Pompey Takeover Saga

[Hockey_saint]

http://www.portsmouth.co.uk/sport/pompey/pompey-past/birch-meets-chainrai-to-discuss-club-s-future-1-3589121

 

Hidden in that article is the following line which makes me suspect that he probably doesn't actually have the money to "step in":

 

"It’s not a case of stepping in because the gap at the moment is too large and unknown in terms of what he’s signing up for"

[Truckasaurus]

After watching chinny on sky sports news i got the impression from his body language that he was not 100% interested in being involved with this awful club,far from it, he gave me lots of negatives which suggests this is a last ditched attempt to get some money back ( somehow ?) He looked like he was sat on a cactus.

[edprice1984]

I remember reading somewhere that the definition of an idiot is someone who repeats the same mistake over & over & over again, each time expecting a different outcome.

That is the definition of insanity, but I take your point. TCWTB is the definition of an idiot

[Gemmel]

Nobody walks away completely when there is 16 million cash in the mix.

 

Birch said the football creditors are 7 million, we know gaydamak is 2.5 secured and Chinny at 17 mill. The new CVA will amount to about 2p in the pound, so somewhere near 2 million.

 

Take chinny out of the loop for one second and that totals about 12 million......... leaving 4 miilion for chinny and a club to sell for ........10 million ish and bingo, he is all but there. But ..... he would have to fund the shortfall between now and when the transfer window opens, before he can sell any players or start collecting any season ticket money. Best guess would be that would cost around 4 million..... and apparently the Chinese, like a gamble.

 

Relegation, Points deductions, failed CVA's won't matter to chinny. It's cash that counts

[Foxstone]

Sorry if I've missed something in the many intervening pages, but was one of Birch's first commitments to the "pack the park thousands" that he would legally challenge Chinney's debenture?

 

I'm assuming that with Birch chatting to Chinney in such a manner, that Chinny's charge over the club is in fact all legal and above board and Birch has no chance of overturning it ?

[angelman]

It's very easy for Birch - ask Chin to deposit £20m (or whatever) into an ESCROW account for the future payments to run the club. Of course give back IF a buyer comes along etc. That way it would be plain to see where his intentions lie and given his past track record of not really having the clubs interests at heart, would be an appropriate course of action.

 

But, if he does come back, do you think he will honour his comments about paying sub £2500 people? Or did CSI do that?

[trousers]

PTS Caption Competition....

 

[eastleighhalo]

PTS Caption Competition....

 

 

if we are toast and you know it clap you hands !

[Corporate Ho]

I remember reading somewhere that the definition of an idiot is someone who repeats the same mistake over & over & over again, each time expecting a different outcome.

 

I though that was the motto of this messageboard?

[Winchester Red]

Ho Ho Ho

 

Anything constructive to add this morning?

[Hockey_saint]

I though that was the motto of this messageboard?

 

Funny, we assumed it was yours!

[Gemmel]

I though that was the motto of this messageboard?

 

That will be you then corpy........... making the same mistake oevr and over again;

 

Minted arabs, Chinese, russians Germans etc.

 

Chinny has no charge against fratton park

 

Snoras is a fantastic bank

 

New stadium coming soon

 

Training ground work started

[Torres]

"The new owner will make Abramovich look small fry."

[Lazlo78]

I though that was the motto of this messageboard?

 

You sure got us there. We keep expecting you to come back with informative answers for our questions, and look what happens time and again

[Wurzel]

PTS Caption Competition....

 

 

If any of you own football boots please can you bring them along to the next game

[trousers]

 

Mr. Potato Head: Oh, really? I'm from Playskool.

Rex: And I'm from Mattel. Well, I'm not really from Mattel, I'm actually from a smaller company that was purchased by Mattel in a leveraged buyout.

[holepuncture]

I reckon Chanrai will string them along and pull out at the last minute, making liquidation a certainty as nobody else will have time to come in.

 

Him and his gun-running mate can then sit on the land until it is ripe for development.

 

I just can't see him throwing his money away. He's playing a game.

 

Whatever his next move, its going to be great. Watching his interview on SSN he was grumpy and angry, however it was all fighting talk.

 

If anyone who has seen 'Underbelly' on FX (Aussie mafia style show), he reminds me of the loan shark on the show. He comes across as a hard businessman, flash, all the lingo, always looking to 'invest'... however default on this shark and he will destroy you. Dont turn on Chinny skates, he will ruin you, his position is secured and nothing will change that.

