Pompey Takeover Saga

[Micky]

Avram Grant really is getting just a little bit stupid now.

 

http://www.skysports.com/story/0,19528,11661_6111765,00.html

 

He continues with the 'it's everybody else's fault' yet when pressed fails to actually come up with an answer as to 'whose'?

 

It is very easy to say it's not fair on PFC, but why oh why can he not see anybody else's view of this and at least acknowledge that, throughout all of this shyte PFC has bloody benefitted, whilst all other clubs (and creditors) have lost out.

 

He really is now just becoming an embarrasment, just think where they would have been had they not cheated.

[trousers]

Avram Grant really is getting just a little bit stupid now.

 

http://www.skysports.com/story/0,19528,11661_6111765,00.html

 

He continues with the 'it's everybody else's fault' yet when pressed fails to actually come up with an answer as to 'whose'?

 

It is very easy to say it's not fair on PFC, but why oh why can he not see anybody else's view of this and at least acknowledge that, throughout all of this shyte PFC has bloody benefitted, whilst all other clubs (and creditors) have lost out.

 

He really is now just becoming an embarrasment, just think where they would have been had they not cheated.

He reminds me of Gordon Brown

[anothersaintinsouthsea]

Absolutely unreal. [-X

 

Die, you skate bast4rds.

 

+1.

 

Surely this is fraud.

[latter day saint]

The latest charity-based Pompey disgrace:

 

if this wasn't conected to those low-life c*nts i wouldn't believe it. someone just pull the plug FFS! :mad:

[saintjay77]

Avram Grant really is getting just a little bit stupid now.

 

http://www.skysports.com/story/0,19528,11661_6111765,00.html

 

He continues with the 'it's everybody else's fault' yet when pressed fails to actually come up with an answer as to 'whose'?

 

It is very easy to say it's not fair on PFC, but why oh why can he not see anybody else's view of this and at least acknowledge that, throughout all of this shyte PFC has bloody benefitted, whilst all other clubs (and creditors) have lost out.

 

He really is now just becoming an embarrasment, just think where they would have been had they not cheated.

 

I actually still find it quite funny. I know standing up for your team is the right thing to do but to try and suggest nothing is there fault when they are part of the club that put them into this situation is laughable.

 

Its probably getting more embarresing for there fans. Not sure if they think that way or still think Avram is someone to continue to cheer on.

 

It cant be long now before the authorities get involved can it? Are they really just leaving it to the administrator? Its obvious to just about everyone that something is not right and its probably illigal. So when will action be taken?

[Channon's Sideburns]

http://www.portsmouthfc.co.uk/LatestNews/news/FA-Cup-Final-Ticket-Information-856.aspx

 

This at least confirms the 50p per ticket garnishing.

 

This is the POL thread

http://fansonline.net/portsmouth/mb/view.php?id=262928

( I'm just off to disinfect my keyboard )

 

Disgusting, rancid little club.

 

Hope that this little episode gets covered by the press sooner rather than later.

 

Aside from cheating other businesses, ripping off an ill child is indefensible. Those in charge should be given long, hard time.

 

CHEATING LOWLIFES

Edited 23 April, 2010 by Channon's Sideburns

[Doctoroncall]

Miaow! But true though!

 

I see you are keeping Guardian readers well-informed.:-)

 

Well, the world of deceit and corruption of the skates needed to be told as there is no hard luck story. I try to be fair and unbiased in my comments but you should see Vastariner's - he's got it in for the club and fans big time!

[saintmonkey1979]

Well, the world of deceit and corruption of the skates needed to be told as there is no hard luck story. I try to be fair and unbiased in my comments but you should see Vastariner's - he's got it in for the club and fans big time!

 

Quite right too IMO

[positivepete]

It will be interesting to see what is published in the days leading up to the cup final. Will the press revert to football issues or unleash a load of other bad news "stories"?

