mrfahaji

Yes but Mourinho did it with Manchester United. There’s no doubt he is a better tactician but Pochettino turned Tottenham from a side that hoped to get close to the top four once in a while to one that is considered a contender for the title in the last few years. He has also spent very little money. God I wish he had failed at Spurs, but not sure it’s a fair comparison to make with Mourinho, Klopp or Guardiola in terms of success.

Funny that he says about playing well for 80-85 minutes but then making a mistake or losing focus and being “killed” for it. That sums up a lot of his performances.

People criticise Pochettino for not having won something, and maybe there’s something to be said for getting teams over the line, winning that “one big game”, as well as raising questions over whether Pochettino is right to make the domestic cups such a low priority. But, what they also tend to forget is that when Pochettino joined Spurs from us, while obviously a step up in terms of club stature, it wasn’t much of a step up in terms of team quality. I for one wondered how he would cope with egos like Adebayor, and wasn’t totally surprised to see him struggle initially. But he the end it’s Pochettino who has made Spurs into a side which now expects to win things (though he did get pretty lucky with Kane turning into such a goal machine, as he was reluctant to give him a chance).

Yeah, the only team they've managed to beat so far is Leicester. Oh...

Oops, post rendered irrelevant.

The first booking was a bit soft, but still arguably a booking on its own - it's a "coming together" until Hojbjerg reaches out and grabs Maddison, stopping him from advancing. I agree there's not much to it, but seen yellows given for it. Add to that the fact he had, as others have pointed out, already been warned about earlier an foul, not sure there can be any complaints. Thought it was bad Hughes tried to make excuses for it, but I'm hoping that was just him not wanting to criticise players in public and in reality he was livid.

Valid point, but Fabrice Fernandes was probably the worst headerer of a football I’ve ever seen. At least he wasn’t a defender though.

I was discussing Hughes with a mate and fellow Saints fan, he wasn't keen on getting Hughes long term, with the argument that it wasn't a "Saints appointment", and that we should be looking for an up-and-coming foreign manager, as we have done in the past. I can understand this view and would generally be onside with it, but the problem is that Saints are not currently the attractive proposition they were when Puel and Pellegrino took over. So the foreign appointment would have to be an even bigger gamble than we might have done in the past - i.e. someone with an even dodgier track record than Puel or Pellegrino. I know this all comes down to scouting, but would you trust the current regime to get it right, given the recent appointments/signings? Unbelievable Jeff has been consistent in his concern/criticism of Hughes from the start, and I think it's fair to raise the issues he has. However it does feel a bit like he is reluctant to give any credit and only too quick to play the "I told you so" card as soon as anything goes remotely awry. Did he credit with Hughes for us staying up? I'd imagine not, even though I couldn't see us getting those results we did against Bournemouth or Swansea, nor putting in the performances against Everton, Arsenal & Chelsea if Pellegrino had remained. If we finish 10th, you get the feeling that Jeff would just say "we would've finished 7th if Hughes wasn't in charge". I know his counter argument would be "but we won't finish 10th, so that's irrelevant", but it's the difference between someone raising a legitimate point and someone being hellbent on being right (and I say this as someone who also raised concerns about Stoke's defensive problems). I also raised a concern about Stoke's slow starts to the season under Hughes, and it looks like that's happening with us too. We clearly weren't helped by the decision to go to China, but I still find it frustrating when the team hasn't had as rigorous a pre season as other teams appear to have done.

Didn’t see the game (apart from MOTD) so appreciate reading the comments - obviously you have to filter the extreme ones out before getting a sense of how we actually played. Sounds like there are some positives. But the concerning thing is that the “if only” comments seem to be all too common nowadays. There’s always some small margin for why we lost, but football is won and lost at the margins, it’s not a good sign to always be on the wrong side of them. Although I do see a squad short of confidence and mediocre on quality, I don’t think it’s abject. Hughes appeared to rejuvenate the squad when he joined and it still seems like the team have the right attitude, but a manager also, whether through tactical or mental work, has to improve the players at these said margins. If you roll your eyes or have a facepalm when watching the goal your team has conceded, that is an individual mistake/lapse. If you find yourself doing it multiple times every game, it’s more than that. Also found Hughes’ defence of the sending off a bit cringeworthy. No defence for Hojbjerg’s dive.

