 Share Posted 28 October, 2009 we are signing riquelme in January ! thanks I forgot that 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dubai_phil Posted 28 October, 2009 Share Posted 28 October, 2009 Wouldnt it be fun if the PL witheld the Sky money they are waiting at the end of this week to clear these historic debts Seems the PAYE and wages plan for this month has fallen apart :smt046 Let's just get this little thought straight can we... The PL hold the Sky money and send it to the clubs. Pompey have borrowed everything against future TV money So, if Pompey owe money to people connected to the PL for say transfers, then the PL could just divert the money from telly to the creditor Meaning that Pompey would breach the terms of all their new loans oh wow Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rattlehead Posted 28 October, 2009 Share Posted 28 October, 2009 to be fair to Merovingian he at least has the balls to show up. How brave of Mongovillian to have the balls to visit a website and tap in a load of anonymous b*llocks. Bravo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clapham Saint Posted 28 October, 2009 Share Posted 28 October, 2009 Let's just get this little thought straight can we... The PL hold the Sky money and send it to the clubs. Pompey have borrowed everything against future TV money So, if Pompey owe money to people connected to the PL for say transfers, then the PL could just divert the money from telly to the creditor Meaning that Pompey would breach the terms of all their new loans oh wow Which is why I can't understand why anybody is continuing to lend thm money... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charliemiller Posted 28 October, 2009 Share Posted 28 October, 2009 we are signing riquelme in January ! you are singing a Requiem for your club in January is that what u ment ? Letters the wrong way round ish Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ottery st mary Posted 28 October, 2009 Share Posted 28 October, 2009 you are singing a Requiem for your club in January is that what u ment ? Letters the wrong way round ish They are also scouting a Barcelona player for January....This is going to get very Messi before then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Merovingian Posted 28 October, 2009 Share Posted 28 October, 2009 How brave of Mongovillian to have the balls to visit a website and tap in a load of anonymous b*llocks. Bravo. take it you do not like us much then fella ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clapham Saint Posted 28 October, 2009 Share Posted 28 October, 2009 How brave of Mongovillian to have the balls to visit a website and tap in a load of anonymous b*llocks. Bravo. take it you do not like us much then fella ? I think that's a bit harsh. At least he isn't a fair weather banterer. Fair play if you ask me (which you didn't but oh well) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Merovingian Posted 28 October, 2009 Share Posted 28 October, 2009 I actually enjoy the banter over here, sensible debate most of the time and a certain amount of underlying respect between each set of fans. Neither of us want to see the other go under but both want to be doing better than each other. Natural healthy rivalry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pancake Posted 28 October, 2009 Share Posted 28 October, 2009 I actually enjoy the banter over here, sensible debate most of the time and a certain amount of underlying respect between each set of fans. Neither of us want to see the other go under but both want to be doing better than each other. Natural healthy rivalry. Stop being so bloody reasonable you skate bastard! Cmon, lets have a fight! ooh ooh ooh fight fight yeah! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Master Bates Posted 28 October, 2009 Share Posted 28 October, 2009 Stop being so bloody reasonable you skate bastard! Cmon, lets have a fight! ooh ooh ooh fight fight yeah! Ah hum.... DO NOT post any threads/posts inciting football-related violence or other acts of a criminal nature. Your details may be passed onto the police, including (but not limited to) your e-mail and IP address. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dubai_phil Posted 28 October, 2009 Share Posted 28 October, 2009 Ah hum.... lol seems like it is gang up on Mods week, how delightful Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bearsy Posted 28 October, 2009 Share Posted 28 October, 2009 Stop being so bloody reasonable you skate bastard! Cmon, lets have a fight! ooh ooh ooh fight fight yeah! Well moderated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Master Bates Posted 28 October, 2009 Share Posted 28 October, 2009 lol seems like it is gang up on Mods week, how delightful Because they've all now gone from temp to perm they think they can get a bit laxed, time they all got demoted back down to temp's to help keep them on their toes and make them realise that they need to do their jobs properly or get sacked.