[exit2]

This is interesting Wes... if you look on the HMRC web site and read up on PAYE' date=' its always teh Employee (player) that is ultimately responsible for ensuring they have paid the correct amount of tax - eg even if teh employer deducts and pays some to HMRC you are still liable for the rest... Now I am not sure about the legals in this case as in effect the players have paid their tax as it was deducted at source by teh club in the normal PAYE way, but this was not paid to HMRC which is surely fraud? Why? Because the players wage slips will staete the deduction as Income TAX, yet this is in fact not the case... what is teh legal situation on this, any lawyers out their care to comment?[/quote']

 

Shame that somebody with legal expertise has not responded to this.

 

We're both laymen, but have an instinctive feeling that there is a distinct possibility that either the club retaining those PAYE monies having deducted them from the players salaries is fraudulent, or else it is a debt owed to the players by the club. As such, it constitutes a footballing debt and should be classified as a secured debt. That would be paid out of the parachute payments to the players, who would have to pay it to HMRC.

 

Any other opinions or knowledge out there that might clarify this?

 

If you have an offical payslip with your tax / ni being showed as deducted it is the repsonsibility of the employer not the employee. Saying that a payslip is not a legal document where as a P60 / P45 is. If the TAX / NI is shown on that then in court it would stand as being paid and the employer is liable

[bridge too far]

If you have an offical payslip with your tax / ni being showed as deducted it is the repsonsibility of the employer not the employee. Saying that a payslip is not a legal document where as a P60 / P45 is. If the TAX / NI is shown on that then in court it would stand as being paid and the employer is liable

 

This is interesting as about a year ago I had to contact HMRC as I wasn't convinced my employer was paying my tax.

 

He owed me two months' salary and I hadn't had a payslip for about 6 months.

 

When he did pay me, he paid me the amount that I expected after tax. He never gave me a P60.

 

HMRC assured me that, even if my employer hadn't paid over my tax, there was no way that I would be liable for it.

 

I resigned, dear reader

[Tractor_Saint]

Go on - £20 to go to get to their target here:

 

http://www.justgiving.com/pompeyfans4stjohnsambulance

 

 

Given that I don't think they can edit the comments if you donate the £20 and given that you'll be the one to go down in history making the final payment - go and post this URL into your comment :

 

 

I, obviously, would do but about to move house and money is tight

[Boris Karloff]

What I can't really understand is that the footballing debts are constantly being referred to as secured debts. Surely they are the same as all the rest? FL/PL rules do not make them legally secured debts, or do they?

[Tractor_Saint]

Blimey - does Android have anything to do with the Justgiving website and the percentages?

 

 

Come on - someone put the tenner in

[Gorgiesaint]

Disgusting, rancid little club.

 

Hope that this little episode gets covered by the press sooner rather than later.

 

Aside from cheating other businesses, ripping off an ill child is indefensible. Those in charge should be given long, hard time.

 

CHEATING LOWLIFES

 

Well just to help it along, I emailed Danny Kelly's show this afternoon on Talksport with the link. Didn't get read out but hopefully it will start the ball rolling. If Stan Colleymore is on tomoroow, it would be worth emailing him given his rant yesterday about shutting Portsmouth down.

[Gorgiesaint]

If you have an offical payslip with your tax / ni being showed as deducted it is the repsonsibility of the employer not the employee. Saying that a payslip is not a legal document where as a P60 / P45 is. If the TAX / NI is shown on that then in court it would stand as being paid and the employer is liable

 

My understanding is that the employee is responsible for the correct amount of tax being paid ie if the employer does not deduct sufficient then the employee is still liable.

 

However in collecting tax/ni contributions the employer acts as an agent for HMRC, therefore if they have deducted an amount which is showing on a payslip given to the employee, the employee is no longer liable. How that then sits with the employer in not forwarding the payment to HMRC, I don't know.

 

A P45/P60 will only confirm the amounts received by HMRC.

[70's Mike]

I was thinking more along the lines of why they hadn't used it as security in the past rather than now - usually it's the first thing a club would use as security.

 

but at fratton that is what £5m not really megger bucks

[Jimmy_D]

Kudos to the Pompey fans that have raised the target for covering their club's debt to St John's Ambulance.

 

They're about the only creditable thing associated with that cesspit of a club at the moment.