Tbh I wasn't his biggest fan when he was at other clubs. He seemed dour, was often complaining, and I thought Stoke were pretty dirty at times when things weren't going their way against us. I imagine that fans of other clubs had and still have exactly the same opinion. The fact he came here and got the players playing more adventurous football, playing with a bit more belief & bite and ultimately kept us up has improved my view of him, but no reason why other fans would change theirs because of that.

Pellegrino and Hughes actually.

Except he has. Your point is still valid that someone of Yoshida's level shouldn't be our best CB, but I think it does him a disservice to assume he is the same player of 2 or 3 years ago.

Yep. Vardy certainly would have been instructive, but perhaps "destructive" would be a better description!

Agreed, seems a bit premature to be saying he's "clearly" our best centre back... here's hoping it proves to be the case, but at the moment I'd put Yoshida at the top of the list just because at least I know what he has to offer.

This is what I was alluding to in my earlier post, Richarlison gets far too easy a run at the ball. And it wasn't an unpredictable turn of events, from the starting position Cedric should have been aware (regardless of whether up to that point other players should have done better) of the danger aware and been more assertive in defending it. I do wonder if in this case that's an example of match fitness, which we know Cedric isn't up to speed with yet. It might sound ridiculous but when you're not 100% sharp it's more the snap decisions and reactions which suffer, rather than your ability to run the length of the pitch. Football is usually won and lost by fine margins, and a split second of hesitation or ball watching can make the difference.

It still takes presence of mind to see the opportunity to do it in a top level match. Just because I've managed it in my back garden a few times doesn't mean it's not impressive.

Can we wait for a few (5+?) games before all of this stuff? The forum doesn't need to be clogged up with every thread being an opinion piece on Hughes before we've even got a good idea how the team is going to shape up. People are right to have concerns, but given he improved some things since he joined last season, perhaps it's better to wait until we have a bit more evidence before drawing any conclusions.

Just watched it again (a few times), paying more attention to this. I do see what you're saying but I still think that at this point (see picture) Cedric is still with Richarlison and it is obvious where the ball is going to be played and the danger area he needs to protect. The move from Tosun/Stephens comes a bit earlier (i.e. before the ball is crossed). I think it's a bit much to expect Stephens to recover once he has vacated that space, but perhaps a bigger question is how he was dragged out so far so easily - which is not the first time we've seen that. You might still disagree with me, but good to hear counter arguments, it makes you look for the small details and check your opinions - sometimes even change them, just not this time

Yep, it definitely feels like this. I know he has always been a bit controversial, but when he was first here those comments seemed to be effective mind games - you might not have liked him but you could appreciate how he was operating. Now he just comes across as a bitter old man. That was what made Ferguson such an impressive manager, that he was always adapting to the changes and challenges in the game. I mean, it is true that Manchester City are only up there because of unlimited money, but United have lost the moral high ground with that in recent seasons. As much as it pains me to say it, only Tottenham (Arsenal to a lesser extent) can really claim to be in that top bracket because of anything other than outspending everyone else by a ridiculous margin.

Isn't that because we have English referees, and there were no English (FA) refs at the World Cup?

Was away this weekend so only just seen the goals. When I heard the comments about Cedric being beaten in the air I assumed it was a typical 'big guy outjumps little guy' scenario, and it's a bit harsh to blame an individual for that really, they can't help being short. But that isn't really what happens - Cedric just fails to stick with him and make it difficult. Anyone can 'run alongside' their opposite number, you have to be a bit more switched on to the danger and more pertinently, show a bit more desire to make that challenge in the box. Richarlison was barely under pressure.

Wow, that's the main thing you are lamenting amidst everything that has gone wrong over the last couple of seasons? Rodriguez was dreadful. Getting the money they did for him was one of the rare things the board did well on.

Surely you lot are barking up the wrong tree with this one

Yep, quite unbelievable really. All those additional costs that the LLDC are covering probably work out to about the same as the rent they're getting