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Pompey Takeover Saga

Fitzhugh Fella

By Fitzhugh Fella,
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Channon's Sideburns

Channon's Sideburns

Posted
Posted

Well if they want to go 'pre-packed' then you can work out your own theory why Mr Chinnery wants to appoint an administrator of his choosing.

 

Also, you can then see Barclays' point of view.

 

IMO those in charge now want first dibs on a pre-pack which would ensure the little scam/enterprise *delete as appropriate - continues. Rather conveniently the books would also not come to light under a new ownership with no links to the old.

 

Hence my theory on Sacha Gaydamak 'coming to the rescue' - buy the club for a pittance, 'write off' his debts from the club and back on the bus we go.

 

What better way than to appoint your own administrator...would be wonderful if Barclays have read the script but request a re-write.

 

Could muck their plans up somewhat. Here's hoping.

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OldNick

OldNick

Posted
Posted

 

What I would like to see happen versus what will probably happen:

 

1. HMRC object to Admin proceedure on the grounds that SOA proves that they have been trading illegally.

2. PCFC get wound up on Monday

3.Director of Public Prosecutions is brought in to start criminal investigation on PCFC

4. Twitchy, Mandrake and Storrie Teller are all found guilty of Tax evasion and sent to Jail

5. Fratton Park is turned into an Asda but in five years time they discover underground stream that causes major subsidence.

6. As land is unfit for habitation turned into land refill

 

What will probably happen

 

1. PCFC go into admin

2. Pre packaged buyer bails themou comprising a consortium of Gaydamak and Chanrai (under different guises of course )

3 Relegation

4. -30 ponts deduction in Championship because they have no CVA

5.Relegation League 1

6. Administration again

7. Insolvency

8. Asda etc

9. Land Fill etc.

 

IMO of course

 

Sadly I have always felt they would get out of it and expressed the best that would happen was -9 this season and relegation.

It seems that may come to pass. I would be delighted if this happened and also Storrie and co got their just desserts.

For them to have less than this happen will be a bitter pill to swallow.

I notice less of the 'they are toast ' posts today.

They have obviously paid for the best minds to work this through and so they look to have thwarted justice.

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Channon's Sideburns

Channon's Sideburns

Posted
Posted
Sadly I have always felt they would get out of it and expressed the best that would happen was -9 this season and relegation.

It seems that may come to pass. I would be delighted if this happened and also Storrie and co got their just desserts.

For them to have less than this happen will be a bitter pill to swallow.

I notice less of the 'they are toast ' posts today.

They have obviously paid for the best minds to work this through and so they look to have thwarted justice.

 

I see you used the word 'paid' Nick.....Portsmouth FC in payment on time shocker...

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Winchester Red

Winchester Red

Posted
Posted (edited)

Quick bit of analysis. What are the main debts?

 

1. Chainrai - £7m or £17m however you look at it

2. Gaydamak - £30m aledgedly

3. Football debters - Christ knows but unavoidable

4. HMRC - £11-20m or -20 points

5. Local others - £5m

 

What can they walk away from?

 

If 1 or 2 want to take the hit that's up to them, not sure why they would

 

3 and 4 you're stuck with one way or another.

 

5 is the only one you can escape from and that ain't much

 

Chainrai isn't in this for the benefit of PFC so how does this pre-pack theory suddenly make it all rosy?

 

...and that's before the FL have it in for them...... aaaannnnndddd why on earth would Chainrai do anythimg to get Storrie off the hook. He's part of the reason why Chainrais in this mess to start with!!!

Edited by Winchester Red
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Goalie66

Goalie66

Posted
Posted
Sadly I have always felt they would get out of it and expressed the best that would happen was -9 this season and relegation.

It seems that may come to pass. I would be delighted if this happened and also Storrie and co got their just desserts.

For them to have less than this happen will be a bitter pill to swallow.

I notice less of the 'they are toast ' posts today.

They have obviously paid for the best minds to work this through and so they look to have thwarted justice.

 

Have faith my friend HMRC could be the trump card as well as payday is tomorrow !!

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pedg

pedg

Posted
Posted
Have faith my friend HMRC could be the trump card as well as payday is tomorrow !!

