Dibden Purlieu Saint

Sour Mash in grumpy tirade against Southampton Football Club - what a surprise!

So what? They have different Work Permit laws to us. Coutinho has qualified for an Italian passport I believe.

Scouse outrage is delicious...

According to the new BMI thing I am no longer Obese, I am just Overweight. Score!!!

See, I can get the gist of that article. hence there shouldn't be a problem with the language barrier between the Pochmeister and our English speakers.

I see Steve Grant has commented on the article...

So was I. ****ing Paul Dickov.

http://www.football365.com/f365-says/8425380/The-Not-So-Inexplicable-Dismissal-Of-Nigel-Adkins It's never nice when someone loses their job. Some will argue that sympathy is a human weakness, and gets in the way of progress. Of course, those people are probably psychopaths, but you can't deny that we'd probably get stuff done an awful lot quicker were it not for emotions. It was therefore understandable that the football world seemed to join hands and unite in sympathy for Nigel Adkins, sacked by Southampton after two successive promotions just as he seemed to be turning this season around. The dismissal was obviously extremely harsh on Adkins. It's almost impossible to think what else he could have done in his two-and-a-half years at the club, and to many Nicola Cortese made an inexplicable decision. Except it really isn't that inexplicable. For a start, the wisdom or otherwise of any sacking cannot be judged until we know how well their replacement fares. The obvious example is the Chris Hughton/Alan Pardew crossover at Newcastle, but a more recent precedent is Steve Bruce taking over from the much-loved Nick Barmby at Hull. Barmby was dismissed shortly after Hull had finished eighth in the Championship, and now under Steve Bruce they're third, behind Leicester only on goal difference. Only until Mauricio Pochettino has been at the club for a few months will we be able to judge the logic of the move. In any case, much of the outrage was down to the timing of the announcement, because Southampton seem to be on such a good run, having lost just twice in the previous ten games. However, at his unveiling Pochettino let slip that he had been studying the team for a few weeks, suggesting that the decision to replace Adkins had been made some time ago. Would the outcry have been quite as loud if the dismissal had taken place in November, when they were bottom of the league having lost all but two games? So which run was Southampton's true form? Cortese clearly decided he couldn't risk it being the first. Presumably Cortese made his decision, then waited for his chosen replacement to be ready. More pertinently for Southampton, it might be that Adkins simply wasn't a good fit for how Cortese wanted to run the club. Ever since Cortese and the Liebherr family arrived in 2009, they have spoken about a defined structure at the club, echoing the way many top European clubs are run. Specifically, that all teams from the kids right through to the seniors play broadly in the same way, and with the same formation - in this case, variants of a 4-3-3. This implementation of what Brendan Rodgers would call a 'philosophy' is basically a mirror of how Swansea have operated in recent years. Rodgers' old club have been praised by many for the structure of their club, ensuring that even though they have changed managers more frequently than many clubs in recent years, the team has played in much the same way. In such a system, the manager/head coach is of course important, but changeable. It's a protective measure too - if, as happened with Roberto Martinez and Rodgers, a manager is lured away by a bigger club, the upheaval to the team is kept to a minimum. This is what Cortese is trying to do at Southampton. Les Reed (former FA technical director and briefly Charlton manager) is head of football development at Southampton. He told The Daily Telegraph before promotion was confirmed last season: "We want to win matches by keeping the ball on the ground and therefore we have to develop players who can do that. The parents understand it, they enjoy it, they want their kids to be playing a good style of football and hopefully over time that becomes the culture of the club." The 'Southampton way' is something that Cortese has preached since his arrival - all part of his five-year plan to reach the top flight, delivered two years early. The club looked at how the best clubs in the world operated and implemented the best of what they saw. Simple, really. "The main thing was not to look at how they did it to copy something but just to learn from what actually they wouldn't do again," said Cortese in The Telegraph. "It was also analysing what didn't work and based on that we kept on developing our ideas." So was Adkins adhering to this policy? As this excellent Southampton fan's blog notes, possibly not, given the way he mucked around with Southampton's system this season, flitting between a 4-2-3-1 that appears to suit the club's better players, and a 4-4-2 that, well, doesn't really. His team selection was also erratic and unpredictable, examples being the occasional dropping of top scorer Lambert and the selection of 17-year-old James Ward-Prowse for his first-team debut against Manchester City on the opening weekend. Ward-Prowse has made three starts since. And perhaps, no matter how well Adkins was doing, Cortese simply believes he has a better man in Pochettino. For a start, whether the idea is palatable or not, a progressive young Argentinean is more likely to attract players of Gaston Ramirez's calibre than a former physio from Birkenhead. Thanks to Cortese and the Liebherr family, Southampton can afford these talents, but now perhaps have a coach to match the money. In addition, Pochettino is highly rated in Spain. While Espanyol were bottom of La Liga when he left earlier this season, the sense was that he had simply run out of steam, after keeping a club with crippling financial problems (problems that meant they were consistently forced to sell players like Pablo Osvaldo and Jose Callejon) steady for nearly four years. If that doesn't sound like a huge amount of time, at the time of his sacking he was the longest-serving manager in la Primera by some way - it's pretty damn hard to stay in any job in Spain for longer than three years. Look at Pep Guardiola's hairline. He may simply be more suited to Cortese's 'Southampton way' than Adkins. Indeed, when welcoming their new manager, Cortese said Pochettino "shares my belief that the most successful clubs are built by nurturing young players through a development system that provides a clear path to the first team". Because of the constant sale of stars at Espanyol, he was forced to field youth-teamers, and did pretty well with them under the circumstances. Bearing in mind Espanyol's city neighbours would naturally hoover up the majority of the top local talent, finishes of 11th, eighth and 14th with second-tier kids is rather impressive. With the club in a better position to hold onto the products of a prolific academy now than when Theo Walcott, Gareth Bale and Alex Oxlade-Chamberlain emerged, Pochettino could be the man to mould these prospects into a competitive team. Managerial decisions are these days made with long-term ambitions in mind. That's why replacing Harry Redknapp with Andre Villas-Boas made sense at Spurs even after they finished fourth last season. Adkins did a fine job at Southampton, but Cortese clearly believed that another man was better suited to the club's future. This might not work - it might turn out that Adkins should have been kept and Pochettino may be a horrible disaster. But the decision isn't illogical. It's cold, it's callous, it might instinctively feel wrong and Adkins should rightly have our sympathy, but Cortese's actions are not inexplicable. In fact, they're all part of the plan.

