kyle04

Shouldn't you be in bed, it's quite late ?

Russian MOD saying a fire broke out on the cruiser, resulting in an ammunition cook off, by all accounts it has not yet sunk. If the cause was a missile strike it's a serious balls up by the Russians.

The joint largest battleship the Germans had, and it never fired a shot in anger. The UK are sending our Harpoon system, hopefully more of the same to come.

Russia allegedly moving some armour up to the Finnish border, reportedly coastal defense systems at the moment, as Finland decides whether to join NATO. Slovakia to agree sale of their "zuzana" self propelled artillery to Ukraine, a serious bit of kit and just what they need. The US really does have to up it's support and agree to backfill every Soviet piece of equipment in eastern Europe so it can go to Ukraine and be used straight away.

Bayern out!

Having watched the video, I can conclude that the narrator is a fucking idiot. Yes, WMD were either a complete lie or a result of fatally flawed intelligence, we know that, Holywood have made films about it etc. To equate that with questioning war crimes in Ukraine is just perverse. The "Russian war crimes" is not a US sourced theory, based on hearsay or "reliable sources". We've seen the destruction, the bodies, the mass graves, the naked corpse of a 3 year old dumped in a cellar among her murdered and raped family. As for US misinformation pre-empting possible events, this is a fucking war, not a video game, innocent people are dying in their droves on a daily basis. Anything that makes Russia doubt a possible next move is acceptable IMO. I don't know what Jonnyboy (the emphasis on the "boy") is trying to achieve by posting this paranoid rubbish.

Correct, the point was though that the Iraqi army were defeated after that time. What followed was a chaotic free for all between religious factions with the US caught in the middle. That Iraq was a huge balls up is not disputed, so the world's a better place with people like Saddam and Bashar al-Assad ruling?

Sanctions don't come under the NATO umbrella though, they've been more of a knock on effect and each country's "relationship" with Russia is different (Germany have their gas conundrum, the UK have their corrupt olligarch riches). I think sanctions broadly speaking will hurt Russia, but the real turd in the waterpipe is of course China, who will openly support Russia judging by the recent UN vote. China have judged that the west can't do without them, as over the past few decades we've virtually handed over most of our manufacturing base to Beijing, which can't be undone quickly if at all. It's worth noting that the US currently owe China $1 trillion, around 5% of their GDP. As far as a potential military conflict with NATO, Russia will get their arses handed to them, no question. Their "army" is a rabble and much of their equipment is unserviceable. If Putin isn't aware of this his generals certainly are. NATO are far more organized and have better weapons. The US had control of Iraq in a month, a vast sprawling alien environment , Russia didn't even come close to entering Kyiv, yet alone taking the city. NATO countries have been slowly increasing the military aid to Ukraine, and despite Putin's threats he's done fuck all about it. I remember his little rant on day 1 when he said something like "if anyone interferes, there will be serious consequences". Well the west have been interfering for 6 weeks and the bombs haven't rained down on Warsaw.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-61077641 "Last month US President Joe Biden said Nato "would respond" if Russia used chemical weapons in Ukraine." I only put the post out there due to statements like this. Alex is right though I think, the practical options are limited. More sanctions? More small arms? The heavier stuff being sent to Ukraine has so far been either ageing Soviet systems (the S300 from Slovakia), or outdated European equipment (German Leopard 1 tanks, British Harpoon missiles) for example, not that Ukraine aren't grateful for anything they get. European artillery shells are the wrong calibre , the more modern European/US armour requires training and is expensive. If true I'm happy that railroad got blown, I was rather hoping for similar on the Belarus trains loaded with Russian armour heading east, a "bridge too far" maybe.

If true, over to you Biden...

It's looking like Mariupol is now resembling Berlin in 1945, tens of thousands of civilian casualties, Ukrainian marines running out of ammo, and men probably. The newly appointed Russian general (Alexander Dvornikov) makes bomber Harris look like private Godfrey apparently so expect more of the same, he's the same animal who leveled Aleppo. So what can Ukraine do now? The child rapists are massing in the eastern part of the country, tens of thousands of men, it's gonna take more than a few NLAW's to get them out. This is going to take many months if not years. As for Putin threatening Finland/Sweden, I don't think he's in a position to start a war with another two countries, if he wants to send forces to the Finnish border (800 miles worth), that's fewer troops in Ukraine, so fuck him.

Er, it's 2022 now?

About he only historically accurate part of the film. Still, people will believe the lies in it (the "French bird" was actually 9 years old at the time, and living in France for example), although it was widely ridiculed at the time AFAIK. Gibson does hate the English though it seems.

