Jump to content

Pompey Takeover Saga

Fitzhugh Fella

By Fitzhugh Fella,
in Golden Posts

 Share

Recommended Posts

Torres

Torres

Posted
Posted

My tuppence-worth for the morning:

 

1: The player wage deferral doesn’t help them any in the long term, it’s merely a device the see them lurch to the end of the season and to cover Birch’s ass financially, otherwise it could be him paying their wages. Come the end of the season, those players will expect to be and probably will be paid in full, from parachute payments received. This though, assumes that the club is not liquidated beforehand, in which case there won’t be any parachute payments. Would the PL pay the outstanding football debts using this money anyway, or keep it for themselves? It also assumes that there’s no judgement against the Football Creditors Rule before the summer. If I was one of the players I’d be thinking long and hard about my chances of ever actually seeing those wages.

 

2: A slight change of perspective for the Football League to consider. Pompey have already blown off a whole load of debt, for which they got a 9 point deduction which made no difference to their relegation. If they pull this off again, they’ve blown off a whole load more debt in return for 1 0 point deduction which may, again, have no material effect on their league status. The Football League will argue that they have punished PFC in accordance with their rules.

 

However, leaving aside whether PFC have been punished for their despicable behaviour, what precedent does it set for other clubs? Where’s the deterrent to other clubs taking similar cavalier approaches to finance and debt? Don’t the Football League, the Premier League and the FA have a duty of care to the professional game in this country to take all reasonable steps to protect clubs from themselves? If Pompey fans argue that “it’s not our fault, we’ve been pardewed by a succession of dodgy owners” well, all well and fine.

 

Don’t the stewards of the game have an obligation to protect clubs from that happening to other clubs? Unless they take more action against Pompey, they’re saying to other sharks “come into our game, bleed our clubs dry, leave their corpses to die if you like, the worst we’ll do is give you a tiny points deduction that you probably won’t notice”. Regardless of the clubs involved, that’s just not acceptable from the authorities. Whether they hit Pompey again to send a clear message or tighten their rules doesn’t really matter (well…) but they must do something…

Link to comment
Share on other sites
dronskisaint

dronskisaint

Posted
Posted
I am quite sure the Pompey Twit(ter) post is incorrect, the PP follow the club not the legal entity. By that logic they will have their FA Cup removed. That said it is quite funny seeing them get bent out of shape by it!

 

AA had £800k of their money presumably when bank accounts frozen, fishy?

 

In respect of Chinny's debenture I am sure Guided Missile posted about 700 pages ago how Jacobs or Azougy (God I miss those guys) screwed up the debenture or charge on a technicality, Birch might just want to google this thread for his loophole to shaft the loan shark.

 

PKF talking about two months and talking to Football League about plan B. This really is sounding like a Doors track for them.In other news BBC's Matt Slater references and acknowledges the good work of the PTS gang.

 

Other than they don't have any beautiful friends:D

Link to comment
Share on other sites
FarehamRed

FarehamRed

Posted
Posted
My tuppence-worth for the morning:

 

A slight change of perspective for the Football League to consider. Pompey have already blown off a whole load of debt, for which they got a 9 point deduction which made no difference to their relegation. If they pull this off again, they’ve blown off a whole load more debt in return for 1 0 point deduction which may, again, have no material effect on their league status. The Football League will argue that they have punished PFC in accordance with their rules.

 

However, leaving aside whether PFC have been punished for their despicable behaviour, what precedent does it set for other clubs?

 

I don't know, but presumably the new "Financial fair Play" rules, that (I think) come in next season are aimed at stopping clubs like P*mpey cheating?

Link to comment
Share on other sites
positivepete

positivepete

Posted
Posted
My tuppence-worth for the morning:

 

1: The player wage deferral doesn’t help them any in the long term, it’s merely a device the see them lurch to the end of the season and to cover Birch’s ass financially, otherwise it could be him paying their wages. Come the end of the season, those players will expect to be and probably will be paid in full, from parachute payments received. This though, assumes that the club is not liquidated beforehand, in which case there won’t be any parachute payments. Would the PL pay the outstanding football debts using this money anyway, or keep it for themselves? It also assumes that there’s no judgement against the Football Creditors Rule before the summer. If I was one of the players I’d be thinking long and hard about my chances of ever actually seeing those wages.

