saint1977

We had to move plus the East and West stands would have needed replacing - bearing in mind there was no room for outward expansion we couldn't have built upwards as it would have blocked the light of surrounding properties. We've had some great times so far at SMS, it's not the stadium's fault that several different boards have made a pig's ear of things. It's easy to be nostalgic because the fanbase was close-knit at the Dell but the reverse-takeover happened in 1996 when we were still at the Dell so the trouble was already brewing.

I don't agree with the posts that say he is an asset stripper etc - I think he comes across as being an upright businessman but I just feel his key decisions have been ineffective for too long even if I have trusted him more than Askham or Wiseman say. I don't think he's come back to ruin SFC - life's too short and I think he has been trying to salvage an investment which is understandable but I was disappointed by that April statement I heard on Radio Solent driving through Hants criticising Nigel Pearson's appointment at a time when we were fighting the drop. People do need to bear in mind that loyalty is a two-way street - Rupert can't have a go at people now when he was sniping from the outside at a time of crisis.

I'm asking an open question here without an angle or any animosity but what prejudice is Rupert suffering from? I'm not convinced that the old Harrow/public school thing is an issue, I think that subsided some time in the late 1990s. Yes, he is experienced so he shouldn't still be experimenting with different structures after 12 years of experience, particularly in a time of crisis don't you think? As a CEO, he shouldn't have made the same mistake twice with Gray/Wigley and the focus should have been getting back up in 2005/06 or at least giving it a good go instead of adding an overhead that wasn't right for a newly-demoted club. That IMO is not prejudice but an honest appraisal of why I don't believe Rupert is the right CEO. I've never met the man so I cannot tell you about him as a person. If he is a Saints fan, best of luck to him and hopefully once the major shareholders have moved on he'll feel comfortable to come to games as a guest. I will point out that a lot of Senior Managers/CEOs in a lot of organisations also put in long service but you have to still perform and this has been Rupert's problem since 2004.

Shrewsbury apparently along with Hawley of Preston who scored against us last season and played for Simpson at Carlisle. Must still have a bit of their Joe Hart windfall left, they've spent a lot for a League 2 side.

They'll be looking at his age - 30 - and the wages. Blackwell might get that money to spend though as Sheff Utd are one of the better-off CCC clubs and that's without the Tevez money, subject to appeal of course. It could work for both sides - Beatts might get half-a-dozen goals to keep Stoke up and Sheff Utd might be able to bring younger blood with some pace in as Beatts has had injury problems this season. Still scored 12 times though even so! I liked Beatts as a Saints player and he's pined for the club a bit since he left as well.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/teams/s/stoke_city/7820562.stm

Alpine shouldn't have been slated for that I agree TDD, there's far too much of that on here. You'd think some of our fans supported different clubs at times. Granted, some people come on here to wind up others and some of the personal stuff is well out of order but the fact we are all Saints fans does seem to get forgotten.

Top post and we made plenty of noise when WGS was here (with a strong home record to boot) but we haven't quite made SMS into the same fortress yet. As you say, the boiling point at boardroom level will hopefully be the driver behind the spirit and sense of purpose coming back amongst us fans.

I'm not saying that I haven't debated it at length on here or that I won't challenge blatant re-writing on history on here. I asked Jonah a question and I thought he gave a interesting and fair answer. We're all Saints fans and Rupert isn't going to be here forever so I can't see the point of locking horns with people for the sake of it, even if I don't agree with everything in Jonah's postings. Generally, I'd be more inclined to agree with those (including both of us) opposing the current board but as the future is not decided yet, there are room for different perspectives. I still don't think Lowe should have appointed JP for example and I don't have great confidence in him as a CEO but at the same time I wouldn't want the club to go into a CVA just to flush him away.

Brilliant stuff, the one with the train and Goodfellas one as well are the funniest things I've seen in ages!

If we sign a RB and we need to, Lloyd James would be better suited to RM IMO. Agree with Adrian on Lee Holmes, he should be playing as him and Skacel are by far the best crossers of a ball at the club although I don't expect Rudi to be here by 1 Feb, hence Molyneux. We just need to give them a decent header of the ball to aim at now!

Thanks Johah, good to hear your perspective and there's a lot of pragmatism in there, something we'll all need as fans. This is the thing that is now paramount for a lot of fans - the who and why of how we got here is receding sharply in importance and the overriding concern is how the club can move forward,personalities of the major shareholders aside.

