saint1977

Who says Southampton v Burnley would be a dull 0-0 draw? Mee at fault there but Danny so composed, compare that to the panic in that position of Theo or Che. Theo could’ve had a tap in before that but wasted Redmond’s good byeline work by not running in front of the defender and that’s about anticipation. Dyche will do his nut at the defending before Ht, very un-Burnley like. Need to not give them a soft third here before the break.

Gifted a way back in by Pope despite the good contact by Armstrong, compensated for Fraser’s inability to save Vydra’s also decent shot at the other end. Stu and Danny have looked the only PL quality Saints so far, JWP not fully fit. Bednarek has been dreadful today. KWP might be happier with Pieters off. Getting a bit more joy being direct.

That was on the cards, they’ve already been in behind 2-3 times with Fraser saving after 40 secs with Saints giving the ball away in terrible areas. Silly foul by KWP although Pieters is a strong lad. Looking a bit brighter so far going forward but too slow with the final ball. And Burnley nearly in again behind. Pieters gets the better of KWP again and nearly a repeat.

Enjoying a book by the conservative author Ed West at the moment called Small Men on the Wrong Side of History. It tracks how Conservative values and policies since the 1980s when capitalism was so much preferable to the Iron Curtain have declined and in fact collapsed amongst under 45s and my group Generation X, which normally would be becoming a lot more Conservative by now. Socialism looked totally defeated, hence New Labour. The hypothesis is that conservatism has retreated into pessimism and cultural envy, when just 30 years ago it had a clear advantage, professional people would not have aligned with the values of the USSR even if Benn, GLC did, although they were regarded as losers. I can see a lot of truth in the book which takes a fresh look at historic political thinkers. Both left and right in the social media age have retreated into a shouty and extreme echo chamber which clashes at each other and what they actually have in common is misperceived as differences. The most vehement and angry conservative posters and worst hatred comes from the dispossessed. The modern day conservatives have been able to regain and retain power through Labour’s own infighting - Corbyn and either side - and crises contrived to divide and rule eg austerity, Brexit, immigration and nationalism/patriotism. Spending a fortune on regeneration in their newly won seats is keeping poll ratings going but how long is this sustainable? The backlash against loud identity politics is helping the government at the moment and putting Labour’s divisions into view again but they are swimming against a medium term tide demographically. Look at NI - catholics recently overtook Protestants for the first time very recently.

You can see why the Welsh Government has been if anything even stricter than England in COVID restrictions https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-56623504

Ralph is similar to Ronald in this respect if the stories are to be believed. Interestingly, I don’t think Valery has even been on the bench since Bowyer took charge at Birmingham. Could be he has an injury but haven’t read about it. He started initially for Karanka but dropped to the bench and now not even in the squad fighting the drop in the division below. The academy has still produced talented players in recent years - not the JWP/Shaw crop certainly, but Hesketh, Slattery, Sims, Vokins and Valery could all have done much better than they have. Smallbone sadly got injured when starting to improve. There is the likes of N’dundlu but I don’t think he’s anywhere near PL/Champ standards. Mitchell came in with much fanfare and MU etc chasing him but looks like another flop. Can’t blame Ralph for that, Crocker is going to have to rebuild and get rid of Reed’s staff. Facilities are there but will take a few years to regenerate and don’t have an owner who can help RH with buying younger first team competing players as well as first team starters to bridge the gap.