 

Think it has been said that Chainrai has guaranteed they will all get paid tomorrow. One assumes that includes paying the taxman his share as well?

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Fowllyd

Fowllyd

Posted
Posted
Sadly I have always felt they would get out of it and expressed the best that would happen was -9 this season and relegation.

It seems that may come to pass. I would be delighted if this happened and also Storrie and co got their just desserts.

For them to have less than this happen will be a bitter pill to swallow.

I notice less of the 'they are toast ' posts today.

They have obviously paid for the best minds to work this through and so they look to have thwarted justice.

 

I think you're jumping the gun here, Nick. Right now we don't know anything, save that they've announced that they'll go into admin on Friday. There's been very little (if any) further news today, and I'd expect the same tomorrow. We'll find out on Friday if HMRC have a statement to make, and indeed if they can do anything to force the winding-up issue.

 

As to pre-pack arrangements, surely that's all guesswork at the moment. And, even if that does happen, it won't surprise me at all if the Football League then draft some new rules so that they'll be able to punish PFC next season anyway - after all, that's what happened to Leeds. The FL will hold the whip hand as Pompey will need their go-ahead to play.

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mcjwills

mcjwills

Posted
Posted (edited)

What will probably happen

 

1. PCFC go into admin

2. Pre packaged buyer bails them out comprising a consortium of Gaydamak and Chanrai (under different guises of course ) They include all Chanrai & Gaydamaks debts as unsecured, offer 20p in £ this means paying themselves £12M pound as the HMRC debt would be less 25% of total CVA is agreed.

3. Relegation

4. No extra point deduction

5. Paid £11M from Premier league as parachute payment. (Only a loss of £1M ).

6. Sell high wage earners & buy journeymen for CCC

7. Following 2 years use Parchute payment to buy way back to PL

 

Bar Stewards will get away with it !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Edited by mcjwills
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Faz

Faz

Posted
Posted
Sadly I have always felt they would get out of it and expressed the best that would happen was -9 this season and relegation.

It seems that may come to pass. I would be delighted if this happened and also Storrie and co got their just desserts.

For them to have less than this happen will be a bitter pill to swallow.

I notice less of the 'they are toast ' posts today.

They have obviously paid for the best minds to work this through and so they look to have thwarted justice.

 

Just for you Nick, they're stll toast, but now to be slowly cooked over a camping stove, rather than flame grilled.

 

If they go into Admin, and that's still an if because HMRC and His Honour may still have a say in it accordng to some, they need to pay off HMRC in full allow a CVA to proceed. So a pospeive buyer still needs to settle between £11m and £22m of HMRC debt, and football debts to get to the point of achieveing a CVA.

 

No CVA means even if the football debts (and we dn't know how much they amount to) are paid, then they start on at least -15 next season. That's without the FL saying "hang on a mo - weren't you guys in admin before?". And without any further punishment if previus executives are found guilty of Financial Irregularities.

 

No Ground, No training ground, no players, no parachute payment. So what does a rospective buyer get for acquiring/settling lets say £20m of debt and, at best, a Championship club.

 

We had infrastructure and were saved at the last minute.

 

I don't think this is the end game just yet. This is just a vehicle for Chinnery/Gheydaboy to get as much of his/their money back as poss.

 

What I don't get is why wait until now to push the Admin button. They were taking a big chance on being given the time they were following the WU hearing. It could have gone south there and then.

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Winchester Red

Winchester Red

Posted
Posted

It's only the late timing of admin that makes me think that pre-pack is a possibility.

 

Create enough time to organise the takeover and announce it 10 minutes after admin.

 

I say again though, any smart accounting will be for the benefit of Chainrai, not football. If Chainrai can make £1 more of his money back, he'd accept another 10 point penalty for the football team. He's just a money lender FFS

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Tamesaint

Tamesaint

Posted
Posted
What will probably happen

 

1. PCFC go into admin

2. Pre packaged buyer bails them out comprising a consortium of Gaydamak and Chanrai (under different guises of course ) They include all Chanrai & Gaydamaks debts as unsecured, offer 20p in £ this means paying themselves £12M pound as the HMRC debt would be less 25% of total CVA is agreed.

