mrfahaji

Don't get me wrong, he was partly culpable for the opening goal, but the match thread was amazing for how many people were shouting at him but not Hojbjerg, when Hojbjerg was the one who lost the ball. Apparently Hoedt should have just cleared it! But couldn't Hojbjerg have just cleared it as well then? It wasn't like he was being marked when he received the ball.

Don't forget to blame Hoedt! Second and third goals were also his fault, as were the Ings and Bertrand misses.

Agree with most of this. I was enjoying how we were playing in the second half, and then they scored a second. We were at least looking a threat going forward, shame that we couldn't make it count. It is a concern how easily we get the stuffing knocked out of us, but given our last year or two of results, is that really surprising? I'm not exactly sure what people could point to today that was directly the fault of the manager. Team selection was decent, we didn't give up too many good chances and we probably had as many ourselves, we had some spells (admittedly short) of good football. Fitness and confidence perhaps.

Brilliant goal. No doubt Hoedt will get the blame for it though.

There's obviously things that can be better, but there is also part of me that feels like Chelsea simply have a lot better players than us, and to beat a side like that you have to be well organised and hard to break down, take your chances, and get the rub of the green. Hughes can be responsible for the first two, but have we really been that bad defensively? Not sure he is responsible for Ings & Bertrand missing, nor Kepa pulling off that save a minute ago.

The thing is, Chelsea scored after the Hoedt/Giroud penalty. So it didn't affect the outcome of the game. It should have been 0-1 and then shortly afterwards, it was.

1 of only 2 comments during the spell that we were playing well. I was thinking "I'm actually enjoying watching us play". But then Chelsea score a soft goal. A bit like the first half, and something which seems typical of us.

Typical that the goal comes just as we were starting to get our heads up a bit.

edit: wrong thread sorry!

Must admit I haven't seen those. Not sure I want to either as I'd probably have the same view of it as you.

I've always thought Koeman's first season was our peak. Because Pochettino had laid the foundations of that side, which we continued to benefit from (fitness, ability to press when needed) but Koeman added a different dimension to our play. Suddenly we could pass the ball from side to side AND go direct. And defensively we were so solid, you were always confident of keeping a clean sheet. Obviously in Koeman's second season we went on that incredible run where we seemed to beat everybody, only Leicester outperforming us, and it of course led to our 6th place finish which was brilliant, but we seemed to look less convincing and maybe had more fortune about our results, rather than because we were actually better than we had been before. Just my opinion, expect there'll be people who think I'm spouting nonsense...

It isn't a great squad, true. But many people, including me, think that our troubles last season were mainly (though not completely) due to Pellegrino being in charge, because he was utterly incompetent. If you still believe that to be the case, then surely any half-decent manager would be able to fare a little better with a similar crop of players? I definitely think Hughes has improved us as an attacking threat, but ultimately it's still about results and if we are looking like relegation candidates then he isn't really doing any better than his predecessor who was deemed (correctly, in my opinion) useless. The one caveat is that we don't have Tadic this season. I was a fan, but I know some people weren't. But, I think it's fair to say that he was a player who really improved when Hughes arrived, and became a key man in our survival. So far it doesn't look like Elyounoussi or Armstrong will fill that void, whether in a similar or different way. Ings is probably the most likely to, but he's more of a striker than midfielder.

Woah, hang on a minute... at no point have I called Cedric out for being a bad player. He just happens to be very unconvincing whenever he is in a position to shoot from distance. I'm not sure he has ever scored a screamer, I think his only goal for us was against Wigan in the cup - I was there, it was very well taken (but he was also atrocious that day), but is probably the only time I've ever seen him show composure in front of goal, hence why I was surprised when he stepped up to take a penalty.

I wasn’t confident with any of our penalties, naturally, but was anyone anything other than aghast when Cedric stepped up to take the fifth?!

I seem to recall we lost away to Bolton, must’ve been early ‘00s as I think we were in yellow and Marsden missed. I’ve seen us lose to a 120th minute goal on two occasions live - John Eustace for Coventry at the Dell and Jody Morris for Chelsea at the Bridge. Closest I’ve been to seeing a shootout live - wouldn’t have been so bad had it been a 120th winner, but this is Saints after all...!

I must say, while he has made some catastrophic blunders, and the pairing of him with Vestergaard seems odd as neither have any pace, I think Hoedt has played decently from time to time. But some people won’t let it go that he is the worse player to ever play on these shores. One dodgy clearance seems to be all anyone needs to ignore any other good pieces of play from him.

I was thinking "great, we even find a way to squander a lead in a penalty shoot out..." Shortly followed by "if my life depended on someone scoring a penalty, Cedric would rank pretty low on the list of players I'd want to take it". Shows what I know! Woo!

Course we will - to win a penalty shoot out, all you need is to be strong mentally. Oh.

hmmmmph

Not sure if serious...? (just seen the other thread - no, not serious)

Know the feeling. I'm not sure football has the same problems further down the pyramid though, it's only the Premier League which is a meaningless circus. It's true that I don't complain as much about the PL when Saints are doing well in it, but that's more because it's more fun putting the noses of the big clubs and big cheeses out of joint, not because the PL is suddenly a glorious spectacle. As per shurlock's comment above (i.e. from Adam Leitch), it's no surprise that it feels like that behind the scenes because that's exactly how it feels to us supporters too.

This is what's so strange about not playing Yoshida. Some people think Hoedt is the worst player to play for Saints in history - I don't, but neither he nor Vestergaard have any pace, so I'm surprised they are constantly picked together while Yoshida sits on the bench.

Agree with this. As well as the fact that Yoshida is quick, so whether he partners Vestergaard or Hoedt (because I'm not sure whether Vestergaard was any better than Hoedt today), he offers something complementary.

I was hoping someone had put some of Merrington's classic remarks & soundbites to a famous film soundtrack when I saw this thread.

Lol. I was pro-Puel for most of that season, and even if I thought his sacking was right in the end, it was only because his job seemed untenable with the apparent unrest amongst the players. But "one of football's brilliant minds" your posts read like a p1sstake.