Sir Ralph

You’re answering a different question which I don’t disagree with in principle. however I think the answer to my question appears to be “no” which was the basis of what was discused

Not the distinction I’m making. The conservatives didn’t knowingly propose policies or oppose restrictive policies which had the direct intention of reducing illegal immigration. The point is the individuals or groups on the left deliberately opposed policies that had the specific intention of discouraging illegal immigration. Put it this way, I can point to various left wing groups or individuals that have deliberately sought to block policies that would restrict illegal immigration. Can you point to any conservative / right wing groups or individuals that have deliberately done the same to the scale of those on the opposite political spectrum?

The point is collectively leftist groups or individuals have tried to repeatedly block serious attempts to restrict immigration . The point of difference was whoether those on the left try to hinder these policies. I didn’t lament the policies - point out where I did? I also didn’t say the Dublin agreement was “extremely” useful. I said it was a factor in helping (noting that wider geo political shifts have occurred since Brexit which have been an factor)and I didn’t vote for Brexit. Please quote correctly. Put it this way, I can point to various left wing groups or individuals that have sought to restrict illegal immigration policies. Can you point to any conservative / right wing groups or individuals that have to the scale of those on the opposite political spectrum?

You ignored the question

Ok be pedantic - if that singular word is what you’re hanging onto I know you’re struggling . Left wing groups or individuals as a collective will try and stop any proposals to restrict immigration Do you agree that the left wing in the whole are the ones that resist proposals to reduce illegal immigration?

I didn’t say anyone was openly championing unrestricted immigration (not in public at least). I said there are groups on the left and in the human rights sector who have tried to oppose government policies to restrict illegal immigration. Amnesty international, liberty, unison, pcs, Lucas, cherry, Corbyn - there were a number of Labour, Lib Dem and Green MPS. There are other groups and parties or individuals that are to the left. I assume you acknowledge that all those named are?

Please refer to my previous post

The point is that once up and running it the intention was that it would have been a disincentive for people so could have resulted in fewer people coming hence an overall saving. Anyway my overall response wasn’t about the merits of the schemes it was in relation to those on the left who will seek to stop any proposals which restrict immigration.

And those on the left challenged or removed various policies that those governments tried to introduce to minimise / disincentivise illegal immigration such as the the Rwanda scheme, use of barges for accommodation and turn back of migrant boats . These challenges and removal of policy were typically by left wing MPs, human rights lawyers, unions, civil rights groups, etc, which hindered government as well as activist groups that physically tried to stop removal. If new policies are proposed, they will do the same again....

You must have missed the part of the thread where some on here who have a different view believe they are 'centrists', which appears to provide some form of self justification that their views are balanced and more considered than others.

I would like to be invited too.

Yes maybe us “little englanders” have a point.

So if you come here you get allowance into a hotel with 3 meals a day and healthcare, including free dental at the asylum seeker accommodation, as well as free prescriptions. If you then work off payroll you can supplement your income. All this compared to countries of origin where even if somebody worked they wouldnt receive this. Oh and charities provide sim cards, clothes, phones and legal advice. Imagine living in a country where you have to work and still cannot benefit from free health / dental care, 3 meals a day et and you land here, get given this and get put up in London where you can freely roam around taking in the tourist sites. That, I believe, is the incentive

Just out of interest where was this published please?

Just proves how degenerate Westminster’s politicians are - imagine even that going through your head.

Don’t think it’s unreasonable to look to reduce the welfare budget we have and use those monies for something else (eg measures to increase employment or increasing spending on education). Other parties seem to have a strategy to maintain / increase these budgets to find favour with an ever increasing group of voters that benefit from the increases. An ever increasing welfare budget is not sustainable and is not a symptom of a healthy country.

Dobbin and matsuki have been anonymous

Started off well and then collapsed after Stephen’s cock up

Get Stephen and matsuki off - wood and Azaz on

Two stupid mistakes. Giving the ball away completely unnecessarily

So we have the same number of yellows as Watford!!!!!

How does Stephen’s get picked ahead of wood

Details will be interesting but it needs significant change. Agree with the comments around the current system comprising “suicidal empathy” and a “strange perversion of compassion”.

I know £17m is an opener but it’s a bit of a Michael take when we purchased him for £20m. £30m absolute minimum - I doubt they will stretch that far