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Pompey Takeover Saga

Fitzhugh Fella

By Fitzhugh Fella,
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OldNick

OldNick

Posted
Posted
We are then in the scenario where the players would quite rightly be putting in a case for constructive dismissal. Whichever way you look at it they, like Chinny, WILL get their money.
that would be very difficult to prove. TB would say he was only making people aware of the clubs position and who can be responsible for the action of its customers. They will of course come out and not condone any actions by fans.
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Frank's cousin

Frank's cousin

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We are then in the scenario where the players would quite rightly be putting in a case for constructive dismissal. Whichever way you look at it they, like Chinny, WILL get their money.

 

And to be honest they would have a strong case. Yes their ages are extreme and excessive, and diffifcult to justify, but the campaign that the club has been using, motional blackmail and a very public level at that + you know what teh fan pressure and abuse will be like, is still discusting way to treat anyone. I would sue their arses for constructive... :x

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andysstuff

andysstuff

Posted
Posted
that would be very difficult to prove. TB would say he was only making people aware of the clubs position and who can be responsible for the action of its customers. They will of course come out and not condone any actions by fans.

 

The PFA have very deep pockets and look after their members well. Would guess they would want to send a powerful message out. And quite rightly so.

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Saint in Paradise

Saint in Paradise

Posted
Posted
And to be honest they would have a strong case. Yes their ages are extreme and excessive' date=' and diffifcult to justify, but the campaign that the club has been using, motional blackmail and a very public level at that + you know what teh fan pressure and abuse will be like, is still discusting way to treat anyone. I would sue their arses for constructive... :x[/quote']

 

No-one can alter their physical age Frank, they can only tell lies about how old they are :lol:

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Under Weststand

Under Weststand

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Posted

Isn't it funny how the football creditors rule has come back to bite them on the a##e.

All these great fans favourite's, hailed by the glorious few are now the devil incarnate! LOL

The football creditors rule is slowly strangling the last gasps of breath from the rotting corpse, while the vultures pick over the last decent cuts of meat of the bone.

The football leagues amendment, is almost certain points penalty, if not worse. I cannot see the FL allowing the dilution of the CVA1 without severe penaltys. It really would send out the wrong message. The U-turn by Birch since the CVA meeting is sending the message to be prepared for the worst. Ultimately Chinny won't care about the points or what league they are in.

he will want the last prime ribeye off the bone, and ownership of the fat filled pipes.

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View From The Top

View From The Top

Posted
Posted
http://www.portsmouth.co.uk/sport/pompey/pompey-past/pompey-in-premier-league-keeper-hunt-1-3991406

 

Premiership goal keeper coming in on loan.

 

People ask me why I got rid of Ashdown, but we do expect to bring players in.....We are just not allowed at the moment............ :facepalm:

 

So his no1 keeper will be a kid.

 

L1 is going to be a brutal wake up call.

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Weston Super Saint

Weston Super Saint

Posted
Posted
those players have had an easy ride so far, wait until the training starts and they have to face the fans one to one. The pressure will be become intense and TB etc know that that pressure will become unbearable as it gets closer to the end. I have no doubt the players will give in as the hate campaign will become pretty fierce. I couldnt say it wouldnt be the same with us. Anyone around in the Branfoot days will know how awful fans can be and that was not about survival

 

Then I would expect some mysterious illnesses to appear from the players receiving the abuse from the few.

 

After all, even when they are 'sick' or have a mysterious muscle problem that means they can't play or train, they still get paid :D

 

It's not as if Pompey have the money to get scans done and prove the illness is a fake is it?

 

God bless reaping what you sow - I don't believe we've had that one yet...

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Under Weststand

Under Weststand

Posted
Posted
http://www.portsmouth.co.uk/sport/pompey/pompey-past/pompey-in-premier-league-keeper-hunt-1-3991406

 

Premiership goal keeper coming in on loan.

 

People ask me why I got rid of Ashdown, but we do expect to bring players in.....We are just not allowed at the moment............ :facepalm:

 

Even now they still don't get it!

Love this comment the FL are just holding out as Punishment :facepalm:

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toofarnorth

toofarnorth

Posted
Posted
What I find refreshing about the Rangers situation is that it seems the SFL clubs appear to want to stick strictly to the rules, under which Rangers newco will have to apply for a place in Div3.

