RedAndWhite91 Posted 23 June, 2009 Share Posted 23 June, 2009 i'm bored now. They really should just accept the ten points and be done with it. agreed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mole Posted 23 June, 2009 Share Posted 23 June, 2009 btw - it's jim ratcliffe / ineos behind the pinnacle group. If only. If it was him it'd explain the secrecy though because JR doesn't like being in the limelight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
St Chalet Posted 23 June, 2009 Share Posted 23 June, 2009 btw - it's jim ratcliffe / ineos behind the pinnacle group. Knowing our luck it will be Daniel Ratcliffe and the Hogwarts company behind us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jollyjohn Posted 23 June, 2009 Share Posted 23 June, 2009 at least you will have MAGIC football then Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chin Strain Posted 23 June, 2009 Share Posted 23 June, 2009 btw - it's jim ratcliffe / ineos behind the pinnacle group. Hmmm...only 7 posts.......bit of a bandit me thinks:butthead: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trousers Posted 23 June, 2009 Share Posted 23 June, 2009 (edited) More new posters on here this evening than a new poster convention Edited 23 June, 2009 by trousers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VectisSaint Posted 23 June, 2009 Share Posted 23 June, 2009 btw - it's jim ratcliffe / ineos behind the pinnacle group. "a highly successful entrepreneur who has built a multi-billion pound empire “using lashings of debt” in just seven years" Oh my God, sounds great... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alehouseboys Posted 23 June, 2009 Share Posted 23 June, 2009 More new posters on here this eveing than a new poster convention ...so which one's the all-new 19C then? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cynicalsaint Posted 23 June, 2009 Share Posted 23 June, 2009 chin - you know the credibility of my source. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hypochondriac Posted 23 June, 2009 Share Posted 23 June, 2009 chin - you know the credibility of my source. I don't though. FWIW that is who I would put my money on if I was betting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rocker268 Posted 23 June, 2009 Share Posted 23 June, 2009 yeah robert steel.... whoever that is He runs pinacle with Tony Lynam, they have been in business together for 4 years, and run pinacle for 1 year together. They explained on South Today last night, I don't think he is involved beyond being a business partner Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miserableoldgit Posted 23 June, 2009 Share Posted 23 June, 2009 btw - it's jim ratcliffe / ineos behind the pinnacle group. As I posted on another thread, Solent "coincidently" did a feature on JR and the INEOS financial situation either just before or just after (can`t remember which) the Sports headlines at around 7.45am today. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ART Posted 23 June, 2009 Share Posted 23 June, 2009 yeah robert steel.... whoever that is Ben Steel and Quenton Hubbard visited St Mary's from Guernsey on the 29th April. Property Developers who claimed they would buy St Mary's and Saints. Put in an offer and didn't want diligence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saints Pedro Posted 23 June, 2009 Share Posted 23 June, 2009 Thats how it will be sorted, its just bartering of a kind, each side wanting the best deal. If Pinnacle rushed in and signed things people would blame them for being too hasty. I have every confidence they will seal it once they are happier with the terms, which may be very soon... I don't think we have much to barter with do we? We need the football league but they can live without us. We say we want to appeal ,they say it's our rules and you can't! Why do they need to concede anyhing? I hope I'm wrong! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulSaint Posted 23 June, 2009 Share Posted 23 June, 2009 Knowing our luck it will be Daniel Ratcliffe and the Hogwarts company behind us. Oh great, first a hockey tw*t and now a quidditch addict! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hutch Posted 23 June, 2009 Share Posted 23 June, 2009 I don't think we have much to barter with do we? We need the football league but they can live without us. We say we want to appeal ,they say it's our rules and you can't! Why do they need to concede anyhing? I hope I'm wrong! I think that's actually the nub. As I understand it they're saying it's NOT our rules, but you still can't anyway, so ya boo sucks to you. Where have all the grown ups gone? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trader Posted 23 June, 2009 Share Posted 23 June, 2009 I have decided NOT to visit this forum until a deal has been announced in the main media. I have wasted the last few years of my life waiting for positive news which never comes. Enough is enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BARCELONASAINT Posted 23 June, 2009 Share Posted 23 June, 2009 I'm bored now. They really should just accept the ten points and be done with it. no they should not! They are showing some balls and trying to get the best possible deal for SFC. Why oh why are some people so obsessed with Pinnacle just rolling over and doing exactly what the FL say. I would rather go down fighting than roll over and be the sort of club that says "thank you sir and by the way please feel free to whack me again whenever you feel like it" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthew Le God Posted 23 June, 2009 Share Posted 23 June, 2009 no they should not! They are showing some balls and trying to get the best possible deal for SFC. Why oh why are some people so obsessed with Pinnacle just rolling over and doing exactly what the FL say. I would rather go down fighting than roll over and be the sort of club that says "thank you sir and by the way please feel free to whack me again whenever you feel like it" I agree Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ruffo Posted 23 June, 2009 Share Posted 23 June, 2009 Personnally, I think the FL have been unreasonable in this instance. Every person and business must have the right of appeal. To take that away is undemocratic. Why is it that so many sporting governance groups get it wrong so often. