Frank's cousin

Of course things can go wrong - always risks involved with all this, but we if we consider his background, the way Marcus operated around debt free investmnet and growth, then it points to a policy of minimising risk and of a planned and structured investment that would have contingency for relegation etc.

Read David Walsh's book 'Seven Deadly Sins about his 10 year + campaign to find out the truth - and he wanted Armstrong to be clean. Facinating read - could not put it down, and sadly indicates that Lance's wins are all sadly tarnished. The problem is that doping was systematic in most teams, even after Festina scandal in 98, with average times INCREASING in 99 despite claims from teh UCO and the Tour that they had eliminated the systematic doping.... yet no reliable test for EPO existed then, and when it did, they moved on to blood doping... But the improvements post cancer treatments for an average rider (v good by most standards, but relative to the heights reached in early tours by the best youngsters) seem incredible, especially his time trial improvements etc. The saddest part for me is we will never know how good he could have been clean versus a clean tour. NOt sure we have a fully clean tour now. Belive Wiggins may be the first clean champion in over 15 years - even major suspicions over Ulrich in 97 given his ban....

All true, but would suggest that as these incidents gain so much more press and media attention due to teh clarity of teh multiple cameras, it is about time we looked to clamp down on a bit, given the the message its sends etc - having said that the controversy over decsions ahas always rightly or wrongly been a part of the game that infuriates yet keeps fans gasbagging in pubs post match for years. Ultimately though sport should be a about fairness and played within the rules, else why have any? Yet in football the authorities seem happy with the status quo. It keeps thye media circus engaged and the game on the back pages ahead of other sports.

Should not underestimate the value to the player of a regular starting place - even if the long term its only as a shop window for bigger clubs and better deals - as long as we get good value from the player and a decent sellling price, its not a bad thing, although would like to think eventually that we have the chance to hold out longer as we flirt with sucess

Oi! I am very sensitive you know:cry:

Cheeky scamp Granty

Especially when you consider Beatts was on that back in 2003 with all the add ons and bonuses...

7m for a young striker with potential is nothing in comparison to what some ae paying - you are assuming that we spent money on one area INSTEAD of another - when teh reality is more likey we we identified the need to Stengthen in ALL areas, but to date have only SECURED the players we want in some. There is a huge amount of naivety on here amongst those who think we did not sign key players in key positions because we signed strikers or spent 15 mil euros on ramirez... the truth is more likely we did not get who we wanted and would not be forced into panic buying lower spec. In addition, thsoe who think signing players is easy need to have a think. Yes some clubs can do deals quicker where they sling money at it or have a Euro competition in the bag to attract players - others like us, need to find players who will buy into the policy and approach and we also rightly seem to play hardball in negotiations - means it takes longer and appears more complex. There will always be players who have promise but never live up to it and all clubs will make mistakes - even the top sides buy players that never make the grade, but for the likes of Ferguson, everyone in the media seem happy to forget his Forlan, Jordi moments... as I say all clubs and we will not be immune to it either.

;-) even true believers are all atheists to some extent... As a true atheist, I just happen to believe in one less god than the 'enlightened'. My 'false idol' I worshiped wore red and white with a 7 on his back.

So you believe we should have bought in an entire new squad?

indeed we are not man U who can afford to buy world class players at the top of their game, but close to 30 as in Van Persie's case - what we can do is a combination of the Arsenal and Barcelona models - buy younger players we hope will develop and also use the academy to its best advantage - means in tehory we will always have a youngish side, but young does not ncessarily mean inexperienced if some of those have been playig in the first team since they were 18 or so - I would love it if we were able to hold the very best talent beyond 22/23 but we will never compete wage wise so without a wage cap that will never happen, we will not be able to... but we could see cyclical success with this model if everything falls into place - just need to stay up now to keep things going - relegation is not a disaster, but would set us back 2-3 years as some players would obviously leave and the building process would start again.

Weer Ok in the mid 70s - lived in Cagliari for a couple of years as a kid and went a couple of times with the old man - They had Cousio (?) Italian international then... but memory is hazy as was only 7/8 at the time....