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/18591278

 

Makes financial sense too though. If they start in division 3 they will inevitabley get promoted each year but all the leagues will benefit from incresaed attendances as they go up through them, whereas if they started in division 1 only the top division would benefit and likely only for one year.

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Joey-deacons-left-nut

Joey-deacons-left-nut

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Posted
There was a bit in the news yesterday about how Lumpitt had made his claim directly to the PFA. THe PFA have aslo claimed it will cost them 26 million if the club is liquidated, yet birch still insists they will get nothing if the club is liquidated. Am I missing something?.

 

NO , he's right, if the club is liquidated they WILL get NOTHING from the CLUB.

 

THey will get their money from the PP issued by the PL/FL.

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trousers

trousers

Posted
Posted (edited)
NO , he's right, if the club is liquidated they WILL get NOTHING from the CLUB.

 

THey will get their money from the PP issued by the PL/FL.

 

I've seen as many people state the opposite of what you've said there in your second sentence as I've seen agree with what you say. I don't think I've seen a definitive statement (from the PL/FL) that backs up either viewpoint.

 

Not having a go at you, just a general observation on various people's different interpretation of the situation.

Edited by trousers
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Verbal

Verbal

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Posted
http://www.newsnow.co.uk/A/584185677?-11209

 

Here we go Appys starting to moan about the size of his squad.

 

So on top of seeking guarantees that they they won't be punished for reneging on CVA1 and walking away from almost 100m of debt, they want to both constructively dismiss their high earners and browbeat the FL into allowing them to start racking up the debts on players again.

 

I wonder when the PFA and/or Football League are actually going to say something with the words 'moral integrity' in it?

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Gemmel

Gemmel

Posted
Posted

This is one of the more intelligent skates views of the premiership loan goal keeper and their general situation

 

Hopefully we can get Henderson back to FP on a loan, after all he's not likely to get 1st team experience with West Ham just yet. Jamo might be a good choice for a back-up, or even to start a few games in League 1, but he would have to be willing to commute to Pompey from Chudleigh (in Devon) again. As for Button, not thanks, he struggled at Argyle and won't ever amount to anything good. The football league should do what they can to help out, after all it was their "fit & proper person's test" that repeatedly failed us and allowed crooks to run our club into the ground. What's worse is that they docked us points for what was a result of their consecutive mistakes

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Weston Saint

Weston Saint

Posted
Posted
http://www.newsnow.co.uk/A/584185677?-11209

 

Here we go Appys starting to moan about the size of his squad.

 

FL - Will you be able to fulfill fixtures?

 

PFC - Yes

 

FL - What about Administration?

 

PFC - We have a CVA in principle

 

FL - Why only in principle?

 

PFC - Because it is dependent on high earners moving on without most of the money we owe them.

 

FL - Are they likely to take this route?

 

PFC - No signs so far

 

FL - So will you be able to fulfill your fixtures?

 

PFC - Good point, we do not know.

 

FL - Come back when you have some certainty and we will consider your prospect of cheating more players out of wages and the world out of more money and taxes.

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Frank's cousin

Frank's cousin

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Posted
I've seen as many people state the opposite of what you've said there in your second sentence as I've seen agree with what you say. I don't think I've seen a definitive statement (from the PL/FL) that backs up either viewpoint.

 

Not having a go at you, just a general observation on various people's different interpretation of the situation.

 

I think I read that if a club is left owing football creditors, then the league has the right to withold the regular payments and pay football creditors directly from these. I suspect this will include any PPs owed. I believe this is why the PFA lodged the 23mil claim for monies owed eg. the cost of resolving all contracts + deferred wages. This way its registered as footballing debt, and the league would pay this money direct if the players dont compromise (which they are currently being emotionally (or motionally ;-) blackmailed to do).

 

If Pompey do not agree to a football creditor repayment plan in full, then golden share is not going to ahppen - its why whichever way you look at Chinney will only buy IF teh players agree to compromise as if they hold out, PPs as well as league income will be auto diverted.... and he will not beabl eto get his hands on that.

 

It does beg the question, that if the players Do compromise, does this constitute a failure to pay all footballing creditors in full - as even though they have agreed to amend/cancel contracts, Pompey will have had a competitive advantage based on players contracts that ultimately were not honoured - this is perhaps why the FL insisted on the the golden share points clause being at their discretion. It would not be beyond the realms of possibilty that should players leave and Chinney take over, that the FL impose a penalty for these failed contracts and acceptance of this is conditional on them receiving their golden share... which would at least be some sort of correct moral punishment... will the FL have the moral balls to do what is RIGHT?

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pedg

pedg

Posted
Posted

http://www.portsmouth.co.uk/sport/pompey/pompey-past/trust-in-final-push-to-help-pompey-takeover-1-3992009

 

It says it has seen ‘an unprecedented number of pledges’ since launching a community buy-out scheme in March this year.

 

Given, as far as I am aware, there has never been a previous example of trying to take over a club in this way the term 'unprecedented' could be used even if only 1 person pledged. Obviously as they are still pleading for people to pledge it was not unprecedented enough!

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Gemmel

Gemmel

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Posted
It does beg the question' date=' that if the players Do compromise, does this constitute a failure to pay all footballing creditors in full - as even though they have agreed to amend/cancel contracts, Pompey will have had a competitive advantage based on players contracts that ultimately were not honoured - this is perhaps why the FL insisted on the the golden share points clause being at their discretion. It would not be beyond the realms of possibilty that should players leave and Chinney take over, that the FL impose a penalty for these failed contracts and acceptance of this is conditional on them receiving their golden share... which would at least be some sort of correct moral punishment... will the FL have the moral balls to do what is RIGHT?[/quote']

 

 

Frank, I think you may have hit the nail on the head. (I think your first point too has legs and that the league can redirect funds to football creditors).

 

pompey agree a compromise with the players wages - They break the football creditors rule, the only way to uphold that rule with any credibility would be too punish them with a points deduction. Almost makes perfect sense.

 

The rest of you are slacking, we should have been onto this two months ago.

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View From The Top

View From The Top

Posted
Posted (edited)
Frank, I think you may have hit the nail on the head. (I think your first point too has legs and that the league can redirect funds to football creditors).

 

pompey agree a compromise with the players wages - They break the football creditors rule, the only way to uphold that rule with any credibility would be too punish them with a points deduction. Almost makes perfect sense.

 

The rest of you are slacking, we should have been onto this two months ago.

 

If they fail to honour any agreement reached then it's a failure of the FCR but if the player chooses to compromise then it isn't.

 

However, the PFA could well argue that the players have been put in an untenable position and therefore should be paid in full.

Edited by View From The Top
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holepuncture

holepuncture

Posted
Posted

Been out the country for a little while. I have now caught up on the past eight pages...

 

WELCOME HOME CHINNY!

 

FL - Will you be able to fulfill fixtures?

 

PFC - Yes

 

FL - What about Administration?

 

PFC - We have a CVA in principle

 

FL - Why only in principle?

 

PFC - Because it is dependent on high earners moving on without most of the money we owe them.

 

FL - Are they likely to take this route?

 

PFC - No signs so far

 

FL - So will you be able to fulfill your fixtures?

 

PFC - Good point, we do not know.

 

FL - Come back when you have some certainty and we will consider your prospect of cheating more players out of wages and the world out of more money and taxes.

 

3647203516.jpg

 

Appy should take a lesson from our own Nige. A few years back a freshly promoted side Scunny came to St.Marys under Nigel with a total squad valuation of just £200k... they earned a 2-2 draw. I doubt Hartlepool will be bleating to the football league about being competitive, nor did we when we had to play our academy graduates and Vincent Pericard.

 

they are currently being emotionally (or motionally ;-) blackmailed to do).

 

If Pompey do not agree to a football creditor repayment plan in full, then golden share is not going to ahppen - its why whichever way you look at Chinney will only buy IF teh players agree to compromise as if they hold out, PPs as well as league income will be auto diverted.... and he will not beabl eto get his hands on that.

 

I recall a long long time ago in this beautiful saga chinny had suggested he would be able to soften his massive fixed and floating loan (which can be recalled at anytime he wishes) and run it more like a mortgage. Something along the lines of £1m P.A... plus (of course, the man is afterall a viscious loan shark) 24% interest!

