trousers Posted 3 July, 2009 Posted 3 July, 2009 http://www.dailyecho.co.uk/sport/4472854.Pinnacle_back_in_contention_for_Saints/ "THE mystery overseas consortium’s hopes of completing a takeover at St Mary’s yesterday were stunned by the Pinnacle group’s return to the scene. The worldwide financial services group were initially confident of announcing a deal had been completed after their lawyers had spent two days negotiating with administrator Mark Fry and creditors." Sorry for another thread, but if I'm reading this correctly the 'new' overseas group were on the verge of a takeover yesterday tea-time but Pinnacle have somehow scuppered it...? How? WFT is going on?
gonzo Posted 3 July, 2009 Posted 3 July, 2009 Personally, I wish Pinnacle would bugger off. All the signs say their bid was a sham.
The9 Posted 3 July, 2009 Posted 3 July, 2009 Just seems to say to me that they were going about their taking-over business and found it mildly bemusing that a party that had withdrawn still believed they were in with a chance. I don't think it would impact on the bid/offer/negotiations etc one little bit.
Nineteen Canteen Posted 3 July, 2009 Posted 3 July, 2009 http://www.dailyecho.co.uk/sport/4472854.Pinnacle_back_in_contention_for_Saints/ "THE mystery overseas consortium’s hopes of completing a takeover at St Mary’s yesterday were stunned by the Pinnacle group’s return to the scene. The worldwide financial services group were initially confident of announcing a deal had been completed after their lawyers had spent two days negotiating with administrator Mark Fry and creditors." Sorry for another thread, but if I'm reading this correctly the 'new' overseas group were on the verge of a takeover yesterday tea-time but Pinnacle have somehow scuppered it...? How? WFT is going on? I must admit that was my interpretation and made comment to that effect on another thread. You say scupper some may say sabotage or the work of jokers and dreamers and as Gonzo suggested out to try and salvage their reputations before the club itself is saved. Only Pinnacle know and I have long since given up in trying to understand their logic.
Doctoroncall Posted 3 July, 2009 Posted 3 July, 2009 as you say Mr T... WTF is going on? surely it's now a race to see who crosses on the line first?
saint_stevo Posted 3 July, 2009 Posted 3 July, 2009 Just finished reading that and thought- so what? If your about to announce a deal, and someone comes else return to the table, surely that doesn't matter?
Toadhall Saint Posted 3 July, 2009 Posted 3 July, 2009 http://www.dailyecho.co.uk/sport/4472854.Pinnacle_back_in_contention_for_Saints/ "THE mystery overseas consortium’s hopes of completing a takeover at St Mary’s yesterday were stunned by the Pinnacle group’s return to the scene. The worldwide financial services group were initially confident of announcing a deal had been completed after their lawyers had spent two days negotiating with administrator Mark Fry and creditors." Sorry for another thread, but if I'm reading this correctly the 'new' overseas group were on the verge of a takeover yesterday tea-time but Pinnacle have somehow scuppered it...? How? WFT is going on? Not sure TBH if Pinnacle could of scuppered anything unless they say we'll pay X Million more than this other group - I think Mr Fry would have got the deal done with the other group.
Puddings and Monkeys Posted 3 July, 2009 Posted 3 July, 2009 http://www.dailyecho.co.uk/sport/4472854.Pinnacle_back_in_contention_for_Saints/ "THE mystery overseas consortium’s hopes of completing a takeover at St Mary’s yesterday were stunned by the Pinnacle group’s return to the scene. The worldwide financial services group were initially confident of announcing a deal had been completed after their lawyers had spent two days negotiating with administrator Mark Fry and creditors." Sorry for another thread, but if I'm reading this correctly the 'new' overseas group were on the verge of a takeover yesterday tea-time but Pinnacle have somehow scuppered it...? How? WFT is going on? How could they scupper someone else's bid? I thought it was a case of first past the post now?
Nineteen Canteen Posted 3 July, 2009 Posted 3 July, 2009 Just seems to say to me that they were going about their taking-over business and found it mildly bemusing that a party that had withdrawn still believed they were in with a chance. I don't think it would impact on the bid/offer/negotiations etc one little bit. It would if Fry took it seriously who then used Pinnacle's bid to ramp up the price or put pressure on the new consortium that actually didn't exist. Lets face it i will be amazed if the consortium haven't managed some kind of discount on the Pinnacle deal.
aberdare Posted 3 July, 2009 Posted 3 July, 2009 Just finished reading that and thought- so what? If your about to announce a deal, and someone comes else return to the table, surely that doesn't matter? Unless Pinnacle suggested to the Administrator they would pay more money and claimed they could prove it, in which case Fry would be pretty much duty bound to have a look at it.
