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Pompey Takeover Saga

Fitzhugh Fella

By Fitzhugh Fella,
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saintjay77

saintjay77

Posted
Posted
Sloppy reporting, as clearly both bits can't be true.

 

As I see it there are 2 possibilities, either:

  • They don't have permission from the FL to add to their squad, or
  • They do have permission, but "the holder of the purse strings" won't allow it until the present wage bill is reduced to the target

Neither of which helps their preparation for the upcoming season.

 

IMO,

1) They have permission to ask the FL if they can sign any player to cover problem positions and to allow them to get to the 20 player limit.

 

2) The FL then look at there squad and give them permission to sign Sonko as long as he is playing in goal.

 

3) Sonko looks at other offers

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Gemmel

Gemmel

Posted
Posted

http://www.portsmouth.co.uk/sport/39Ciftci-not-ready-for-Championship39.6441382.jp

 

Dear Steve,

I do not know what aa has told you or whether you are just too stupid to understand what the transfer embargo actually means, but would suggest you contact the FL directly and run it past them, with your intention to loan other players out, so you can bring better ones in. This dispensation you have been given to sign 3 players, appears to have been authorised by andriod himself, but unfortuneately there are other people who need to rubber stamp it.

Wind the clock back and look down the other end of the M27 and you will see how a club in financial trouble, "bloods" the youngsters.

Of course, that might result in relegation and not the title challenging squad that you were promised, but then perhaps you shoudl have asked a few more questions, or at least opened your eyes.

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rallyboy

rallyboy

Posted
Posted

They may have just turned a corner! - offloading Utaka cheaply would be the first sensible thing AA has done since he arrived, perhaps he has just realised that the wagebill has to be slashed and if it means giving players away it has to be done.

It's desperate - but these are desperate times, has AA just woken up?

 

Though it's best not to gob off about how you won't be taken for a ride by buying clubs shortly before you do it - you could look an idiot.

If he does embark on a mass bargain bin clearout he will get the overheads to a more sustainable level and make the accounts of the business more attractive to a buyer.

Unfortunately they will be heading for relegation and his laughable CVA will have nothing to fund it.

 

A year on there is still only one answer - big cash, now.

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tony13579

tony13579

Posted
Posted
They may have just turned a corner! - offloading Utaka cheaply would be the first sensible thing AA has done since he arrived, perhaps he has just realised that the wagebill has to be slashed and if it means giving players away it has to be done.

It's desperate - but these are desperate times, has AA just woken up?

 

Though it's best not to gob off about how you won't be taken for a ride by buying clubs shortly before you do it - you could look an idiot.

If he does embark on a mass bargain bin clearout he will get the overheads to a more sustainable level and make the accounts of the business more attractive to a buyer.

Unfortunately they will be heading for relegation and his laughable CVA will have nothing to fund it.

 

A year on there is still only one answer - big cash, now.

The way forward was to accept the griffins cva plan, sell the club off for a realistic price to a local businesman and start rebuilding the team on gate receipts and sponsorship.

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EastleighSoulBoy

EastleighSoulBoy

Posted
Posted
http://www.portsmouth.co.uk/sport/39Ciftci-not-ready-for-Championship39.6441382.jp

 

Dear Steve,

I do not know what aa has told you or whether you are just too stupid to understand what the transfer embargo actually means, but would suggest you contact the FL directly and run it past them, with your intention to loan other players out, so you can bring better ones in. This dispensation you have been given to sign 3 players, appears to have been authorised by andriod himself, but unfortuneately there are other people who need to rubber stamp it.

Wind the clock back and look down the other end of the M27 and you will see how a club in financial trouble, "bloods" the youngsters.

Of course, that might result in relegation and not the title challenging squad that you were promised, but then perhaps you shoudl have asked a few more questions, or at least opened your eyes.

 

It's infuriating that they have not sat Steve down and explained, fully, just exactly what they have to play with and the constraints placed upon the club. Or maybe they have....well, their version of it anyway.

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pallidcreatures

pallidcreatures

Posted
Posted

Anyone else get a feeling that things are quickening up behind the scenes? No court date, no Sonko, no kit to sell, no money, no players...

 

Utaka slashed, apparently to £1m... It will be interesting to see which runs out first, time for Pompey or space on page 600 of this thread.

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hutch

hutch

Posted
Posted

Just when we thought the comedy value was waning, up steps Cotterill to fill the shoes so admirably filled until recently by Storrie, Grant and Andronikou.

 

From his "News" article on Ciftci:

 

He's shone the brightest out of Pompey's starlets - but Steve Cotterill has warned Nadir Ciftci will not play a part in the Blues' Championship season. Cotterill is convinced the former Dutch under-17 international is not yet ready for the Championship. Instead, he wants to loan him out in either League One or League Two.

Good luck selling that one to the League, Steve. Not up to nPC, but OK in L1?

 

There are obviously a couple of clubs lower down that I would like to help out and I certainly think he would help them out.

