Johnny Bognor

You make some good points and i dont disagree. I was merely highlighting that even a report by esteemed economists isnt difficult to pull apart, even by an amateur like me. As it happens, many are shacked up in shared housing. For what it is worth, immigration in the referendum was not an issue for me. Our digital press and mailing house is 100% staffed by eastern europeans. They work incedibly hard and their work ethic is far superior to the new labour nannied millenials with their over inflated sense of self worth and their over inflated sense of entitlement. IMO the UK should allow as many as we need to keep our economy on track.

The Libyan School of Economics haven't exactly been whiter than white when it comes to donations and where they come from... http://woolflse.com/dl/woolf-lse-report.pdf Quite a few porkies have been told for financial gain. Hmmm.. But then they are helping to breed homophobia, sexism and elitism. Maybe someone on here was a student??? http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2781919/Top-London-university-caught-new-sexism-row-freshers-week-leaflets-branded-women-slags-trollops-crumpets.html ... and that's before they defrauded british taxpayers for fake research http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3863462/Exposed-university-helped-secure-9million-money-passing-rivals-research-bankroll-climate-change-agenda.html So they take money from the EU to produce research which shows the EU in a positive light, and it's all above board??? (whilst omitting important factors). Yeah, right. I'm with ya mate

I actually got the 11bn figure from page 31 http://siteresources.worldbank.org/INTPROSPECTS/Resources/334934-1199807908806/4549025-1450455807487/Factbookpart1.pdf, hence why I pasted the link to it. I generally don't make a habit of quoting the Express. However, I concede that I made a mistake by quoting £ instead of $. But then I'm not an esteemed economist. Nevertheless, my point still stands. A significant factor has not been taken into account. This maybe a genuine mistake by such esteemed economists or it may be a deliberate omission by "unbiased" economists. I'll leave that for others to decide... Many EU migrants come here to work and to earn money. Hey, I would do the same. A significant proportion of them do not settle here indefinitely. A significant proportion of them save/send money home. Only last week I was chatting to my Romanian taxi driver. Thoroughly nice bloke. Apart from talking about Saints vs Steaua Bucharest, he was telling me how he lost his job in the Bucharest police force due to cutbacks and how he had a wife with two young children who he needs to support. He came over here three months ago to live with his brother and is sending as much home as he can. Then there are the two members of staff who have asked for a raise, because what they send home has fallen 20% in real terms since the £ devalued. Then there's our Spanish animation professional, who commutes weekly from Spain, to support his family. I can't be the only person out there, that is aware of this drain of GDP overseas and that there is some impact. I'm not knocking them. I would do the same. So the point in the document that states that EU immigrants spend all there money here and this is good for the economy, is factually incorrect. Jeez, I'm only on page one of your beloved document and I'm already picking holes in it.

The world bank data is based upon money remitted... here's their latest factbook. http://siteresources.worldbank.org/INTPROSPECTS/Resources/334934-1199807908806/4549025-1450455807487/Factbookpart1.pdf The £11 billion remitted from the UK includes ALL migrants and I'm not sure of the proportion EU vs Non-EU migrants remittances. But when you consider that the impact of remittances to Eastern Europe are twice as important as trade, it must be significant. If we take Lithuania for example, 4% of their GDP is reliant on overseas remittances... money which is being taken out of other economies...

I know a few leftie remainers, whose primary reason to vote remain was because they would prefer EU domination/control, as opposed to unchecked tory party rule.

OK I've played the man, as you well know. Now I'll play the ball. Page 1 - "But immigrants consume goods and services and thisincreased demandhelps to create more employment opportunities." Yes they do (as well as paying their taxes), but there is absolutely no consideration for the money that's sent back to countries of origin. In my personal experience, I know a number of Eastern Europeans that have settled here. But equally, I know a significant number that are either living frugally and sending their money back to their families or are saving money for when they go back home. A world bank report estimated that some £11 billion is sent home from the UK every year, which is aside of the amounts being saved for future use back home. I would expect such esteemed economists, with vast resources at their disposal, to at least acknowledge this factor. Instead it has been completely ignored, presumably because it doesn't help to support their conclusions??? Still this "independent" and "unbias" research has some validity, even if it doesn't consider the complete picture and is selective in which evidence is assessed.

In terms of the EU migrants contributions, there are a number of things to consider... One of these, which aside of earnings and tax, is the money that is taken out of the economy and sent to the country of origin. In my business, the shop floor is 100% staffed by eastern Europeans. Their work ethic is exemplary. They earn good wages and pay tax. But a significant proportion save money to take back with them. We had an Estonian account manager on 27k a year. She was brilliant. Over 8 years she saved enough to build a house for cash back in Estonia. So whilst she paid her dues, her net income didn't end up in our economy... Not sure if this drain of cash is taken into account..

It's misleading to suggest that the turnaround in our fortunes was solely down to the common market. Britain continued to deteriorate after joining the common market, after which we had to go to the IMF with our begging bowl 3 years later. In fact, things only started to turn for the better for Britain, when thatchers market reforms came into effect ... a decade after joining the common market (although most lefties would never like to admit it)

The only reason we won't get a good deal, is a political one. May was quite right in her approach of being constructive with our friends in Europe. However, if they choose not to be constructive, then they will be cutting off their noses. Today's speech gives some certainty in that the default position will be a clean brexit (as opposed to a dirty brexit) and let's see what transpires in terms of a trade deal. We've opened a negotiating position and laid down a few markers. It will be interesting to see the responses of the elected leaders of the 27 nation states. The £'s best one day performance since 2008 would suggest that the markets seem relatively pleased with the position.

