Matthew Le God Posted 11 July, 2010 Share Posted 11 July, 2010 What chance is there of a HMRC appeal being rejected? It depends what they are appealing about. There are a few issues they could potentially raise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benjii Posted 11 July, 2010 Share Posted 11 July, 2010 Lol at MLG's brand of humourless pedantry ploughing it's furrow on Teh News website. Although on this occasion it is fair cop. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew Le God Posted 11 July, 2010 Share Posted 11 July, 2010 Lol at MLG's brand of humourless pedantry ploughing it's furrow on Teh News website. Although on this occasion it is fair cop. Well there is a difference of £50k Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hutch Posted 11 July, 2010 Share Posted 11 July, 2010 To put it into context, if he offloads Belhadj (£3.5M less fees, add ons), then Boateng and James, he will still only raise approx 20% of his wages reduction target and 35% of his transfer target, the whole first team has to go. But apparently he hasn't: http://www.goal.com/en/news/11/transfer-zone/2010/07/10/2019173/i-have-not-signed-for-al-sadd-portsmouths-nadir-belhadj I make it around Є450k in the kitty so far. Only about another £14.6m to go. The creditors must be getting nervous. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
angelman Posted 11 July, 2010 Share Posted 11 July, 2010 Meanwhile a massive chunk of the £15m expected from outgoing transfers looks like it has been secured. Diop on his way to Greece for 300k euros, yes a whopping 300k - the creditors will be chuffed with that! http://www.portsmouth.co.uk/frattonlatest/Cotterill-confirms-Diop39s-on-his.6411961.jp?CommentPage=2&CommentPageLength=10#comments I am getting confused. Didn't Android say he wasn't going for less than £1m (€1.2m)? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rallyboy Posted 11 July, 2010 Share Posted 11 July, 2010 so the money they've taken for Diop will now be needed to pay Belhadj for the time he's on holiday until he decides where he fancies. AA must be finding this whole running a football business malarky a bit complex, his maths is certainly suffering, it must be time for a rallying call, a big press release about 'Havant and Waterlooville couldn't break our spirit in a friendly' - or anything to distract from the fact that the ship is clearly holed beneath the waterline. This is now the least successful firesale in history and Storrie's legacy makes Peter Ridsdale look like a cautious businessman with excellent financial judgement - and some fish. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thedelldays Posted 11 July, 2010 Share Posted 11 July, 2010 what is it about £15m people are talking about..? how is that linked to creditors etc..? cheers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sidthesquid Posted 11 July, 2010 Share Posted 11 July, 2010 what is it about £15m people are talking about..? how is that linked to creditors etc..? cheers Do keep up at the back there.... Handy Andy declared that to give the creditors their magnificent fourpence in the pound this year he needed to raise £15million in player sales this summer. So far he has reached the heady heights of £415000. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Faz Posted 11 July, 2010 Share Posted 11 July, 2010 Do keep up at the back there.... Handy Andy declared that to give the creditors their magnificent fourpence in the pound this year he needed to raise £15million in player sales this summer. So far he has reached the heady heights of £415000. That's £415k GROSS. Deduct agents fees, bonuses etc - if they see more than £250k of that I'll be amazed. And probably still have to contribute to Diops salary. There's no way a Greek club can match his Pompey wages. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thedelldays Posted 11 July, 2010 Share Posted 11 July, 2010 £15m in sales...? fuks me...when we went down we had some prize assets..? we could have barely raised £15m with crouch etc.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