 

2: A slight change of perspective for the Football League to consider. Pompey have already blown off a whole load of debt, for which they got a 9 point deduction which made no difference to their relegation. If they pull this off again, they’ve blown off a whole load more debt in return for 1 0 point deduction which may, again, have no material effect on their league status. The Football League will argue that they have punished PFC in accordance with their rules.

 

However, leaving aside whether PFC have been punished for their despicable behaviour, what precedent does it set for other clubs? Where’s the deterrent to other clubs taking similar cavalier approaches to finance and debt? Don’t the Football League, the Premier League and the FA have a duty of care to the professional game in this country to take all reasonable steps to protect clubs from themselves? If Pompey fans argue that “it’s not our fault, we’ve been pardewed by a succession of dodgy owners” well, all well and fine.

 

Don’t the stewards of the game have an obligation to protect clubs from that happening to other clubs? Unless they take more action against Pompey, they’re saying to other sharks “come into our game, bleed our clubs dry, leave their corpses to die if you like, the worst we’ll do is give you a tiny points deduction that you probably won’t notice”. Regardless of the clubs involved, that’s just not acceptable from the authorities. Whether they hit Pompey again to send a clear message or tighten their rules doesn’t really matter (well…) but they must do something…

 

As you say, this just passes the problem to the new owners, who to get their golden share, will have to settle the football debts. So although the club may sell for a nominal pound, the cost of entering the league is growing by the outstanding wage bill each month.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Wurzel

Wurzel

Posted
Posted

Don't know if I'm alone but for me the Pompey rivalry is now just a minor detail in this saga. It's better than any soap on tv, with new twists and turns every day. Company law, financial rules, football regulations, evil foreigners, courtroom drama, political interventions, celebrity endorsements (well Matt Slater ;)), regular characters, cameo appearances, comedy, sympathy, even genuine sadness at times (ok those bits are few and far between) It's even got product placement (Barbie dolls and mobility scooters) I think I'd be following it on a daily basis even if it was about Rangers, Plymouth or anyone else come to that.

 

And like any good mystery story nobody can be quite sure how it's going to end. Gonna miss it when it does though.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Ken Tone

Ken Tone

Posted
Posted
Don't know if I'm alone but for me the Pompey rivalry is now just a minor detail in this saga. It's better than any soap on tv, with new twists and turns every day. Company law, financial rules, football regulations, evil foreigners, courtroom drama, political interventions, celebrity endorsements (well Matt Slater ;)), regular characters, cameo appearances, comedy, sympathy, even genuine sadness at times (ok those bits are few and far between) It's even got product placement (Barbie dolls and mobility scooters) I think I'd be following it on a daily basis even if it was about Rangers, Plymouth or anyone else come to that.

 

And like any good mystery story nobody can be quite sure how it's going to end. Gonna miss it when it does though.

 

 

and no advert breaks!

Link to comment
Share on other sites
benjii

benjii

Posted
Posted

Regarding the previous CVA:

 

The Football League has a rule requiring clubs to exit administration with a CVA or face a big additional points deduction (or in extremis the revocation of their "golden share"). There must be some underlying assumption here that the club will actually meet their obligations under such a CVA, otherwise the rule is entirely hollow. If a club subsequently restructures its CVA debts (either reducing them or materially delaying them) doesn't it follow that they ought to receive an additional points penalty commensurate with the materiality of the alteration of the CVA liabilities?

 

I have emailed the Football League to ask this question. You don't even need to mention Pompey to ask it.