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smithy Posted 23 June, 2009 Share Posted 23 June, 2009 I have decided NOT to visit this forum until a deal has been announced in the main media. I have wasted the last few years of my life waiting for positive news which never comes. Enough is enough. See you tomorrow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pap Posted 23 June, 2009 Share Posted 23 June, 2009 If we really do have hundreds of millions in backing, and someone like KK in the frame, cannot see why we're holding out for these ten points. Something doesn't add up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mole Posted 23 June, 2009 Share Posted 23 June, 2009 If we really do have hundreds of millions in backing, and someone like KK in the frame, cannot see why we're holding out for these ten points. Something doesn't add up. Why has it taken 3 years for you to make your first post? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pap Posted 23 June, 2009 Share Posted 23 June, 2009 In truth, this is probably my fourth post. I definitely posted after our 3-2 win at Burnley when we lost out to Derby in playoffs. A local resident had flippers for hands. You can't not comment on that sort of caper. Dunno what's happened to the stats tho'. When do I have to pay my £5? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rocker268 Posted 23 June, 2009 Share Posted 23 June, 2009 If we really do have hundreds of millions in backing, and someone like KK in the frame, cannot see why we're holding out for these ten points. Something doesn't add up. It's not just the 10 points though, as it stands it is more the right to appeal, which they should be entitled to, it has also been said that this is only one issue of several, that the football league only made an issue last wednesday or thursday, as I understand it the FL had agreed to everything, then at the last minute threw it all into confusion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoeShmoe Posted 23 June, 2009 Share Posted 23 June, 2009 I'm bored now. They really should just accept the ten points and be done with it. My thoughts exactly... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
supergoose Posted 23 June, 2009 Share Posted 23 June, 2009 In truth, this is probably my fourth post. I definitely posted after our 3-2 win at Burnley when we lost out to Derby in playoffs. A local resident had flippers for hands. You can't not comment on that sort of caper. Dunno what's happened to the stats tho'. When do I have to pay my £5? It's gone up it's now £500,000 but you do get the opportunity to bid for the club. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dockland Dave Posted 23 June, 2009 Share Posted 23 June, 2009 If we really do have hundreds of millions in backing, and someone like KK in the frame, cannot see why we're holding out for these ten points. Something doesn't add up. Pap, because what the FL have done is "an abuse of power". I don't neccessarily belive that we should get the 10 points back, because in all bar a technicality we are administration, but we should have a right to appeal. However if we can get off on a technicality, then let it happen. I suspect the -10 points will gaurentee an extra season season in league one and cost our prospectiver owner millions. I suspect our owner is a very rich individual because he has looked after his cash and fought decisions like this! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hutch Posted 23 June, 2009 Share Posted 23 June, 2009 If we really do have hundreds of millions in backing, and someone like KK in the frame, cannot see why we're holding out for these ten points. Something doesn't add up. I prefer to believe that Pinnacle are holding out on moral/ethical grounds, and not because the funding package depends on it. If I'm right, the future is bright, the future is red & white, with some genuine men at the helm. I hope I'm not wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pap Posted 23 June, 2009 Share Posted 23 June, 2009 It's not just the 10 points though, as it stands it is more the right to appeal, which they should be entitled to, it has also been said that this is only one issue of several, that the football league only made an issue last wednesday or thursday, as I understand it the FL had agreed to everything, then at the last minute threw it all into confusion. All. I've paid my £5, so let discussion commence. When we were docked the 10 points, I thought fair enough. We were trying to break the spirit of the law through financial prestidigitation - even though the letter of the law is something quite different. I happen to agree with the general sentiment that the FL would lose a high court battle simply because they didn't set their parameters loosely enough when they made the rule. As I understand it, every club has had to waive the right of appeal after a takeover. So, back to original post. I honestly believe