[krissyboy31]

If you have an offical payslip with your tax / ni being showed as deducted it is the repsonsibility of the employer not the employee. Saying that a payslip is not a legal document where as a P60 / P45 is. If the TAX / NI is shown on that then in court it would stand as being paid and the employer is liable

 

But surely taking money out of one's pay packet and then not passing it on for the purpose it was taken (I.e. PAYE and NI) is tantamount to stealing.

[fuente saint]

Taking tax from an employee (or charging VAT and not passing to HMRC) is an offence under theTheft Act 1968

[emerson massey]

Kudos to the Pompey fans that have raised the target for covering their club's debt to St John's Ambulance.

 

They're about the only creditable thing associated with that cesspit of a club at the moment.

 

Completely agree, its always nice to see something like this, regardless of who it involves.

[Sevvy]

Avram on sky sports stated that they had paid the 20p debt they owed to Qatar, so if they have paid them 100% surely that means they now have to pay the rest of them100%

[Matthew Le God]

From Saturday's always reliable Mirror...

 

http://www.mirrorfootball.co.uk/news/Portsmouth-FA-Cup-heroes-put-up-for-sale-by-fax-just-three-weeks-ahead-of-the-final-at-Wembley-Exclusive-article402779.html

 

Crisis club Portsmouth put their FA Cup final squad up for sale yesterday - in a fax sent to all rival clubs.

 

Pompey’s administrator Andrew Andronikou has brought in football agency Icon Sports Management to sell their players just three weeks before the Wembley showpiece.

 

The For Sale fax dropped on the desks of managers yesterday with midfielder Kevin Prince Boateng the top valued player at £5 million.

 

The former Tottenham midfielder has injury problems but is still highly-rated by the doomed outfit.

Versatile Marc Wilson is rated at £4 million, which is more than interested clubs have said they will pay. Algerian World Cup winger Nadir Belhadj is at the same price.

 

Some of the fees have stunned potential buyers - with Pompey remarkably looking to make a profit on some players who signed for nothing.

 

Pompey want £3 million for Tal Ben Haim, who joined them on a free transfer, and the same figure for John Utaka whose wages have been draining them.

 

Strikers David Nugent [£3m] and Tommy Smith [£2m] can go with the former Watford man’s valuation also more than Pompey paid for him at the start of the season.

 

Veteran midfielder Michael Brown is valued at £1m, a high price for a player of his age. South African skipper Aaron Mokoena - signed on a free - is now quoted at £1m.

 

England keeper David James is listed as available on a free transfer along with number two shot-stopper Jamie Ashdown and a handful of other senior pros including injured Hermann Hreidarsson, Ricardo Rocha and Steve Finnan.

 

Even young hopeful Joel Ward, who made his debut recently, is down on the list as available to go for nothing along with veterans Kanu and Angelos Basinas.

 

Icon have also listed Aaron Hughes at £1 million - a case of mistaken identity as he is at Fulham. Namesake Richard is presumably the player who can leave Fratton Park for that fee.

 

Pompey have astonishingly revealed that they value their players at a combined total of under £30m. They are more likely to get around £10m at best, but that could still be a £500,000 pay day for Icon.

 

Icon have been employed by the administrators who were searching for agents with no previous links with the club or any transfer deals or players at Fratton Park.

 

But more experienced agents are furious and said: “Many people are owed big money by Portsmouth and won’t see it when they go into administration. They should be allowed to get some of their cash back by selling some of the players.”

 

Meanwhile there is a scramble among creditors to get into the administration tribunal, with several owed large sums and wanting a greater say in the process.

 

Only seven interested parties are on the committee who will vote on the administration package on May 6. Others want to be in on the act to sift through the figures.

 

Some of those values are laughable, as is the £30 million total and the agents feeling hard done by.

[trousers]

Avram on sky sports stated that they had paid the 20p debt they owed to Qatar, so if they have paid them 100% surely that means they now have to pay the rest of them100%

You're mistaking Pompey for an organisation that gets penalised for breaking the laws of the land...

[Gorgiesaint]

Icon have also listed Aaron Hughes at £1 million - a case of mistaken identity as he is at Fulham. Namesake Richard is presumably the player who can leave Fratton Park for that fee.

 

It seems that Comical Andy's sloppiness is catching - ISM list the wrong player following the mis-spelling of player names on the 70 page document released earlier in the week.