3. Relegation

4. No extra point deduction

5. Paid £11M from Premier league as parachute payment. (Only a loss of £1M ).

6. Sell high wage earners & buy journeymen for CCC

7. Following 2 years use Parchute payment to buy way back to PL

 

Bar Stewards will get away with it !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

What has happened in this scenario to the football debts?? If they are not paid in full, they are not allowed back into the F League.

 

Don't worry - they are toast.

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St Marco

St Marco

Posted
Posted

Another important point is when they are confirmed down this year and in admin they will sell the last remaining players who are worth anything. The loan players will return to their parrent clubs.

 

Leaving an already dire team a lot dire.

 

Meaning next season if they are in the CCC they will have to field their youth team due to having no funds to buy players. Meaning they will likely be battling relegation next season too. If they don't have a CVA then they could get a -20 deduction too.

 

So either way you look at it there is no "get out of it" scenario. The only way that happens is if some rich guy takes over, clear's their debts and puts money in the club to buy the players to get them up the table. Which is unlikely. So rather then being put out of their misery they are just set to suffer for at least another 12 months.

 

Someone said they will never grace the PL again after this and you hae to say at least for the long forseable future they are right.

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Winchester Red

Winchester Red

Posted
Posted

Can someone explain to me, in the context of the PFC supporters who enjoyed the stolen FA Cup victory, how the following scenario is 'getting away with it'

 

C&G organise a prepack, re-buy the team themselves using dodgy Storrie as a front man purely to get 2 x £16.5m of parachute money and then disapear.

 

C&G will always walk away from any situation. If it gets bad enough you just disapear to a different country. Ask daddy.

 

But we are football fans and taunting / bantering PFC fans is what it's all about. How is anything that's occuring going to mean they are 'getting away with it' - I still think it's going to be a 5 year horror story, unless somehow they get put out of their misery and they reform as AFCP

 

The only thing they can potentially look forward to is C&G stitching up Storrie as they shut the door and turn out the lights in a couple of years

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Gingeletiss

Gingeletiss

Posted
Posted
And there's this:

 

'If the business IS VIABLE and has a good future then administration is a very powerful means to defined the company against the petition. Administration will “stay” (or postpone) the winding up petition and prevent a winding up order being made and any other legal action (except with leave of court).

 

To me, this reads that PFC stll have to attend the court on Mar 1. They wll say 'Oh it's OK now your Lordship, we've gone into administration'.

 

But his / her Lordship might well say 'but the business still isn't viable so I'm dismissing your defence - administration will solve nothing'.

 

The more I read, the more I'm convinced they'll try a pre-pack.

 

The administrator may propose a Company Voluntary Arrangement to protect the business for up to 5 years. Or it may be sold to a new company or buyers (including you as directors).

 

See this is how it was explained to me. That once the WO was dealt with by the court (2 weeks ago), then only the court could allow them into administration, and any secured creditor, would have to apply to the courts. All these the media experts (and benjii) have made me doubt the validity of this however..........

 

 

Protection of assets between petition and order

Once the winding up petition has been presented, a date is set for a court hearing at which the petition will be heard and a winding up order made against your company. A considerable time may elapse between the presentation of the winding up petition and the hearing for the making of the order.

 

You should make use of this time to seek professional advice on the options open to you and your company, you can call the business helpline on 0800 24 0800 for free and confidential advice before it’s to late.

 

In general, your company should be allowed to continue to trade in that period but the creditors need to be protected against possible disposal of its assets. Your actions as a director are therefore under great scrutiny in this period of time and the ability to trade effectively can be impaired due to the impending hearing being at the forefront of your mind.

 

Invalidation of disposal of assets

Unless the court orders otherwise, any disposal of your company’s property, alteration in the status of its members or transfer of shares after the commencement of the winding up petition is void. The purpose of this provision is to preserve the value of the assets of a company for the benefit of persons interested in those assets.

 

 

 

It seems that the taking of the stadium by Mr Chainrai, may not be all that it seems..!!