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pancake Posted 28 October, 2009 Share Posted 28 October, 2009 I see no-one had the balls to report the post though... us Mods can get infractions, Baj gave me one the other week (an infraction that is). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldNick Posted 28 October, 2009 Share Posted 28 October, 2009 How brave of Mongovillian to have the balls to visit a website and tap in a load of anonymous b*llocks. Bravo. I was not meaning brave in the 'face up to have a scrap way', but to come on from a very weak position and take part in the debate.The Billy Big Mouth who struts around when things are good has departed.Daren and myself did predict it of course. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldNick Posted 28 October, 2009 Share Posted 28 October, 2009 has there been a club statement? They are always amusingespecially the one about the arab not saying those things and then having to remove it. i found it amusing that Storries friends for years who are agents are not pushing.I wonder why. lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joesaint Posted 28 October, 2009 Share Posted 28 October, 2009 Someone put this on the Pompy 606 "Evening. I was told (admittedly by a dyed in the wool Saints fan, but one with pretty good contacts) that Storrie was owed a 7 figure amount from the Club. He had no chance of seeing it again from the Doctor, so brought these new guys to the table, and ensure payment. As I say, it was not a good source that told me this, however consider this. It is inconceivable, that Storrie was paid up all the bonus and salary he's earnt during the present troubles, and why did he not walk away when snubbed by Gaydamak? This is just me giving you something to debate, and not a wind up attempt.....Honestly." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SW5 SAINT Posted 28 October, 2009 Share Posted 28 October, 2009 a tip for you Merov as over here we know a little about these things - if you do see wages missed, administrators circling, owners running away with furniture, players advertising themselves in the press and men with clipboards measuring the pitch to see how many houses they can get on it, you will be staggered to find that there will still be fans in denial standing among the rubble of the club still pointlessly debating centre back partnerships and demanding to know why the board hasn't appointed Wenger/Maradona/Moyes. The majority just won't get the seriousness and when the fat lady rides in with the four horsemen surrounding by vultures they will think it's just the half time entertainment. 'But no one goes out of business, something always comes up....' Yes, as long as there isn't a worldwide financial crisis that has wiped out huge sectors of those who would normally invest. We picked the wrong time to get relegated (twice), Pompey may have picked the wrong time to be in desperate need of investment. Then again a billionaire might sail in anyday, all he will have to do is try to make sense of who owns what, give them all a few million to bugger off, find the £30M for the arms dealer, £10 for tax, £25M to clear the newest loans, £50M for the next years outgoings, £20M for transfers in Jan, £5M to sort the managerial situation, the £3M for agents, £5M for other clubs, £10M for a training ground, £30M to redevelop Fratton (all figures approx but you get the picture), leaving him with a a ground half the size of St James Park and a club that has cost twice as much as Newcastle and has half the income potential. That will be one shrewd billionaire who can see a business beyond the problems. Or he will wait for the admin where all but the name will go to creditors and he can start from scratch on a new site - cost? £100M to launch in the Conference South? Brilliant Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldNick Posted 28 October, 2009 Share Posted 28 October, 2009 Someone put this on the Pompy 606 "Evening. I was told (admittedly by a dyed in the wool Saints fan, but one with pretty good contacts) that Storrie was owed a 7 figure amount from the Club. He had no chance of seeing it again from the Doctor, so brought these new guys to the table, and ensure payment. As I say, it was not a good source that told me this, however consider this. It is inconceivable, that Storrie was paid up all the bonus and salary he's earnt during the present troubles, and why did he not walk away when snubbed by Gaydamak? This is just me giving you something to debate, and not a wind up attempt.....Honestly."It does seem possible but the thought on here yesterday it was an agent who was owed a lot of money.PS I would have thought would have made sure his cheaque was the first to be written each month. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickG Posted 28 October, 2009 Share Posted 28 October, 2009 LOL. Does a thread about Pompey's proposed takeover that reaches three pages in a couple of hours once again demonstrate just how little you care about Pompey? FWIW, while the deal could still fall apart I was told yesterday by someone who's actually involved in the takeover that whilst there were still a few issues to sort out it's still very much on. Time will tell I guess, but I wouldn't laugh too loudly too soon if I were you. I'm not party to the whole thing but if the rumour about where the money's coming from (and how much of it there is ready to be used on players and improving the club) are true you lot are going to be pig sick. Err, I think you'll find that Pompey's position is built on loans from banks rather than any money from Gaydamak. Britain's position in the world however is more than partly built on arms dealing. If you really find arms dealing that distasteful and want to assume a moral high ground I suggest you emigrate. I assume you're talking about Hydra Properties here. Rather than being "sacked" Al Fahim is no longer CEO of Hydra but is still a main board director of the company. As for raising the money from Abu Dhabi, that's not where it's rumoured to be coming from. Try Germany. takes a while to get this money from Germany? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hypochondriac Posted 28 October, 2009 Share Posted 28 October, 2009 Lol. Good post nickg. It's nice to laugh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimmy_D Posted 28 October, 2009 Share Posted 28 October, 2009 Their squad probably isn't anywhere near good enough to stay up... This development effectively means the first player they buy (or even loan) has the price of their debts to football clubs lumped on top, and that will have discouraged any investors that were hoping to come in and just spend on the players to stay up in January and then hope the prem status was eventually going to pay off the debts. They really are in a mess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mouldy Coat Posted 28 October, 2009 Share Posted 28 October, 2009 love the message from Jenny in Fareham at the bottom of the page http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-1223436/Pay-Pompey-Basement-club-Portsmouth-hit-Premier-League-transfer-ban.html Saints are bigger gates than us whilst being 3rd from bottom in League 1, this angers and upsets me. Perhaps if we sold out Fratton, creditors might see a club worth saving - Jenny, Fareham, 28/10/2009 14:25 but clearly Skates are a bigger club than us!!!? hillarious Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Micky Posted 28 October, 2009 Share Posted 28 October, 2009 Looks like Pompey are not the only ones suffering financially though - Hull appear to have problems that the FAPL are scutinizing as well: http://www.skysports.com/story/0,19528,11095_5657545,00.html Perhaps Twentytwentyvision (post 3106) is nearer the mark for more teams other than Pompey.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smirking_Saint Posted 28 October, 2009 Share Posted 28 October, 2009 a tip for you Merov as over here we know a little about these things - if you do see wages missed, administrators circling, owners running away with furniture, players advertising themselves in the press and men with clipboards measuring the pitch to see how many houses they can get on it, you will be staggered to find that there will still be fans in denial standing among the rubble of the club still pointlessly debating centre back partnerships and demanding to know why the board hasn't appointed Wenger/Maradona/Moyes. The majority just won't get the seriousness and when the fat lady rides in with the four horsemen surrounding by vultures they will think it's just the half time entertainment. 'But no one goes out of business, something always comes up....' Yes, as long as there isn't a worldwide financial crisis that has wiped out huge sectors of those who would normally invest. We picked the wrong time to get relegated (twice), Pompey may have picked the wrong time to be in desperate need of investment. Then again a billionaire might sail in anyday, all he will have to do is try to make sense of who owns what, give them all a few million to bugger off, find the £30M for the arms dealer, £10 for tax, £25M to clear the newest loans, £50M for the next years outgoings, £20M for transfers in Jan, £5M to sort the managerial situation, the £3M for agents, £5M for other clubs, £10M for a training ground, £30M to redevelop Fratton (all figures approx but you get the picture), leaving him with a a ground half the size of St James Park and a club that has cost twice as much as Newcastle and has half the income potential. That will be one shrewd billionaire who can see a business beyond the problems. Or he will wait for the admin where all but the name will go to creditors and he can start from scratch on a new site - cost? £100M to launch in the Conference South? Fantastic post. With all things considered they really are deep in the sh*te. I do fear for our fishy friends, and TBH i don't wanna see them go out of business. Then who will we be up against ?? Bournemouth ?? Reading ?? Don't get me wrong i want them to suffer and suffer hard but not cease to exist, i wouldn't