 

I suggest that others do the same.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Gemmel

Gemmel

Posted
Posted

The questions and rumours about stopping or suspending parachute payments, are (IMHO) surely to do with the CVA and Baker Tilley. My best guess would be that in the same way the footballing debts were paid directly by the FL from the parachute payments to the creditors, the same is happening with the CVA money, which is probably now pretty much like for like (Outstanding pp vs 17 milliion CVA debt for unsecured creditors)

 

In any event if that is not correct, Birch has already stated the old one will be repleaced by a new one. Which by deafult means the club didn't honor the terms of the orginal CVA (Unless they offer more - fat chance of that) which would incur a points penalty.

 

We need Clapham Saint on here.....

 

Someone posted that when the terms of the CVA are not met or sort for renegociation, the old CVA is scrapped and the debt reverts back to what it orginally was.

Can anyone confirm that?

 

My best guesstimate at this point in time.... Pompey will be run and owned by the supporters trust, starting in the conference next season.........so not quite toast, but ever so slightly browned.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
JackFrost

JackFrost

Posted
Posted
Just stuff from the meeting last night but grim reality on BBC front page.

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/17137954

 

Interesting comments from Birch

 

"The Football League will not let us bring any players in and they don't want us to have a competitive advantage when we still owe clubs money.

"If we have less than 14 fit players then they will allow us to bring someone in."

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Gingeletiss

Gingeletiss

Posted
Posted (edited)

10

DL Leeds both toast

Thursday, February 23, 2012 at 09:25 AM

More likely MA has blessed it and he has a player coming in on loan and we got 500k from Brum as a deposit cash, cash we need, one in one out and 500k now and 1.5mill in May! Sounds good business. and knowing Appy, he has a player same if not better and more versatile coming in!

 

http://www.portsmouth.co.uk/sport/pompey/pompey-past/pompey_favourite_to_join_birmingham_1_3550529?commentssort=1

 

 

Um!!!! so a loan , with a buy clause.......transfer embargo my ar se!!

 

24

Ssblue

Thursday, February 23, 2012 at 09:32 AM

hopefully we'll get a current Prem Player on loan.....and get his wages paid for as long as we play him in every game :) could this even be a good thing??

Edited by Gingeletiss
Link to comment
Share on other sites
Gemmel

Gemmel

Posted
Posted

Antonov is offering (On facebook) to wipe the 10 million CSI debt to zero, if it helps the club survive.

 

Can anyone who uses facebook, let him know, that he has no say in the matter and CSI is now owned 100% by UHY...... Of which one of their employees, may not be so keen to help pompey at the moment

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Gingeletiss

Gingeletiss

Posted
Posted

Loving this guy, he has been giving them some stick!!

 

 

135

hiddenhedgeender

Thursday, February 23, 2012 at 11:29 AM

Calmed down yet? I just asked a few questions my "most" passionate deluded friends. If it hadn't come from a Southampton Company Union Men (sic) subscriber then maybe you wouldn't get in such a kerfuffle. Just pointing out what Saints fans have known for years and the rest of football is now realised. Your replies have gone from the sublime to the ridiculous. I don't care about you. I've never been involved in the hooliganism that plights football and the derby games between our clubs. I've never seen you as a threat in football terms until your fairly recent 'successful' period. I'm completely ambivalent to your plight but the attitude of some of your fans is laughable. I'm just a good Samaritan Saint trying to help you through the trials and tribulations of life as a modern day football fan. I have attained inner peace. I wish all of you the same. Are you all 100% positive that no P£mpey fans sang "One Peter Storrie....." at Wembley?

Link to comment
Share on other sites
trousers

trousers

Posted
Posted
Antonov is offering (On facebook) to wipe the 10 million CSI debt to zero, if it helps the club survive.

 

Can anyone who uses facebook, let him know, that he has no say in the matter and CSI is now owned 100% by UHY...... Of which one of their employees, may not be so keen to help pompey at the moment

 

157247_100002045545893_2069963014_q.jpgVladimir Antonov

Tuesday near London, England

This people just robbed me and my family! And i'm going to prove it! If i'll get a compensation from them after legal battle i'll invest to Pompey again! One way or another! Anyway Pompey in my heart forever! PUP!