Now that one did make me :lol:

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hutch

hutch

Posted
Posted

To make the CVA rescue work, Andy had to get in £18m from selling players this year. And get a CVA.

 

It looks like the firesale has started in earnest. Andy (not the club) owes somebody £6m. A case of "get as much cash in as possible and pay back what you can" before pulling the plug?

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tony13579

tony13579

Posted
Posted

Thanks pompeyscott for banning me. you are still a usefull idiot, feeding all your mates false hope. 9 working days to the new season, no court date, no kit, no players,

Have your protest on your square of turf you bought in the 70's. Fratton Park will make a nice Tescos, aldi, Lidl's etc

The only way out of your doom and gloom is to pay the creditors a fare share of the assests including the parachute payments and sell the club on to an interested businesman.

Griffins proposal is the only way forward..... TTFN

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pedg

pedg

Posted
Posted
http://twitter.com/search?q=%23pompey

 

 

The third it is then. Is it me or has aa suddenly injected some urgency into all of this..... Whats driving that I wonder

 

Odd isn't it. Especially as it appears as far as the technical details show, i.e. not distributing details of his revised figures before the meeting and discounting a share of HMRC debt when he should have included it and appealed if he disagreed, he appears to be bang to rights.

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Fowllyd

Fowllyd

Posted
Posted
5-1 with Paddypower for up/down double.

 

The only problem there is that it would depend on the Skates actually making it through the season - you can bet your life (though maybe not with Paddy Power!) that no bookie will pay out if Pompey get liquidated first.

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dronskisaint

dronskisaint

Posted
Posted
To make the CVA rescue work, Andy had to get in £18m from selling players this year. And get a CVA.

 

It looks like the firesale has started in earnest. Andy (not the club) owes somebody £6m. A case of "get as much cash in as possible and pay back what you can" before pulling the plug?

 

If the HMRC (as I expect) win the appeal - does the CVA have to go back to squre one &, if so, will the 'new' expectation for player sales be part of an even smaller offer? Or will the offer be bigger still if/when the Football creditors are combined with the rest.

 

Your input much valued by the way...it's a long way beyond my experience now...normal conditions just don't seem to apply!

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saintjay77

saintjay77

Posted
Posted
If the HMRC (as I expect) win the appeal - does the CVA have to go back to squre one &, if so, will the 'new' expectation for player sales be part of an even smaller offer? Or will the offer be bigger still if/when the Football creditors are combined with the rest.

 

Your input much valued by the way...it's a long way beyond my experience now...normal conditions just don't seem to apply!

 

I thought that if HMRC win its down to AA to go back and either come up with a new CVA, Liquadize the company or come out of admin without the CVA. 1st option would buy time and maybe produce something the Creditors including HMRC will accept, 2nd option must be more favourable to Chainrai if it looks like more money has to be paid back than before and 3rd option is unlikly as not only would it bring a massive points deduction but it wll also no doubt bring a few WUO's from HMRC and maybe a few more.

 

EDIT:

There is always the chance that another Appeal would happen from whoever loses the current appeal.

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Gemmel

Gemmel

Posted
Posted
I thought that if HMRC win its down to AA to go back and either come up with a new CVA, Liquadize the company or come out of admin without the CVA. 1st option would buy time and maybe produce something the Creditors including HMRC will accept, 2nd option must be more favourable to Chainrai if it looks like more money has to be paid back than before and 3rd option is unlikly as not only would it bring a massive points deduction but it wll also no doubt bring a few WUO's from HMRC and maybe a few more.

 

EDIT:

There is always the chance that another Appeal would happen from whoever loses the current appeal.

 

Even if they followed the Griffin CVA (Commissioned by HMRC IMO) then that pays 64p, possibly rising to 99p and that would still represent the first time HMRC have voted in favour of a CVA not offering 100% of monies owed. What you also need to consider is that the Griffin CVA factored in 30 million in player sales. Given aa has failed with his 15 million of player sales, there is a massive delta.

 

I could be wrong, but if HMRC win, that means they can block any CVA. Administration would buy time, but would need something or somebody to fund it. They might get some chancer like lloyd to take the club over for nothing and he tries to agree a payment schedule for the total tax debt, but that still leaves otehr creditors open to action.

 

If HMRC win, i think they will be liquidated.

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anothersaintinsouthsea

anothersaintinsouthsea

Posted
Posted

from the snooze:

 

Pompey have been given the all important date when they will face the taxman in court.

They will meet representatives from HM Revenue & Customs in London on August 3.

 

HMRC launched an appeal earlier this month against administrator Andrew Andronikou's CVA.

 

If the appeal is successful Pompey will have to come out of administration without a CVA in order to start the new season on August 7.

 

If this happens it is likely the club with be hit with further points deductions.

 

The appeal is set to be heard at 10am in the High Court in London

.
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stevegrant

stevegrant

Posted
Posted
If the appeal is successful Pompey will have to come out of administration without a CVA in order to start the new season on August 7.