The problem with any privately owned business is that any we will never see the level of detail in any published accounts that would be necessary to fully understand the financial situation... especially given that there is more than one entity under the holding company and there woill be various accounting practices that I certainly dont have a clue about... ...so we will always be subject to speculation - especially given that its RIGHT we try and be aware of what is going on in light of the criticism of those down the road. Turks is right (well feck me ;-) ) about the policy - buy young and build - that has resale value etc - all pretty good, but comes with greater risk initially to survival... but I am OK with the risk, but that is opinion which I know some will not agree with - all depends on how much you value prem survival versus a longer term aim. Cortese will be desperate to stay up - no one wants an income reduction, but I suspect that the policy combined with PP of 48 mil over 4 years will be enough to ensure we dont go into melt down - suspect all contracts come with wage reductions on relegation clauses anyway. so... why the need for the BVI loan? I suspect cash flow - if correct and we had to pay the Ramirez money upfront, then this is understandable if we were also looking to have cash available for Jan window, given that a) prem revenue is made in installments, and not upfront, b) normally 15 mil would be paid over 3 or 4 years (length of contract etc)... ...But why would this be needed if the family or Mrcus left provision/trust cash for development well its only a rumour, we simply dont know how much was left in trust by Marcus for the club or whether that has since all been used up. But its not beyond the realms of plasibilty that there is a trust fund - but if placed in trust, then there are usually specific rules for when or how money can be used - and If we have a pot somewhere, I suspect that its predominantly for infrastructure improvemnets or development after we achieve a certain status etc... but that is all speculation. so should we be worried?... my guess is no, but its right to ask questions, even if we wont get any answers - I really would emphasise the fact that it would be incredibly unlikely that anyone would rescue a club, pay off its creditors, establish a long term plan and then fall into the overspending trap that saddles the club with debts again - it would simply make no sense and is the polar opposite of how Marcus and by default Nicola ran Marcus' businesses together - debt free with investment coming from existing capital. Ironically, one advantage of the previous PLC structure was more detailed access to annual accounts, greater transparnecy etc, but as aprivately owned institution, we will have to trust those in control. I do from what little we have seen. I appreciate there are some fans who do not like the current regime,for whatever reasons (mostly never stated - and mostly those who would dislike any regime that did not include some sort of fan ownership/board member) - who will naturally try and play this up and elevate 'the right to question' into a panic/major concern issue - but IMHO, there is no validity in their argument.

Be realistic Phil... you are not in your 20s anymore and like many of us post 40.. perhaps best to avoid the temptations of the flirtatious advances of the fruglies/hookers/eastern european clap distributors with slimey yet potentially violent pimpsods... when close to coma through Munich's best golden bubbly liquid. Surround yourself with those you can trust to ensure trousers dont come off until safely back in hotel... alone... so as to avoiud giving FMDP and additional unwanted 'gift' on the the honeymoon, whilst ensuring credit card details remain confidential. Remeber the curse of the the golden buddly liquid - its strange twisted sense of humour that makes you see Claudia Schiffer in every face, the sweet lovely innocence of the Albanian 'friends' you may make ( think 'Taken') and leaves the 'jewels' in need of more than penicilin

Been gping for years - cant blame 'foreigners' - 'local' players did it all the time in the 70s when they could get away with it. Only become more 'visable' in the last 20 years or so with umpteen cameras at at all grounds... wont be solved until retrospective punishment for cheating is applied - would kill it off in no time. simple solution to diving and blatent cheating is ref gives player an opportunity to come clean on the pitch and recive a yellow, and its end of. NO honesty and retrospective is a 3-4 match ban. simple

'Calculator out' not a surprise really given how thick that **** is....

Strongest lineup..... commentators are fleck witsfleck wits

Fonte looks in a bad way......

Arse 3

Bias is on FOX soccer

Arse 2

Arse

Must be the same one - sat their jizzing over himself about Chelsea talent....

Totally Chelsea bias on the the first row sports stream......

Neil Young in the Summer at the SECC