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Channon's Sideburns

Channon's Sideburns

Posted
Posted
Anybody?..... bacause I really (no matter how hard I bat myself on the head with my Coke can) can't see how the people who live in our universe (the fans not the crims) are going to get any joy out of this!

 

The prosecution rests m'lord

 

FIFA and UEFA have now called for action against clubs stretching their means...just mentioned on Solent.

 

'A Wake Up call for World Football'....

 

Ooo-er.

 

BTW I think the 'getting away with it' argument (to which I partly subscribe) is based on the fact that....

 

If justice was served, as they cannot find a buyer, they would be declared insolvent and liquidated on Monday.

 

Let's forget the wide reaching ramifications of this to everyday folk who have supplied the club and look at the issue only.

 

Pompey have lied, cheated their way to administration. They are STILL AT IT.

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Winchester Red

Winchester Red

Posted
Posted (edited)
Did anyone hear WAVE 105+ Chamber of commerce saying how P*mpey going into Admin will cost the city millions, and how local businesses rely on them. They are seriously having a laugh. What about all people they owe money to now and in they're previous alias (PFC) that they still owe money to. F*CKIN JOKE!!!!!

 

That's my point.

 

Nobody that matters to us is getting away with it - businesses, fans, nobody.

 

Call me cynical but I'm used to people like C&G walking all over people and getting away with it. Nobody seems to be able to do anything about that.

 

Owners f*ck up football clubs, not fans, and owners somehow need to be held to account.

 

I'm still hoping HMRC can be my hero!

Edited by Winchester Red
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dubai_phil

dubai_phil

Posted
Posted

Maybe,just maybe, the City of Portsmouth is about to start to fall out of love with it's football team.

 

I also think that if the fans believe that there is no reason to form AFC Pompey they will be making a big mistake.

 

Still, at least they didn't lie about meeting "interested parties" those 4 groups have been pretty clearly shown as being stakeholders in the "damage limitation exercise".

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Winchester Red

Winchester Red

Posted
Posted
Maybe,just maybe, the City of Portsmouth is about to start to fall out of love with it's football team.

 

I also think that if the fans believe that there is no reason to form AFC Pompey they will be making a big mistake.

 

Still, at least they didn't lie about meeting "interested parties" those 4 groups have been pretty clearly shown as being stakeholders in the "damage limitation exercise".

 

That really is the best way forward.

 

Don't support the fresh out of admin PFC. Show some balls and walk away.

 

Start a new club and give them your money. You might not be able to keep the parachute payments out of C&G's hands but you can rid yourself of **** owners for ever. Use the Barcelona 1 share/vote per person model

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Saint_John

Saint_John

Posted
Posted

Radio Solent said at 5:30 that the administrators will be from UHY - Hacker Young from London E1 something.

I assume they mean these people ? http://www.uhy-uk.com/pages/people/london.php

 

Does anyone remember when "junior" took over there were reports that something like 6 out of his previous 7 companies had gone bust.

 

Did they call in administrators ? and if so which ones ?

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derry

derry

Posted
Posted
That's my point.

 

Nobody that matters to us is getting away with it - businesses, fans, nobody.

 

Call me cynical but I'm used to people like C&G walking all over people and getting away with it. Nobody seems to be able to do anything about that.

 

Owners f*ck up football clubs, not fans, and owners somehow need to be held to account.

 

I'm still hoping HMRC can be my hero!

 

In administration the players contracts are a millstone. Even the loans are contracted to the end of the season. Their clubs won't want them back, probably couldn't play them so won't take them.

 

The players on inflated contracts will be given away if they can find any takers. Probably all the players left are on inflated contracts in relation to the CCC and won't want to stay.

 

The players will have to be paid, contracts paid up or made free agents by mutual agreements and how much is owed in image rights/bonuses a la Sol Campbell all to be paid in full.

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Fowllyd

Fowllyd

Posted
Posted
It's only the late timing of admin that makes me think that pre-pack is a possibility.

 

Create enough time to organise the takeover and announce it 10 minutes after admin.