wish that on anyone, i really wouldn't. We also took the wrong time to hit financial turmoil, but we got lucky, that and we have a good fan base and a decent infrastructure etc. Pompey just don't have that luxury. Yes they are already in the promised land which would count alot towards investment potential. But they have no training ground, a sh*te stadium (that they can't fill ). A team that is never going to survive this year AND now cannot be strengthened in jan. And also the fact that future revenue is secured against loans. Storrie and the executives should be shot for making such a momumental f*ck up to be honest, and if they do what we can all see coming and kill the club then they probably will be !!! Shows you the road we COULD have gone down. THANK YOU MARKUS !!!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimmy_D Posted 28 October, 2009 Share Posted 28 October, 2009 Thing is, if Pompey do manage to get the embargo lifted before January, what club in their right mind would sell them any players? They would worry that they wouldn't get any money from them! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint_John Posted 28 October, 2009 Share Posted 28 October, 2009 Probably not a great deal in the grand scheme of things, but the comments Peter Storrie made a few weeks ago about Arkadi having been the one making the decision as to who the club was sold to when the fake doctor got in ahead of the Saudis pretty much proved that it was Arkadi's money that had funded the club since Sacha's takeover. Getting all sensationalist for a second... the 2008 FA Cup was bought by illegal arms dealing proceeds Another seal of approval for the Fit and Proper Persons test as well :roll: So one FA Cup win equals "170,000 landmines, 420 tanks, 150,000 shells, 12 helicopters and 6 naval vessels" (http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/europe/article6892954.ece) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bridge too far Posted 28 October, 2009 Share Posted 28 October, 2009 So one FA Cup win equals "170,000 landmines, 420 tanks, 150,000 shells, 12 helicopters and 6 naval vessels" (http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/europe/article6892954.ece) And the consequent loss of life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ericofarabia Posted 28 October, 2009 Share Posted 28 October, 2009 I see no-one had the balls to report the post though... us Mods can get infractions, Baj gave me one the other week (an infraction that is). I was going to, but then I got scared of being bullied by the big bad mods :cool: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trader Posted 28 October, 2009 Share Posted 28 October, 2009 http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-1223436/Pay-Pompey-Basement-club-Portsmouth-hit-Premier-League-transfer-ban.html The Premier League must be praying P*mpey get relegated so they can be rid of this embarrasment of a club and all the associated problems. They couldn't possibly engineer such an outcome could they? Hmm... And lo! it came to pass Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trader Posted 28 October, 2009 Share Posted 28 October, 2009 See original post 2837 on this thread Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mack rill Posted 28 October, 2009 Share Posted 28 October, 2009 Us the blue few have had enough of (which man from the land of sand) really owns us,And how deep is the steaming divot we are standing in is. So this weekend owing to all the little Hitlers in yellow, Doing there utmost to add to the worries on the pitch, Word has it the wigwam game could be a Happy slap a stewed game, :smt014;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Verbal Posted 28 October, 2009 Share Posted 28 October, 2009 Us the blue few have had enough of (which man from the land of sand) really owns us,And how deep is the steaming divot we are standing in is. So this weekend owing to all the little Hitlers in yellow, Doing there utmost to add to the worries on the pitch, Word has it the wigwam game could be a Happy slap a stewed game, :smt014;) Nope, don't understand a word. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dubai_phil Posted 28 October, 2009 Share Posted 28 October, 2009 Us the blue few have had enough of (which man from the land of sand) really owns us,And how deep is the steaming divot we are standing in is. So this weekend owing to all the little Hitlers in yellow, Doing there utmost to add to the worries on the pitch, Word has it the wigwam game could be a Happy slap a stewed game, :smt014;) You see I blame Pancake for this outbreak of incitement to violence on the forum.... Meanwhile, in other news DP ain't lost it, F1 at the weekend, $400 a ticket for the weekend, big gigs each night, yep I blagged a pair of freebies for Kings of Leon in concert (don't give a carp for the racing). Wouldn't have mentioned it but found out they were selling on the black market down here for about 300 quid each... So I have a tough call, sell the tickets and use the