Not true :facepalm:

 

They could remain in administration for the whole of this season if necessary without any penalties from the Football League.

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stevegrant

stevegrant

Posted
Posted
Have you been banned from pompeyonline yet?

Not that I'm aware of, I haven't been on there for ages though. I was having a decent discussion with a couple of people on there a while back and then a few of the resident mongs waded in and I got bored of it all.

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saintjay77

saintjay77

Posted
Posted
Even if they followed the Griffin CVA (Commissioned by HMRC IMO) then that pays 64p, possibly rising to 99p and that would still represent the first time HMRC have voted in favour of a CVA not offering 100% of monies owed. What you also need to consider is that the Griffin CVA factored in 30 million in player sales. Given aa has failed with his 15 million of player sales, there is a massive delta.

 

I could be wrong, but if HMRC win, that means they can block any CVA. Administration would buy time, but would need something or somebody to fund it. They might get some chancer like lloyd to take the club over for nothing and he tries to agree a payment schedule for the total tax debt, but that still leaves otehr creditors open to action.

 

If HMRC win, i think they will be liquidated.

 

Had the Griffin cva been the only cva and were it presented at the beginning then they would have had more chance to sell that value. I think there proposal was to sell any player possible also where aa thinks he only needs to sell one or two.

 

On top of that however, some people have mentioned the Wimbledon administration in that football creditors were paid in full from a new buyer or from new funds coming in. Did the griffin cva have this in it or were football creditors being paid the same way aa's cva proposed?

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hypochondriac

hypochondriac

Posted
Posted
Not that I'm aware of, I haven't been on there for ages though. I was having a decent discussion with a couple of people on there a while back and then a few of the resident mongs waded in and I got bored of it all.

 

Yep I saw that. I think there were plans to remove you from the site because you dared to tell the truth which they didn't like to hear.

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Wes Tender

Wes Tender

Posted
Posted

http://bankruptcyandinsolvency.blogspot.com/2010/07/what-is-football-creditor-rule.html

 

This was an interesting read, written as a blog by an IP called Stephen Hunt, described on the comments in The News as the Android's nemesis. In particular, I liked this comment:-

 

Put it in practical terms, when I am constructing a Statement of Affairs for a company, where does the Football Creditor sit?

 

The FCR does not forfeit the asset so the money due from the TV rights etc must appear as an asset at the beginning of the document. Either the football creditors are then shown as a deduction as some form of charge, or the assets are avalailable to other creditors and the football creditors rank as unsecured. It cannot be any other way can it?

 

9 July 2010 12:32

Stephen Hunt said...

I have just had a conversation with someone who was looking at the opposite view in that the income wasn't the asset of the club. This raises quite different problems.

 

If there is a rule that states that the income belongs to the club but on insolvency it is payable elsewhere then this is a classic forfeiture clause that has been tested time and again, especially in the field of pensions. In short, it is very difficult to forfeit your own assets on insolvency but a third party can impose a forfeiture in terms that you only have a right to an asset whilst you are not insolvent. See Scientific Investment Plan 1999.

 

I think the League might suffer some real difficulty in running this argument without causing colateral damage to itself. It's all very well constructing a contract that says that certain monies are not payable to an insolvent club, but it is quite another to then expect the club to perform its duties and effectively earn that money only to see the fruits of that work paid away by the Board under its discretion. In bankruptcy that is the equivalent of a bankrupt working for free and the spouse receiving a high wage and this would be overturned as a sham. The League could end up in a position whereby the only way to protect their Rule is to fully suspend the club and to remove it from fixtures.

 

The very last sentence suggests that the FL might find itself in a position whereby they could only protect the football creditors' rule by not allowing the Skates to participate in the league. The dark storm clouds gather over Krap Nottarf and grow darker with each passing day.

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slickmick

slickmick

Posted
Posted
Even if they followed the Griffin CVA (Commissioned by HMRC IMO) then that pays 64p, possibly rising to 99p and that would still represent the first time HMRC have voted in favour of a CVA not offering 100% of monies owed. What you also need to consider is that the Griffin CVA factored in 30 million in player sales. Given aa has failed with his 15 million of player sales, there is a massive delta.

 

I could be wrong, but if HMRC win, that means they can block any CVA. Administration would buy time, but would need something or somebody to fund it. They might get some chancer like lloyd to take the club over for nothing and he tries to agree a payment schedule for the total tax debt, but that still leaves otehr creditors open to action.

 

If HMRC win, i think they will be liquidated.

 

Did they not agree to Palace's offer of 1 or 2p in the pound ?

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Chez

Chez

Posted
Posted
Did they not agree to Palace's offer of 1 or 2p in the pound ?

 

I doubt it, its more likely that they apposed the CVA, but they were not owed a sufficient amount to give them the amount of votes needed to stop the CVA being approved. That's a guess though.

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