 

I say again though, any smart accounting will be for the benefit of Chainrai, not football. If Chainrai can make £1 more of his money back, he'd accept another 10 point penalty for the football team. He's just a money lender FFS

 

How can you say such a thing? Surely you must know that he's not just any old money lender, he's a money lender 'who's fallen in love with this club'. Honestly, some people!

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rallyboy

rallyboy

Posted
Posted

Storrie believes that if he says something enough times it becomes the truth.

 

They told us they had not been served a winding up order, there would be no firesale, he told us there was new investment, that talk of financial problems was media lies, he said that the Prem had offered Pompey their own transfer window, he said there were several consortiums in a bidding war, he told us they had agreed a deal, he announced that it would solve the club's problems, he's now telling us they will go into administration on Friday...

 

Does he actually mean that they will ask the court to swap the winding-up for adminstration?

Does he mean that Chainrai is going to prove that he now doesn't claim to be the owner as he did last week but is now classing himself as a secured creditor?

And will they actually do this or just talk about it?

 

There's a pattern of Storrie appointing himself the boss of everyone and telling people what's going to happen in Storrie World - but the taxman and the court are deafeningly silent, keeping their powder dry perhaps?

 

I would like to hear information from someone involved other than Portsmouth as I don't believe what they say.

 

Though the taxman may still be too busy - digging the graves.

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Winchester Red

Winchester Red

Posted
Posted (edited)
How can you say such a thing? Surely you must know that he's not just any old money lender, he's a money lender 'who's fallen in love with this club'. Honestly, some people!

 

Ahhh, stand corrected

 

He's a money lender that's fallen in love with this club's money

 

:D

 

Let the asset stripping comence.....

Edited by Winchester Red
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krissyboy31

krissyboy31

Posted
Posted
The players will have to be paid, contracts paid up or made free agents by mutual agreements and how much is owed in image rights/bonuses a la Sol Campbell all to be paid in full.

 

Do these "image rights" come under football debt or will they get away without having to pay them? After all it seems they were contracts, aside from the playing ones in order to hide them from HMRC (allegedly).

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Weston Saint

Weston Saint

Posted
Posted
Storrie believes that if he says something enough times it becomes the truth.

 

They told us they had not been served a winding up order, there would be no firesale, he told us there was new investment, that talk of financial problems was media lies, he said that the Prem had offered Pompey their own transfer window, he said there were several consortiums in a bidding war, he told us they had agreed a deal, he announced that it would solve the club's problems, he's now telling us they will go into administration on Friday...

 

Does he actually mean that they will ask the court to swap the winding-up for adminstration?

Does he mean that Chainrai is going to prove that he now doesn't claim to be the owner as he did last week but is now classing himself as a secured creditor?

And will they actually do this or just talk about it?

 

There's a pattern of Storrie appointing himself the boss of everyone and telling people what's going to happen in Storrie World - but the taxman and the court are deafeningly silent, keeping their powder dry perhaps?

 

I would like to hear information from someone involved other than Portsmouth as I don't believe what they say.

 

Though the taxman may still be too busy - digging the graves.

Best yet, well done.
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krissyboy31

krissyboy31

Posted
Posted
I think the bottom line is that Chanrai, Gaydamak and HRMC all want their money and it's the administrators job to get them as much money as possible.

 

None of the people involved have the slightest interest in Portsmouth Football Club.

 

Which is basically what that Mike Hall (PFC Supporters Trust) said to SSN.

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Gingeletiss

Gingeletiss

Posted
Posted

Just a quick snippit from the bluephew trust.....

 

 

 

alfahim80.jpgThe Pompey Supporters’ Trust would like to clear up some confusion surrounding the reports of Suleiman Al Fahim transferring his 10% share in Portsmouth City Football Club to the Trust.

 

Legal experts spoke to Mr Fahim yesterday and it became apparent that these shares wouldn’t be offered directly to the Trust. Al Fahim was proposing that the shares be given to an organisation called “INTRUST” with supporters buying the shares from him at an agreed price over a period of time. This would only be the case if Mr Fahim was to buy the Club and he had asked the club for three weeks’ Due Diligence from the present owners which we believe to have been rejected.