proceeds to buy the skates next week to ensure their demise all the way to the BSQ or stand like a loon singing about Sex being on Fire....? Feck, I'll use the credit card for the skates project and keep the tickets, If I don't succeed next week then price should be down to a dozen free Yorkie bars the week after. Don't we all want to lol about the sk8tes falling out of love with their sheiks.... TOLD YA SO! Nobody ever listens ho hum Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Under Weststand Posted 28 October, 2009 Share Posted 28 October, 2009 love the message from Jenny in Fareham at the bottom of the page http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-1223436/Pay-Pompey-Basement-club-Portsmouth-hit-Premier-League-transfer-ban.html Saints are bigger gates than us whilst being 3rd from bottom in League 1, this angers and upsets me. Perhaps if we sold out Fratton, creditors might see a club worth saving - Jenny, Fareham, 28/10/2009 14:25 but clearly Skates are a bigger club than us!!!? hillarious The post at the bottom gets me question is, does the FA wish to destroy one of their major clubs :smt046 or do they wish to help them survive and to pay their bills? Why the hell should they be helped for F**k sake they massively overspent, by buying on tick against the sky money. And its now time to pay the piper. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Under Weststand Posted 28 October, 2009 Share Posted 28 October, 2009 Feck, I'll use the credit card for the skates project and keep the tickets, If I don't succeed next week then price should be down to a dozen free Yorkie bars the week after. You could always take out a short term loan to pay for them Phil & secure it against their Blue Square premier league TV money for year 2013. Or which ever year's TV money has not been secured against yet Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dark Munster Posted 28 October, 2009 Share Posted 28 October, 2009 I think that there's a cut off date for that to happen - last year we went into administration a week after the date... If memory serves it was an even more idiotic 3-4 days! Yep, Lowe's little parting "gift" to Saints fans. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dark Munster Posted 28 October, 2009 Share Posted 28 October, 2009 Swanson has been told by Portsmouth officials that the club remains "relaxed" about the transfer ban and they expect the issue to be resolved as quickly as possible. I wonder if it will be as quick as it took for the ice-cream doctor to complete his takeover from Gaymadman? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dubai_phil Posted 28 October, 2009 Share Posted 28 October, 2009 You could always take out a short term loan to pay for them Phil & secure it against their Blue Square premier league TV money for year 2013. Or which ever year's TV money has not been secured against yet hmmm a cunning plan Baldrick, now all we need is someone with a perfect track record of takeovers. Are there any "Family farms" or "Petting zoos" near Porstmouth?...... time is getting close, the coup de grace should at least be administered (oh nice new meaning) by a former forum member Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Micky Posted 28 October, 2009 Share Posted 28 October, 2009 Us the blue few have had enough of (which man from the land of sand) really owns us,And how deep is the steaming divot we are standing in is. So this weekend owing to all the little Hitlers in yellow, Doing there utmost to add to the worries on the pitch, Word has it the wigwam game could be a Happy slap a stewed game, :smt014;) Nope, don't understand a word. Allow me to interpret. The Skates are so p i s s e d off at the huge pile of s h y t e in which they currently lie, they have decided to take action. Not being the brightest of fans, they don't really know who to blame, and so they are going to take retribution on their own insomuch that the Stewards are going to get a right good kickin' during the Wigan game. Or words to that effect - my skate is not fluent, but passable. HTH..! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Cat Posted 28 October, 2009 Share Posted 28 October, 2009 http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport/2009/oct/28/bbc-ashes-sky-simulcast 3rd story down Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miserableoldgit Posted 28 October, 2009 Share Posted 28 October, 2009 Allow me to interpret. The Skates are so p i s s e d off at the huge pile of s h y t e in which they currently lie, they have decided to take action. Not being the brightest of fans, they don't really know who to blame, and so they are going to take retribution on their own insomuch that the Stewards are going to get a right good kickin' during the Wigan game. Or words to that effect - my skate is not fluent, but passable. HTH..! Thanks for that. I did press "Translate" on my Google toolbar but it didn`t help much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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