Nineteen Canteen Posted 3 July, 2009 Posted 3 July, 2009 Unless Pinnacle suggested to the Administrator they would pay more money and claimed they could prove it, in which case Fry would be pretty much duty bound to have a look at it. Exactly
The9 Posted 3 July, 2009 Posted 3 July, 2009 How could they scupper someone else's bid? I thought it was a case of first past the post now? Exactly. It is. There's been no "scuppering" going on, it doesn't even say what the consortium's reaction was, only that they were "initially" confident which implies (with no supporting evidence) that it was not the case at the end of the day. They are probably still just as confident of announcing a deal. Who knows, but there's nothing in that that tells me categorically that Pinnacle's intervention made any difference at all ?
Weston Super Saint Posted 3 July, 2009 Posted 3 July, 2009 Not sure TBH if Pinnacle could of scuppered anything unless they say we'll pay X Million more than this other group - I think Mr Fry would have got the deal done with the other group. I think even if they announced something like that, Fry would still have done the deal with the other group
saint_stevo Posted 3 July, 2009 Posted 3 July, 2009 Unless Pinnacle suggested to the Administrator they would pay more money and claimed they could prove it, in which case Fry would be pretty much duty bound to have a look at it. Guessing if they were deep into negotiations they would have a contract with Fry, so even if Donald Trump came along and offered 17billion dollars it would not matter
The9 Posted 3 July, 2009 Posted 3 July, 2009 It would if Fry took it seriously who then used Pinnacle's bid to ramp up the price or put pressure on the new consortium that actually didn't exist. Lets face it i will be amazed if the consortium haven't managed some kind of discount on the Pinnacle deal. Yes, but there's no evidence of that other than the word "initially", it's quite the leap of faith (especially from Fry).
saint_stevo Posted 3 July, 2009 Posted 3 July, 2009 I think even if they announced something like that, Fry would still have done the deal with the other group Guess you heard the 'Fry delayed the swiss exclusivity money agreement to let Pinnacle in' Rumour?
The9 Posted 3 July, 2009 Posted 3 July, 2009 Guessing if they were deep into negotiations they would have a contract with Fry, so even if Donald Trump came along and offered 17billion dollars it would not matter He'd only sell us to Vince McMahon for 34 billion dollars as soon as he took over anyway. Little WWE wrestling joke for ya there...
Brian Griffin Posted 3 July, 2009 Posted 3 July, 2009 If this is the case, then there has to be questions raised on the funding of this overseas consortium especially as there is more than enough evidence to suggest that Pinnacle haven't got a pot to **** in. For some reason there is a preference to the Pinnacle bid, who prefers it? Fry? Creditors? Guess it will come out in the wash. My preference is anyone who will sign the damn documents and truely show they have the clubs best interests at heart by getting this farce over and done with , so the club has a half decent chance of having a good go at this league.
northam soul Posted 3 July, 2009 Posted 3 July, 2009 Jesus Christ, as others have said if they were about to do a deal the only one who could scupper it would be Fry who if Liarnam and co have returned may have said hang on i want to see what they have got to say. The problem here is that Fry has bought himself some time with the player sales so he can drag this out if he wants to. If somebody is ready to go then just sign the paperwork and if its you Mry Fry delaying then cough out of it and do the deal.
Ian the Red Posted 3 July, 2009 Posted 3 July, 2009 can't believe Pinnacle is back in the bidding.......... MLT would have announced something if they are serious.
saint_stevo Posted 3 July, 2009 Posted 3 July, 2009 He'd only sell us to Vince McMahon for 34 billion dollars as soon as he took over anyway. Little WWE wrestling joke for ya there... Very
gonzo Posted 3 July, 2009 Posted 3 July, 2009 can't believe Pinnacle is back in the bidding.......... MLT would have announced something if they are serious. I don't think Matt will have anything more to do with them. They've already done their utmost to make him look like a tit with the very people who idolise him.
saint_stevo Posted 3 July, 2009 Posted 3 July, 2009 If this is the case, then there has to be questions raised on the funding of this overseas consortium especially as there is more than enough evidence to suggest that Pinnacle haven't got a pot to **** in. For some reason there is a preference to the Pinnacle bid, who prefers it? Fry? Creditors? Guess it will come out in the wash. My preference is anyone who will sign the damn documents and truely show they have the clubs best interests at heart by getting this farce over and done with , so the club has a half decent chance of having a good go at this league. Not from me, bunch of time wasting morons
doughnutman Posted 3 July, 2009 Posted 3 July, 2009 can't believe Pinnacle is back in the bidding.......... MLT would have announced something if they are serious. I get the feeling that MLT is no longer involved in the Pinnacle bid (although that is IMO and I could be wrong)
alpine_saint Posted 3 July, 2009 Posted 3 July, 2009 Isnt this simple to explain ? The price agreed with Pinnacle, weeks before and before Davis, Surman and McG p*ssed off, is higher than that with the mystery consortium. Therefore, Fry has probably had his head turned...