Predictably depressing and binary responses to the report from many quarters, rather than a balanced look at what's improved and what remains to be improved with a commitment to action plans to remedy them. For me, single identity politics has gone too far, it's very hard to write cohesive responses to address issues for a whole range of different groups. That was the whole point of rolling gender, race, disability, LGBT+ into the Equality Act 2010 from each of the previous generation of individual acts 1970s-90s. If you tackle persistent inequality and dismantle barriers for one focus area, it should create the conditions to do it for all. Just seems that May/Cameron's obsession with immigration led to Windrush, building de-regulation too rapidly led to Grenfell, austerity re-opened a sense of socio-economic bitterness across the most deprived areas for all groups (including white working class). What some of the responses on this thread lose sight of is how many of the posters here are from a BAME background? I'm not, so there has to be some listening from beyond the loud voices of the activists on social media about what their life is actually like in Haringey, Burnley, Bristol or Shirley. What matters to them and what might help them? I think the socio-economic issues are getting over-run by the cultural issues. Those do certainly require reasoned and objective discussion as well e.g. history and the Empire but they are cheaper headlines for the tabloids to produce a headline on. Talking of socio-economic inequalities: People from ethnic minorities are more likely to have persistent low incomes and among young people unemployment rates are high even for Indian and Chinese people who "comfortably outperform the white average in education and incomes overall and generally benefit from positive stereotypes". It says discrimination is "likely to be a part of the story", with experiments showing ethnic minority candidates have to apply for about 1.6 times the number of jobs to get the same number of responses as a white person. Here's one area that could be focused on from the report. HR departments are part of the problem - they collect logos like Stonewall or Disability Confident but what I've seen as a manager in other areas is that it gets people an interview but the questions/process are very narrow or the person is offered the role and then has problems with checks especially if they aren't UK born (thanks to Theresa May). If the person makes it through that to the start date because they are an excellent candidate, they then need the right mentoring at different times to maximise their potential. That's just as true for someone white who has been in the care system, left the military through illness as it is race. The current approach from too many employers, big public sector as the worst, is that it doesn't put this investment in, it collects data and logos to make them feel better. Even when it recruits, retention and progression levels are too low, especially for Afro-Caribbean backgrounds. I don't agree that bit of the report entirely - some fair adjustments are needed, especially as this pandemic is going to leave quite a legacy of ill health added to an ageing population managing multi-conditions working longer. The move towards more flexible working might have a positive longer-term impact in maximising the skills and contribution for more of the population instead of the old fashioned employer culture pre-COVID.

Yep, some top players have graduated from the big U21 sides as we are finally seeing with Shaw and JWP’s emergence after being an U21 bedrock but equally Jankewitz could turn out to be Yoann Folly, a staple in the French U21 sides but running out for Plymouth within a few years of his SFC debut. Tim Sparv was another with big billing, again not a bad career but certainly not signed by Bayern aged 25 in his prime. Did knock Saints out of Europa under Koeman though.. Domestically, Ravel Morrison represented all of the England age sides but seemingly attitude and application spoiled one of most natural abilities amongst his peers.

Lerner did invest quite a bit at the start, restored the famous Holt Hotel, then lost interest. Although he did always sound like a driving instructor’s nightmare. The official story on Gao was that he leveraged against his own assets outside of China (Macau?) through lenders in Hong Kong. I don’t know how Kat got the PL to pass him and proper, the intentions about why he bought it are about as clear as a frosted window. If it was domestic reasons I don’t think they must have led to much benefit, certainly I didn’t see anything which indicated it had. I can’t think it makes it any easier as a sale although a good due diligence period might flush some of the questions out. His companies didnt seem to be doing overly well eg Lander and the LD Sports thing was odd. I struggle to see how he will make a profit and probably a considerable loss - of assets to the bank if the original statement was true. If there was a choice between Da Grosa and Gao - not a great choice at all but I think with the former we’d have some chance of following what he and his lenders were up to. Bordeaux was a red flag though. As for Radcliffe, good as that would be, it pops up on here every so often as a wish rather than a firm connection. Was linked to Chelsea so has the means but can watch his football at Monaco. Question is, would Saints add value to their current portfolio, especially with work permit regs now so harder to trade a pool of players? Maybe they would and we are less likely to get in Europe than Monaco. Can’t see anyone paying top whack with the loan and Gao hadn’t sold the club even before that, seems to have been for sale for some time. LeG hinted on here that someone was close to buying per pandemic although as per previous post, you’d have thought period of exclusivity first, even if a proper buyer could me that shorter though having demonstrable funds.

A few interesting bits of info on players eg Gunn’s second loan isn’t mandatory, although I recoil at £13.5m paid for him. At today’s prices and for an outfield player, that’d be £20m+ and there would be no pressure on the Ings situation because that’s a big chunk of the replacement. Les and Ross you morons, we didn’t even need a third first team keeper. The pair of bunglers probably thought someone would bid for Fraser but not after the loopy second contract extension. Reed did more damage than Branfoot, Askham and Lowe combined. Sounds like Vesty off and Salisu is replacement. Hope JV hasn’t firmly settled on Spurs unless we can pull another KWP out of the hat in exchange eg Tanganga on loan/fixed fee option. Rather that than a poxy £12m fee or something. Brendan might pay more and I would rather be managed by him than Mourinho. The main item of interest is the sketchiest, eg takeover. It’s not surprising there is scant information as Gao doesn’t communicate with the club he owns four fifths of let alone outsiders. As we also still don’t even know why he bought in the first place, it’s impossible to guess with any accuracy what his price or conditions eg deposit might be for buyers. The only facts we do know is that the interest on the loan will bite in the near future, wrecking any ideas of self sustainability, and the club is a liability not an asset if the club is relegated. So selling sooner rather than later would help him but a canny buyer will know this and drive his price down, whatever that is. There were some rumours the string start had led to him raising the price but I don’t think Da Grosa ever had the funds anyway. Domestic issues in China if relations sour further with the West may force matters. What we know from the late 2000s on here is that for all the magnificent seven stuff and people with briefcases, the real buyer was in the background keeping their own counsel, because they had the means but wanted the best deal so the net investment counted. There was lots of noise at Derby but that’s fallen through. I bet Dyche is not better off in the transfer market at Burnley this summer. Interesting new Bahrain owner at Wigan but will have to wait and see. Next season is going to be a brute if there isn’t a takeover by June though, which seems unlikely unless there was another exclusivity period in place to examine the finances.