 

We have no doubt the offer was made in good faith but as a formal offer hasn’t been made directly to the Trust, this isn’t a proposal we can put to a members vote. We would like to thank Mr Fahim who we believe had the best interests of the fans at heart and it shouldn’t be forgotten that he put five million pounds into the Football Club.

 

 

 

What's pertinent here IMO, is that he acquired this 10% for 10p, that is to say, he got the shares for £1 of Gaydemark junior.

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saint si

saint si

Posted
Posted

This really intrigued me:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/8535297.stm

 

The European Club Footballing Landscape study looked at the 2007-08 accounts of all 732 clubs licensed by UEFA.

 

The report does not include the debts of Portsmouth or West Ham, because they were not granted UEFA licences that year owing to financial problems.[/Quote]

 

So UEFA have been aware of the financial problems since at least the 07/08 season... and yet they played in the UEFA cup in 08/09... so are we to believe that the position actually improved before the start of the 08/09 season?

 

Trying to find details on what a UEFA license actually is (nothing to do with the coaching badges)... only come across this so far:

 

http://www.sportbusiness.com/news/135821/uefa-unveil-strict-new-financial-guidelines

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tony13579

tony13579

Posted
Posted
from comments "the News" http://www.portsmouth.co.uk/sport/Storrie-I39ll-stay-to-fight.6098638.jp?CommentPage=9&CommentPageLength=10#comments

Arry went to spurs

Storrie stayed at home

Both the miserable curs

Never repaid a loan

So the club is on the brink

And the fans are left to wail

Lets hope they throw the kitchen sink

And put them both in Jail

From the ashes we may see another day

If the green gives us all a rub

All we can do is hope and pray

That we still have a club

 

I have been a season ticket holder for many years and all the time Storrie is at the club I will not pay Pompey another penny of my money.

The only reason Storrie wants to stay on at Portsmouth is so he can rake though our ashes to see if there is any money left.

Go now Storrie

 

Hi everyone, this has all turned into ratsh*t, as regards to PS he needs to go asap, Perhaps he can go and hook up with HR again and help him finish off Spurs, I am not the only one who thinks that HR is doing the same to spurs as he did to Pompey, I have it on good authority that all the big named players who joined pompey and went onto spurs had there wages increased by two thirds to join them no surprise hey,

Like on Tuesday I was with the introduer who set the deal up with the south Africans, I spoke to him just after he received the call that the deal was off, we were gutted as you can imagine, if going into admin will save our club then we also need to sweep out all the main causers of the problem, I think they know who they are, the chap I was talking with on Tuesday said more or less the same but he is not aloud to say because of the job he is in.

 

The worms have finally turned

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sidthesquid

sidthesquid

Posted
Posted

Regarding the conspiracy theory/ b@st@rds are going to get away with it again situation -

crumb of comfort number one: even the Prem would now have to look pretty hard at any new alleged owner of a phoenix Poopey, and surely any tenuous link to those that rendered the club into admin would be reason enough to fail the FPP test.

crumb of comfort number two: Poopey's problems are not really about debt but running costs. They need £20-25 million just to maintain themselves until the end of June and a max of £5-6 million of income. So excluding all the other debts someone has to be prepared to stump up circa £20 over the next five months

And that second crumb is the one that I think will choke them

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saint si

saint si

Posted
Posted
Not sure if its already been posted, but this link explains the Pompey / Administration thing quite well ... they are fooked dudes !

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/mattslater/2010/02/portsmouth_fc_in_crisis_qa.html

 

.

 

Read that earlier - really very good, honest and frank about their chances. Comment 3 made me laugh (now removed, but quoted in comment 13). Typical head-in-sand skate!

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OldNick

OldNick

Posted
Posted

I have not seen it posted, but SSN had a reporter on who said that the PL have said they will honour the next 2 seasons parachute payments as well as the last tv money , in total 37m whatever happens.

Now at first it seems a lot of money but of course if Gaydamek and the HMRC are owed more than that, they are not out of the deep water.

I think the HMRC statement/reaction could be pivotal, a lot of ups and downs still to come for them it seems. The wages and administration bills will also become part of money due to Chanrai of course as well.

I wonder what interest rates these loans are on.

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