that if we have substantial financial backing and KK in charge, these points are going to be irrelevant. Why? KK has a proven record of getting lower division teams promoted. When he took Fulham up, they had 101 points by close of play. True, he did this by getting players that were outside their contemporaries budgets, but it was done. On current form, we'd finish second and gain automatic promotion. What concerns me is that this takeover is dragging on - pre-season preparations are in disarray and there is literally no ownership at the club right now. Wotte doesn't know what the future holds, Kelvin Davis is allegedly coaching goalkeepers and the rest of the transfer market is well and truly active. I'd take resolution, solid financial backing and an inspirational manager over 10 points any day. Better to be an alive man with a chance than a dead man with principles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trousers Posted 23 June, 2009 Share Posted 23 June, 2009 What concerns me is that this takeover is dragging on - pre-season preparations are in disarray and there is literally no ownership at the club right now. Wotte doesn't know what the future holds, Kelvin Davis is allegedly coaching goalkeepers and the rest of the transfer market is well and truly active. I'd take resolution, solid financial backing and an inspirational manager over 10 points any day. Better to be an alive man with a chance than a dead man with principles. Indeed....we must be reaching a juncture now whereby every day 'lost' trying to protect the right to appeal against the -10 point penalty is translating into projected points lost on the field at the start of the season due to poor pre-season preparation. If the 'fight' against the FL was ONLY about the -10 points then it's fast becoming a false economy... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
It's There Posted 23 June, 2009 Share Posted 23 June, 2009 All. I've paid my £5, so let discussion commence. When we were docked the 10 points, I thought fair enough. We were trying to break the spirit of the law through financial prestidigitation - even though the letter of the law is something quite different. I happen to agree with the general sentiment that the FL would lose a high court battle simply because they didn't set their parameters loosely enough when they made the rule. As I understand it, every club has had to waive the right of appeal after a takeover. So, back to original post. I honestly believe that if we have substantial financial backing and KK in charge, these points are going to be irrelevant. Why? KK has a proven record of getting lower division teams promoted. When he took Fulham up, they had 101 points by close of play. True, he did this by getting players that were outside their contemporaries budgets, but it was done. On current form, we'd finish second and gain automatic promotion. What concerns me is that this takeover is dragging on - pre-season preparations are in disarray and there is literally no ownership at the club right now. Wotte doesn't know what the future holds, Kelvin Davis is allegedly coaching goalkeepers and the rest of the transfer market is well and truly active. I'd take resolution, solid financial backing and an inspirational manager over 10 points any day. Better to be an alive man with a chance than a dead man with principles. Disagree about "on current form"- -10 points is a DISASTER- Look how many team would have dropped into the bottom 4 in League one if they had been docked 10 points. Leeds played VERY well AND were lucky to get such a good run going. After the last few seasons we need all the help we can get. Also, I think we don't deserve the -10 as we weren't in administration.. simply and legally. It should be fought, and then if Pinnacle get nowhere, then at least they can say they tried. I'd HATE to get to May next year and be blaming Pinnackle for not challenging the deductionj when we just missed out on promotion/playoffs or, even worse, were relegated because of the deduction! IMHO of course Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Nice Posted 23 June, 2009 Share Posted 23 June, 2009 Le Tiss Words on SSN earlier.... Le Tissier admits the situation has proven to be a hindrance to all concerned, but is hopeful an agreement can still be reached. "As it stands we have had the contract from the Football League which they would like us to sign, and that is with our lawyers," he told Sky Sports News. "Hopefully we can find an amicable way to resolve this. At the end of the day, we realise that the Football League are people that we want to work with in the future and we want an amicable resolution. "The exclusivity period is over, but we are still confident that we can finish this deal and that is what we intend to do. "We feel this is the best bid and is in the best interest of Southampton Football Club and the supporters. That is what matters the most. "Hopefully we can get it done soon and that is what we are trying to do. "We just want the right to a level playing field that is due to us and we are going to do our best to get that. I can assure the fans that every effort is being taken to make sure this deal goes through. "We are hoping that everything can be sorted out in the next 48 hours, but of course when lawyers are involved things can take a bit longer." Le Tissier also revealed that assurances have been made to the club's players and staff that they will be paid on schedule this month. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dannysfc Posted 23 June, 2009 Share Posted 23 June, 2009 Le Tiss Words on SSN earlier.... Le Tissier admits the situation has proven to be a hindrance to all concerned, but is hopeful an agreement can still be reached. "As it stands we have had the contract from the Football League which they would like us to sign, and that is with our lawyers," he told Sky Sports News. "Hopefully we can find an amicable way to resolve this. At the end of the day, we realise that the Football League are people that we want to work with in the future and we want an amicable resolution. "The exclusivity period is over, but we are still confident that we can finish this deal and that is what we intend to do. "We feel this is the best bid and is in the best interest of Southampton Football Club and the supporters. That is what matters the most. "Hopefully we can get it done soon and that is what we are trying to do. "We just want the right to a level playing field that is due to us and we are going to do our best to get that. I can assure the fans that every effort is being taken to make sure this deal goes through. "We are hoping that everything can be sorted out in the next 48 hours, but of course when lawyers are involved things can take a bit longer." Le Tissier also revealed that assurances have been made to the club's players and staff that they will be paid on schedule this month. That's All I Want To Hear Tbh And Surely If MLT Can Talk The Talk Then He Can Walk The Walk And Get On And Push This Takeover Over The Line And We Can Start Talking About Football For A Change As I Am Starting To Wonder Whether We Will Get Taken Over Which I Hope The Pinnacle Lot Will In The End ! Saints Till I Die !! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SFC Forever Posted 23 June, 2009 Share Posted 23 June, 2009 prestidigitation - that Pap is one hell of a word. I get the gist and concur Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trousers Posted 23 June, 2009 Share Posted 23 June, 2009 Look how many team would have dropped into the bottom 4 in League one if they had been docked 10 points. Look how many teams would have dropped into the bottom 4 in League One if they had spent a large chunk of pre-season under a cloud of uncertainty Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CB Fry Posted 23 June, 2009 Share Posted 23 June, 2009 All. I've paid my £5, so let discussion commence. When we were docked the 10 points, I thought fair enough. We were trying to break the spirit of the law through financial prestidigitation - even though the letter of the law is something quite different. I happen to agree with the general sentiment that the FL would lose a high court battle simply because they didn't set their parameters loosely enough when they made the rule. As I understand it, every club has had to waive the right of appeal after a takeover. So, back to original post. I honestly believe that if we have substantial financial backing and KK in charge, these points are going to be irrelevant. Why? KK has a proven record of getting lower division teams promoted. When he took Fulham up, they had 101 points by close of play. True, he did this by getting players that were outside their contemporaries budgets, but it was done. On current form, we'd finish second and gain automatic promotion. What concerns me is that this takeover is dragging on - pre-season preparations are in disarray and there is literally no ownership at the club right now. Wotte doesn't know what the future holds, Kelvin Davis is allegedly coaching goalkeepers and the rest of the transfer market is well and truly active. I'd take resolution, solid financial backing and an inspirational manager over 10 points any day. Better to be an alive man with a chance than a dead man with principles. Great post, agree with all of it, except the bit about the FL losing in the high court. They wouldn't lose, the FL would win 100 appeals out of 100. But of course it wouldn't ever get to high court, not within about three years anyway. By which time the 10 points will be a complete irrelevence to the SFC of 2012. Anyway, the rest of your post is fab. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RonManager Posted 23 June, 2009 Share Posted 23 June, 2009 That's All I Want To Hear Tbh And Surely If MLT Can Talk The Talk Then He Can Walk The Walk And Get On And Push This Takeover Over The Line And We Can Start Talking About Football For A Change As I Am Starting To Wonder Whether We Will Get Taken Over Which I Hope The Pinnacle Lot Will In The End ! Saints Till I Die !! Keep writing unpunctuated sentences that long without taking a breath and you will die! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dannysfc Posted 23 June, 2009 Share Posted 23 June, 2009 Keep writing unpunctuated sentences that long without taking a breath and you will die! Thanks RonManager For The Advice But I'm Sure I'l Live And If You Are Finding It Hard To Understand Then Live With It Ok Mate ! Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mole Posted 23 June, 2009 Share Posted 23 June, 2009 More new posters on here this evening than a new poster convention And they're all crap speelers and showing signs of illiteracy... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wildgoose Posted 23 June, 2009 Share Posted 23 June, 2009 See you tomorrow. Ha Ha that made me laugh out loud! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saint_stevo Posted 23 June, 2009 Share Posted 23 June, 2009 Mr Lynam? Everyday that passes, it looks more and more so, you may 'update the fans' etc, but i wish you wouldnt and you and your 'client' would just decide because each day that passes is a day closer to us not having a club to support next season. Your frustratingly Stevo P.S- You owe me £57 for a new keyboard on my laptop, the F5 is totally worn out Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