A quite possible scenario. Administration is not something to wish for, whether a CVA actually happens or not. All we can do is follow the first XI at SMS and see what unfolds.

Brum have private backing from the Golds and Sullivan, not sure about WBA, I think they were the lowest payers in the PL last time around and don't seem to have pushed the boat out this time either. The only reason Palace kept Johnson et al for a season was Simon Jordan bankrolling it. Ashton was sold by Norwich. My gripe with 2005/6 was the daft focus on some admittely good ideas from SCW that derailed the first team focus on the crucial first year parachute season and increased the overhead without a significant end product - Theo and Bale were already in the system and debuting in 2005/6. Makes you realise by that fact that McGoldrick has stalled badly on his progress as he made his debut in 05/06.

I don't think a lot of rational fans would disagree with much of that. Personally I'm not a fan of any of the major shareholders but it's refreshing to see a poster that wishes to have debate without getting personal or unpleasant so well done. I may not be a Rupert fan but as people will see from my comments on supporting the relegation clauses in players' contracts that my view is far from myopic. I'd love to think that Leon Crouch was a rescue option but I'm not convinced, too much seemed to gamble on Fulthorpe who doesn't seem to be able to bring a bid to anywhere near boiling point.

Whilst I have similar views to the current board to yourself Alps, I can't agree on the 50% reduction. Many other PL clubs including Bolton when Big Sam was there have similar clauses in players' contracts. Of course the huge hikes in wages for average players have watered down the impact a bit but I don't blame Rupert for doing it.

Some of your analysis is good but you are assuming that the board can service the club's overheads. It is far from clear that they are able to do this. Question with no angle here: Where do you think this "external funding" will come from? My guess is re-financing via private loans but I'm as in the dark as anyone else at present. Aviva are unlikely to push for admin as it doesn't make sense for them. Private re-financing via soft loans may cover the Barclays overdraft remaining but we'll still have to cut overheads. Administration is most likely if the board cannot service the overhead costs, don't know if they've got an investor in mind or a recovery plan afterwards, you may know more about the board's intentions than me.

I simply replied to Bones's post by citing a lone example of a owner buy-back post admin that I had seen, well done to BTF on Governmental guidance she has posted. John B has posted below from a perspective that is supportive of Rupert Lowe but understands and takes into account the view of fans on the current unacceptable slide into League 1 and acknowledges the doubts over the appointment of JP which was an unneccessary risk at a dangerous time. You would do well to look at John's approach which puts his points across without getting personal. Most fans DON'T have an anti-Lowe agenda but a pro-SFC agenda and they see Lowe as an obstruction to moving forward which is different. There are a small minority of posters that are fanatical either way which you'll find at any club. Personally I would like to see ALL of the major shareholders depart but it's out of my hands and vast majority of fans on this board.

Good post John and there seems to be a common interest amongst most of us on here to ascertain what the "end game" might be, how it may happen and most importantly, when. Like many of us, I'm also intrigued by the "external funding" bit, the word "investment" wasn't used yet the world economy doesn't indicate that credit will be easy in any way to locate. Whether that points to a private benefactor, or a re-financing via a different source of private loans I don't know but it is possible perhaps from the likes of Withers.

Pretty accurate barometer IMO of how many Saints fans I know feel about the current situation, myself included.

Can't remember seeing it Trousers but would be interesting to see if there's a quote around.

I'm not a bean counter or Law Graduate but I can say that I saw a programme recently on a Department store in the North of England that went into administration and was bought back after a loss of staff by the original owners. Don't ask me how this works but it was definately the outcome, to my surprise. Can't comment on Bates at Leeds as not sure how that worked. Charlie Miller posted something about this on the admin aftermath thread which looked interesting from a pre-admin point of view.

The fans have been through plenty of relegation battles - half-a-dozen of them in the 1990s as we held on for a new stadium and another three this decade so far so "fight" or "spirit" is not one thing our fans lack. I agree that administration is not a universal truth (in fact it would be very unpleasant and painful all-round) but it is clear that even with the playing wages cut right to the bone, the board cannot service the club's overhead levels. We are not far off running out of players to sell and it is not a sustainable position, League 1 reduces the income further. Relegation is not a certainty but most of the regular SMS attenders on this site will tell you, me included, that it's highly likely based on performances and results since the autumn.

I agree with you on everything bar Wotton whose legs went a couple of years ago after a serious injury at Plymouth. Plus Wotton seems to be regarded as bad meat by the first team management. Wouldn't have minded a younger Wotton.