Zing

No, I do understand that, and I am happy for people to do that as I have mentioned in this thread, they are good long serving fans. They are not loyal however if they stop going, BY DEFINITION. They are no longer loyal because they have stopped going and wavered in their support for the club. I am talking the pure definition of the word, and that was my initial point. Quite why it has gone this far I have no idea whatsoever, because all it seems is that people have different definitions for the word 'loyal' in this context.

Sorry if you did, I must have missed that.

By the way, how did our last argument go when I identified that Cortese was actively looking for a manager when Adkins was still in his job? Just interested because you acted like this in that thread too.

The better fans part. My whole point is as follows: Loyal is constant and unwavering support for a person or institution. By these fans stopping going this has shown a wavering as to their support of the club. By definition they are no longer loyal fans. Surely even you must understand that?

I am the troll yet you are the one making stuff up to provoke a reaction. Seriously? If you truly believe that at the moment is one of the worst periods in the history of our club then frankly I'm not sure what you want and I would suggest you do as your mates have and no longer support the side.

Bloody hell some of you are miserable bastards. In his opinion the balance has been tipped. Yes we have all heard the plans for the club, but it is always taken with a pinch of salt as there have been false dawns before. But now with the raw ambition of NC being shown perhaps we really are looking at pushing ourselves forward into the next group of teams and upwards. Bit disappointed that some of the more erudite posters on this board have decided to post pointless remarks on a thread that is someone's opinion (it's not even a negative/outlandish thing to say). Let him enjoy the ride even if you don't.

But my points all through this are in reference to Southampton football club and our ticket prices, not the wider world.

So are you just not going to home games then?

Behave, muppet.

Why don't we have the resources? What extra resources do the United fans have? And where have I praised the Premiership experience. Please don't put words in my mouth, it's a distateful thing to do and shows a waning argument.

I don't think it matters how often you go as long as you're not claiming to be loyal. The self righteous uberfan Sour Mash and his gang of disgusted mates will stop going I presume, and thats their choice, but in my eyes (and in the definition of the word 'loyal' - you're still not getting this point btw) they will no longer by loyal Southampton fans. I'm not saying they are bad fans, they purport to be good fans and I have no right to question that, but loyal? I don't think so.

What I love is your self-righteousness on the forum. It is possibly the most missplaced aspect of this forum.

That's not wrong. The fans may say that is the reason they stopped, but it just wasn't. Why did so many keep on going wearing their **** green and gold scarves? You can't have it both ways. What is also telling is that only around 4000 fans decided to do this, and not necessarily 4000 fans that were loyal to United. And would you say they are more loyal Manchester United fans than the ones who have been there for 30 years and still go. I would say no, as I would say they are no longer United fans. But it is the end for you now I presume? Let me know how FC Saints of Southampton gets on.

And my biggest reason for not going is having a 4 month child that I would like to spend time with at the weekends. I have an Annual Gold card but it's still £25 per game to travel.

It is a widely held opinion that it was setup due to the Glazers take over of the club, ladening the club with debt and meaning they would invest less in players. The fact that they supported the club that has made THE MOST out of the Sky era of football (which is the reason football has changed) and the reason they stopped was due to them investing less is one of the most hypocritical reasons if you are saying the above is true to stop supporting a football club. If the takeover hadn't have happened they would have continued to support United. If you're going to pick a group of people that bunch of idiots is not the way to go.

Thanks for actually reading my posts and not over-reacting at the fact that my definition of loyal (which pretty much follows that of the dictionary) differs to others non dictionary definition. It's not as if I am saying they are bad fans, I am sure they are excellent Saints fans, but at our highest position in the last 7 years? I don't think this is where you stop supporting the club.