 

157247_100002045545893_2069963014_q.jpgVladimir Antonov

Tuesday near London, England

Guys! If CSI creditors is a problem for PFC future, i can assure you that all of them will sign full write off their debt to ZERO to save our club. We never were a problem! We did our best to perform better! If you all think that we were a problem then my apologise to all and we are fully ready to convert our debt to an equity with ZERO financial interest! I can promise it as a biggest creditor to CSI! Play UP POMPEY!

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Shufty Zubrik

Shufty Zubrik

Posted
Posted
157247_100002045545893_2069963014_q.jpgVladimir Antonov

Tuesday near London, England

This people just robbed me and my family! And i'm going to prove it! If i'll get a compensation from them after legal battle i'll invest to Pompey again! One way or another! Anyway Pompey in my heart forever! PUP!

 

157247_100002045545893_2069963014_q.jpgVladimir Antonov

Tuesday near London, England

Guys! If CSI creditors is a problem for PFC future, i can assure you that all of them will sign full write off their debt to ZERO to save our club. We never were a problem! We did our best to perform better! If you all think that we were a problem then my apologise to all and we are fully ready to convert our debt to an equity with ZERO financial interest! I can promise it as a biggest creditor to CSI! Play UP POMPEY!

 

See how easy it is to give money away when it has been thieved it in the first place. Thanks for offfering to give away the life savings of pensioners in Lithuania. Grand gesture.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Langleysaint

Langleysaint

Posted
Posted

He really is getting them biting, excellent work,

Loving this guy, he has been giving them some stick!!

 

 

135

hiddenhedgeender

Thursday, February 23, 2012 at 11:29 AM

Calmed down yet? I just asked a few questions my "most" passionate deluded friends. If it hadn't come from a Southampton Company Union Men (sic) subscriber then maybe you wouldn't get in such a kerfuffle. Just pointing out what Saints fans have known for years and the rest of football is now realised. Your replies have gone from the sublime to the ridiculous. I don't care about you. I've never been involved in the hooliganism that plights football and the derby games between our clubs. I've never seen you as a threat in football terms until your fairly recent 'successful' period. I'm completely ambivalent to your plight but the attitude of some of your fans is laughable. I'm just a good Samaritan Saint trying to help you through the trials and tribulations of life as a modern day football fan. I have attained inner peace. I wish all of you the same. Are you all 100% positive that no P£mpey fans sang "One Peter Storrie....." at Wembley?

Link to comment
Share on other sites
dubai_phil

dubai_phil

Posted
Posted
I just love the way that the thicker end of the blue phew are going mental about Erick the Viking being loaned out and still claiming that they need to bring better play players in. They really don't get Birch's 6-week warning.

 

BUT

 

They are getting in the loans with the parent club paying wages. Sure they have the costs of hotels/food/transport etc, but each one who goes out saves them between 10 & 15k a week.

 

Plenty of decent PL players out there in need of a game. The more they bring in the merrier IMHO....

 

Because as we all know, new players take time to bed into a team and style of play. The more they bring in the longer it will take them to "Gel" (we had that argument ourselves in the Burley days)

 

I mean. let's face it our super duper PL star on loan has made an enormous difference to our team hasn't he? :rolleyes:

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Truckasaurus

Truckasaurus

Posted
Posted

I was sure cheats FC were going to be liquidated,i was thinking from my limited nolligde they were history, then they went into admin aaahhh!!! B*****ks they got away with it (for a bit). Then the tacks man gets his way with the admin chappy,things are looking up again.Now all the stuff coming out of the hole over on the dark side makes me think cheats FC are doomed (again) There is too much money owed (£46million)

 

I think the fat lady has just picked up the mike

 

Hoorah for the fat lady.

 

What da ya reckon she will sing ?

Link to comment
Share on other sites
rallyboy

rallyboy

Posted
Posted

It's gonna be that Cher classic methinks...