L1Minus10 Posted 11 July, 2010 Share Posted 11 July, 2010 Boateng, Wilson and Belhadj are the key. I reckon they'll get 3,2 and 2 million for those three. Even so, still over £8m short. Maybe 1m for Nugent...Storrie sees himself as a player for performance bonus purposes, maybe they could get a couple of million for him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deano6 Posted 11 July, 2010 Share Posted 11 July, 2010 Boateng to net them 7 million. http://www.caughtoffside.com/2010/07/10/liverpool-consider-shock-move-for-7m-ghana-playmaker-kevin-prince-boateng/? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saintjay77 Posted 11 July, 2010 Share Posted 11 July, 2010 Boateng to net them 7 million. http://www.caughtoffside.com/2010/07/10/liverpool-consider-shock-move-for-7m-ghana-playmaker-kevin-prince-boateng/? "A bid as low as £7M"????? Do Liverpool not know the situation Poopy are in? Not being funny but any club wanting to buy a player from a club firmly in the poop would not seriously offer silly money for one of there players. Its in Liverpools interest to pay as little as possible for any player. Paying £7M would be barmy IMO. Not sure he is Liverpool staandard either so I doubt there fans would be overly impressed to see that kind of money get spunked on a mid table level player. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JackFrost Posted 11 July, 2010 Share Posted 11 July, 2010 It'll be closer to £700,000 than £7 million. Sure Boateng had a very good world cup but can't see him being sold for anything over a few million Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Micky Posted 11 July, 2010 Share Posted 11 July, 2010 Boateng to net them 7 million. http://www.caughtoffside.com/2010/07/10/liverpool-consider-shock-move-for-7m-ghana-playmaker-kevin-prince-boateng/? And that, according to the article, is a low bid, so perhaps some have under-estimated thier ability to raise the 15 million. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mack rill Posted 11 July, 2010 Share Posted 11 July, 2010 Meanwhile a massive chunk of the £15m expected from outgoing transfers looks like it has been secured. Diop on his way to Greece for 300k euros, yes a whopping 300k - the creditors will be chuffed with that! http://www.portsmouth.co.uk/frattonlatest/Cotterill-confirms-Diop39s-on-his.6411961.jp?CommentPage=2&CommentPageLength=10#comments If we get 300k for that useless sack of sh*t That will be a result! i kid you not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
View From The Top Posted 11 July, 2010 Share Posted 11 July, 2010 Boateng to net them 7 million. http://www.caughtoffside.com/2010/07/10/liverpool-consider-shock-move-for-7m-ghana-playmaker-kevin-prince-boateng/? I'm sure in the CVA report it shows that they still owe £3m for him and as we know, footballing debts must be paid in full. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saintjay77 Posted 11 July, 2010 Share Posted 11 July, 2010 And that, according to the article, is a low bid, so perhaps some have under-estimated thier ability to raise the 15 million. surely his market value cant be over £5M at the moment. Spent half the season injured in a team that spent most of the season rooted to the bottom of the league. Had a few moments of looking good and has done fairly well for Ghana who only did a little better than expected. If a player is worth 5M then the selling club will usually want something closer to 6M while the buying club will be looking closer to 4M. Throw a club that is desperate to get any cash in the door and the price they will except plummits. Why any club would pay over the odds when they can save themselves at least half of that money is potty. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
St Chalet Posted 11 July, 2010 Share Posted 11 July, 2010 surely his market value cant be over £5M at the moment. Spent half the season injured in a team that spent most of the season rooted to the bottom of the league. Had a few moments of looking good and has done fairly well for Ghana who only did a little better than expected. If a player is worth 5M then the selling club will usually want something closer to 6M while the buying club will be looking closer to 4M. Throw a club that is desperate to get any cash in the door and the price they will except plummits. Why any club would pay over the odds when they can save themselves at least half of that money is potty. I assume the Spuds have a sell on clause as well! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Micky Posted 11 July, 2010 Share Posted 11 July, 2010 surely his market value cant be over £5M at the moment. Spent half the season injured in a team that spent most of the season rooted to the bottom of the league. Had a few moments of looking good and has done fairly well for Ghana who only did a little better than expected. If a player is worth 5M then the selling club will usually want something closer to 6M while the buying club will be looking closer to 4M. Throw a club that is desperate to get any cash in the door and the price they will except plummits. Why any club would pay over the odds when they can save themselves at least half of that money is potty. I would tend to agree, but if the quotes in the article are true, it would appear that they could be in line to get at least 7 million for him. If RH has put that figure in the quote to 'test the water', then PFC have to make a serious decission as to whether they accept or hold out for even more and