 

My favourite from that was trying to list Hermann Hreidarsson twice on the list of player liabilities- and spelling his name wrong both times but in two different ways.

 

Anyway - what did Storrie-teller value the squad at in court (under oath I presume)? £35m wasn't it? They've lost £5m already - won't take them long to lose another £5m off that valuation......

 

 

 

 

 

 

.... see gone already!!!

[TopGun]

It seems that Comical Andy's sloppiness is catching - ISM list the wrong player following the mis-spelling of player names on the 70 page document released earlier in the week.

 

My favourite from that was trying to list Hermann Hreidarsson twice on the list of player liabilities- and spelling his name wrong both times but in two different ways.

 

 

Pedantically I also find it amusing that they list Euro transactions as Euros rather than € . They list GBP as £.

 

Presumably the person who put the list together can't find the € key! Which indicates the slapdash nature of the whole document.

Edited 24 April, 2010 by TopGun

[for_heaven's_Saint]

Avram Grant really is getting just a little bit stupid now.

 

http://www.skysports.com/story/0,19528,11661_6111765,00.html

 

He continues with the 'it's everybody else's fault' yet when pressed fails to actually come up with an answer as to 'whose'?

 

It is very easy to say it's not fair on PFC, but why oh why can he not see anybody else's view of this and at least acknowledge that, throughout all of this shyte PFC has bloody benefitted, whilst all other clubs (and creditors) have lost out.

 

He really is now just becoming an embarrasment, just think where they would have been had they not cheated.

 

I can just imagine Avram Grant singing/rapping the words to Bloodhound Gang's 'Why's everybody always picking on me?', and when I looked at the lyrics, they fit him surprisingly well!

 

 

The morn' that I was born my old man beat up the doctor

He clocked the doctor cause the doctor said I looked like Chewbacca

The doctor said sir you're misled sir which infers you mistook me

I did not mean your lovely wife was shackin' up with a wookie

What I mean is Wolverine is less hairy than your son

He's looks like Chewie Baba Booey Baba Booey and Hong Kong Phooey all in one

To put it mild your new-born child's completely nutty fu-fu lookin'

I'd shove him back into the oven until he is done cookin'

But why's everbody always pickin' on me?

[Saint in Paradise]

Pedantically I also find it amusing that they list Euro transactions as Euros rather than € . They list GBP as £.

 

 

Maybe they know the fans wouldn't recognise the Euro symbol.

[dubai_phil]

We were lured into thinking there may be some sense of reality down the road with teh St Johyn's appeal.

 

This one suggests otherwise

 

http://mypompey.com/blogs/goldenboot/archive/2010/04/23/illegal-uefa-pompey-ban-breaches-two-european-laws.aspx

[saint lard]

Apologies if already posted....and yes it is only the Sun.....

 

http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/sport/football/2945806/Balram-nabs-Pompey-cash.html

 

Come as no surprise.

[Fitzhugh Fella]

He reminds me of Gordon Brown

 

I sense the influence of the Daily Mail

Edited 24 April, 2010 by Fitzhugh Fella

[trousers]

 

I sense the influence of the Daily Mail

 

It's the other way around - I influence them ;-)

[Doctoroncall]

We were lured into thinking there may be some sense of reality down the road with teh St Johyn's appeal.

 

This one suggests otherwise

 

http://mypompey.com/blogs/goldenboot/archive/2010/04/23/illegal-uefa-pompey-ban-breaches-two-european-laws.aspx

 

I see one comment saying they have been punished four times for going into admin: -9 pts, £1m fine, ban from europe and relegation itself.

 

If they are going to be that perverse I suppose they could add TCWTB, Admin Man Andy and Super Duper owner Chainrai to the list.

[doggface]

what id the most likely outcome here? surely no one is gonna come in and bail them out? Surely it would not make sense financially.

 

Is liquidation a distrinct possibility?

[Gingeletiss]

what id the most likely outcome here? surely no one is gonna come in and bail them out? Surely it would not make sense financially.

 

Is liquidation a distrinct possibility?

 

This has always been my stance, I see no reason to change that opinion.

[benjii]

We were lured into thinking there may be some sense of reality down the road with teh St Johyn's appeal.

