StrangelyBrown

Irrespective of my feeling that RM is the wrong man for the job, I hope we win - lose and this is really bleak....

Where Man city are concerned it isn't just about the quality of their players, there is a fundamental difference between our style and theirs - they can (and do) vary it up and go long and also move the ball forward at pace - we avoid doimg either at almost all costs and it makes us so predictable.

The alternative is hope that RM finds a way to win, which frankly isn't going to happen frequently enough taking big risks around our penalty area... Making a change is at least trying something rather than accepting the inevitable

That is by far the most sensible line up and therefore the least likely to come out of Russ' magic selection tombola.

I heard something interesting yesterday on a podcast - I think they hit the nail on the head. Talking about Kieran McKenna the comment was that he's starting to be successful at Ipswich because he always puts the needs of the club first rather than his own philosophy. Whereas other managers such as Kompany and now Russell Martin put their own reputation first and blindly stick to their philosophy hoping that even if they are unsuccessful they will be known for their philosophy and it will enable them to go on to something better. This certainly fits with RMs comments about the journey he and his disciples have been on. Sadly, RM isn't about Southampton Football Club he is about Russell Martin.

But we all know that "must pick" isn't a setting on the RM forward line tombola....

At least we didn't get dicked and we learned that Ryan Manning isn't our saviour after all. So still a complete waste of everyone's time. We're not going to win if we give the ball away in stupid positions so we're not going to win playing Russball which in the PL relies on us having players who are good enough not to make mistakes against the very best players. I just don't get why we continue to do the same things over and over again without learning that it doesnt work...

I clearly don't understand this football thing if Ryan "a bit too shit for the championship" Manning is our saviour.

I'm hoping that RM will have a change of heart and play a pragmatic counter attack based on 4-2-3-1: Ramsdale KWP ABK Harwood-Bellis Taylor Downes Lallana Dibling Fernandes Archer Stewart And that we give it a damn good go and keep playing to the very end.

To get anything out of this game requires pragmatism and acceptance that we aren't good enough to try and keep possession against some of the very best players in the Premier League.... By the looks of things Russ is still going to be here so undoubtedly we'll try and play Russball. We're going to get royally spanked. What a waste of everyone's time.

"we discussed no tactics at half time" - sums it up 100%. He's literally taken no ownership for the the way we set-up and has put it all on a lack of character from the players. Just an idea, but perhaps the players didn't have any belief because we were set up to lose from the start? RM is starting to show Nathan Jones levels of delusion.

Bye bye Russ you fucking helmet

Fucking clueless team selection and no change in the way we are playing since we conceded. RM really is a helmet sometimes

I'm not sure you can put Derby's downfall to simply getting relegated with the lowest points total - they were a club with financial problems that went through the very core of the club combined with woeful management at a club level.

I thought there were some positive signs today and we could easily have come away with a win if only Archer was playing with a bit of confidence. Lallana's role baffled me a bit - he clearly doesn't have the legs to cover yards he was expected to and gave the ball away cheaply a few times in deeper positions, but on the flip side gave us some much needed experience and creativity that we missed as soon as he went off. RM needs to work out how to fit him into the team so that he doesn't need to run around so much and can orchestrate things. The subs were my major frustration - why bring on players who have already fallen short this season to try and see out the game. Armstrong and BBD are nowhere near good enough. Aribo did nothing in the short time he was on the pitch. Archer and Stewart both look like they need some game time to build confidence, but the league is unforgiving and I suspect their confidence will be shot after today. Dibling and Fernandez both look quality - I just hope we'll get to enjoy them for longer than this season!

Archer looked the better player IMO - might have missed his 2 chances but all Delap did was fall over

Absolutely this. I thought we'd only get a point against Forest, but I hadn't really given them credit for their front 3 so with hindsight we were always going to struggle. The next few games should give us a few points, but let's see what happens....

I just wonder if anyone other than RM thinks he should be anywhere near the team... I'd be surprised if there was anyone to be honest

I'd be interested in seeing a poll of whether anyone thinks he's good enough for a starting place or not.

Really? While I don't believe that stats tell the whole story, the "end product" narrative that is thrown around on here doesn't stack up. Edozie was our 5th biggest contributor for goals and assists last season (6 goals and 3 assists) despite playing far less minutes than everyone else in the top 10 apart from David Brooks. His record was better than Ryan Frazers and yet Frazer got more playing time - was that because Frazer had better end product or because he was RMs mate??

2 games into a season we expected to struggle in against two established sides with decent premier league quality attackers and we've only lost by 1 goal in each game and yet it is doom and gloom again on here... Get a grip folks

Not sure about this. We're at the end of Howard Wilkinson's strategy to reset English football. Job done. Now we need a new strategy that creates a clear identity for English football and delivers on that. This is far deeper than simply the manager isnt good enough. We don't really have an identity other than making other teams play down to our level.

I can't, he hasn't been good for a couple of years now and is perpetually injured. He's also significantly overpaid. Literally makes no sense to me otherwise than nostalgia.

Fair play to Martin, he seems to be learning and adapting our approach now to the games ahead of us rather than religiously holding onto one way of playing. Hopefully he can keep learning as there is a steep learning curve ahead next season, but I think he's earned himself a bit of time from us all to get the team up to speed and learn what it takes to get results in the top flight.

Fantastic stuff. Incredibly stressful to watch, but gobsmacked how resolute we were in our defending. Russell Martin - all is forgiven. He seems to be learning and what a time to add pragmatism to his football playbook.