revolution saint

But the point is that "none of the above/spoiling your vote" is actually different to not voting.

Couldn't have put it better myself. In my case it's a combination of the fact that I don't currently feel that there's a party available to me and our "first past the post system".

Good point. We should have a poll - Do you want to punch Gordon Brown or Johnny Bognor? I'll start. Johnny Bognor.

Typical. I start a debate that gets interesting and then disappear off to work. To be honest it seems to have slipped a bit into the usual points scoring and that wasn't the intention of the question. I could have been phrased it a bit better though - maybe voting out of tradition rather than habit. It's interesting to note that no one I think has tackled the second point which was "what would make you change your vote (if you are a one party person)? Personally I think I would always find it hard to justify voting for the Tories but I don't think I could ever rule it out. There's a lot to be said for floating voters - they at least ensure we're not all mired in constituencies that are destined to stay the same political hue for generations. Of course a more representative system may help as well. All very interesting though.

Hope all you like - it's why certain regions remain heartlands for certain parties. How else would you explain it? Edit: Actually I see your point but parties change. Voting loyalty shouldn't be set in stone because of central tenets that a party once held, or should it?

Hands up - who does it? Who, when push comes to shove, can't bring themselves to vote anything other than the party they've voted for all their life? And is there anything that would persuade you otherwise?

Definitely onside and there weren't any complaints from the Man U players either. I remember talking to a Man U supporter who was at the game (tragically I was 4 and couldn't make it) and even he didn't dispute the legitimacy of the goal. Funnily enough I got the DVD years ago and was suprised at how well Saints played. It seems received wisdom that we got battered, held on and scored a goal against the run of play but it didn't seem that way to me.

Have to say he does actually come across well in interviews and does seem like a laugh. Probably past it now but he was a decent player and am I the only one who remembers that he scored a great goal against us for Leicester (I think) at the Dell? the kind of player you loved to hate if he played against you but would love if he was on your side.

Ummm thanks, that's what I said I would do? In reality though spoiling/defacing my vote actually does nothing except give me a smug feeling that at least I can have a moan. I'm not "not voting" because of apathy. I'm not voting because of two reasons - firstly there won't be any party on offer in my constituency I consider worth voting for and secondly without a proportional representational vote voting tactically wouldn't be any help even if I wanted to. Last election I had four parties to vote for - the usual three plus UKIP. I didn't feel that any of them deserved endorsing. If I'm going to vote for a party (bearing in mind it will make no difference whatsoever) then I'm going to make sure it's one I agree with.

1997 the tories took a right kicking across the country - except for the constituency I live in where they actually increased their majority. That killed any idea I may have had that my vote actually would count. It doesn't and neither does your vote count if you're not lucky enough to live in a marginal. You may go home satisfied you've paid a part in the political process but the fact is when we wake up on the day after the election the majority of people eligible to vote will not have voted for the party that won and neither will there be a proportional distribution of power based on that vote.

So given a choice between party A and party B both being exactly the same except for slogans you'd choose to legitimise the process? Of course someone has to run the country - my point is I'd rather none of the contenders did. That's a valid point of view isn't it? It's just not represented on the ballot paper which is why I will spoil my vote unless I'm persuaded otherwise. I should also point out that if my ballot paper contained all the parties on this poll or we had proportional representation then I probably wouldn't be spoiling my vote.

I think there should be a "spoiled vote" option. That way it can reflect those who do care but find no one who is worth voting for. I'd expect this GE to have a very low voter turnout and to a large extent that's because of disillusionment with the current state of politics. As someone pointed out earlier unless you live in a marginal then your vote won't really count anyway. I don't really see the point of voting where I live - it'll always be Tory. A blue paper bag would get elected here. I also see very little difference between the major parties (lib dems excepted to a certain extent) so ironically given that this election like so many others will be dominated by the word "change" I can't actually see very much of it on offer. I'll spoil my vote and refuse to get hoodwinked by a lot of PR and slogans.

Yes you did. You stated before the game you weren't worried about the performance just the result. Then you moan about the performance. Anything to moan about eh?

So you want us to grind out a result no matter what. We do that and you change the goalposts? Why not just say we should be champions league material and then you can moan all you like? Yes, that's why people dislike you - because you're not only negative but dull, very dull. Nothing inciteful from you just moaning as usual. By the way I'm not really sure why you care - you gave up on the playoffs around about the Exeter draw so surely anything closer (to the playoffs) is a result? Oh but it's you isn't it? The perennial dull one who just enjoys moaning.......

Certainly deserves a referendum. I'm undecided about whether it's a good idea though. To be honest I'd rather have a fully elected House of Lords.

Assuming we're in league 1 then Antonio and Waigo have done enough for me to get permanent deals and probably Semi too. I reckon we need a decent dominating centre mid as well. Not a box to box player but someone who puts his stamp on the game and runs it. It appears Stock can do this though I've never seen him play. Someone mentioned Carsley and that's a great shout. Not sure if he's getting games at Brum and he'll be 37 next Feb but he'd be that old head we hoped Wotton would be. Apparently Graveson is considering coming out of retirement as well.

Well it says that Swindon are actually a pretty decent team at this level. Was that your point?

See the persecution complex is coming on well. As I see it at the start of the season there were a few people who thought that the playoffs were not only a realistic target but anything less would be a disappointment. Most people thought playoffs would be great and could be achieved but probably unlikely. Most people haven't adjusted their expectations and still see this as a pretty good season. It's only the ones who've repeatedly stamped their feet and moaned because we're not closer to the playoffs that have had to adjust their expectations and they have taken a bit of stick. So to sum up; I'm not going to give you any credit for changing your opinion to one that thinks the playoffs are unlikely - most of us thought that at the start of the season.

I'd love to know what his goals per minutes on the pitch ratio compared to other players is. I was undecided about signing him a few months ago but for 500K and if you accept that at times he'll be frustrating then his goals justify buying him. He's also a funny fella so why not?

I remember a conversation at work when talk Sport first went on the airwaves. One bloke said, "talk sport? more like talk b****cks." I decide to listen to it after that. He was right.

Just got back as well. Good day out, caught the 8.18 from Totton which was packed to the rafters and not really that much fun after two hours. Waterloo station was amazing though - Just loved how we seemed to be everywhere. The metropolitan pub on Baker street equally packed but a good atmosphere. I thought the stadium was impressive but I didn't like the acoustics - couldn't hear what song was being sung and when you could it seemed all three sides were singing at different paces. However, visually it was great and despite being top tier the view was still good. Despite the acoustics the atmosphere was great. Thought Carlisle did OK but didn't offer much up front. Once we got over the first ten minutes we were much better and Lambert seemed such a threat. We actually created some great chances without it seemed dominating possession. Seems churlish to criticise a player but Wotton didn't have the greatest of games. Thought Lallana was good in most of our best attacking moves. In some ways scoring four may have flattered us but on the other hand we had several other great chances that we didn't convert. Lallana could have had a great goal if Waigo hadn't got in the way (not his fault though!). Anyway, great day and felt brilliant to see Saints take over the capital.

I think he'd have liked this. 3 years ago and it still seems like yesterday.

Definitely a classic but my favourite Jam song changes by the week. Have you got "Extras"? Some great acoustic and demos on there.

Yeah it's alright - different song though.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wcKZoFRpZCI - Small Faces "Tin Soldier" - Inspiral Carpets feat Mark E Smith