 

This one suggests otherwise

 

http://mypompey.com/blogs/goldenboot/archive/2010/04/23/illegal-uefa-pompey-ban-breaches-two-european-laws.aspx

 

That guy's an utter fool. Seen that blog before.

 

Interestingly you can leave comments without having to sign in or register.

[aintforever]

what id the most likely outcome here? surely no one is gonna come in and bail them out? Surely it would not make sense financially.

 

Is liquidation a distrinct possibility?

 

If it's liquidated they won't get £50mill in parachutes so probably not.

 

But I suppose it must depend on the size of the football debts and how much Chanria will have to blow trying to get a CVA and keep the club running. And at the moment it looks like they won't see any parachutes until 2012, so as a secured creditor Chanrai might prefer to liquidate it as I think then he's first in line and there will be no need to pay the football debt.

[rallyboy]

I just read through the entire list of creditors, it's ridiculous (if vaguely accurate).

 

I see £500K owed to Spurs for O'Hara - will that be the fee from January when he was brought back in illegally?

'No transfers, just loanees, oh your accounts look healthy, help yourself, see you at Wembley.' Cheats.

 

But what about the schools, colleges and charities, the small companies that suffer with cashflow problems, how could they do that to these people?

 

It must be time to pull the plug, the farce has gone on long enough.

Let them have their farewell party, a final outing for the Storrie banners, finish the league programme and pull the shutters down.

Grant can continue to spout rubbish, his reputation is shot to bits - perving around industrial estates, an appalling league record, and when in front of a microphone he displays the judgement of a deluded clown.

 

AA can treat everyone like idiots and spin more lies, and the big two pulling the strings can waltz off with the property deal that they have always wanted - like none of us know what's been going on for nine months!

 

Let's face it, there isn't anything left to launder so they might as well call it a day, the corpse is drained - some of the stars of this little soap will be beyond the law, others will get away with it, and hopefully several will do time.

 

Time to call it a day.

[andysstuff]

what id the most likely outcome here? surely no one is gonna come in and bail them out? Surely it would not make sense financially.

 

Is liquidation a distrinct possibility?

 

 

To my uneducated mind, it's starting to look like there may be a better chance of money in it for Chanari if the club is liquidated now rather than having to wait till 2012 for a sniff of cash.

 

So yes I think it's starting to look more and more likely. What's the betting the Cup Final money ends up in his back pocket too??

[Gingeletiss]

http://www.portsmouthfc.co.uk/LatestNews/news/FA-Cup-Final-Ticket-Information-856.aspx

 

This at least confirms the 50p per ticket garnishing.

 

This is the POL thread

http://fansonline.net/portsmouth/mb/view.php?id=262928

( I'm just off to disinfect my keyboard )

 

 

There's more! not one, but two cancer charities!

 

http://www.portsmouth.co.uk/newshome/Cancer-charities-owed-thousands-by.6250652.jp

 

The money owed to Harbour Cancer Support Centre in Gosport was raised in a raffle and auction held at a Fratton Park function in March last year.

[dubai_phil]

Sweepstake time.

 

At what point will AA have a press conference and express his disappointment/moral outrage/horror at what he found when he started to do his investigation work. Something along the lines of "I had no idea things were so bad" as he starts to cover his arse (CVA) to protect his future career having realised he's been sold a sinking trawler?

 

I reckon some time around FA Cup weekend followed by pop

[Crab Lungs]

There's more! not one, but two cancer charities!

 

http://www.portsmouth.co.uk/newshome/Cancer-charities-owed-thousands-by.6250652.jp

 

The money owed to Harbour Cancer Support Centre in Gosport was raised in a raffle and auction held at a Fratton Park function in March last year.

 

This is getting beyond belief.

 

Especially when you consider the hysteria on our main board when Cortese kicked out a few people from SMS this season...

 

Portsmouth fans, jeez... at least some are finally "getting it" now, several months after we did.

 

I have to wonder what Storrie's up to these days, what he's thinking...

[Crab Lungs]

Btw... where s Corpy? and PIR?

[Thedelldays]

It really is becoming sad now..what is worrying is that pompey are a disgrace...an utter disgrace to a level NONE of us could imagine..