 

If he cant dine and dash on the skates with the parachutes stuffed in his pocket, then perhaps he may like to revisit this option.

 

He could sit back and watch his money roll in each and every week like a nice little pension for him.

 

£25K per week to Chinny to gain access to the crumbling wreck

£6K per week to Gaddy to gain access to the car park which leads to access to Chinnys ground

 

Translates roughly to the same amount as the average squad cost per week in League 1.

 

The trust members could pledge a grand each to Chinny each and every year (+ 24%) to keep the rent off the books... although they are not used to accounting as we are well aware of!

 

Good to have you back Chinny

 

6ABB8170DAB46CE4756F3CB970AAAE.jpg

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Marsdinho

Marsdinho

Posted
Posted
And to be honest they would have a strong case. Yes their ages are extreme and excessive' date=' and diffifcult to justify, but the campaign that the club has been using, [b']motional [/b]blackmail and a very public level at that + you know what teh fan pressure and abuse will be like, is still discusting way to treat anyone. I would sue their arses for constructive... :x

 

3 times actually Frank, not that we're counting. ;)

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Frank's cousin

Frank's cousin

Posted
Posted
Woops, I must try harder to keep up....

 

I trying to build 5 laptops and read the last couple of days posts on here, not quite up to page 1304 yet.

 

Do not worry, my public shame is for all to share... maybe in punishment I should be forced to watch the 2008 cup final rerun... but surely even this forums rules are not that hideous?:blush::scared::lol:

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dvaughanwilliams

dvaughanwilliams

Posted
Posted
I think I read that if a club is left owing football creditors, then the league has the right to withold the regular payments and pay football creditors directly from these. I suspect this will include any PPs owed. I believe this is why the PFA lodged the 23mil claim for monies owed eg. the cost of resolving all contracts + deferred wages. This way its registered as footballing debt, and the league would pay this money direct if the players dont compromise (which they are currently being emotionally (or motionally ;-) blackmailed to do).

 

If Pompey do not agree to a football creditor repayment plan in full, then golden share is not going to happen - its why whichever way you look at Chinney will only buy IF the players agree to compromise as if they hold out, PPs as well as league income will be auto diverted.... and he will not be able to get his hands on that.

 

What you say is definitely true for a club that is a going concern. They have had PP's diverted to their football creditors during their administrations already. What is not known is what happens in a liquidation because it is a rare event, especially when the club involved is owed PPs. Also, the total amount owed is more than the PPs due. Would the shortfall get made up, if so by whom? As I remember things, previously the diverted money only went to clubs that were owed money, rather than players who were owed. Would clubs be prioritised in this instance? Players who have had wage payments missed have been offered loans from the PFA in the past, with the PFA then being Football Creditors of the club, I don't know what the PFA have offered to players of other clubs that have been liquidated.

 

It does beg the question' date=' that if the players Do compromise, does this constitute a failure to pay all footballing creditors in full - as even though they have agreed to amend/cancel contracts, Pompey will have had a competitive advantage based on players contracts that ultimately were not honoured - this is perhaps why the FL insisted on the the golden share points clause being at their discretion. It would not be beyond the realms of possibility that should players leave and Chinney take over, that the FL impose a penalty for these failed contracts and acceptance of this is conditional on them receiving their golden share... which would at least be some sort of correct moral punishment... will the FL have the moral balls to do what is RIGHT?[/quote']

 

In my view, no. Unless there is constructive dismissal or pressure applied to the player that is deemed unlawful. If the players compromise then it is no different to any other agreement where a player is released early from his contract in exchange for a percentage of his outstanding wages due.

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hutch

hutch

Posted
Posted
They appear to be keen to try and imply CVA2 is all done and dusted don't they?

In their terms, and using CVA1 as the model, they're right.

 

They have a CVA, they just don't have any money to pay it. But that's never stopped them before, has it?

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pedg

pedg

Posted
Posted
In their terms, and using CVA1 as the model, they're right.

 

They have a CVA, they just don't have any money to pay it. But that's never stopped them before, has it?

 

But they currently don't have a CVA. They have a group of creditors who have been agreed to the terms of a CVA but until Chinny pony's up the money they don't have CVA in place.

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