 

 

Vlad the Embezzler isn't even offering to give the stolen money away, he wants to convert it into equity should Mr Birch manage to save the business.

So my pompey friends, I help bigtime, play up the team! Pack the arena! and if this new bloke manages to offload some of the other debts, count me back in! If I'm not in jail

 

There's nowt as generous as those who make a living through organised crime.

Accept maybe loan sharks, and their little puppet helpers who keep back £200K for expenses.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Ken Tone

Ken Tone

Posted
Posted
Interesting comments from Birch

 

"The Football League will not let us bring any players in and they don't want us to have a competitive advantage when we still owe clubs money.

"If we have less than 14 fit players then they will allow us to bring someone in."

 

Which is why Appleton won't play any youngsters, because if he does they count as first team squad memebrs and count towards the 14. Even now they are still cheating ..or at least manipulating the rules.

Birch presumably will be quite happy if he gets rid of Huseklepp's wages and Appleton manages to con a mate into lending him another player almost for free, especially if that helps them stay in the championship and therefore be a little more saleable.

 

Mind you even if the FL is caught by its own policies over this, they ought to only allow an emergency loan until PFC's other players return to fitness, so they clock up 14 anyway. Cue many lingering 'injuries' that mysteriously won't clear up.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
miserableoldgit

miserableoldgit

Posted
Posted
I was sure cheats FC were going to be liquidated,i was thinking from my limited nolligde they were history, then they went into admin aaahhh!!! B*****ks they got away with it (for a bit). Then the tacks man gets his way with the admin chappy,things are looking up again.Now all the stuff coming out of the hole over on the dark side makes me think cheats FC are doomed (again) There is too much money owed (£46million)

 

I think the fat lady has just picked up the mike

 

Hoorah for the fat lady.

 

What da ya reckon she will sing ?

Do you attend the Mackrill "School of English"?;)

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Foxstone

Foxstone

Posted
Posted
Which is why Appleton won't play any youngsters, because if he does they count as first team squad memebrs and count towards the 14. Even now they are still cheating ..or at least manipulating the rules.

Birch presumably will be quite happy if he gets rid of Huseklepp's wages and Appleton manages to con a mate into lending him another player almost for free, especially if that helps them stay in the championship and therefore be a little more saleable.

 

Mind you even if the FL is caught by its own policies over this, they ought to only allow an emergency loan until PFC's other players return to fitness, so they clock up 14 anyway. Cue many lingering 'injuries' that mysteriously won't clear up.

 

In fairness to the phew they can't afford a band aid plaster let alone a calf scan, so the treatment room will look more like a knackers yard than a football re-hab centre....

 

But perhaps just another symptom of 7 years in the prem with no infrastructure !

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Scummer

Scummer

Posted
Posted
So Reading don't think that they will get paid by Poopey so choose to get the money in themselves and then give them their cut afterwards.

 

All their bookings for coach travel are going directly through Lucketts as well, no-one trusts Pompey to pass on any money owed to them.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
stevegrant

stevegrant

Posted
Posted
So Reading don't think that they will get paid by Poopey so choose to get the money in themselves and then give them their cut afterwards.

I particularly liked the bit of the article where the writer was clearly distracted and thought their fingers were in the right place on the keyboard but ****ed it up :lol:

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Wurzel

Wurzel

Posted
Posted
So Reading don't think that they will get paid by Poopey so choose to get the money in themselves and then give them their cut afterwards.

They don't get a cut do they? Think it's only cup games H&A share the receipts, league matches it all goes to home club.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
holepuncture

holepuncture

Posted
Posted

A couple of days away and the PTS train roars on relentlessly! Its been a fantastic couple of days it appears, I anticipated some action after a nice little snippet in the metro this morning (no cash in 2 months, players to defer)... but it get even better on here.

 

Im gutted I missed the webchat, looked a real chuckle-athon

 

It appears the FL has finally woken up.

 

Absolutely and I think a big pat on the back to all of those who lobbyed the FL to condem the skates, that pressure would not have gone unnoticed - hats off to all involved, you have done this country, its national sport and most importantly yourselves - Proud.

