S-Clarke

I find it depressing when people use the ''we got a profit'' ''he allowed us to buy x'' lines to try and justify a sale, it's a truly depressing way to think about anything. We shouldn't give a shit about money, finances. All we should care about is having the best players on the pitch and watching a game that's enjoyable, which is what we pay for at the end of the day. I don't pay money to watch us to then get a hard on about how much we sell player x for. Charly was grossly misused under Martin, very much the same way as Charles. He was too much of a maverick for Martin which says more about him than it does Charly.

It's getting to the point where one of us lot should step into the dugout and inject a bit of common sense into proceedings. Why would anyone start a midfield two of Aribo and Smallbone? What on earth do you see in them, attribute wise, to come to the conclusion that they can be of any use in midfield at this level? (heck, even the Championship as a pair). It was no surprise we looked better in the 2nd half when we had a midfield, a bit of a cliché but it is the the engine room - it's where everything goes right or wrong, if you start the game without a midfield it's just a case of the defenders playing damage limitation - and when you start with Wood and Bednarek as your defenders, you can't even play damage limitation. This has been the most soul destroying season I couldn't even have imaged in August, we play every game like a lower league underdog going up against a big boy - we have a little spell in the match, but overall are no where near good enough and end up losing. At this stage we are not even a top half Championship side. What we take away from today is that Bournemouth are absolutley light years ahead of us on the pitch, as we knew would be the case. How our ownership have allowed that to happen - with their fanbase and infrastructure - is frankly unacceptable and they have no more leeway, get it wrong next season and it's game over for them and their ownership game with us - and as a fan base we've got to be very, very vocal about it.

I know what you mean, but I think peoples opinions are a little skewed by the Tella situation. There will be the odd occasion when that happens, but I think generally when a PL club loans out players and they do well at a lower level, it's to the benefit of the then PL club rather than anyone else. I can't imagine a situation where Edwards isn't starting for us next season, he's got a big contract and the loan has been perfect for him this year - the situation where it benefits ourselves, QPR and the player.

The only chink of light that I can cling onto is that fortunes in football can change so, so quickly (when you're not a 'big' club). It can go sour for Bournemouth as quickly as it could turn good for us, although at the moment it looks slim pickings!

Yep, very true. Our CB recruitment is leading the way in crapness. Only we can go from Fonte and VVD to Yoshida and Stephens less than a year later. The Southampton Way of doing things differently I guess.

Yeah he has, but if you go back to 2018/2019 the most consistent factor with our awful defence has been Bednarek. Bar a couple of purple patches here and there, he's been involved in it all. Both 9-0's, the 5-0's, 6-0's etc. +60 goals conceded in every season he's been a consistent part of it, I include last season in that as well. He's definitely redeemed himself professionally since his stomp off to Villa, but he is one of the reasons we leak goals as he's so incredibly limited.

Such an awful goalkeeper. No idea why coaches talk him up so much, there aren't many worse which the stats back up.

He has form for this, it's how he got his move from Ipswich to Swansea originally. That's why he was booed by Ipswich when we played them, he left a sour taste. It's a shame that it will end like this as he was excellent for us last year, but he'll certainly never play for us again imo.

When fans are so, so negative about their team after a poor run of form, it's surprising how often the game turns out to be decent and they get a result. On this occasion though? No chance. We're just not at the level to compete with teams like Bournemouth anymore, it's not poor form it's just a poor team. The fact that Bournemouth are now levels above us should send SR's heads spinning, as they've let this happen.

People are in danger of following the generic ''Player to leave script'', which entails entirely downgrading their past performances and impact for us and making them out to have always been poor. Happens all the time. He has been poor this season, no question, but last season he was our best player. The best CM in the league IMO. You can't really start to call last season decent, or underwhelming, he was excellent. I still stand by the fact that he 'could' be good at PL level, only if he has the right players around him. You can't expect him to do a number 6 job on his own at this level. If you put him alongside a Romeu type then I think we'd have different opinions on him from this year. He's let himself down for sure, and has been the one player who has disappointed me the most this year. He hasn't particularly earned the right to stomp his feet after his showings this year, but let's not discredit his efforts last year.

It was well documented at the time that RM was a big part of the recruitment process in the summer, leading it in some aspects in light of no DoF. Of course recruitment is a club-wide debate, but RM had a hell of a lot of influence over our picks in the summer (Wood and Fraser as two examples). I don't think he appreciated the step up and seemed comfortable continuing with the same spine from the previous season, with the likes of BBD/Wood thrown in for good measure. If Juric was here in the summer I'm fairly certain we'd have seen a lot more physicality come into the door. Our recruitment team entirely underestimated that requirement in the summer, the power and pace teams have at this level is now ridiculous.

He is the one who built a squad so ill-prepared for top flight football, he thought it was a good idea to spend resources on the likes of BBD, Wood, Fraser, Archer etc. So it's on him. I wouldn't say the style got us promoted last season, it was the level of quality relative to that level which dug us out of lots of holes - those holes were created by the style and farting around. As we've gone up a level, the quality in our squad has dropped (which is a really poor indicment of the recruitment) - but he still persisted on playing the same style but without the required quality level to dig us out of the holes it continuously stuck us in.

Good post ally, lots of good points there. There has always been a desire to over complicate things at Southampton though, or we try to proclaim we are reinventing the wheel. That's been the case with Clive Woodward becoming our DoF, or selling all of our first team and trying to compete in the Champ with teenagers, or believing we can be successful with just passing the football - ignoring any physical requirements. At the end of the day, football is simple. It's about scoring more goals that the opposition, and letting in less than them. Picking players to achieve those things isn't as simple, but following the principles of buying good players with the right attributes and putting them into positions they are comfortable in would be a start. There was an element of arrogance coming into this season, believing our own hype and that ''pass, pass, pass'' would surprise everyone in the top flight. It really isn't revolutionary, and when you're trying to do that in the Top Flight with Smallbone, Stephens, Aribo, Armstrong, Fraser etc then you are utterly foolish really. There will be a big reset in the summer, both of philosophy and player. I expect a bigger exodus than last time and we won't be left with 'PL' players as we were last time out (such as Adams, Bednarek, KWP etc). It's not going to be an easy ride back, and it may take some time, but this summer needs to be the opportunity we start turning this club around and getting back to the basics. All eyes are on SR now, they either start doing the right things or they screw up again - and if they screw up again, they've got to go.

We need more than just Spors, he now needs free reign to build a football structure around him (inc. scouting and analysts). I'd agree that Spors is a positive step in the right direction, but it's only the start of what I hope to see before we see any real gains.

Yes, that's what I wasn't sure about. I didn't see the positive moments or positive bits of play he was referring to, so that was a bit worrying. He's been quite honest and blunt so far in his assessments of things, but yesterday his comments were a bit waffly it has to be said. I do find it hard to judge him either way though, impossible in fact. I can't be for or against him at this stage, there's too much in the mix he hasn't been able to control to come to a clear judgement.

This season is on Russell Martin. He presided over the Summer Transfer window and ensured we filled our squad with his mates, and players who couldn't adapt to PL football. I can accept Downes and THB as they had to happen based on last season, but we didn't need to sign Wood, Fraser or BBD. It was well documented that Martin had a full involvement in recruitment due to the absence of a proper DoF. He didn't understand what was required for the PL, the club - guided by him in the lack of any football structure - completely ignored the gap between the leagues. Juric hasn't done anything of note, but he can only work with what he has. The best thing I've seen from him is his understanding of what is required for PL football, he's said it a few times - and that's why we don't see Martins mates like we used to. It will take us some time to recover from what we did in Summer 24.

I do find it hard to be either for or against the manager at this stage, it really is a sad state of affairs that we have people calling for his head already. The problems are way deeper than a manager appointed a couple of months ago. Things haven't improved because we have shit players, who are hamstrung by a losing habit. They are mentally fragile as it is, so losing every week is going to be enough to end some of them. How we prepared for this season will forever haunt me. Martin and his cronies have a lot to answer for, he was overseeing the clusterfuck.

We were last year, this season not so much. He's been a big part of the reason we're sat on 9 points, our midfield has surrendered pretty much every game.

I struggle with Aribo as well, he's a good lad, but quality wise he's horrendous in my opinion. I imagine he'll be off to Turkey in the summer, that'll be a big chunk off the wage bill. It'll be a big change up, but I think we need to say cheerio to the likes of Aribo, Bednarek, McCarthy, Stephens, Smallbone etc - guys that have been here quite some time now. It's time to build around Charles, Edwards and the like, players not tarnished by the mess that went on before them. The guys above are severely damaged goods.

I think that snapshot of an 11 isn't the true story though, Danny Ings was a key part to our success during that calendar year - goals make so much difference to any team. Shortly after that we fell through the floor for what it's worth! I've always been a big Ralph fan and I think he got the maximum out of what he had available to him, but he ran out of steam due to years of zero investment. I don't think anyone would be able to do much with the above 11 over a period of time though.

I didn't say Downes nor Armstrong are pathetic. Yes, they were our best players last season, but that doesn't give them a free ride to contribute absolutley fuck all this year and nor does it give them a free ride to take the piss out of the club and 'go on strike', which is what he's done. Ugochukwu is pretty shit fwiw, don't like him at all as he can't play football - so I haven't switched that up.

The biggest takeaway from that team was the fact we had a midfield, Romeu was pivotal and provided genuine steel. Look at how pathetic we are in the middle nowadays, even last season was painful to watch. I'd love a Romeu type in our 11 again, but we have no one even fit to lace his boots. The bunch of players Juric has inherited is the most underprepared and ill-suited bunch for PL football, and even more ill-suited for the style of play he wants to play (as it was built for pass, pass, pass). It's a right old mess we've got ourselves into, it's going to take some time and probably a good few managers to get through this next few years.

And that is why I do not hold the confidence that some do on our ability to be competitive next year. We were inept, hamstrung by our losing habit and home form which doesn't exit. I'm not seeing the 'good things' that Juric claims to have seen either. A bunch of utter trash in that 11, some good players for sure, but they are brought down so badly by the utter trash we've managed to acquire over the last few years. We'll lose anyone who can play football in the summer, and we'll be left with the likes of Bree and Fraser to build around. I really don't expect anything next year other than a bumbling stoke-style season. We've got a long road ahead of us.

The players loved him because he covered up their limitations and allowed them to do whatever the fuck they wanted to do. The preparation and start to this season tells you how utterly underprepared we were. They loved him because he gave them an easy ride. Juric is a bit grizzly and will have a go, some of the softies won't like that. It is really poor show for him to drop and run like he has though, it's not like he's been the standout this year - he's been our worst midfielder by a mile.

It doesn't mean much. I always stand by the opinion that in the lower leagues momentum counts for more than money, but when you can combine momentum with a bit of money it's sometimes an unstoppable force.