Yeah, we could easily have had..... 1 goal

Lets get it into perspective, Chelsea are a world class outfit, built on stolen Russian mafia money sure, but there it is. They played their best football today, and when the opposition are a collective shambles, large scores are the result. But, Chelsea haven't won by 6 or more in the PL for 10 years. The two 0-9's were a little unlucky because every goal attempt seemed to go in. Today 0-12 would not have flattered Chelsea, we were that poor (24 attempts, 14 on target, woodwork hit 3 times, as opposed to 4 attempts, 1 on target, a typical Adams fluff. Some are saying this was our worse performance for decades, maybe. These are many deficiencies in the squad in all areas, but there always will be with our budget. I do wish Ralph would at least play are full backs on their proper positions though, why the fuck does he persist with KWP at left back just to accommodate Livramento, it's jut bloody ridiculous, a sort of "managers son" bias in a sunday league boys team.

Well thats some achievement if their assessment is true. In the 8 years hence the AZOV have been incorporated into the mainstream military, and are at present slowly being wiped out in Mariupol. Yes Ukraine has had a turbulent recent history, but dosen't deserve Russia's blatent attempt to wipe them out. Though still a young country in many ways, they're more democratic now that Russia will ever be.

“We are a European army, and we do not mock our prisoners,” senior presidential adviser Oleksiy Arestovych said at the time. “If this turns out to be real, this is absolutely unacceptable behavior.” A slightly different attitude from Russia's constant "fake news/false flag" assertions after every atrocity it commits. This can't be condoned though, although given the behaviour of Russian troops towards unarmed civilians I would think many Ukrainian POW's have met a similar fate. What is for now an isolated incident can get blown out of all proportion and fuel the Russian propaganda machine, although it appears that the unit responsible were Georgians.

I agree particularly with the last paragraph, as far as this forum goes, it's far more bruising to the ego to have a post intelligently picked apart than just to be called an idiot, or worse. Many have been on the receiving end of lazy abuse rather than reasoned counter argument. OK this is a football forum, but the topics often discussed in the lounge should merit a higher level of debate otherwise why bother at all.

On a similar note, a chart of the top 20 gas consuming countries : You can see the problem Germany have.

Thats true, but Germany in particular have their balls in Russias grip at the moment, its not easy to just turn off the taps and get gas elsewhere. A chart of gas producing countries puts it in perspective : (Germany are 48th, with a figure of 337,258,250)

So the Russians are now using mobile versions of Auschwitz, and yet claim to be destroying Nazis. Still, the UN will vote on removing Russia from the Human Rights council, that'll really hit them where it hurts.

How so? If you're talking about newspapers you have a variety of viewpoints to choose from (Mail/Express v Guardian/Mirror for example). The TV news channels are broadly objective , social media is a chaotic free for all so where's the manipulation coming from? A few examples may back up your opinion.

Theres a video somewhere of a truckload of captured conscripts bemoaning their fate, complaining of being given rifles "that don't even fire". It's encouraging to think that much of Russia's vast military arsenal might be unfit for service. Also, the Russian troops now being re-deployed might not be fit for action, given the traumatic mauling they've received. A retired US general alluded to this recently, what he termed "regeneration" of battle weary troops, a process that can take many weeks. Regarding the Russian tanks, yes many will be rusting away in warehouses 1000's of miles from the front line. The T72, T80 etc have a fundamental flaw in their design which is obvious when viewing pictures of them destroyed, many have literally been blown to bits when their own ammo detonates after a ATGM hit. They have auto-reloaders instead of a manual system, thus needing only 3 men not 4 to operate the tank. These reloader carousels are mounted just below the turret, and just above the tankers with no barrier. The psychological impact of seeing your comrades blown to atoms after every hit must be enormous. Some ex US military top brass have called for Ukraine to be supplied with Abrams M1 battle tanks, a far superior and safer weapon, but I doubt this will happen. Whilst the US aid has been substantial, the recent $300M package seems a lot until you equate that with the $9 Billion per month they spent on the Iraq war.

I would take the Russian MOD figures with a very large pinch of salt. This site has been linked before : https://www.oryxspioenkop.com/2022/02/attack-on-europe-documenting-equipment.html?m=1 It lists each sides losses with photographic evidence of each entry, although as it states the actual losses will be higher than documented but there's an enormous discrepency in the figures for the Ukrainian losses, but the Russian losses are quite close to these figures. The Russians claim to have lost about 1500 men so far, the actual figure is probably anywhere between 12,000 to 18,000 dead alone. Aside from that, around half of "lost" Russian equipment has been captured by Ukraine, they have more stuff now than they started with with the exception or aircraft and ships.

I think someone like MLT, a minor celebrity if you like, has to very very careful and double check facts before tweeting about things as serious as Bucha, or Covid for that matter. The platform is a throw away and largely vacuous media IMO (I don't subscribe personally), but once it's published cant be undone. Stupid people can easily make fools of themselves, Trump is a classic example although his tweets have at least shown the world what a complete moron he is, the same is happening to MLT who seems to be slowly drifting into paranoid mental illness. If his current concern is media manipulation I could name one country in the spotlight at the moment who is practicing this with great expertise.