risk losing the deal altogeather. Either way 7 million is a lot more than most on here thought he would go for, but on the other hand the article might hold no substance whatsoever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weston Saint Posted 11 July, 2010 Share Posted 11 July, 2010 Boateng, Wilson and Belhadj are the key. I reckon they'll get 3,2 and 2 million for those three. Even so, still over £8m short. Maybe 1m for Nugent...Storrie sees himself as a player for performance bonus purposes, maybe they could get a couple of million for him.Belhadj reported to have gone for £3.5m http://www.portsmouth.co.uk/frattonlatest/Belhadj-seals-Qatar-move.6410437.jp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rallyboy Posted 11 July, 2010 Share Posted 11 July, 2010 Liverpool have no budget. They would have to sell Gerrard and Torres before starting to offer money like that for a world class player, let alone an overpaid thug who can't walk up the street without vandalising parked cars. That article has the correct date on it but the factual content falls away dramatically after that. Can we assume that Pompey have priced him at £4M then realised they owe £3M and expect someone else to settle their problem? Surely they have more chance of playing in the Europa League this year than getting £7M for Boateng, even Man City would consider that laughable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
St Marco Posted 11 July, 2010 Share Posted 11 July, 2010 So then it was 15th/16th wasen't it that they had to wait to see if there were any challenges to the CVA? This week will be the week if we find out if they have indeed got away with it! I wonder if HMRC are going to challenge would they wait until the last possible momment? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EastleighSoulBoy Posted 11 July, 2010 Share Posted 11 July, 2010 Belhadj reported to have gone for £3.5m http://www.portsmouth.co.uk/frattonlatest/Belhadj-seals-Qatar-move.6410437.jp That's old news from the 9th. Hatch posted this earlier: http://www.goal.com/en/news/11/trans...-nadir-belhadj Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aintforever Posted 11 July, 2010 Share Posted 11 July, 2010 So then it was 15th/16th wasen't it that they had to wait to see if there were any challenges to the CVA? This week will be the week if we find out if they have indeed got away with it! I wonder if HMRC are going to challenge would they wait until the last possible momment? They usually do it at the last minute. I don't think they will this time though, the crooks down the road have been one step ahead of the taxman at every turn. Chanrai will just say agree a CVA or I pull out and you get nothing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EastleighSoulBoy Posted 11 July, 2010 Share Posted 11 July, 2010 They usually do it at the last minute. I don't think they will this time though, the crooks down the road have been one step ahead of the taxman at every turn. Chanrai will just say agree a CVA or I pull out and you get nothing. If that Mexican Stand Off occurs I really believe that HMRC may well not be phased and will reply "Do it". One club down,big lesson for football and ALL it's conniving cheats, job done. It's the bigger picture that HMRC have their eye on and if the Skates, in this instance, die then football will, truly, police itself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JackFrost Posted 11 July, 2010 Share Posted 11 July, 2010 They usually do it at the last minute. I don't think they will this time though, the crooks down the road have been one step ahead of the taxman at every turn. Chanrai will just say agree a CVA or I pull out and you get nothing. But that will set a very dangerous precedent and show every other club in the land how to live beyond your means for glory and if it does go tits up, get away with a minimal punishment. I cannot see HMRC not appealing, if they don't they are going to be in this situation again and again and lose out on more money than they may think in the long run with several different clubs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chez Posted 11 July, 2010 Share Posted 11 July, 2010 If we get 300k for that useless sack of sh*t That will be a result! i kid you not. at times fans from both ends of the M27 will have to agree and this is one of those times. A truely terrible player. I'm quite simply amazed Andriod has the audacity to ask for a million. I honestly don't think I'd want him at our place and we are talking about two divisions lower than where he has been `playing'. I kid you not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dark Munster Posted 12 July, 2010 Share Posted 12 July, 2010 They usually do it at the last minute. I don't think they will this time though, the