 

SSN saying that TB has been unable to agree a deal with BC

 

Not sure that this means much in the immediate term. They're both out to get the best deal possible so it would have been odd if they met for the first time and agreed on a deal straight away.

 

Could still happen, although I suspect BC will be keen to be able to say he tried and failed in order to oil the councils planning cogs for his supermarket application.

 

So, is it a game, or is he falling in love with the club again, again?

 

[Viking Warrior]

Chainrai told Sky Sports: ‘I will definitely make efforts to become a reluctant owner, again, until a proper owner can be found.

 

Is that an admission he is not a proper owner and never has been

[Foxstone]

I though that was the motto of this messageboard?

 

Morning Ho!

 

Will you welcome Chinny back as your one and only saviour ?

[Corporate Ho]

Meanwhile back at the ranch the corpse whore thinks Chinny is a "scumbag” and has failed (despite a couple requests by myself) to explain why he thinks that?

Without Chinny being on the scene the DFCSBs would have been toast some time ago and his actions since have all been about protecting his business arrangements in order to get his outlays back.

Maybe the corpse whore puts all the charities, builders and others who have invested their time and hope into the rotten to the core excuse of a tin pot football club in the same light as the "scumbag” for wanting protection /payments that are due to them? ...after all the principle is the same ... they want the money that is rightly theirs to have.

IMHO opinion "scumbag” Chinny is now their very last hope ...while he quite rightly states that those that have overseen the management of the stinking rotten football club have been at fault all along by not learning from many previous mistakes.

Quite why the label "scumbag " fits Chinny or anyone else that legitimately are owed shed loads of money by them purely because they want it is beyond me !

 

Failed to answer why I think Chainrai is a scumbag - that really is a genuine PMSL moment.

27/10/2010 (post 34,942): Saints fans have condemned Pompey fans for laying even part of the blame for our predicament but it's hard not to look at the way Chainrai’s taken over the club and not view it as a scam from start to finish. When Faraj initially tried to buy the club before Fahim the PL were informed that Chainrai was a backer, despite his statement that he'd had no involvement before his mystery loan last October.

 

Chainrai’s plan is to strip the club of whatever he can

27/10/2010 (post 34,949): We owe Chainrai £16m for a loan that one of his companies (Portpin) lent another of his companies (Falcondrone). Andronikou let slip in court that both companies are his. That money never reached the club but was funneled straight back to the BVI. So when Faraj "defaulted" on the "loan" Chainrai got the club. So if he's got the club why should we still owe him the £16m?

19/11/2010 (post 35,384): The whole thing was a con to allow Chainrai and Kushnir to take over with no outlay. The non-payment of the HMRC would therefore seem to have been deliberately orchestrated to push us into admin and allow their takeover with Andronikou's collusion.

23/01/12 (post 48,826): Like Chainrai ever cared anything about the club or did any sort of recruitment drive. We got Kitson and Lawrence because he didn't have to pay for them and didn't care what wages they were on because he wasn't paying. Why would he care? It's like when you lot keep banging on about him "getting his money back" when he never put a penny into PFC in the first place.

There’s at least a couple of dozen more examples but I’m assuming you might have got the gist of it by now. Just in case you haven’t, my belief is that Chainrai never did pay a £17m loan to al Faraj. He certainly never paid it to PFC. The money was paid from one BVI based company to another making it impossible to trace. If he has “invested” any money into PFC it was nowhere near £17m and whatever he put in he’s had it back and he’s now trying to squeeze even more out of it. The debenture he claims to hold on the ground should be legally taken away as the charge was applied 3 months after the sale of the club to CSI and no further investment was made that would make such a charge legally binding – even the judge at the recent administration hearing couldn’t understand why Andronikou had granted it.

Hope that clears things up

[St Jim]

PTS Caption Competition....

 

 

Voldermort: "Look, I can see the whole 'Pack the Park' crowd through my hands"

[Gemmel]

There’s at least a couple of dozen more examples but I’m assuming you might have got the gist of it by now. Just in case you haven’t, my belief is that Chainrai never did pay a £17m loan to al Faraj. He certainly never paid it to PFC. The money was paid from one BVI based company to another making it impossible to trace. If he has “invested” any money into PFC it was nowhere near £17m and whatever he put in he’s had it back and he’s now trying to squeeze even more out of it. The debenture he claims to hold on the ground should be legally taken away as the charge was applied 3 months after the sale of the club to CSI and no further investment was made that would make such a charge legally binding – even the judge at the recent administration hearing couldn’t understand why Andronikou had granted it.

