Joensuu

Sauce?

A person who is offended by a given term.

Did you ignore my Cameron quote then? And the UAF membership list?

Nobody. It is the term that is least likely to cause offense.

I imagine the child will grow up a mental mess. This will have nothing to do with the sexuality of his/her parents, and everything to do with who his/her parents are. Oh, and good on you Elton, now shun the wig and the limelight and settle down to parenting.

Of course people gravitate towards people they are familiar with, that's only natural. But this natural action is the polar opposite of multicultralism, it leads to divided groups.Groups need to be encouraged to mix and integrate to avoid mutual misunderstanding. What you have identified is that without multicultralism, unitegrated communites will become established. Multicultralism is the solution to this problem. There is ethnic and cultural diversity in Wales, Scotland, and Ireland too, we all aspire to be more integrated, and less divided as communites. England isn't alone in this. As for our flag, you are right it used to cause offence to many, simply because it was adopted by extreme authoritarian groups. No 'new' element of society (as you call them) is offended by the Union Flag, however they are rightly offended by the threat of skinhead violence it used to indicate. You seem to be blaming Political Correctness for this, rather than the true root of the problem - racism. There is no problem with communites 'continu[ing] with their own customs', but there is a problem when communites refuse to mix and integrated into British customs. This is what multicultralism is about, integration, not division. As for 'Sharia law', yes a tiny number of w@nkers who haven't integrated do want to impose this. This isn't a failing of multicutralism, it's a failing not to more actively support and assist multicutralism. The fact that some communities aren't integrated is discusting IMO. I think you might misunderstand multicultralism.

I think Hypo is vying for the coveted StuBensonPhilips trophy. We are in a better position than almost any club in the country, and some of our fans don’t think that’s good enough. It’s like holding four aces, and then discarding three of them in the hope that you pick up a straight flush. Of course, I’m sure this will be dismissed as b*llocks by some, after all, I shouldn’t have allowed logic or evidence to get in my way before jumping to a conclusion.

I disagree with Cameron. It is not multiculturalism that has failed, but segregation - and misunderstanding. Where communities have become separate, say in Burnley, it is natural that both groups will be suspicious of each other. Where the segregation of entire communities has been prevented, multiculturalism (in its true form) has been seen to flourish. London is obviously the best example, where there is a true cultural mix and integration there tends to be few problems, where individual communities have been able to dominate problems occur. It's not multiculturalism thats the problem, but the lack of it.

I think not:

9/10 for me. So glad we retained our best players, signed Guly and Chaplow, and moved on Puncheon. I'm also delighted that we didn't throw silly money at League One 'stars' who would probably have resented the bench and would have themselves needed replacing this time next year. My assumption is that we will bring in a couple of strong loans, bringing us short term cover without adding more league one standard players to bloat next years squad. Loans, rather than purhases, were always the sensible option for us right now. As such, if we don't bring in a couple of solid loans over the next few weeks, my rating of the window will drop.

You don't get it do you. Whether the UAF are flawless or demonic is completely irrelevant to discussing the rights and wrongs of the EDF. If you are on trial for armed robbery, and you know that your neighbour is a shoplifter, would it be relevant to your defense to mention this in court?

And why is that relevent to discussing the rights and wrongs of the EDL?

Absolutely, one warms households, the other (hopefully) warms police cells.

The last resort in Dune's rhetoric: if cornered, distract by attacking something largely irrelevant. (note to Dune, your thread's about the EDF, not the UAF, what the UAF do, or don't do, has no bearing on the actions of the EDF). Anyhow, until the EDF ban all their skinheads, thugs, rioters and racists, the UAF will be percieved by the public to be by far the more legitimate of the two organisations.

BTW, are the 'Moderate EDF' mentioned in the thread title a splinter group? I assume that the desperate attempt to legitimise this fascist organisation (aka the slick, PR-savvy 'mission statement') must have fractured the membership, afterall it means the EDF thugs now have to pretend not to be racist, which pretty much eliminates the primary reason all of the members joined in the first place.

Except of course the EDF action has the opposite affect. Nobody wants to be associated with racists and skinheads, so the anti-religious extremism cause becomes undermined by the EDF.

All religions are compatible with democracy, as, of course, is secularism.

Agree with you, the EDL mission statement certainly could be the basis of a sensible anti-religious extremism lobby group. Doubt many EDL members would sign up to their own mission statement. Hang on, here you were making a sensible point, only to make yourself look silly. Have you ever read the Old Testiment? Islam is no worse than Christianity.

I haven't followed the whole argument here, but how anyone can write such contrary tripe is beyond me; this is a perfect example of Dune at this inaccurate and illogical best. It's like having a conversation with a bolshie teenager who wants to 'win' so much that they argue black is white.

Sorry, but what is a 'christian democracy'? Oh, and why is the only alternative to this 'Socialist'?

What is a 'working class Conservative'? Is it someone who is using an economic excuse to justify their bigotry, or just a masochist?

Certainly all sounds plausible (plausable?), but surely thats an assumption on your part? It would also make Cortese`s (partial) denial of any loans a lie. I also fell you have over estimated the start up costs. Our spending to date broadly matches our income. You might be right, but if so lies have been told. Perhaps youre right to be sceptical, after all the board have let us down for years. Perhaps im just old-fashioned when i give people the benefit of the doubt until they first let me down.

Agree with you on the first two points (although, seen as our stated aim is to break even, and our current expenditure would suggest that we are doing so, then I think it safe to consider that to be our current policy, until there is evidence to the contrary.). Hang on Gemmel, why are you assuming that there are any loans? Weren't they (mostly) dismissed by Cortese when he said "we are a debt free healthy club". Also listen out for his response to Dubai_Phil. So, if loans and debt have been denied, what leads you to assume the opposite?

Cortese certainly indicated to this reporter that he aimed to break even once we are in the Championship (albeit without a direct 'break even' quote). http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/paulfletcher/2009/09/back_from_the_brink_southampto.html?page=15 After you referring to this interview? http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/teams/s/southampton/9269293.stm About 3:20ish Cortese is asked who is now in charge. If you notice he very carefully avoids answering the question, and instead tells us that everything is the same as it was when Markus was around, and that 'Markus [was] never ever involved'. However, Cortese was employed by Markus, and would have been removed by Markus if he (Leibherr) wasn't happy. As such, if nothing has changed, then Cortese IS still answerable to somebody, and that somebody has to be the current owner(s). Agreed. So let's base our estimate on the minimum known. Just by merit of being both debt free and by having a relatively high income, we are by far the wealthiest club in League One. Even compared to the top Championship clubs we are very wealthy. Of course, this is just the mimimum estimate of our known wealth.

http://www.ridgeway.co.uk/ - Looks to me to only be a deal with the local dealers.