Well there isn't strictly free movement of goods so I don't see why not Sent from my SM-G920F using Tapatalk

Yep, cut and paste job.

Many a truer word is spoken in jest, me old pedigree chum. It does remind me of a few people on this thread lolz

It’s far more important I’m proved right than for Brexit to be successful, says Remain supporter *August 18, 2016 *Written by Neil Tollfree A Remain supporter has confirmed that he would feel much happier for Brexit to be a massive failure and proven*right than for Britain to become successful in a post-EU world. “Well, obviously, I’d like to live in a successful country,” said Simon Williams, a Remain supporter who works in ‘media’. “But not at the expense of me being proved wrong. That’s unthinkable. “These are clearly very uncertain times,” he continued while sipping a frappe-mocha-latte-coo-coo-ca-chino. “So I think it’s important that I, along with all remain supporters, maintain a constant state of gloom and pessimism, and meet any signs of optimism by saying something like ‘well, it’s early days, you wait until the country just falls into a big hole in the ground and everyone dies screaming, then you’ll be sorry’. “Because otherwise it might mean that Brexit won’t be a disaster, and who wants to live in a world where people like me can possibly be wrong about anything.” Mr Williams continued banging on interminably about racism, the older generation, and claiming to be ‘seriously looking at relocating to Ireland,’ before he realised that everyone had stopped listening so he wandered off to drink some ‘craft’ ale instead. Sent from my SM-G920F using Tapatalk

Out of interest, can you remind me what deal the US have with the EU???

Yes I can't see him referring to you as winalot lol

"my old pedigree chum"© is my line, used specifically in response to references to "Pal" © Come up with your own dog food brand... "Winnalot" has not been referenced yet...

Afternoon me old pedigree chum... OK, slight error on my part and it will teach me not to post in haste. I 'should' have said that despite the immediate fall following the referendum, the IMF believed that sterling was still overvalued... at that time. But to pretend that the £ was not overvalued pre-referendum is beyond the realms of idiocy. I know you don't disagree with that. The consensus may be that the £ is NOW undervalued, but no-one thought this was the case 8 months ago. Again, I know you don't disagree with that. As for research, there will always be a suspicion, especially when it comes to institutions who are benefiting from the EU. The LSE, who are a Jean Monnet centre of excellence, receive EU funding. This in isolation doesn't present a problem, but when there is an EU agenda to subvert and influence the peoples of Europe, through the teaching profession, then I personally take issue with it. Jean Monnet professors must devote their time exclusively to teaching or researching "European integration" and must therefore "renounce" all responsibility for teaching "non-European integration" issues. Teaching activities are "co-financed" for a maxi-mum period of three years, in exchange for a commitment to maintain a full-time course on European integration for at least seven years. For that, a ceiling is set at a total of €30,000, spread over a three year period. Out of interest, are you suggesting that the EU are NOT exerting undue influence on the young through education?

Are you for real???? IMF states £ overvalued - 2015 https://fullfact.org/economy/exchange-rates-and-imf/ Deutsche Bank state £ is the most overlaued currency in the world - Dec-15 http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/currency/12065157/Pound-is-most-overvalued-currency-in-the-world-analysts-claim.html I could go on, but the consensus of most analysts and institutions, was that the £ was overvalued... the IMF stated in July, that despite the fall after the referendum, it's STILL overvalued. A correction would/should have happened at some point anyway, the referendum vote was merely a catalyst...

I would be interested to see if others think that the article is just dull factoids. It certainly alludes to the fact that there is institutionalised brainwashing going on. Yes the article has a political slant, but no more than you would expect if you had an ex-monnet chair like gianmarco ottaviano on the ""research"" team. Or is it a case that you're allowed to post politically biased articles and I am not??? Im surprised you've not heard of monnet chairs or the jean monnet programme. An EU funded institutionalised brainwashing programme that even Goebbels would have been proud of. http://www.jean-monnet.ch/en/ https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jean_Monnet_Programme https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jean_Monnet_Foundation_for_Europe

This gives you some insight into the eye watering amounts spent on promoting the EU and driving EU propaganda. I suggest you have a proper gander... https://www.brugesgroup.com/propaganda/54-issues/propaganda/204-propaganda-how-the-eu-uses-education-and-academia-to-sell-integration Note the LSE gets more than a mention. So lets not pretend that our univeristies provide "independent" research. No mention of the monnet chair from you. They have a specific brief to promote the EU in a good light. One of the architects of your "independent" and "balanced" report LOL

Quotes a document by a research department partly funded by the EU ... In addition to this, one of the key contributors is a monnet chair..... you know... those EU paid professors... who's responsibility it is to promote the EU... Didn't think my old pedigree chum would fall for this 'research'. Tell me who's funding the research and I'll tell you what the probable outcome will be. No vested interest here. Nope, none at all. Even you must be able to fathom that that you don't bite the hand that feeds you...

... and of course Jamie's going bust in Aus had everything to do with Brexit

"The only function of economic forecasting, is to make astrology look respectable."

It's funny how the EU won't allow us to 'buy' access, yet they rely on NATO for defence without paying their fair share.

... and this is aside from the fact that he wouldn't have led the negotiations anyway.. he was stepping down in October and as everyone acknowledges, it will take a lot longer to thrash out a deal. So it makes perfect sense to step down now.