crooks down the road have been one step ahead of the taxman at every turn. Chanrai will just say agree a CVA or I pull out and you get nothing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deano6 Posted 12 July, 2010 Share Posted 12 July, 2010 Liverpool have no budget. They would have to sell Gerrard and Torres before starting to offer money like that for a world class player, let alone an overpaid thug who can't walk up the street without vandalising parked cars. That article has the correct date on it but the factual content falls away dramatically after that. Can we assume that Pompey have priced him at £4M then realised they owe £3M and expect someone else to settle their problem? Surely they have more chance of playing in the Europa League this year than getting £7M for Boateng, even Man City would consider that laughable. That'll be why they're bidding 20 mil for Ghana's top scorer Gyan then... http://www.eatsleepsport.com/liverpool/hodgson-eyes-20million-world-cup-star-1076867.html? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skintsaint Posted 12 July, 2010 Share Posted 12 July, 2010 when will liverpool learn not to buy players as they have played 2 good games in a world cup. Seen enough of him to say hes worth 4m tops. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rallyboy Posted 12 July, 2010 Share Posted 12 July, 2010 so as I said then, they would need to sell Torres, and they are only looking at paying that for a player much better than Boateng - on top of that, that article is rumour-based on what Hodgson 'might do' presumably lifted from some of his tv punditry - 'what do you think of him Roy?' - 'Great player'....rumour launched. There has been no bid for anyone, Liverpool are skint. So I stand by exactly what I said, Liverpool have no budget, they need to sell first. And any Torres deal might involve him being able to walk at the medical. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Secret Site Agent Posted 12 July, 2010 Share Posted 12 July, 2010 when will liverpool learn not to buy players as they have played 2 good games in a world cup. Seen enough of him to say hes worth 4m tops. I agree. HCDAJFU at L1 level, but at Prem I don't think so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hutch Posted 12 July, 2010 Share Posted 12 July, 2010 An interesting thought for those who are convinced that the have "got away with it". The Saints XI which won convincingly at Winchester on Saturday was made up of the youth squad (well, except for Pulis) who weren't invited to the pre-season in Switzerland. The Pompey team which pulled off a plucky 2-1 win at Havant & Waterlooville was the first team. Even The News reports today that they won't be able to make any new signings "for the foreseeable future". They must be odds-on for successive relegations, even if they get to keep all their points this season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
angelman Posted 12 July, 2010 Share Posted 12 July, 2010 so as I said then, they would need to sell Torres, and they are only looking at paying that for a player much better than Boateng - on top of that, that article is rumour-based on what Hodgson 'might do' presumably lifted from some of his tv punditry - 'what do you think of him Roy?' - 'Great player'....rumour launched. There has been no bid for anyone, Liverpool are skint. So I stand by exactly what I said, Liverpool have no budget, they need to sell first. And any Torres deal might involve him being able to walk at the medical. Torres walking? This isn't the first time his Achilles has gone, and I wonder whether he will ever get it mended properly. Not sure anyone will pay top dollar and take the risk, it would be somewhat foolish. As it is, he will be off games for, what, 2 or 3 months, and I can't see anyone buying him until January at the earliest. Therefore L'pool don't get a big transfer fee and can't pay stupid money for Boateng. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gorgiesaint Posted 12 July, 2010 Share Posted 12 July, 2010 (edited) Back to Pompey from Scouse watch I notice the BBC transfer rumours had : Portsmouth midfielder Papa Bouba Diop is likely to leave Fratton Park for AEK Athens in a £3.5m deal. (the Guardian) http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/gossip_and_transfers/8809014.stm Did check the Guardian website & couldn't find it. I can only assume this includes his wages! Edited 12 July, 2010 by Gorgiesaint Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saintjay77 Posted 12 July, 2010 Share Posted 12 July, 2010 at times fans from both ends of the M27 will have to agree and this is one of those times. A truely terrible player. I'm quite simply amazed Andriod has the audacity to ask for a million. I honestly don't think I'd want him at our place and we are talking about two divisions lower than where he has been `playing'. I kid you not. He is not that bad a player and he could do a job in most teams from mid table prem downwards. I honestly still wouldnt value him over £5M though. I guess he is a bit like a Robbie Savage as in if he is in your team you would excuse him but if he isnt then you wouldnt want him cause he is a cokc! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saintjay77 Posted 12 July, 2010 Share Posted 12 July, 2010 They usually do it at the last minute. I don't think they will this time though, the crooks down the road have been one step ahead of the taxman at every turn. Chanrai will just say agree a CVA or I pull out and you get nothing. I will be amazed if they dont appeal on this one. They wont want to appear to be happy about letting 80% of what they are owed go on funding a clubs promotion push back to the big time for a start. Can you imagine local business' taking the same kind of stance as poopy? The football creditors rule is crazy when you think of what the tax's go on. The forces, National Health service, Police and Fire Service are funded by the tax's paid in this country so to be put behind paying off rich football players ahead of them is a joke. Even if they think they have no chance of winning I believe they would still throw an apeal in at the last min just to make things difficult for the FL and one of its members. With an appeal in place the transfer embargo will still be in place and poopys chances of preparing for the coming season will be even harder. They may be forced to leave Admin without the CVA and the FL will have to dish out further points. If they continue to make things as difficult as possible for any club that goes down this route it may help them persuade the leagues to change the football creditors rule to make it more fairer for them and maybe even others. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sidthesquid Posted 12 July, 2010 Share Posted 12 July, 2010 From The Skate News Makka, 12/07/2010 11:17:43 Lintonblue : HMRC will appeal at the last minute as thsy did with Leeds,mainly because Chanrai is getting the club back. If a new owner appears than HMRC wont challenge,but as AA is putting up barriers so Chanrai can keep the club this wont happen. Then we exit admin without a CVA and a large points deduction. The CVA is then worthless and Chanrai can pay creditors as little as 1p in the £,and do what he wants with any income,so he wont put in a penny but take money out ,then the club will be finished once the parachute payments have gone,only this years are earmarked for football creditors. Interesting point. Is that actually the case if the CVA is refused? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint_lambden Posted 12 July, 2010 Share Posted 12 July, 2010 1 GK David James (captain) a 3 DF Ricardo Rocha 4 DF Aaron Mokoena 6 MF Hayden Mullins 7 DF Hermann Hreidarsson a 10 FW David Nugent 11 MF Michael Brown (2nd vice-captain) 17 FW John Utaka 19 FW Danny Webber 20 FW Tommy Smith 22 MF Richard Hughes 23 MF Kevin-Prince Boateng No. Position Player 27 FW Kanu a 31 GK Liam O'Brien 34 FW Danijel Subotić 35 DF Marc Wilson 37 FW Gaël N'lundulu 38 MF Marlon Pack 40 DF Joel Ward 41 MF Matt Ritchie 45 MF Tom Kilbey 47 FW Nadir Ciftci FW Paris Cowan-Hall GK Jon Stewart a - out of contract Bold - ones that would do well in the Championship - it's really not many. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saintjay77 Posted 12 July, 2010 Share Posted 12 July, 2010 Just realised they got rid of Papa Bouba Diop yesterday. Looks like they were after around £1M but the actual fee was un-disclosed. How can a club in Admin make un-disclosed transfers? I thought that when it gets to the point of admin just about all financial dealings would be made much more public? For a club that has been run so badly a bit of transparency would be a welcome change to the clubs fans I would have thought. The un-disclosed figures would only get revealed when the club gets liquidated anyway so whats the point of keeping quiet now? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