 

Ok serious question corpy.

 

Someone on here posted the details from some record (Companies House- I think) of three money transfers from chinny to pfc - Do you dispute these?

As to taking away the debenture as it was three months after, that sounds very weak (He wouldn't have sold on tick without any sort of security) and Birch would love to rip up the debenture if he could..... but it looks as though he can't, which would suggest that it is genuine.

 

So if chinny could prove that he really did lend the money...... would you welcome him back?

[St Jim]

Nobody walks away completely when there is 16 million cash in the mix.

 

Birch said the football creditors are 7 million, we know gaydamak is 2.5 secured and Chinny at 17 mill. The new CVA will amount to about 2p in the pound, so somewhere near 2 million.

 

Take chinny out of the loop for one second and that totals about 12 million......... leaving 4 miilion for chinny and a club to sell for ........10 million ish and bingo, he is all but there. But ..... he would have to fund the shortfall between now and when the transfer window opens, before he can sell any players or start collecting any season ticket money. Best guess would be that would cost around 4 million..... and apparently the Chinese, like a gamble.

 

Relegation, Points deductions, failed CVA's won't matter to chinny. It's cash that counts

 

As I've mentioned before, that's on the assumption that a CVA gets approved which, the longer this goes on, I just can't see happening.

[eastleighhalo]

 

Failed to answer why I think Chainrai is a scumbag - that really is a genuine PMSL moment.

27/10/2010 (post 34,942): Saints fans have condemned Pompey fans for laying even part of the blame for our predicament but it's hard not to look at the way Chainrai’s taken over the club and not view it as a scam from start to finish. When Faraj initially tried to buy the club before Fahim the PL were informed that Chainrai was a backer, despite his statement that he'd had no involvement before his mystery loan last October.

 

Chainrai’s plan is to strip the club of whatever he can

27/10/2010 (post 34,949): We owe Chainrai £16m for a loan that one of his companies (Portpin) lent another of his companies (Falcondrone). Andronikou let slip in court that both companies are his. That money never reached the club but was funneled straight back to the BVI. So when Faraj "defaulted" on the "loan" Chainrai got the club. So if he's got the club why should we still owe him the £16m?

19/11/2010 (post 35,384): The whole thing was a con to allow Chainrai and Kushnir to take over with no outlay. The non-payment of the HMRC would therefore seem to have been deliberately orchestrated to push us into admin and allow their takeover with Andronikou's collusion.

23/01/12 (post 48,826): Like Chainrai ever cared anything about the club or did any sort of recruitment drive. We got Kitson and Lawrence because he didn't have to pay for them and didn't care what wages they were on because he wasn't paying. Why would he care? It's like when you lot keep banging on about him "getting his money back" when he never put a penny into PFC in the first place.

There’s at least a couple of dozen more examples but I’m assuming you might have got the gist of it by now. Just in case you haven’t, my belief is that Chainrai never did pay a £17m loan to al Faraj. He certainly never paid it to PFC. The money was paid from one BVI based company to another making it impossible to trace. If he has “invested” any money into PFC it was nowhere near £17m and whatever he put in he’s had it back and he’s now trying to squeeze even more out of it. The debenture he claims to hold on the ground should be legally taken away as the charge was applied 3 months after the sale of the club to CSI and no further investment was made that would make such a charge legally binding – even the judge at the recent administration hearing couldn’t understand why Andronikou had granted it.

Hope that clears things up

 

Oh dear so it your belief is it ? ...and we all know what else you choose to believe with your blinkered view of all things blue dont we?

 

Idiot

[St Jim]

I though that was the motto of this messageboard?

 

[Gemmel]

As I've mentioned before, that's on the assumption that a CVA gets approved which, the longer this goes on, I just can't see happening.

 

I agree with you St Jim, but it won't matter to chinny if it is approved or not. Sure that means more points deductions, but he just wants cash.

 

Actually the perfect scenario would be another 25 points deduction this season for the failed old CVA and then another 25 next season for not getting this new CVA approved...... that and selling all their players would gurantee league 2 football the season after next.

[Winchester Red]

You're in a grumpy mood this morning Ho

 

Didn't you have time for any toast before work?

[Gorgiesaint]

Not sure if I managed to post this view yesterday, so apologies if I've stated this before. Chainrai now appears to be the one and only potential saviour, if (and it is a big if) Chainrai takes over again, then the future of PFC will be in the phews hands.