Not racist but a tannoy for Lord Duckhunter (and others) to this thread. I remember the stick Wendy Toms got as a new lino (and she was decent at it, often in tandem with fellow Dorset resident Paul Durkin) but a female referee is pioneering territory. MInd you, working in a postal sorting centre at the same time probably prepared her to deal with some of the terraces. Can’t be worse than Mike Dean or Lee Mason as a positive. Just waiting for the first tabloid or social media storm about chanting by fans when they are back in grounds and the likes of MIllwall away is nasty for even the most robust of players and officials. The current players might not be so bothered as previous generations might have been. She could do a good job, hope she does, and it could be a quiet start as Vale are safe and Harrogate are nowhere near the top or bottom in 15th. https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/56578350

Putting Bowen to one side, you can see why the PL and FA are hot on the issue though. As well as the almost daily racist tweets after matches, you’ve got stuff like this. I agree with Baddiel, extreme reactions to something so innocuous on the inclusion front are not just an Aston Villa or sport issue, but society over the last few years on social media. Hopefully with the nice weather they will find other activities than spewing bile. https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/56570189

I also felt it was a bit unfair to have dug it up from when Bowen was a minor so we do broadly concur. In the current climate where the topic is very heated (given the volume of abuse being directed at black players globally) there’s some positives that can come out of it through educating the next generation rather than punishing the player now, which I don’t think would be reasonable. One of the learning points is that nothing is ever really deleted on social media platforms. I do hope that he doesn’t have any sanctions from the PL but my suggestion came about as an alternative to a fine or ban. I personally would leave it at his apology as it was when he was 15.

He did, and it is a horrible word. He was a 15 year old from Hereford at the time with very narrow horizons that will have broadened massively now as a 24 year Premier League star in one of the world’s biggest cities and a diverse squad in some mitigation. I’ve not seen any other incidents involving Bowen since and I think it should be seen as an opportunity for him further down the line post worst of pandemic/social distancing to educate today’s generation of 15 year olds in a couple of workshops run by WHU who would look up to him about how what he wrote and what the world is really like. IMHO, that would be a better than a fine which has no impact or a ban for what he did as a minor.

England game not worth commenting on other than another JWP cap. Damned however many they won by but give credit to Albania for not folding like a garden chair like SFC do. At least it was better than the midweek waste of time v Italy Z, just relegate them and the other joke nations to playing Netley Central. Adams starting for Scotland in Israel, that should be a more eve game and harder to call. Israel competent and Scots improving.

I agree with much of this, and I put it down in some ways to the introduction of more overseas players in the 1990s onwards enhancing techniques and style of play. Taking your example of OR, his football education was at Barca where the emphasis on control in tight spaces would have been encouraged alongside the defensive work. Most DMCs from that era would have got an early yellow like Rom but then a red with the lack of control. The very best centre halves of that era eg Hansen could play and Mark Wright was more cultured than most, but the majority were the ‘get it clear including the striker’ brigade. Pitches have improved greatly which helps playing out from the back. Pace of the game has increased several fold, watching the Big Match and MOTD back from the 70s and 80s some of the games remind me of our last League One stint in terms of tempo. Probably less scope as a result to take risks as the very best sides domestically eg City take you to the cleaners on the break so ruthlessly if you lose it in the wrong areas. James Maddison is another good example of a current day player with exceptional ability, as is Grealish but Jack is one of the very few outside of clubs regularly playing in Europe. I guess I’m just disappointed with SFC as we have traditionally either produced them or bought them, but the PL sides in the bottom half are generally horribly workmanlike to watch with the odd exception.

First season where I became aware of Saints and started following. Great team and he was a core part of it. The club was so entertaining to follow and 83/84 was probably the best season. An era when it was a game and not a pure business. Unfortunately, whereas every club in D1 and a fair few in D2 had a Worthington/Osgood/Currie/MLT/Bowles/Hudson type player that’s not been the case for a long time. Only real entertainers today are at City/Utd and maybe 2 or 3 other clubs, with likes of Rodriguez going to Everton for a season. Tadic and Lallana are the nearest we have had recently, Rickie was very technical and skilled for a target man. Spurs have one in Alli and Maureen won’t even play him.