angelman Posted 12 July, 2010 Share Posted 12 July, 2010 They can't afford Utaka or James. When Utaka came out all defensive over his reported £80k per week, he said that it was a third of this, so probably a third and round up to £30k a week which is still £1.5m a year. James was on what, £40k a week (£2m a year) and probably could get similar to that in the PL. So keeping those two alone would be £3.5m a year. Squad looks a little, ummmm, thin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saintjay77 Posted 12 July, 2010 Share Posted 12 July, 2010 From The Skate News Makka, 12/07/2010 11:17:43 Lintonblue : HMRC will appeal at the last minute as thsy did with Leeds,mainly because Chanrai is getting the club back. If a new owner appears than HMRC wont challenge,but as AA is putting up barriers so Chanrai can keep the club this wont happen. Then we exit admin without a CVA and a large points deduction. The CVA is then worthless and Chanrai can pay creditors as little as 1p in the £,and do what he wants with any income,so he wont put in a penny but take money out ,then the club will be finished once the parachute payments have gone,only this years are earmarked for football creditors. Interesting point. Is that actually the case if the CVA is refused? No idea if thats right or not but it sounds like more fag packet maths from the blue few. I would have thought the creditors could still appeal and take the club to court to recover its loses. Doesnt matter if someone new owns the club or not. Just a guess though. Need Clapham Saint or someone to confirm maybe? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benjii Posted 12 July, 2010 Share Posted 12 July, 2010 From The Skate News Makka, 12/07/2010 11:17:43 Lintonblue : HMRC will appeal at the last minute as thsy did with Leeds,mainly because Chanrai is getting the club back. If a new owner appears than HMRC wont challenge,but as AA is putting up barriers so Chanrai can keep the club this wont happen. Then we exit admin without a CVA and a large points deduction. The CVA is then worthless and Chanrai can pay creditors as little as 1p in the £,and do what he wants with any income,so he wont put in a penny but take money out ,then the club will be finished once the parachute payments have gone,only this years are earmarked for football creditors. Interesting point. Is that actually the case if the CVA is refused? Well, AA is under a duty to achieve the best result for the creditors. However, Chanrai is the only secured creditor and the unsecured creditors would receive nothing on a liquidation and asset sale as there is nothing of any value to sell. So it might be a plausible scenario. If there is only one interested party and the alternative to a cheap sale to that party is a liquidation that would only give a return to that party then the creditors as a whole are not being harmed if that party acquires the business. Certainly the current CVA terms are worthless if there is no CVA. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saintjay77 Posted 12 July, 2010 Share Posted 12 July, 2010 1 GK David James (captain) a 3 DF Ricardo Rocha 4 DF Aaron Mokoena 6 MF Hayden Mullins 7 DF Hermann Hreidarsson a 10 FW David Nugent 11 MF Michael Brown (2nd vice-captain) 17 FW John Utaka 19 FW Danny Webber 20 FW Tommy Smith 22 MF Richard Hughes 23 MF Kevin-Prince Boateng No. Position Player 27 FW Kanu a 31 GK Liam O'Brien 34 FW Danijel Subotić 35 DF Marc Wilson 37 FW Gaël N'lundulu 38 MF Marlon Pack 40 DF Joel Ward 41 MF Matt Ritchie 45 MF Tom Kilbey 47 FW Nadir Ciftci FW Paris Cowan-Hall GK Jon Stewart a - out of contract Bold - ones that would do well in the Championship - it's really not many. the 3 in bold prob wont still be there at the start of the new season along with a few others on that list. I doubt Mokoena will be there or Rocha. They cant sign anyone or renew contracts of James, Kanu and HH until the CVA gets passed and if HMRC apeal then the embargo will prolly be kept in place even longer. If they come out of Admin without the CVA then the FL can punnish them with a further Transfer Embargo. With the ship sinking that fast I think they will find it hard to keep most of there squad from wanting away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benjii Posted 12 July, 2010 Share Posted 12 July, 2010 No idea if thats right or not but it sounds like more fag packet maths from the blue few. I would have thought the creditors could still appeal and take the club to court to recover its loses. Doesnt matter if someone new owns the club or not. Just a guess though. Need Clapham Saint or someone to confirm maybe? A creditor could get a judgment proving that they're owed money but that would be a fat lot of good! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimmy_D Posted 12 July, 2010 Share Posted 12 July, 2010 From The Skate News Makka, 12/07/2010 11:17:43 Lintonblue : HMRC will appeal at the last minute as thsy did with Leeds,mainly because Chanrai is getting the club back. If a new owner appears than HMRC wont challenge,but as AA is putting up barriers so Chanrai can keep the club this wont happen. Then we exit admin without a CVA and a large points deduction. The CVA is then worthless and Chanrai can pay creditors as little as 1p in the £,and do what he wants with any income,so he wont put in a penny but take money out ,then the club will be finished once the parachute payments have gone,only this years are earmarked for football creditors. Interesting point. Is that actually the case if the CVA is refused? As I understand it, if they don't come out with a CVA the club gets liquidated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saintjay77 Posted 12 July, 2010 Share Posted 12 July, 2010 A creditor could get a judgment proving that they're owed money but that would be a fat lot of good! ah fair enough. I just thought that creditors would only get bugger all/next to nothin if the club is liquidated and there are no assets worth anything. Figured pretty much all other routes would leave a door open for creditors to at least try to get something back. A club that ditches all of its debt and sticks 2 fingers up to everyone while still continuing to trade and look to make money seems even less right than anything they have done already. Also seems like the best way out for any owner of a club. screw it up, offer a rubbish settlement so everyone rejects it, then buy it for bugger all and pay back nothing. If the club is shut down and the assets are sold off would the football creditors rule be null and void? so effectivly the liquidators would get as much money they can from all assets and would be able to share it out more evenly between all creditors? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
benjii Posted 12 July, 2010 Share Posted 12 July, 2010 ah fair enough. I just thought that creditors would only get bugger all/next to nothin if the club is liquidated and there are no assets worth anything. Figured pretty much all other routes would leave a door open for creditors to at least try to get something back. A club that ditches all of its debt and sticks 2 fingers up to everyone while still continuing to trade and look to make money seems even less right than anything they have done already. Also seems like the best way out for any owner of a club. screw it up, offer a rubbish settlement so everyone rejects it, then buy it for bugger all and pay back nothing. If the club is shut down and the assets are sold off would the football creditors rule be null and void? so effectivly the liquidators would get as much money they can from all assets and would be able to share it out more evenly between all creditors? Yes, to the last paragraph. The football creditors rule has no legal status - clubs comply because otherwise they have no business ie. they couldn't play football anymore. If a club was liquidated the football creditors would stand at the back of the queue along with all the other unsecured creditors. Creditors could, in theory, take action against an administrator I think. As far as action against PFC goes though there's not a lot they can do. The insolvency really draws a line under the matter. I think the point to remember about the first paragraph is that whilst that could happen and whilst it seems morally wrong, in most scenarios that would not actually benefit the owners; they are likely to have lost a lot of money too. If you believe what's reported, Chanrai is currently down by around £14m + any further contributions to find the administration. Al-Fahim is down £5m apparently. Al Faraj... well, goodness knows what that was all about! Even if Chanrai assumes control for next to nothing it will take him a long time to get his money back and the prospect of making a profit is pretty slim. He will own Pompey - it's not exactly a great thing to own! There are far better ways of trying to make a quick buck! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HK_Phoey Posted 12 July, 2010 Share Posted 12 July, 2010 My understanding is if they come out of admin without the CVA in place, not only will they suffer a points deduction but they are no longer protected from creditors which basically means any creditor can apply to have them wound up. If the CVA is rejected on appeal they can stay in admin and try to put together another agreement but since the original proposal is supposedly the best deal available for creditors there would need to be some serious back tracking/manouevering to make this fly, either way emabargo stays in place. Now whilst no one can predictable second guess what HRMC is likely to do, if HRMC's true aim is to teach football a lesson and pursue some of the more, let's call them colourful characters, that have been involved for personal transgressions, then the easiset and quickest way to do this is to try and get the CVA rejected wait for them to come out of admin, issue a winding up petition themselves and then they get to pick over the bones this could all happen in weeks. No need to wait the 9 months outlined in the CVA for the forensic accounting process every one says is thier primary objective. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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