 

their disgusting actions have done damage to nearly every part of their community and the sport..

 

the EPL MUST ben seen to be done more now..and how long before the government (who ever it will be) will step into football to try and stop it from eating itself..or even give the FA back the powers.

for ALL the FAs faults, they at least tend to have footballs best interests at heart

 

what makes all even worse, is Avram FUKING grants whinging all the time about how hard done by they are...he is saying how unfair it is they are not allowed to be in europe...

 

someone needs to shut HIM and that club up..

[Gorgiesaint]

There's more! not one, but two cancer charities!

 

http://www.portsmouth.co.uk/newshome/Cancer-charities-owed-thousands-by.6250652.jp

 

The money owed to Harbour Cancer Support Centre in Gosport was raised in a raffle and auction held at a Fratton Park function in March last year.

 

Just when you thought they couldn't get any lower, this is pure theft & if this doesn't get the police sniffing round Farton then nothing will.

[Thedelldays]

how did arry come out all those times claiming how baffled he was that they were skint...

[Crab Lungs]

Just when you thought they couldn't get any lower, this is pure theft & if this doesn't get the police sniffing round Farton then nothing will.

 

I have to wonder... did AA leave out the charities in hope that they'd maintain their dignified silences? I wonder whom or what else is going to come out about PFC in the upcoming days...

[Um Bongo]

We deserve to be in Europe.

 

I think it's the wrong decision that we are not allowed to play.

 

It would be good for English football to have Portsmouth in Europe.

 

This is a team that everybody thought would break but they got to the FA Cup final.

 

We earned our position in Europe because we did a good job.

 

In fact, it was an unbelievable job in very, very difficult circumstances.

 

We need to be in Europe. We have done everything to deserve to be in Europe according to the rules.

 

But now there is another decision that has been made off the pitch about this club.

 

I'm asking myself "where is the famous English fair play?"

 

Everything used to be decided on the pitch in this country.

I educate on English fair play.

 

When I was young, we gave examples in my country about the English and their fair play.

 

Any decision was made on the pitch, not off the pitch.

 

According to the rules, Portsmouth need to be in Europe next season.

 

As far as I know, we couldn't register for our Uefa license because we were in administration.

 

I don't understand why they didn't give us an equal chance in the league but why now in the cup as well?

 

I know that some of the things that have happened at Portsmouth have been a pain in the backside for the Premier League.

 

But now they are starting to be a pain in our backsides.

 

I don't know who should be punished but I know who should not.

 

It should not be the team, the players, the fans or the staff.

 

Who should be punished is not my job to decide.

 

It's the job of the Premier League not to take the easy solution.

 

They could do more to find the right people to blame.

 

I heard we can go to court and I think we will do everything we can to play in Europe because we deserve it.

 

I hope there will be justice for this club.

 

We are trying to do our job in football – I think everybody knows that it's difficult but we did it.

 

It's good for the Premier League that a team like us didn't break.

 

We have shown spirit, we are always fighting and have always done our best in every situation.

 

So I don't understand why there are so many decisions off the pitch about this club.

 

Why are there all these decisions against Portsmouth?

 

Someone should tell the Premier League to wait a little bit.

 

Of course we have been treated unfairly – that is for sure.

 

We didn't do anything – not the players, not the fans, not the staff.

But who do they punish every time?

 

We are victims of other circumstances.

 

I know that it's very difficult to find the right people who did things wrong and punish them.

 

But I still don't understand this decision.

 

It's so disappointing because I like the European competitions.

 

Of course it is a factor in whether I would stay but it is not the main problem for me.

 

The main problem is what will happen with the club.

 

Who will take the club? What will happen with the debts?

 

But one thing is for sure, this club deserves its place in Europe for what we have achieved on the pitch this season.

 

I hope the people who make these decisions will understand.

 

Avram Grant speaking yesterday.

 

Words fail me.

[ohwhenthesaints]

Avram Grant speaking yesterday.

 

Words fail me.

 

Try this one:

 

****.

[dronskisaint]

Try this one:

 

****.

 

Does it rhyme with the sort of boat that posh people push with a pole on the River Cam?

 

I hope so:mad: