mrfahaji

True but part of that problem was that the centre back next to him was often Jack Stephens, who seems to enjoy heading as much as Bertrand enjoys life. I thought Cedric was one of our worst players last season, but I'm willing to give him the benefit of the doubt in that Pellegrino's hesitant, negative tactics seemed to most obvious in the way Cedric played - i.e. reluctant to get forward, always looking for a safe inside pass etc.

That's not a point I was arguing. The 'competitive' bit vs other UEFA countries referred to how competitive teams from EPL would be in European competitions. Unless you are just defending how things are. In which case, I'm not sure a sufficient (for me at least) counter argument to "we could make things better than they are" is "they are already better than elsewhere, so why bother?"

Hmmmm, I'm not sure those stats support your theory to be honest (equally, they don't categorically disprove it). It's actually 6/13 because QPR were bottom when he was sacked. There are only 3 seasons with a noticeably worse defence rank than position rank (i.e. at least 3 positions worse), Blackburn 07, Stoke 16 & Stoke 18, while there are three seasons where the defence was significantly better (Blackburn 05, Fulham 11 & Stoke 15). The reason I fetched this data wasn't solely to oppose your view either - I actually posted a similar view here https://www.saintsweb.co.uk/showthread.php?60017-Had-we%92d-gone-down-last-season&p=2647400#post2647400 , where it was met with a counter argument that Hughes's sides are good defensively. I guess we will see for ourselves as the season plays out, but I don't think the statistics demonstrate it one way or the other. Maybe he just had good defenders some years and not others!

Unless the author has knowledge of Saints' interest, or even some insight as to why Moura would be the perfect fit for us (tactically), then not really.

I don't even think it needs to be on individuals. A team wage cap would suffice, and you could even make it flexible so that bigger clubs have a bigger budget - I don't expect a level playing field, just a bit more level than it is - that way clubs would have to make the call on splashing wages on a big name player and using up all their cap, or having more 'good' players. Plus it would make players think twice regarding their wage demands - are they really moving for 'trophies'? If so, wouldn't they demand less money to ensure their club could sign a few other good players? It's just a pipe dream unfortunately. No incentive for the PL to do it as it would make them 'less competitive' vs other UEFA countries, there would be endless legal challenges about restricting people's market value like they have with the NFL, and even once in place there's no doubt club would try and find ways round it, but paying "image rights" which don't count as salary instead etc. I genuinely think it would solve a lot of football's ills though. So much money in the game and yet it all just gets spunked on player wages and agent fees. Transfer fees are absurd, but at least there is some element of knock-on effect and 'trickle down' (though even that is debatable).

Didn't see the game, but from the comments (which sound like a consensus, not just one or two wetting the bed), what on earth has happened to Romeu? He's never been blessed with pace but I had hoped that last season was just the Pellegrino effect making him so slovenly - he looked unfit - and hoped with a good preseason he might have sharpened up a bit. Not only was his defensive play sloppy last year but we rarely saw him bringing the ball forward like he did under Puel. I often think he plays better as a single DM rather than alongside, say, Hojbjerg or Lemina, but it seems to be more than to do with positioning. Any thoughts?

I too have concerns about our defence, and Hughes ability to organise one - particularly when I heard that "Stoke never did defensive drills", but I wondered whether it's true that 'over his managerial career' he has overseen leaky defences. Here are the stats: 2004/5 Blackburn - Finished 15th. GA 43, 7th best defence in division. 2005/6 Blackburn - 6th. GA 42. (7th best). 2006/7 Blackburn - 10th. GA 54 (13th) 2007/8 Blackburn - 7th. GA 48 (7th) 2008/9 Man City - 10th. GA 50 (11th) 2010/11 Fulham - 8th. GA 43 (4th). 2011/12 QPR - 17th. GA 31 in 18 games, works out to 65 over full season (16th). 2012/13 QPR - conceded GA 23 in 12 games = 73 full season (joint worst). 2013/14 Stoke - 9th. GA 52 (11th). 2014/15 Stoke - 9th. GA 45 (6th). 2015/16 Stoke - 9th. GA 55 (14th). 2016/17 Stoke - 13th. GA 56 (12th). 2017/18 Stoke - sacked with Stoke 16th. Conceded 47 in 22 games = 81 full season (worst by a long way) Clearly one or two dodgy seasons in there, but also a few good ones. Certainly not sure there's enough evidence in this to suggest that his defences are always awful.

I was running through a load of stats on whoscored to see if there were any creative or goalscoring players in some of the other leagues at smaller clubs that might be a bit more under the radar. Found three or four players I'd never heard of (admittedly, others may well have done, my world knowledge is not what it once was), and every one I googled was linked with one of the biggest teams in the world. That's the depressing state of football now, the top clubs have so much money they can afford to go after anyone who might be half-decent, regardless of whether they need them or plan to give them any game time.

I've been encouraged by the signings we have made, they are certainly inkeeping with the types of players I feel we should be going for, and at the same time seeking to address obvious problem areas. I do think we need another attacker though, and at this stage I would take either another CF or a wide attacking midfielder. I share the concern with others that Austin, Gabbiadini & Long might not be sufficient, but equally they all have their strengths and for what we can afford we're not likely to be able to get anyone better than a squad rotation player. However, getting rid of Tadic and Boufal and only replacing them with Elyounoussi is a bit of a risk. Elyounoussi strikes me as more of a 'dribbler', which means we will be lacking a player with a bit of guile and creativity. If I'm wrong about Elyounoussi and he is a better Tadic replacement, then we are thus still missing a player who can influence games with the ball at his feet. I can still hope Redmond shows a big improvement, but after the past couple of seasons I don't want us to be reliant on that, certainly if he continues to play on the left.

:lol: whoever came up with that deserves a medal for originality :lol:

Was it "Darude - Sandstorm"? Seem to recall that playing a fair bit. Or maybe Zombie Nation... Personally, I would like to see a return of Queen's "One Vision".

Not sure you should criticise another's intellect when you've just said that some players are giving it "200% in the gym and in training".

Yeah sure, to be honest I was more using your post to highlight the fact that he wasn't the only one with doubts, but seems to be the only one hanging on to such extreme views. Of course, if we are relegated it will be "I told you so" - after all, the reason people use forums is to prove to other people that their view is right, rather than to share ideas and perspectives, right?!

Include a clause in the deal that he MUST play against his parent club

I'm sure a lot of people did change their minds about Hughes though. I would have been very anti- him earlier in the season, when we appointed him I felt like he was the only option, but still better than Pellegrino, and by the end of the season I thought he'd done a great job and deserved a shot at the position full time. I am a little concerned about Stoke's defensive performances, and rumours that Hughes never worked on defensive drills in training, but equally some people have pointed to his time at, say, Blackburn and Fulham, as spells where he made teams solid and difficult to beat. I'm also wary that Stoke always seemed to start the season badly under Hughes. But it is ok to change your mind about someone if, over time, the evidence changes.

Pretty much, although Stuart Armstrong could also be a good addition. My issue is that we have lost Tadic and replaced him with Elyounoussi. That's fine, but after finishing 4th from bottom we need to be looking at improving our squad, not just maintaining the quality (and Elyounoussi is a risk as well - could be great, but we haven't definitely lost a creative player in Tadic).

I just googled Maxi Gomez and saw an article saying that "Celta want £4.5m after Fulham interest". Who knows how much of that story is made up (probably a lot), but if that's even close to the valuation it does make you wonder why we wouldn't be all over that in preference of spending £20m on a proven...risk!

Agreed, I think most people were encouraged and hopeful about Clasie, it just didn't work out (though I guess you can always be disappointed when the professional scouts don't get it right). Everyone was unsure and underwhelmed at best for Carillo, and totally bemused by Forster's new contract.

I am probably wrong, but of all those players listed maybe Markovic is the best value. Never really given a shot, and didn't he do quite well in his loan spell at Hull? I'm not saying I want us to sign him, but would be interesting to know what people who have seen him play more think.

He probably put in the best two individual performances from any Southampton player last season (Palace A & West Brom A). Of course two swallows don't make a summer, but it at least demonstrates some ability and potential.

Oh man, I knew they normally go there but didn't look like they were this year. I've just got back (i.e. yesterday) from Verbier, could have gone via Evian on the way back to Geneva!

Ah ok, sorry I misinterpreted your post. Yeah I think that's reasonable for the centre forward. If we could get 20 between the players who share the CF spot (i.e. Austin + Gabbiadini + 1 from Long) that would be decent.

If Gabbiadini scores 12-15 goals and isn't even our main striker then we're in for a storming season...! I'd take one or two of our support attackers getting close to double figures to be honest.

Yep. From the OP, the line that jumped out at me was "Elyounoussi. Ward-Prowse. Sims. Redmond". Not sure there's enough there, especially if Elyounoussi doesn't live up to expectations.