SOTONS EAST SIDE Posted 3 July, 2009 Posted 3 July, 2009 All sounds very Marc Jacksonesque to me. They're not in first place anymore. So roll on the Swiss or other consortium bid! Dont pin anything on Pinnacle!
Cabrone Posted 3 July, 2009 Posted 3 July, 2009 I still have a strong feeling that Pinnacle's game plan was always to push this to the wire to squeeze the price down but unfortunately for them another group has come in with some financial muscle which may force them to act. If they weren't interested you would think that they would have backed off for good yet they still seem to be hanging around. They took a look at the books, decided they liked what they saw but wanted to get it at as low a price as possible so concocted an excuse over league points to soften Mr Fry up a bit. I think that MLT and TL were honest and acted with integrity but the money men are now calling the shots and they are going to play hard ball right till the bitter end. All IMO of course.
northam soul Posted 3 July, 2009 Posted 3 July, 2009 Perhaps Liarnam has spent the last few days phoning round all the recent lottery winners. That old dude who won £25mill the other week was probably his first call. Hello whos that Its Tony from Pinnacle Who You know Matts mate, we are going to buy SFC Not with my ****ing money your not and slams phone down. He then is busy scanning camelot for some more names and i dont mean the castle or though he may as well parade King Arthur on sky.
dubai_phil Posted 3 July, 2009 Posted 3 July, 2009 (edited) Isnt this simple to explain ? The price agreed with Pinnacle, weeks before and before Davis, Surman and McG p*ssed off, is higher than that with the mystery consortium. Therefore, Fry has probably had his head turned... Alps IMHO I think you will find that the PRICE is the same for everyone. What will vary will be how that is STRUCTURED. Let us assume that the original Pinnacle figure was somewhere around 12mil CASH But you could also structure an offer of say 12mil OR EVEN 15mil including "deferrals" based on performance to Aviva or other creditors, or even TBF on revenue from player sales or season tickets, so the BID could be 9mil cash and UP TO 6mil in deferrals The way that Fry seems to be working is that he will take the CASH figure every time so Pinnacle would get back into the driving seat HTH Edited 3 July, 2009 by dubai_phil oops maths was wrong - sorry!
trousers Posted 3 July, 2009 Author Posted 3 July, 2009 How could they scupper someone else's bid? That was my question. If the answer is "They can't" then I'll make a concerted effort to stop misinterpreting media reports.
Nineteen Canteen Posted 3 July, 2009 Posted 3 July, 2009 I still have a strong feeling that Pinnacle's game plan was always to push this to the wire to squeeze the price down but unfortunately for them another group has come in with some financial muscle which may force them to act. If they weren't interested you would think that they would have backed off for good yet they still seem to be hanging around. They took a look at the books, decided they liked what they saw but wanted to get it at as low a price as possible so concocted an excuse over league points to soften Mr Fry up a bit. I think that MLT and TL were honest and acted with integrity but the money men are now calling the shots and they are going to play hard ball right till the bitter end. All IMO of course. Yet another theory, Trousers' trousers must be filling with friendly milk at the propsect of so many delicious conspiracy theories. Careful Trousers all this excitement be careful not to simply blame it on the heat and humidity. I am very pleased to see you finally well rewarded, good the good guys get what they need occassionaly. Today you feast like a king.
Nineteen Canteen Posted 3 July, 2009 Posted 3 July, 2009 That was my question. If the answer is "They can't" then I'll make a concerted effort to stop misinterpreting media reports. Ho Ho
eelpie Posted 3 July, 2009 Posted 3 July, 2009 Alps IMHO I think you will find that the PRICE is the same for everyone. What will vary will be how that is STRUCTURED. Let us assume that the original Pinnacle figure was somewhere around 12mil CASH But you could also structure an offer of say 12mil OR EVEN 15mil including "deferrals" based on performance to Aviva or other creditors, or even TBF on revenue from player sales or season tickets, so the BID could be 9mil cash and UP TO 6mil in deferrals The way that Fry seems to be working is that he will take the CASH figure every time so Pinnacle would get back into the driving seat HTH But if no buyers are interested in Fry's price, surely the price would come down.