I just don’t see the point of SFC any more - this aspect of the industry is supposed to be one of its global and national USPs and deservedly knocked out of a competition where it has a proud history by a club which as others have pointed out probably spends 10% of SFC’s youth development budget if that. Well done Burton, showing their growth and hunger as a club. Unlike the first team, the budget for the academy is very significant and it isn’t washing its face. The young players bought in to much fanfare seem to regressing badly. There appears to be a revolving door of journeymen coaches - the likes of Dodd and Paul Williams had actually played a lot of PL games and could prepare young players for its rigours. With the facilities, budget and reputation, the club should be able to attract the best coaches in that category. Whole club reeks of decay and takeover needed to save the club urgently.

Judging by other examples eg Bamford for Leeds I think it was, it’s the former eg Stockley Park don’t understand the rules. That’s what happens if you let ex-posties run games. Ex players from the lower leagues please trained through the levels who actually understand the game

Yes he is a good player and what we need. Probably need a takeover in the early summer to buy all of the players we need with two FBs (one who is 2 footed to cover Berty’s upgrade and KWP) a CB if Vesty goes, a CM if Jankewitz isnt ready, winger and strikers required. Sad about Lewis Cook, good player on his day but yet another ACL casualty. An injury which needs far more research as it has increased a lot in recent years. Assuming Lerma injured today as well? He’d have caused problems in gaining midfield control without Romeu available.

Was Yan Valery injured for Birmingham or has Lee Bowyer rumbled him after a single training session? Had been on bench for Karanka. Don’t think we will see him in a Saints shirt again, lower league overseas loans for 2 years. Better news for Jake Vokins, played nearly all of the 2-0 win for Sunderland at Accy. Hopefully doing his confidence and experience some good there after a shaky start.

Sounds like Gao will be gone soon, clearly there’s been discussion about the risks of the lack of available capital to the PL brand. If SFC can limp over the safety line on the pitch then the PL will want Gao moving on and bringing in more owners who can underwrite some of the pandemic losses and bring stability. Kat’s made her money already so whilst she’s sold to Gao when she shouldn’t have, I can’t see her wanting to compound it if someone proper wants to buy for her stake. The PL should never have allowed Gao to buy and also there’s domestic pressure in China to move football clubs on as assets. Fosun might be able to weather it but it seems unlikely Gao has the clout to. Lets hope unlike Derby’s takeover saga whoever it is acts fast to save the club and we don’t end up with what Burnley have. Wont be another Markus but they need some upfront investment on a significant scale to shore the club up and rebuild the playing side.

Considering the old left regularly referred to New Labour as ‘Tory Scum’ that’s probably accurate. Fair comment, I’m conversely a smidgen left of centre on economic and social issues but also get contaminated with the leftie tag by the ‘Conservative Way Forward’ and Monday Club brigade when many of my views are anything but. Met have many failings and were a bit heavy handed but put in a very difficult position - protecting the government’s social distancing rules which have broad x-party support limiting the pandemic whilst the same politicians now grandstand and kick verbal lumps out of the police. I don’t think it’s entirely fair. As for examples chanting - even if it’s a very small minority - to defund the police and other slogans, just no. That’s not the hallmark of restoring a more balanced and civilised society. It is worth pointing out that some of the vigils did socially distance and focused on remembering Sarah Everard which is the primary issue at hand. What’s been unfortunately lost in the noise is the broader valid concern at the extent of growth of violent anti-female ideologies on the dark web, seemingly where there’s a cross-section of activists who are also players in the EDL/far right environments we both loathe as hate tends to cross gender/race/difference boundaries. That’s not to say this particular suspect used them but there is a growing number of criminal trials in the US, UK, Australia and NZ which demonstrate early links to similar online content inciting people. Sadly, some of them seem to grow out of well-intentioned networks to help male mental health, which receives far less support than it ought to but which are then taken over by extremist agendas.

Good technique, deflection didn’t put Che off his set up at all and very clean volley, Sanchez no chance. 3 in 3 now. Now, sharpen up the overall performance. Get Minamino and Tella running at their glacial back four.

Yes, the Clinton’s certainly knew Epstein well, as did other elite figures despite Fox allegedly trying to crop them out of photos https://www.forbes.com/sites/lisettevoytko/2020/10/18/spider-book-excerpt-how-trumps-presidency-helped-expose-jeffrey-epstein/?sh=2b6f9137408f