yorkiesaint

12-14 hours if there is a direct flight. Quite a long way.

I'll be happy if we beat Norwich to be honest. They have turned over Arsenal and Man U this season and look very well organised. Might be as hard as the Liverpool game.

Yes david but in your 7 games: spurs got 10 points, times by 5.4 (approx gives you the 38 games) and this gives 53 for the season- mid table, but probably should and will do better. saints got 6 points, times by 5.4 and this gives 32 for the season- relegation form. My point is that in the premier league these small differences are enough to sink a team, even if some of the results are the same. This is without considering that spurs won some of their other games and we did not.

I called for NA to get the sack after the WBA game. Worse start in premier league history, coupled with naive defending, strange substitutions. Personally I think NA underestimated the required quality, preferring to get fitter people on the pitch even if they were less experienced, or not as able. The set up of the team was wrong, and presumably under NA's control. Even if he does turn it around (which I hope he does incidentally!), it will be after a series of errors that would have cost any other manager his job. We have beaten the two other teams in the relegation zone which is great, and looked great going forward against QPR. Now we have to start beating the better sides to stand a chance. The Reading win has given me more hope!

This has to happen. We have the second worse defence in premier league history. If we continue at this rate, we will finish the season on 15 points. We are completely disorganised when we don't have the ball. Our new signings aren't improving the team enough, or at all. whether adkins or les reed or both go I don't care, but something has to change.

I don't think so. It cost 33 million all in, plus there is the outstanding loan to pay back. If/when we are relegated who's going to pay 40-50 million for a championship club? I would say the investment is looking decidedly shaky.

The problem with this theory that we went up too soon is that we were clearly better than w ham last season, but they have shown that with a more modest outlay it is possible to push on to mid table. Our problems are so obvious that even forum mongs can spot them, and we look like doing a reprise of Billy Davies's Derby or McCarthy's Sunderland.

Only 3 teams have survived a goal difference of -8 or more after 8 games in the 21st century, although Wigan have done it twice. The good news (?) is that we are one of them! However, then we had 6 points and -9 GD and went on to finish mid table with a goal difference of -8. Goal difference after 8 games, league of shame this century: 2007-8 Derby -16 Relegated 2003-4 Wolves -15 Relegated 2009-10 Hull -12 Relegated 2001-2 Leicester -12 Relegated 2012-13 SAINTS -11 ?? 2012-13 Norwich -11 ?? 2011-12 Bolton -10 Relegated 2012-13 QPR -10 ?? 2005-6 Everton -10 Survived 2011-12 Blackburn -9 Relegated 2010-11 W Ham -9 Relegated 2010-11 Wigan -9 Survived on GD 2009-10 Burnley -9 Relegated 2009-10 Skates -9 Relegated 2007-8 Reading -9 Relegated 2006-7 Charlton -9 Relegated 2003-4 leeds -9 Relegated 2002-3 S'land -9 Relegated 2001-2 Derby -9 Relegated 2001-2 SAINTS -9 Survived! 2011-12 Wigan -8 Survived 2005-6 W Brob -8 Relegated 2002-3 W ham -8 Relegated 2002-3 W Brom -8 Relegated 2000-1 Bradford -8 Relegated

An excellent post. I think it is fairly safe to assume that when the £33m was converted into shares that marked the end of financial commitments from the liebherrs. There never has been a pot of gold, just an investment which will be profitable if they can sell their shares for more than they paid. I have always assumed that this is the endgame of the 5 year plan, but of course I might be wrong about this.

he says 'he hopes it will go right'.....

Saint Scott, I appreciated your post.

Noodles, you torture us enough with your avatar!

Can we see the poll results hour by hour?

TBH I would be just as excited about Adam Johnson. On another level than Phillips. Wolves asking silly money for Jarvis. Who are the alternative targets should it fall through?

I would say: Davis 4: some good moments, some bad. Should have closed down Tevez for the 1st goal. Clyne 7: promising debut, did really well, mistake led to city's 2nd. Fonte 7: great in the air Hooiveld 6: will improve Fox 6: not helped by Rodriguez. Mistake led to third goal Ward-Prowse 7: great game for the 17 year old. Saints improved when he went off though Lallana 7: solid good passing Puncheon: 7 did his job well, a threat when he had the ball near the box Guly 8: showed his versatility, great performance for the team Rodriguez 5: not his fault, Adkins takes responsibility Schneiderlin 7: defended well Lambert 9: changed the game. Presumably not fit enough for 90 mins S Davis: 8: improvement on JWP Sharp not enough time, but the right move to put him on. Adkins 8: starting line up a compromise, planned a strong finish and got one. Need Ramirez on the left!

I expect us to lose, but I feel we can do better then the last ten minutes. For all the good work we are failing at things we can get right. Unless Adkins can work some magic City will turn the screw in the second half.

Well. Very poor, we look nervous. Davis struggling, should have narrowed the angle or the goal. Fox and Rodriguez struggling. Clyde doing well, probably the only positive.

I agree with you, quantity isn't everything, and some were squad players. However: For Swansea they included Siggurdson, McEachran, Caulker, Graham, Routledge, Lita and Vorm. For Norwich Vaughan, Morisson, Bennett, de Laet, Pilkington, Johnson, Naughton and Ayala were all important last season, maybe de Laet less so. Some of these were loans, so maybe that is part of our strategy too.

Norwich last summer: 8 signings Swansea last summer: 11 signings Reading this summer: 7 signings W ham this summer: 8 signings Us this summer: 4 signings

Is Jordan Rhodes still up for grabs? I would like the look of Lambert Sharp Lee and Rhodes as a strikeforce.

People who would have liked to have scored as many as Guly this season: Carlton Cole Kenny Miller Nicky Maynard Craig Mackail-Smith Nicola Zigic Marvin Sordell Adam Le Fondre

38 now in Devon but grew up in (ahm), Totton. First home game was sometime in the mid '80s, a 1:0 defeat to Birmingham City who scored 5 mins from time. Can't remember the year but the goal precipitated an angry pitch invasion which emptied the stand. I was a small kid in this big melee, so I won't forget it. I'm sure someone on here will remember it. First away match was a 4-0 defeat to Derby County at Pride park. 4 goals in 15 mins, sitting with my Derby-supporting mate. Never did that again!

Rupert Lowe taught you well, but your jedi management tricks will be no match for the premier league! I am one of those doubters. Instead I argue that we follow Norwich's example and cherry pick the most exciting players from the lower leagues, players that can clearly step up, no prima donnas, no bad apples, no cut price italian imports. Introduce the best youngsters as we go, I have no problem with that. Others have named good candidates already.

I agree, if w. ham are not promoted i will be very surprised. They have a premier league quality squad. The best we can hope is that they take points off our rivals.

Its hardly a closed question that Sharp can make it in the premier league, he hasn't got amazing pace or unstoppable raw power. In that sense Maynard is less of a risk.