docker-p Posted 23 June, 2009 Share Posted 23 June, 2009 I never knew we had such a bunch of lilly-livered surrender monkeys as fans! By the letter of the law we have been cheated, and are being asked to give up our right to appeal be an organisation not fit for purpose. An organsiation behaving in the best traditions of a south american banana republic, changing the rules to suit them. The more Pinnacle push the League and their old school tie brigade the better i like them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
obelisk Posted 23 June, 2009 Share Posted 23 June, 2009 Great post, agree with all of it, except the bit about the FL losing in the high court. They wouldn't lose, the FL would win 100 appeals out of 100. But of course it wouldn't ever get to high court, not within about three years anyway. By which time the 10 points will be a complete irrelevence to the SFC of 2012. Anyway, the rest of your post is fab.If you were my lawyer I think I'd have to consider killing myself, even if innocent. Pretty grim guilt trip there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saintsmike25 Posted 23 June, 2009 Share Posted 23 June, 2009 I never knew we had such a bunch of lilly-livered surrender monkeys as fans! By the letter of the law we have been cheated, and are being asked to give up our right to appeal be an organisation not fit for purpose. An organsiation behaving in the best traditions of a south american banana republic, changing the rules to suit them. The more Pinnacle push the League and their old school tie brigade the better i like them. And the closer we get to the Blue Square South, you never take on the league and win in these matters. Leeds/Bournemouth/Luton/Rotherham should all be examples of that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pap Posted 23 June, 2009 Share Posted 23 June, 2009 It's a stretch, but was merely referring to current Division One final points that took the teams into automatic promotion. If someone like KK can keep and bring players into L1 that otherwise, would not give us a second glance, we've got a top chance - even with the -10 deduction. The most important thing about our hoped-for resurrection is setting the stall out early and correctly. We've already missed early. Let us hope that all future decisions for the club are correct. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sussexsaint Posted 23 June, 2009 Share Posted 23 June, 2009 (edited) I was watching SSN with my 6 year old tonight listening go MLTs statement and he suddenly went all quiet and I realised he was watching me. 'daddy you really like that chap don't you?' said he 'yes' said I ' he has been my hero for as long as I can remember' Then he beamed all over his face and I swear to you he said ' I bet that's why you called me Matthew isn't it?' I just smiled at him and he whispered 'does Mummy know?' In the middle of all this farce I think I will always treasure those few brief seconds. I know it's sappy but I am more than a little wasted Edited 23 June, 2009 by sussexsaint Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
batterseasaint Posted 23 June, 2009 Share Posted 23 June, 2009 Important point in the quotes from Matty on Sky Sports when he said that they have a contract on the table from the FL. Lynham has also told us that they WILL buy the club and the issue will be resolved. As I understand it, their concerns are not so much about the ten points, and not even about the principles of being allowed to appeal, but more about gaining assurances from the FL that we will be given a licence for next season. So now they have that assurance in the form of a proposed contract from the FL. And given their 'determination' to buy the club, why don't they complete the purchase and then fight the battle with the FL as the actual (not prospective) owners of the club? If they manage to get any compromise built into that contract, then great... if not, we know we can play in League 1 next season anyway. So what is now stopping them from completing the deal? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
batterseasaint Posted 23 June, 2009 Share Posted 23 June, 2009 I was watching SSN with my 6 year old tonight listening go MLTs statement and he suddenly went all quiet and I realised he was watching me. 'daddy you really like that chap don't you?' said he 'yes' said I ' he has been my hero for as long as I can remember' Then he beamed all over his face and I swear to you he said ' I bet that's why you called me Matthew isn't it?' I just smiled at him and he whispered 'does Mummy know?' In the middle of all this farce I think I will always treasure those few brief seconds. I know it's sappy but I am more than a little wasted If this was Facebook, this post would say 'BatterseaSaint likes this'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CB Fry Posted 23 June, 2009 Share Posted 23 June, 2009 If you were my lawyer I think I'd have to consider killing myself, even if innocent. Pretty grim guilt trip there. I was Saints lawyer I wouldn't make any money by dragging everything out over every single sentence, but that doesn't make me wrong. We won't get the 10 points recinded and if we ever do "appeal" to the FL, the Court of Arbitration for Sport, the high court, Watchdog, the European Union, Norwich Union, the Pope or Lynne Foulds Wood we will never, ever, win. All of you can come and poo on my head if I'm wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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