 

But our work is not over, we must challenge every attempt pompey make at blatant cheating, it is our duty on behalf of the deluded bestests.

 

Just stuff from the meeting last night but grim reality on BBC front page.

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/17137954

 

With regret, I would like to say thankyou and goodbye to David Lampitt, a Saints legend right up their with Peter Storrie and Stevie Cotterill. His outstanding PR and spin, combined with the utterly insane quality over quantity has made such an important contribution to the current plight - and PMSL for not having the (Former FA Head of)Integrity and honour to resign.

 

My sympathies to the normal skate staff who are suffering as a result of the shambolic and criminal activity going on above them.

 

Im looking forward to Balram and Sashas next moves, that should be tasty. It would be funny to see them rock up in a lorry with henchmen and start ripping computers off the walls, taking all the stock from the shop, removing any machinery etc - when the latest debt default rolls in.

 

Not sure how TB will screw over the viscious loan sharks debenture, which has been validated in various legally codified documents and UK courtrooms.

 

 

Ive said it before and il say it again, Moneyfields.

 

Moneyfieldsbigcrowd.jpg

 

Moneyfieldstrain.jpg

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Tamesaint

Tamesaint

Posted
Posted
Regarding the previous CVA:

 

The Football League has a rule requiring clubs to exit administration with a CVA or face a big additional points deduction (or in extremis the revocation of their "golden share"). There must be some underlying assumption here that the club will actually meet their obligations under such a CVA, otherwise the rule is entirely hollow. If a club subsequently restructures its CVA debts (either reducing them or materially delaying them) doesn't it follow that they ought to receive an additional points penalty commensurate with the materiality of the alteration of the CVA liabilities?

 

I have emailed the Football League to ask this question. You don't even need to mention Pompey to ask it.

 

I suggest that others do the same.

 

I think you have hit the nail on the head. Surely not honouring a CVA is the same as not having one in the first place? If you exit admin without a CVA you get a 15 point penalty - and this is exactly what the cheats should have for not paying a penny to the old CVA.

 

Plus perhaps another 2 points for a second administration (a la Bournemouth). This also forgets the administration a few years ago.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
JackFrost

JackFrost

Posted
Posted
A couple of days away and the PTS train roars on relentlessly! Its been a fantastic couple of days it appears, I anticipated some action after a nice little snippet in the metro this morning (no cash in 2 months, players to defer)... but it get even better on here.

 

Im gutted I missed the webchat, looked a real chuckle-athon

 

 

 

Absolutely and I think a big pat on the back to all of those who lobbyed the FL to condem the skates, that pressure would not have gone unnoticed - hats off to all involved, you have done this country, its national sport and most importantly yourselves - Proud.

 

But our work is not over, we must challenge every attempt pompey make at blatant cheating, it is our duty on behalf of the deluded bestests.

 

 

 

With regret, I would like to say thankyou and goodbye to David Lampitt, a Saints legend right up their with Peter Storrie and Stevie Cotterill. His outstanding PR and spin, combined with the utterly insane quality over quantity has made such an important contribution to the current plight - and PMSL for not having the (Former FA Head of)Integrity and honour to resign.

 

My sympathies to the normal skate staff who are suffering as a result of the shambolic and criminal activity going on above them.

 

Im looking forward to Balram and Sashas next moves, that should be tasty. It would be funny to see them rock up in a lorry with henchmen and start ripping computers off the walls, taking all the stock from the shop, removing any machinery etc - when the latest debt default rolls in.

 

Not sure how TB will screw over the viscious loan sharks debenture, which has been validated in various legally codified documents and UK courtrooms.

 

 

Ive said it before and il say it again, Moneyfields.

 

Moneyfieldsbigcrowd.jpg

 

Moneyfieldstrain.jpg

 

My favourite is the image with the chair ;)

Link to comment
Share on other sites
 Share
Go to topic listing
×
×
  • Create New...