OldNick Posted 3 July, 2009 Posted 3 July, 2009 Fry must hate it if he has to take longer in getting the deal done, lol
Saint Fan CaM Posted 3 July, 2009 Posted 3 July, 2009 I still have a strong feeling that Pinnacle's game plan was always to push this to the wire to squeeze the price down but unfortunately for them another group has come in with some financial muscle which may force them to act. If they weren't interested you would think that they would have backed off for good yet they still seem to be hanging around. They took a look at the books, decided they liked what they saw but wanted to get it at as low a price as possible so concocted an excuse over league points to soften Mr Fry up a bit. I think that MLT and TL were honest and acted with integrity but the money men are now calling the shots and they are going to play hard ball right till the bitter end. All IMO of course. Nail - hit - head. Right dead centre IMO.
aberdare Posted 3 July, 2009 Posted 3 July, 2009 But if no buyers are interested in Fry's price, surely the price would come down. IF the swiss bid is being in any way orchestrated by Ramon Vega, and I would think that a decent each way bet, his previous attempts to buy clubs including the "neighbours" have all revolved round absolutely nothing up front (the literal quid) but the consideration to be paid over a significant period of time from trading and transfers. Whilst on paper that would suggest Fry can tell the creditors they are getting x in the £, it may well be that a smaller number paid instantly is equally or more attractive to the creditors.
Redondo Saint Posted 3 July, 2009 Posted 3 July, 2009 If this story is true and TL really did make the commment to the Echo “the last 24 hours have been busy, but probably not as busy as the next 24 hours", then my opinion of him and the Pinnacle bid has reduced further. He really needs to keep his gob shut and just finish the job. Anything else simply confirms he is on a major ego trip and no more credible than Jackson. Can someone remind me of TL's business success?
Webby Posted 3 July, 2009 Posted 3 July, 2009 It's just the echo putting 2 and 2 together to make a story. Mind you, we all do it too don't we?
jam Posted 3 July, 2009 Posted 3 July, 2009 This story doesn't tie in very well with the Solent report this morning in which the reporter said he asked Fry if the Pinnacle group were back in the running and Fry's words were 'not as far as I'm concerned' and that he'd had no contact with them.
lordswoodsaints Posted 3 July, 2009 Posted 3 July, 2009 Isnt this simple to explain ? The price agreed with Pinnacle, weeks before and before Davis, Surman and McG p*ssed off, is higher than that with the mystery consortium. Therefore, Fry has probably had his head turned... I should imagine it is something along these lines. Pinnacle have probably offered the same money for less of a deal.
gordonToo Posted 3 July, 2009 Posted 3 July, 2009 After what has gone on already the FL may well be entitled to conclude that Pinaccle fail the "fit and proper person" test. They cetainly do in my book at any rate.
NickG Posted 3 July, 2009 Posted 3 July, 2009 http://www.dailyecho.co.uk/sport/4472854.Pinnacle_back_in_contention_for_Saints/ "THE mystery overseas consortium’s hopes of completing a takeover at St Mary’s yesterday were stunned by the Pinnacle group’s return to the scene. The worldwide financial services group were initially confident of announcing a deal had been completed after their lawyers had spent two days negotiating with administrator Mark Fry and creditors." Sorry for another thread, but if I'm reading this correctly the 'new' overseas group were on the verge of a takeover yesterday tea-time but Pinnacle have somehow scuppered it...? How? WFT is going on? Fry made it very clear that he had had no new contact from Pinnacle and the only place he had heard of their renewed interest was in media. Therefore not involved with takeover.
sussexsaint Posted 3 July, 2009 Posted 3 July, 2009 Fry made it very clear that he had had no new contact from Pinnacle and the only place he had heard of their renewed interest was in media. Therefore not involved with takeover. Thank you, case closed - now can we sell the club now please
Iowsaintsfan Posted 3 July, 2009 Posted 3 July, 2009 my view is that pinnicle have use the most time possible to look like they have pulled out and make it look like saints would go to the wall in order to get the FA to backtrack on the -10 points and then get what they where looking for, all IMO of course
trousers Posted 3 July, 2009 Author Posted 3 July, 2009 my view is that pinnicle have use the most time possible to look like they have pulled out and make it look like saints would go to the wall in order to get the FA to backtrack on the -10 points and then get what they where looking for, all IMO of course I give it 4 minutes before someone points out it's the Football League, not the FA.
aberdare Posted 3 July, 2009 Posted 3 July, 2009 my view is that pinnicle have use the most time possible to look like they have pulled out and make it look like saints would go to the wall in order to get the FA to backtrack on the -10 points and then get what they where looking for, all IMO of course At least one club has gone bust most decades. The FL response is not going to change because otherwise Saints will go bust. Complete delusion.
aberdare Posted 3 July, 2009 Posted 3 July, 2009 I give it 4 minutes before someone points out it's the Football League, not the FA. Managed it subtly with a minute to spare
Chez Posted 3 July, 2009 Posted 3 July, 2009 Unless Pinnacle suggested to the Administrator they would pay more money and claimed they could prove it, in which case Fry would be pretty much duty bound to have a look at it. Actually I'm not sure Fry is duty bound to look at it. If (and this is the key) he has already established that they are fakers then it is in the best interest of his creditors to ignore them and concentrate on the bird in the hand so to speak so long as that offer appealed to the creditors.
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