 

When Lowe took control, we had a number of fans boycott the club and if the rumours are to be believed, the lack of support for Lowe undermined the financial position and we lost the confidence of the bank who then pulled the plug. The phew, if they continue to support the club, will be able to keep the wounded beast going for Chainrai's benefit as they'll probably slip to L1 and possibly L2 before he'll have extracted enough out of the carcass. Maybe if they're lucky, he may even allow a fans buy-out.

 

Alternatively, if they want to get back at Chainrai then they could boycott the club, screw him financially and force the liquidation so he loses money. Of course, they'll have to lose their club and go with plan B. Tough choice for them, do they continue to support the loan shark with the possibility of a continued slow death, or lose their club in the short term but get financial revenge on Chainrai? It will be an acid test of how many of them have actually learnt anything from the last few years.

 

Either way, it's going to be continued fun and enjoyment from our perspective.

 

Oh and talking of entertainment, Storrie-teller is on Talksport between 12 & 1 with Keys & Gray if anyone is interested.

[saintbletch]

PTS Caption Competition....

 

 

Appleton couldn't believe just how many fans had actually packed the park. He used his hands to frame the few so that he could better estimate the numbers. "Hmm, 83,", he thought. "a good turn out". But privately he concluded that either the park was much smaller than he had previously thought, or his understanding of the word 'pack' was wrong.

[trousers]

@pn_neil_allen: Appleton targeting loan striker signing before Reading visit. http://t.co/l5ELoEaZ #Pompey

 

Monday, March 5, 2012 at 10:32 AM

Gibraltar Pompey

Post 2-couldn't care less what Cov think. As LL said the other week, the players and fans have been punished enough. Time for the owners to get what's due to them. Pompey have sacrificed another high earner so why shouldn't they be able to loan a cheaper player, especially if the other club pay part if not all of his wages.

 

Edited 5 March, 2012 by trousers

[Lazlo78]

Any news in this: http://www1.skysports.com/football/news/11674/7568957/ ?

 

I think not...

[Panda]

@pn_neil_allen: Appleton targeting loan striker signing before Reading visit. http://t.co/l5ELoEaZ #Pompey

 

 

 

 

Appleton added: ‘Probably, some clubs won’t do business with us.

 

‘Their concern will be financial and whether we can actually pay for the players who are coming out of their club.

 

‘I can understand that in a way.’

 

[Lazlo78]

@pn_neil_allen: Appleton targeting loan striker signing before Reading visit. http://t.co/l5ELoEaZ #Pompey

 

 

 

 

But: you can't really fault Appy for trying. He's not hired to take care of law or economy - he's hired to win football matches and let people above him in the hierarchy try to strike a balance between sporting results and economy.

 

So obviously he HAS to try to get a striker in if the rules permit it. And if he manages to get in a striker, the blame should lie at Birch's feet I should think (plus at the rules)...

[sussexsaint]

PTS Caption Competition....

 

 

Lord Voldemorts Muggle repelling charms work on all but a few of the locals, leaving him with a small band of smelly police-cursing, heather selling, dog on a string gypsies who will join his Death Eaters

[ohwhenthesaints]

I bet he gets Simon Cox in.

[Sour Mash]

But: you can't really fault Appy for trying. He's not hired to take care of law or economy - he's hired to win football matches and let people above him in the hierarchy try to strike a balance between sporting results and economy.

 

So obviously he HAS to try to get a striker in if the rules permit it. And if he manages to get in a striker, the blame should lie at Birch's feet I should think (plus at the rules)...

Someone down there is currently negotiating some decent deals for them. Getting a loan fee from Cardiff, on top of them picking up all his wages is ridiculous considering the circumstances. On the basis that Lawrence was on £15k a week, if they got a loan striker in and were paying him £5k a week, they could still well argue that they had significantly cut costs. As you say, depends how Birch is going to play things I suppose and how many favours Appleton can wrangle from his contacts (West brom).

[rallyboy]

Wake up Media, let's not confuse 'deferred wages' with the term 'paycut' - two VERY different things.

Unless HMS Liquidator cruises past the Round Tower sometime soon...which is unlikely.

 

Though I can't see how they will get a new CVA agreed, those involved aren't as dim as the last lot, and AA isn't there to make up the figures.

 

And the only incentive, the parachute payments, are getting gobbled up everyday by deferred wages, the longer that goes on the less Chinny can trouser.

 

Imagine AA pulling the strings again?! - that would be insane, and I would then have some sympathy for the small sensible section of the fanbase.

 

But even taking the loan shark's debt out of the mix for a mo it still looks beyond salvation.

The club is tainted beyond repair.

 

As for sitting down with the elusive arms dealer and appealing to his caring side, Birch would be better off holding peace talks in the Gaza Strip.

No Avram, it's not a night club.

And no, we won't drive you there.

[Lazlo78]

And to add to my above post: the Pompey fans can't claim the same excuses for ignorance as Appy can. They have an obligation to look at the bigger picture and act correspondingly. Unfortunately most of the fans have chosen to focus entirely on the sporting results failing to understanding how that aspect is inseparable from the economical aspects...

[Winchester Red]

Someone down there is currently negotiating some decent deals for them. Getting a loan fee from Cardiff, on top of them picking up all his wages is ridiculous considering the circumstances. On the basis that Lawrence was on £15k a week, if they got a loan striker in and were paying him £5k a week, they could still well argue that they had significantly cut costs. As you say, depends how Birch is going to play things I suppose and how many favours Appleton can wrangle from his contacts (West brom).

 

 

Hmmmm - 3 month loan

 

Ok Trevor,

 

We'll pay all his wages, that's £200,000, and pay you a loan fee of £50,000

or

We'll pay half his wages, that's £100,000, and pay you a loan fee of £150,000

Which do you want to go for?

 

Just spin, that's all it is.

 

Cardiff will have paid what they wanted to pay. No more.

[Sour Mash]

Hmmmm - 3 month loan

 

Ok Trevor,

 

We'll pay all his wages, that's £200,000, and pay you a loan fee of £50,000

or

We'll pay half his wages, that's £100,000, and pay you a loan fee of £150,000

Which do you want to go for?

 

Just spin, that's all it is.

 

Cardiff will have paid what they wanted to pay. No more.

What are you on about? it's a great deal for the Skates considering the circumstances, they should be chuffed with that.

[Viking Warrior]

pompey in Line to borrow Rickie Lambert in time for the reading game. Appleton believes this will be the only way to get three points against reading.

[Gemmel]

Well let's hope that apply gets his man in time for tomorrow night.

 

This one will hurt them.....anything they can get up there will help us :)

[Saints foreva]

I bet he gets Simon Cox in.

 

That's what I reckon as well.

[hypochondriac]

If they get Simon cox it is ridiculous.

[St Jim]

bit of a dilemma for the phew tomorrow night. Beat Reading and they help save themselves from relegation (which in turn, if they do avoid relegation, makes them more attractive to buy) but at the same token assist our promotion push.

[Gingeletiss]

Hmmmm - 3 month loan

 

Ok Trevor,

 

We'll pay all his wages, that's £200,000, and pay you a loan fee of £50,000

or

We'll pay half his wages, that's £100,000, and pay you a loan fee of £150,000

Which do you want to go for?

 

Just spin, that's all it is.

 

Cardiff will have paid what they wanted to pay. No more.

 

Thing is, the only people claiming all his wages are being paid, are Skates (and a few on here). I have seen no official confirmation of this............link anyone!!

[Sour Mash]

Thing is, the only people claiming all his wages are being paid, are Skates (and a few on here). I have seen no official confirmation of this............link anyone!!

I could be wrong, but I'm pretty sure Birch said it. Can't see him lying outright like that.

[Gruffalo]

Peter Storrie coming up on TalkSport with Keys & Gray this afternoon - 12:30-13:00.

[Gruffalo]

Peter Storrie coming up on TalkSport with Keys & Gray this afternoon - 12:30-13:00.

 

Actually started now..

[The9]

I bet he gets Simon Cox in.

 

FL Rule 52.3.2 http://www.football-league.co.uk/regulations/20110629/section-6-players_2293633_2125731#50 indicates that a club may only have 4 players on loan (of any type) from any one other club in a season, though you can add a youth loan to that total.

 

By my reckoning they've had Thorne (twice), Mattock, and Allan, all from West Brom.

 

So does "players" mean that you can loan one player multiple times and it only counts once, or does it mean they've had their 4 from West Brom already ?

 

There's another rule about only having 2 over 23s from the same club on a "Standard Loan" but that's irrelevant as Standard Loans are half or full-season ones agreed inside the Transfer Window, and they can't have any more of those anyway as the transfer window has closed.